Hesitation on hard right turns

[NancysToy]

And don't get me wrong, I'm not saying why they did or why they didn't do what they did. It's their company and they can make it as bozo proof as they deem necessary....as ridiculous as it may be for an experienced rider.
All I was saying is that their comments about it handling like a "lawn dart" are absolutely silly and 100% untrue.....that's all.
I've ridden many machines that pucker up the butt cheeks a LOT more than a spyder without VSS... And I'm not that good of a rider....

Remember that I was speaking of the prototype machines. I'm sure there were plenty of engineering changes to tame things since that time. It wouldn't take much to turn this type of design into a beast. Suspension geometry, steering ratios, power steering, brake control systems, horsepower, tire sizes and compounds, and a host of other things have been changed, added, or refined since those early years. I have served as a test rider or driver in the past, and it can be challenging at times. Those guys usually don't say these things for no reason...they are hard to scare. I'm sure they weren't just blowing smoke.

[billrob71]

Sorry but i totally disagree with their assessment. Ive ridden a spyder without VSS and considerably more power, and I can honestly say they are full of crap saying that....maybe if your a complete idiot with no common sense or have no coordination.
The VSS system is fantastic in the rain, similar to a car. However, not necessary on dry pavement and especially at low speeds for anyone with even average riding skills.

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I half to agree, there is a common sense factor that needs to be there if it's raining and you ride like a idiot it's a good feature but for someone with good experience and know how to ride
, respects the machine and knows what the capability of the machine is there is a lot less chance for disaster.

That being said when hanging into a corner at higher speeds and not having the VSS kick in and have the potential for a unsuspecting rider to loose balance due the power shutting down and the bike straightening up I think is just as dangerous. Any possible way to lessen the VSS activation I wanna and am gonna try. I'm not looking to go and do a drifting contest or a big smokey donut with it but just want the bike to handle like a bike.

[billrob71]

You all totally lost me on the lawn dart thing.

What is a lawn dart?

See said picture for visual display
pointy horseshoes thrown at plastic circle on the ground

[SNOOPY]

Yeah. There is a VSS light on the right gauge pod. Flashy Flashy.

Ill have to look for it. Lol

[Bob Denman]

Remember that I was speaking of the prototype machines. I'm sure there were plenty of engineering changes to tame things since that time. It wouldn't take much to turn this type of design into a beast. Suspension geometry, steering ratios, power steering, brake control systems, horsepower, tire sizes and compounds, and a host of other things have been changed, added, or refined since those early years. I have served as a test rider or driver in the past, and it can be challenging at times. Those guys usually don't say these things for no reason...they are hard to scare. I'm sure they weren't just blowing smoke.

If they said it; you can bet, that's what they felt...

[DrewNJ]

Some of you guys are like sheep....

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[DrewNJ]

I HIGHLY recommend that those of you who have never ridden one without the nanny controls actually ride one and assess the handling for yourself.
It does NOBODY ANY good repeating junk you've "heard".

Way to much "he said this" or "BRP doesn't recommend that"....


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[billrob71]

I HIGHLY recommend that those of you who have never ridden one without the nanny controls actually ride one and assess the handling for yourself.
It does NOBODY ANY good repeating junk you've "heard".

Way to much "he said this" or "BRP doesn't recommend that"....


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How can it be disable without causing everything else not to function correctly?

[DrewNJ]

How can it be disable without causing everything else not to function correctly?

As far as I know, it can't, not with what's available with the stock electronics. At least not yet.
I have some hands on build time and have ridden one with the motor/electronics out of an Aprilia RSV. Which has no nanny whatsoever. Not even ABS.
Other than ABS I haven't missed the nanny at all with the limited seat time I've had. However, I haven't been in the rain with it yet. I'm sure its not as friendly.

We have been doing some testing with the steering sensor and yaw rate sensor. However, this is all way above my level of expertise. The guy I'm friends with who "gets it" doesn't do forums. For some obvious reasons.

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[billrob71]

But doing the angle shim you were talking about changes the engagement angle to change the activation time?

[DrewNJ]

But doing the angle shim you were talking about changes the engagement angle to change the activation time?

Yes, but it is subtle because you still have the side to side inputs. Nanny is still there but is a bit more forgiving and let's up sooner.
So when you get a bit hot on the throttle with some side pitch, you still get the smack down.
It isn't a radical change so don't expect to much.... ;-)

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[billrob71]

Well still gonna try it and see how it does, something is better then nothing at all

[DrewNJ]

Well still gonna try it and see how it does, something is better then nothing at all

If you end up digging into this and dont mind, give something a try. While you have the yaw sensor loose stand it on its nose/connector up and just turn on the ignition. See if you get any faults. Wonder how far out of wack it can go.
Also,
At the advice of a good friend who is into Nissans,
I tried unplugging the sensor. From what I'm told with some of those cars they have wired in a switch that interrupts power to the yaw with great success to have some fun. Only downside was the vss light on the dash.
However, with the spyder it throws a vss fault/scrolling message, then a few seconds later a DPs fault with the check engine light.
I even tried turning the bike on and then unplugging, thinking it might initially register as OK....nope.

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[billrob71]

Yeah I'll try that
If you unplug it on Gm cars it will activate the abs system at all times and just doesn't let ya do anything.

I be curious to get the wiring diagram and try to run a jumper to kinda by pass it

[DrewNJ]

I wonder if we could figure out the input voltage when at rest and just jumper that all the time. Or wire in a second yaw sensor in a disabled position and making it switched with the existing one....
Its worth brainstorming right?

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[Bob Denman]

Be careful...

[billrob71]

I wonder if we could figure out the input voltage when at rest and just jumper that all the time. Or wire in a second yaw sensor in a disabled position and making it switched with the existing one....
Its worth brainstorming right?

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Hell yeah it would

gotta get a wiring diagram

Most car now a days seem to start with a 5 volt reference and I would think there some kinda of potentiometer inside that sensor.

When I called BRP a bout possibly recalibrating the VSS system to the setting that the 14s have but they told me everything has been changed so I would be curious if that is the case I would think they could work out a new calibration for it but it's not in there best interest so doubt that will ever happen

[SNOOPY]

[DrewNJ]

Be careful...

Thanks dad....we will.

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[DrewNJ]

Hell yeah it would

gotta get a wiring diagram

Most car now a days seem to start with a 5 volt reference and I would think there some kinda of potentiometer inside that sensor.

When I called BRP a bout possibly recalibrating the VSS system to the setting that the 14s have but they told me everything has been changed so I would be curious if that is the case I would think they could work out a new calibration for it but it's not in there best interest so doubt that will ever happen

So your thinking the sensor is mechanical on the inside? I wish I had one to cut into....but those suckers are pricey!

What's odd is that there are a TON of identical Bosch yaw rate sensors with the exact same plug for many vehicles, but with different part numbers....,
Hmmmm....wonder if different sensors have different calibrations based on movement?

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[billrob71]

I looked up the part numbers today between the 13 and 14 and they are different every thing on them .
We don't replace many at work but I'll keep a eye out for one and see if I can find one

[Bob Denman]

A couple of years' ago; some of the gang tried to contact Bosch, to see if there was a way to program the VSS for varying degress of sensitivity.
They failed to score any useful information...

[DrewNJ]

This might get us pointed in the right direction.... Page 10
http://www.nord-com.net/stoni/docs/bosch_eSensors.pdf

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[DrewNJ]

Looks like your right about the 5v reference.
My first thought is to take the acceleration line output out of the mix. Or give it a 2.5v steady reference?

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[DrewNJ]

I'm wrong. Looks like 2.5v reference . interesting specs

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