Adventure in wrapping exhaust pipes!

[SNOOPY]

Has anyone used the Thermo-tec "Hi-Heat Coating" spray on the wrap? Seems like that could seal it in and give even more protection....

http://www.amazon.com/Thermo-Tec-120...2+heat+coating

LOL

I just ordered my wrap and ordered the spray w/ it, like just 3 minutes ago. lol

Thermo Tec 2"x50' copper #11032 and Coating #12003.

This seemed to be best pricing and free shipping... http://www.amazon.com/Thermo-Tec-110.../dp/B000TXSF4Q


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[SNOOPY]

That's mainly to protect the wrap against moisture. Some absolutely need it, some wraps can go without depending on the material. If the pipes are wrapped in place, it's going to be near impossible to spray them. According to Thermo-Tec support, the copper wrap can go without, but they still recommend it to make the wrap last longer. The copper injection does tend to flow out through the fabric, but with time, the wrapping will likely oxidize as any copper surface would. The spray keeps it from oxidizing more than anything. As for the other brands, their reasons for the spray will vary.

Not sure if I'm wrapping in place or removing yet.

"If" I wrap the pipes "installed", what are your thoughts on spraying the wrap "before" installing and touching up what I can get at afterwards?

[MidLifeCrisis]

Not sure if I'm wrapping in place or removing yet.

"If" I wrap the pipes "installed", what are your thoughts on spraying the wrap "before" installing and touching up what I can get at afterwards?

I think that would hugely complicate the process. Not sure if the spray would crack and peal when flexed. It could also remain tacky until baked on which would make the whole process doubly fun. It may be a good question for their customer service department. They were pretty helpful when I called them. The information I posted above regarding the spray was what they provided when I called them.

One thing you want to ignore for sure in the instructions is the tidbit about curing and light smoke for 20 minutes. The Spyder looks more like it's on fire and it took well over 40 minutes before mine stopped smoking. Just what we need on YouTube, so stay clear of the public.

[cjackg]

Has anyone used the Thermo-tec "Hi-Heat Coating" spray on the wrap? Seems like that could seal it in and give even more protection....

http://www.amazon.com/Thermo-Tec-120...2+heat+coating

The few reviews I found on the spray dont sound too good... The black or aluminum spray is about half the price of the copper... Here's one review that makes me think twice about spraying...

"This product may work on exhaust wrap, but it did not work for me on new metal
as advertised. I used three coats of this product on a pair of new block hugger
headers and the exhaust pipes back to the mufflers that I glass beaded before
painting, and let the paint dry for two weeks. When I started the car, my garage
filled with really toxic smoke from the exhaust, and the Thermo-Tec paint
blistered onto the floor. I DO NOT recommend this product."

[jcthorne]

I do not understand why the thermotec wrap needs to be painted at all. Since it is not exposed to moisture or sunlight, what needs protecting?

[SNOOPY]

I think that would hugely complicate the process. Not sure if the spray would crack and peal when flexed. It could also remain tacky until baked on which would make the whole process doubly fun. It may be a good question for their customer service department. They were pretty helpful when I called them. The information I posted above regarding the spray was what they provided when I called them.

One thing you want to ignore for sure in the instructions is the tidbit about curing and light smoke for 20 minutes. The Spyder looks more like it's on fire and it took well over 40 minutes before mine stopped smoking. Just what we need on YouTube, so stay clear of the public.

That was another one of my questions. I've used wrap on minibikes and they smoke bigtime for a while.

Wonder if it helps keeping the panels off and letting it idle for a bit....

[spyderyderjim]

Not sure if I'm wrapping in place or removing yet.

"If" I wrap the pipes "installed", what are your thoughts on spraying the wrap "before" installing and touching up what I can get at afterwards?

Lowers exhaust pipes heat temps (about 100 degs), quieter, Cool Tec heat shield on top of exhaust pipes wrap stops gas from boiling in tank,(Tucson, Az 112+ deg weather).
You can wrap exhaust pipes in place with lots of patience, MidlifeCrisis did. Use wire like previous mentioned, thread wire attached to wrap on left side pipe up front & over pipe, pull about 1 foot excess wrap, double back over itself close to front of #1 header, wrap tight back to O2 sensor, wire in place. Continue wrap from O2 sensor all the way back to exhaust gasket connection past gas tank.
Here are exhaust temps after wraps on 2013 RT-S exhaust/brake mastercylinder heat wraps, including exhaust heat temps with Lasor temp gun after wraps.
July27, 2013 Exhaust Heat temps after pipeswrapped, Cool-Tec reflective shield,3,700 miles. 168 deg Left # 1 exhaustpipe, idling; 271 degafter ride. 217 deg in front of gas tank; (HP sticky shield insulation around gastank). 290 deg gas tank before insulation wrap; 197deg after wrap. 86 deg gas cap idling; 116 deg after ride. Gas 128 deg. 231deg right # 2 exhaust pipe in front of gas tank . 215deg right #2 exhaust pipe in front of brake master cylinder. 163deg in front of brake master cylinder. 191 deg wrapped Y by pass pipes idling; 385 deg after 30 mile ride. 165 deg pipe in front of 2 Bros muffler idling; 260 deg after ride . 117 deg muffler tailpipe exit at idling; 132 deg after ride. 165deg radiator fan exit right side; insulated with HP sticky shield. Note:Exhaust wrap, plus Cool-Tecreflective shield stopped gas boiling in tank. Exhaust temps lowered about 100 degs oveall.Put #9 Iridium sparkplug in #2 cylinder (#2 cylinder runs lean).
Hope this info helps a few ryders in winter projects. Enjoy. Jim

[3 Wheel Addict]

That was another one of my questions. I've used wrap on minibikes and they smoke bigtime for a while.

Wonder if it helps keeping the panels off and letting it idle for a bit....

It does help to leave the panels off but don't make the same mistake I did and run it with the frunk removed. There is a ambient air temp sensor mounted on it somewhere and it will set codes for that sensor and the MAP sensor, they are tied together somehow. The smoke is excessive and stinky for sure but I ran mine at idle till the fan kicked on and just shut it off and walked away. Short ride later seemed to get rid of the last of the smoke. Long ride on sunday and now it don't stink anymore, hoorah!

[Bob Denman]

That's good to hear!
Do you think that an installation; followed by a couple of hundred miles in the saddle, would be enough to clear the air?

[3 Wheel Addict]

That's good to hear!
Do you think that an installation; followed by a couple of hundred miles in the saddle, would be enough to clear the air?

I would do the idle thing out of the public's eye cause it really really does smoke ALOT! Then not so much after. I rode about a hundred on sunday and all seems great now. I really hope this cures my heat issue as well cause it can't be that simple. My next curiosity is how long will the pipe wrap last?? Will it have to be replaced every so often?? I can't seem to find answers to that question anywhere.

[MidLifeCrisis]

I would do the idle thing out of the public's eye cause it really really does smoke ALOT! Then not so much after. I rode about a hundred on sunday and all seems great now. I really hope this cures my heat issue as well cause it can't be that simple. My next curiosity is how long will the pipe wrap last?? Will it have to be replaced every so often?? I can't seem to find answers to that question anywhere.

So long as the pipes stay clean and moisture free, the wrapping will last. Riding in rain too often will likely shorten the life, but the Spyder pipes are tucked up under the Tupperware enough they should be fine. That's part of the heat problem and the real reason why the master cylinder and canister are melting. You'll be pleased with the results, but may have to come back and insulate a couple of other problem spots if you find them. I didn't, but the 2013 may be different.

[Tx web rider]

when i first got my rs i had the dealer instal the heat tape on the left pipe when he finished the work

i took it to the gas station and was going to head home when i stopped at the pump all of a sudden i was enveloped in this foul smelling smoke

so i kicked off the brake and rolled it away from the pumps when people started pointing and moving away lol

i let it stop smoking and pushed it back after having to explain to the gas station attendant it was not on fire

so please dont do like i did and go directly to a gas station with after the wrap has been installed

[Mr. Bill]

First off let me say it's a huge improvement in sound (quietness of engine) as well as heat. Not sure yet if it's the answer or not but after a lengthy ride I notice way less heat coming out of the cracks by the seat. Gas cap don't seem as hot either, just warm. I don't know how everybody else wrapped their pipes but I completely removed the complete exhaust system to wrap the head pipes from one end to the other. Getting the long front pipe out is a chore! Here's a clue if your thinking about doing this... get 2" wide wrap and it may just be me but the DEI titainium stuff is crap! I started using it first and that stuff like to pull apart if you tugging hard to wrap it tight. Went back to local speed shop and they said get the Thermo-tec "copper" and be done with it. BTW safety wire is the absolute best way to secure it plus you don't have to buy those expensive stainless ties. As of now I pleased with the results and i'm going to see what BRP thinks of this and if it will affect the warranty.

Not sure what the problem was with the DEI Titanium wrap. I just wrapped my full exhaust system in about 30 minutes with the DEI Titanium wrap with a bit of help from a friend to hold the pipes while I wrapped. There was no problem with the wrap ... no pulling apart or tearing of the wrap and we pulled it very tight. This was not the first exhaust we have wrapped. I used stainless steel hose clamps at the ends they seem to work well and are easy to install. The few clamps I needed were only about $1.50 each, the wrap about $60.00. All in all a very quick and easy install. I do have to add that the entire exhaust system was removed for the wrap. I used all but about 3" of a 50 foot roll to do the exhaust and the cat by-pass pipe. This modification should take care of some of the heat issues.
DSCN3895.jpg

[crazyspyder]

Not sure what the problem was with the DEI Titanium wrap. I just wrapped my full exhaust system in about 30 minutes with the DEI Titanium wrap with a bit of help from a friend to hold the pipes while I wrapped. There was no problem with the wrap ... no pulling apart or tearing of the wrap and we pulled it very tight. This was not the first exhaust we have wrapped. I used stainless steel hose clamps at the ends they seem to work well and are easy to install. The few clamps I needed were only about $1.50 each, the wrap about $60.00. All in all a very quick and easy install. I do have to add that the entire exhaust system was removed for the wrap. I used all but about 3" of a 50 foot roll to do the exhaust and the cat by-pass pipe. This modification should take care of some of the heat issues.
DSCN3895.jpg

I did this exact job on my 2012 RT with no problems either, titanium will outlast that COPPER CRAPP ....here we go

[SNOOPY]

But but but....

[spydercamp13]

I had my exhaust wrapped from the headers back, saw absolutely NO difference in my heat problems. In fact after the wrapping which was done by my local can am dealership, I noticed gas bubbling in my gas tank, probably been bubbling since day one, but this was the first that I had removed the gas cap when the tank was full to add some gas additive. I wasn't impressed to say the least.
With all the issues I've had with my 2013 RTS-SE5, I have turned it over to an attorney to file under the federal lemon law act of 1975, Magnuson and Moss. Those of you who have relentless issues with heat related problems and other issues might want to consider doing the same.

[spydercamp13]

Forgot to mention, they only wrapped on side of my exhaust. And after finding the gas bubbling, I called the dealership and had them trailer it back to the shop for another round of whatever is decided. I think I'm ready to go back to the Goldwing. There units are all encased in tupperware and not having all these problems.

[3 Wheel Addict]

Not sure I even want to get this started again? Wrapping may or may not be the answer but It has helped my 13 RT/S to what extent? Won't know that for sure till next summer. In the mean time i'm still waiting for the BRP "fix" or "suggestion" what ever that may be.

[Benggolf]

Thanks all to those who contributed to this thread.
A very interesting and worthwhile project to do IMHO.
Any idea how long the exhaust wraps will last (in terms of mileage or length of service) assuming
you use the Spyder on 1-2 long trips each year only, but regular weekend rides (2-hour trips) from spring to fall.

I guess rust will not be an issue here because the pipes are stainless steel....only probably deterioration of the wraps.
Do you think it will last at least 5 years?

While on this topic of wrapping things up, what do you use to insulate the gas tank? Thanks in advance for the info.

[SNOOPY]

40 years

[PMK]

This topic has me curious. I have used ThermoTec products on an aircraft I maintained. It worked well. I had discussions with ThermoTec prior to installing the tape and they cautioned that the tape can cause increased heat into the pipe. This can result in increased erosion of the metal or in extreme cases, overheat the material causing other problems. They recommended that thin wall exhaust be wrapped with caution.

I also used the safety wire method to secure the tapes, and the tapes were installed wet with water to ease installation.

We ran ThermoTec for many years on the aircraft with no issues to the pipes themselves. Issues that did arise were were the tape working loose over time and required some attention. I never enjoyed working in the exhaust area with bare arms. Not on account of heat, since the ThermoTec wrapped pipes still radiate heat, it was more on account of the ceramic fibres getting in the skin with a feel similar to handling fiberglass.

When the ThermoTec had finally served it's term, I did some research and went with Jet Hot.

http://www.jet-hot.com/

These guys did a blast prep inside and outside on the exhaust tubes. They then applied their coating. Overall, the Jet Hot was a much better barrier for heat (our primary goal). The finish, while we did go with a textured higher temp product, looked great year after. Increased engine performance was a non issue but I'm sure it helped. he big noticeable difference was when doing maintenance. With ThermoTec products, it took a while for the exhaust to cool before you could work without concern for burns. With Jet Hot, the exhaust was cool to the touch in just a minute or two.

So is the wrap being used on Spyders for a cost issue or just convenience to DIY and not ship the pipes?

Not slamming the ThermoTec products since they do work, just curious why I have not seen it mentioned about Jet Hot.

PK

[3 Wheel Addict]

This topic has me curious. I have used ThermoTec products on an aircraft I maintained. It worked well. I had discussions with ThermoTec prior to installing the tape and they cautioned that the tape can cause increased heat into the pipe. This can result in increased erosion of the metal or in extreme cases, overheat the material causing other problems. They recommended that thin wall exhaust be wrapped with caution.

I also used the safety wire method to secure the tapes, and the tapes were installed wet with water to ease installation.

We ran ThermoTec for many years on the aircraft with no issues to the pipes themselves. Issues that did arise were were the tape working loose over time and required some attention. I never enjoyed working in the exhaust area with bare arms. Not on account of heat, since the ThermoTec wrapped pipes still radiate heat, it was more on account of the ceramic fibres getting in the skin with a feel similar to handling fiberglass.

When the ThermoTec had finally served it's term, I did some research and went with Jet Hot.

http://www.jet-hot.com/

These guys did a blast prep inside and outside on the exhaust tubes. They then applied their coating. Overall, the Jet Hot was a much better barrier for heat (our primary goal). The finish, while we did go with a textured higher temp product, looked great year after. Increased engine performance was a non issue but I'm sure it helped. he big noticeable difference was when doing maintenance. With ThermoTec products, it took a while for the exhaust to cool before you could work without concern for burns. With Jet Hot, the exhaust was cool to the touch in just a minute or two.

So is the wrap being used on Spyders for a cost issue or just convenience to DIY and not ship the pipes?

Not slamming the ThermoTec products since they do work, just curious why I have not seen it mentioned about Jet Hot.

PK

There have been lots of people on here that have had their pipes ceramic coated and it works well also, but wrapping is a one day job in your garage with instant results. As far as damaging the pipes, the jury is still out on that one. Our head pipes on the spyders are double wall pipes and I know many people in the race care arena that have had exhaust wrapped for years and it was single wall pipes. Mostly the problem come from wrapping the pipes and then getting them wet causing moisture to accelerate the rusting of the pipes, our pipes are also stainless.

[SNOOPY]

I think my wrapped pipes will outlast the time that I own it, and I plan on keeping my bike a long time.


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[Mowerman]

Can you wrap just the left side pipe? Will that make any problems. I have the cat by-pass installed on my 2013 rt. It just seems like I still have heat coming from the left side pipe.

[timeless]

Can you wrap the exhausts while leaving them in place.
I'm very interested in the wrap, but I'd rather not remove the exhaust pipes, even if it takes more time and material.

I wrapped mine in place 2 years ago, it was hard but doable by using shorter strips & over lapping the joints. I also wrapped the catalytic converter and pipe going to the muffler.