Gun question. To carry or not to carry.

[grumpybob]

True... but WarTime is another matter!
I agree with your assessment; most folks will fall short when the hits the fan. You won't have time for that steely-eyed gaze through the sights...
You'll have time to pull, point, fire and crap yourself... that's about it!
There's nothing romantic about it, and you're not a hero; you're just a survivor! (If you get a bit lucky!)
Now that I've depressed everybody:
RECOGNIZING the start of an ugly situation helps to tip the odds in your favor; live life alert!

Used to hunt bad guys/groups in the USA.

I agree with what you are saying Bob. Will also add PTSD is real, and it doesn't have to be combat that causes it. If you make a mistake you will live with it the rest of your life, even if it was warranted you will still have to live with it - I know I do.

[Bob Denman]

RECOGNIZING the start of an ugly situation helps to tip the odds in your favor; live life alert!

Amen Brother!! I call it situational awareness.

It's funny that you should mention that...

Situational Awareness.jpg

[serf]

I have dual citizenship as I was born in Canada. When I visit friends in Canada I have to leave my weapon at home. I don't feel it is unsafe there but I feel a bit naked without it. Canada doesn't have much of a gun culture but you have your share of crazies up there.

My reason to carry is that I really don't trust law enforcement to protect me. If I call 911 no matter where I may be, the response time for help is going to run from twenty minutes to two hours. If you say 'shots fired' they may bust their ass to get there faster but by then it could be much too late. I don't want it to be too late for me or my wife. We both have CCW permits, we both spend a lot of time on the range, we're both in our seventies and we both would like to enjoy our eighties.

whats the saying... "when seconds count, the police are just minutes away."?

[IWN2RYD]

Everyone has great input on this. And really this is a subject I have a few hours of thoughts on, but respect everyone else's thoughts and opinions to much to make a wall of text two pages long... So I offer...

Simple... Cars kill people more than Guns do in this Country by a landslide. Yet you do not see folks banging down doors to the Manufactures demanding they stop manufacturing them. Instead they demand improvements. And boy have they delivered the last 20+ years!

There are more crimes used with a "Weapon" in this Country than all types of Auto Accidents combined.

The weapon could be anything from a fist, to a stick, ax, gun or what have you.

I have taken Driver ed, defensive driver courses and a few other so that I can better protect my family when behind the wheel. And it has paid off not only for us, but those that I might have had an accident with had I not of had the training. Recent example... Icy road, saw a driver coming through a corner a bit to fast in my estimation... Saw a little to much activity with the steering wheel, made a reactive decision to what I was seeing and I pulled into the next driveway I could (Covered in snow BTW). As soon as I was making that decision (Simultaneously)... The other car lost traction and began to spin uncontrollably. Barely, and I mean I thought for sure the impact was coming, barely missed us, and destroyed the SUV on the telephone pole one driveway down from the driveway I pulled into... Now we believe things happen for a reason, however I am 99% confident that if I did not take that Defensive Driver course, we may have been what that SUV hit... Training and being prepared saves lives.

That is one of many reasons why we both CCW in multiple States. For the Training experience, and preparedness for what "Can" happen. We pray we never ever have to present our weapons. However, I have seen my fare share of folks that would not ever have the ability to get a weapon legitimately harm those who could, can or have.

We all do not live in the "Leave it to Beaver" world. Police officers are being cut everywhere. In fact... Our Sheriffs Dept has one Officer per 10,000 people right now.

It took 22 minutes for one to show up (First on scene BTW) to the accident our now deceased Son was in. Another Seven minutes for the Ambulance. My son lost his life to a regular every day situation that we all see.

Now why I should have the confidence in an Officer being at a crime scene any faster to stop the situation from going bad?

And exactly how do we really think we can stop a person in the middle of a violent act, ask them to stop while we wait for an Officer to assist in the situation?

I do not live on Main Street where Officers roam. I live in a town of 25,000 that has Four Officers in total on duty.

That said, the best lesson I have ever learned from my Officer friends, is to listen to my instincts, always do the best I can to be "Aware" of my surroundings (Meaning other humans movements, actions ETC) and never be perceived as a threat.

Kind of like never being the fastest one on a stretch of HWY... Stay cool, inconspicuous and survive...

[minerdoug]

You never know what kind of "crazies" that you will run into out in the middle of "no where". It is best to try to avoid any situation where self defense is needed, but have a back up plan--Remington 1911 .45!

[Bob Denman]

That's an old GI-issued one; right?
Is it really just a 1911, and not an A1 model??

[grumpybob]

That's an old GI-issued one; right?
Is it really just a 1911, and not an A1 model??

The M1911-A1 was first built/manufactured in 1922or 1923 I think 1922 for sure, slept with an A1 way to many nights.
these upgrades were made to the M1911.

Tang on the grip safety was lengthened to protect the shooter's hand from the hammer

Receiver is cut back on the right side behind the trigger to allow a more natural position for the shooter's trigger finger

Trigger face is cut back and ridged for better finger pressure control


Mainspring housing at the bottom, rear of the handle is arched and knurled to improve shooter's grip

Front sight top is wider to facilitate aiming

[Bob Denman]

Correct! But a non-cobbled-up original 1911...

[devilrider]

i to carry here in MI not all the time because of my job but when off work yes i do feel safe too many nut case's out their its time we take our FREEDEOM BACK THAT SO MANY OF SERVICE MEN AND WOMAN GAVE THERE LIVES FOR AND THE ONES STILL FIGHTING

GOOD BLESS AMERCIA HOME OF THE BRAVE AND FREE

[Bob Denman]

Welcome aboard!

[grumpybob]

i to carry here in MI not all the time because of my job but when off work yes i do feel safe too many nut case's out their its time we take our FREEDEOM BACK THAT SO MANY OF SERVICE MEN AND WOMAN GAVE THERE LIVES FOR AND THE ONES STILL FIGHTING

GOOD BLESS AMERCIA HOME OF THE BRAVE AND FREE

Max Beilke unofficially last soldier out of Vietnam. Killed on flight 22 - 911 at Pentagon. I believe this to be true. Hope I spelled his name correctly

[effgjamis]

You never know when you are going to need the firearm but when you do need it, it can mean the difference between life and death. Why wouldn’t you carry one on a trip? Most trips I never see it and it is in the front case between my knees. You cannot predict what situations you may encounter in life. I try to be ready for all of them I can imagine.
In this modern world we live in, where we give long leashes to crazy people, make excuses for previous dangerous/sociopathic behaviors and actions, empty our prisons early and have a general social disdain for once commonplace morals and values, there are, in fact, thousands of opportunists walking the streets and highways. The police cannot be everywhere nor should they be. Your personal protection is your responsiblity. Get handgun training, practice regularly and be ready to act to save yourself from someone who wants what you have and will kill or injure you to get it. Calling 911 will be worthless in an emergency.

I do not know about you but I am too old to take a beating and too young to die. I do not look for fights but I am going to protect my property and self, period. In Texas, major crime has dropped considerably since conceal/carry rights of Texas citizens. You rarely hear of CHL citizens shooting someone without cause and there are hundreds of examples every year where crimes were averted because of citizens having a firearm. A better question would be, “Why not carry”?

Very well said and I agree 150%. I also carry and I do have a CWL. I also carry a list of all the states which have or have not a reciprocal agreement with my license state. I do try and obey and respect those states by securing my weapon while going through those states of which are getting fewer and fewer.
It was my understanding when, I went into Canada that I best not have any weapon, secured or not regardless of my credentials. ( this was the time of the Magog Spyder Event). Not sure what it would be for a Canadian entering in US.

[bruiser]

Max Beilke unofficially last soldier out of Vietnam. Killed on flight 22 - 911 at Pentagon. I believe this to be true. Hope I spelled his name correctly

You have it correct. But he was officially the last combat soldier to leave Viet Nam in 1973. And the flight he was killed on was American 77. Max was the Ops NCOIC at Camp Alpha when he departed Viet Nam. This is confussing since there were just over 200 GIs remaining in country but they were Marine Guards at the Embassy and military attaches (they replaced MACV).

[bruiser]

It's funny that you should mention that...

Situational Awareness.jpg

Holy Crap . Here kitty kitty, nice kitty.

[grumpybob]

You have it correct. But he was officially the last combat soldier to leave Viet Nam in 1973. And the flight he was killed on was American 77. Max was the Ops NCOIC at Camp Alpha when he departed Viet Nam. This is confussing since there were just over 200 GIs remaining in country but they were Marine Guards at the Embassy and military attaches (they replaced MACV).

Very happy to know somebody else knows/remembers this!! Wasn't sure if it was official or not that he was the last combat soldier to leave, he served in the Army.

[Yeochief]

As a life member of the NRA, retired military and retired postman, I'm likely already in some data base labeled “Potentially Dangerous Nut Jobs”.


If I purchase a firearm, my name will go through the Instant Background Check system, but isn't supposed to be recorded for posterity.


However, if I decide to apply for a Concealed Carry Permit, my name will be on public record as a gun owner. Given the current administration and hysteria over firearms, I have real reservations about having my name on such a list. Just sayin'.

[AlamoRyder]

As a life member of the NRA, retired military and retired postman, I'm likely already in some data base labeled “Potentially Dangerous Nut Jobs”.


If I purchase a firearm, my name will go through the Instant Background Check system, but isn't supposed to be recorded for posterity.


However, if I decide to apply for a Concealed Carry Permit, my name will be on public record as a gun owner. Given the current administration and hysteria over firearms, I have real reservations about having my name on such a list. Just sayin'.

I know what you mean. Everyday things get crazier in this country and I guess we have to live through some real stupidity from our leaders to learn what reality is from the the other sides prospective. I had enough about 3 years ago but I guess some others need another few years. So be it I guess. They can put me on any list they want because I know I am in the right and I will protect my rights to the end. We have a saying here in Texas from our early history with Mexico’s dictator Santa Anna who sent a small force to take a communities small cannon used for protection from Indians. “Come and Take It”!! I don’t look for trouble but I will not bow to abuse. I ain’t worried about no stinkin’ list!!

[bruiser]

My name is already on a lot of lists. By the way, I looked at a Beretta Bobcat and Tomcat for the wife. She liked the feel and weight of the Tomcat. Now I have to find one she can test before I spring for one.

[Bob Denman]

Glad to hear that you found one that'll work for her!

[gnirtsnod]

It must be the Canada in me, but I have seen a few guys post about side arms in here. I am just curious why the need to carry? I have to admit, I haven't been in a lot of the USA. Just the north to mid-west from New York to Washington State, which is probably more than most Canadians. I love to visit the USA.I have a pistol. Never felt I needed it on a road trip. The only places I ever felt concerned for my safety were parts of Michigan and Illinois, and a perhaps some of Indiana. I have relatives that live in Texas in the winter, and they have never expressed a concern. Am I missing something? When I get on the Spyder and venture south, should I be carrying where I can? Looking for advise? I have been in some of the biggest holes in Canada, and made it out. I am not try to stir up the big gun debate, just wonder what people think about the need to carry.

Four of us were riding in the mountains of WV when we decided to take a break along side the road in a little pull-off. A young woman was walking her dog and although she may have been a little concerned, we never even looked toward her or got near her. Well she must have called her man friend because a car load of guys showed up screaming and hollering to us. We all rose, stepped over to the bikes, flipped open the tour paks, and laid our hands on our guns - not pulling them out. The guys chose not to see if we were bluffing and drove on off. We drove on our way, as well. The trip remained enjoyable.

Did someone say something about a "parachute"? ...Don

P.S. I don't go out to eat in Macon without a concealed piece - day or night. I'm not paranoid. I just read the local paper.

[Questions]

"Better to have it and not need it then to need it and not have it."

[bruisersbaby]

My name is already on a lot of lists. By the way, I looked at a Beretta Bobcat and Tomcat for the wife. She liked the feel and weight of the Tomcat. Now I have to find one she can test before I spring for one.

Hoping to take the concealed carry course soon. They offer one on base, through Outdoor Recreation. I'm not new to using a gun (or an M-16) but need the refresher.

[retread]

I have a 12 year old grandson who is going to be attending a gun safety course with me, I need a refresher, and he needs a good start. If he pays attention, and does well, he may be going to the range with me.

john

[retired1]

My house was burglarized. They stole my Model 19 S&W snd my, never fired, 22 cal. Henry"Golden Boy". I wondered if anyone had experience or opinion about the Taurus 45 cal./410 revolver.
Thnx John

[Bob Denman]

Loaded with two and a half-inch .410s; it'll more than do the job on any miscreant!
The Long Colt slugs might cause trouble with over penetration in a household environment