no more evo swaybar

[mrb]

Yep thats my Spyder. Best dollars I spent in my opinion.

[BajaRon]

VTC floorboards
VTC spoiler
VTC mini top vents
Elkas stage 1 shocks
Trailer hitch
Hid kit
Double play
Brite sides all around
Garage remote upgrade
More led lights
Turn signal indicator upgrade
And most important I have a gremlin bell on the way (thanks Bob)

You folks are not going to make me put a sway bar on this thing!

As long as you don't know what you're missing....You'll be fine.

[JCSMOKE]

As long as you don't know what you're missing....You'll be fine.

That's the ticket! I ain't missin nuthin

[darren]

I find it difficult to cut a nice smooth arc in the sharper corners, seems like I'm constantly making corrections....would a sway bar help with this?

Im going to be hammered for this, try stiffer side wall tyres /non genuine, thats only if your have not tried it so far. Besides that the sway bay doe's help

[FANG]

I am stoked - I ordered the sway bar last night from Martin - now just waiting for it to come in. Fang is undergoing some major mods finally. Thanks to my great wife - Christmas present was to allow me to mod up my spyder the way I have wanted it.

Have ordered and received:
Tricled - fender lights and angel eyes
Glordyers
ESI - amber fender tip lights; mud flap lights; and hard bag lights
Custom Dynamics - triple play

on order and awaiting delivery:
Madtad windshield
Bert's Mega Mall - Can-am Givi hard bags with black color panels -- I have a silver moon spyder but want the black so I can pinstripe them in orange as I have the rest of the spyder.

waiting to order:
Corbin Back rest

[SPYD1]

I am stoked - I ordered the sway bar last night from Martin - now just waiting for it to come in. Fang is undergoing some major mods finally. Thanks to my great wife - Christmas present was to allow me to mod up my spyder the way I have wanted it.

Have ordered and received:
Tricled - fender lights and angel eyes
Glordyers
ESI - amber fender tip lights; mud flap lights; and hard bag lights
Custom Dynamics - triple play

on order and awaiting delivery:
Madtad windshield
Bert's Mega Mall - Can-am Givi hard bags with black color panels -- I have a silver moon spyder but want the black so I can pinstripe them in orange as I have the rest of the spyder.

waiting to order:
Corbin Back rest

You will love the sway bar but I strongly recommend complimenting it with a pair of 2011 RT shocks.

[dannymax]

Im going to be hammered for this, try stiffer side wall tyres /non genuine, thats only if your have not tried it so far. Besides that the sway bay doe's help

I checked my tires and the fronts are in the 13# - 15# range, may be a little low for my size...6' 5" @ 250#....think when riding season comes back around this spring I will play with the pressures more and see what happens. I also got a sway bar from Martin and have high hopes for the outcome. Plus, I only got about 600 mi. in before it was time to put it up for winter, so the 'bonding' is no where near complete.

[NancysToy]

I checked my tires and the fronts are in the 13# - 15# range, may be a little low for my size...6' 5" @ 250#....think when riding season comes back around this spring I will play with the pressures more and see what happens. I also got a sway bar from Martin and have high hopes for the outcome. Plus, I only got about 600 mi. in before it was time to put it up for winter, so the 'bonding' is no where near complete.

Try about 18-20 psi in the front tires. You'll be amazed at the difference. Also check to see where your front spring preload is set. You may need to crank it up.

[spyder stryder]

since evo swaybars are no longer available, is it possible, or even worth it, to modify the stock swaybar to stiffen it up. i think one of you hot rodders or engineers would know how to do this.

coz post # 32
The only way to stiffen the stock bar is to shorten the arm length.
If you look at the complete bar the length from bend to bend is the
effective length of the bar which that & the wire size helps determen
the spring rate of the bar.If the spring rate is 300 # with a 6 inch arm
you shortened it to 5 inches then the bar will stiffen up some as the
shorter arm will have less leverage on the bar rate. You would have to
make another upper mount to reconnect the arm back to the chassis.

[FANG]

You will love the sway bar but I strongly recommend complimenting it with a pair of 2011 RT shocks.

Have the shocks already just have to put them on when I get all my other iyems in.

[spyder stryder]

I checked my tires and the fronts are in the 13# - 15# range, may be a little low for my size...6' 5" @ 250#....think when riding season comes back around this spring I will play with the pressures more and see what happens. I also got a sway bar from Martin and have high hopes for the outcome. Plus, I only got about 600 mi. in before it was time to put it up for winter, so the 'bonding' is no where near complete.

A tire has a pumatic spring effect to it. Less air softer
more air harder.With less air the tire will roll over on the
side wall to much and cause a bad feel to the way the bike
handles. These bikes are not to be laid over through a turn
like a two wheeler so you have to break old habits & rethink
what is going on. As the low pressure lets the tire roll to much
it can't turn the weight as well. This can cause a understeering
or pushing effect meaning the bike will want to go straight instead
of holding the radius of the turn as it should. When you added air
the sidewall of the tire stiffened up so it could support the load &
turn the bike better. You need to be careful about the amount of
pressure in these tires as you know not enough & you wear the
outsides faster,to much you wear the center faster. Get something
to check the tire temp with then ride a few miles & check the temp.
Check about 1/2" from each edge & in the center. Center too hot drop
air 1/2 pound at the time until you have even temp,or go up which ever.
When the temp is even up if the bike goes back to the bad steering effect
then you will need a tire with more sidewall support.

[Campverdefela]

Try about 18-20 psi in the front tires. You'll be amazed at the difference. Also check to see where your front spring preload is set. You may need to crank it up.

The shop manual for the RS with the stock tires calls for a max. psi of 17. So is this wise to push the max rating? In my opinion 17 psi is plenty.

[NancysToy]

The shop manual for the RS with the stock tires calls for a max. psi of 17. So is this wise to push the max rating? In my opinion 17 psi is plenty.

As I recall, that manual also recommends 13-15 psi for front tire pressure. Unfortunately, the front tire sidewalls say otherwise. They are rated 15 psi minimum and 30 psi max, I believe. The max pressure means the tire itself is safe far above what BRP recommends. The minimum pressure is the one that worries me most. Tire manufacturers seldom state a minimum pressure, unless there is a serious safety issue running less, like the possibility of vehicle roll-over, or having the tire unseat off the rim. May of us have used about 20 psi on the RS and 18 on the RT for many years and many safe, sane miles. Run what you feel is safe and what handles best, but don't worry too much about anything but pressures outside those printed on the sidewalls.

[spyder stryder]

Ron did a good job on post #15 on the suspension differences between the shocks & bar results.
Now if you guys will look back on post #22 by SPYD1 & enlarge the photo so you can see it better
you will see three springs & two shocks mounted on the front of the spyder. Two springs are mounted
on the shocks which make these a coilover unit. The third spring is the anti roll bar that is red mounted
at the bottom of the chassis. The springs are the only thing that is holding the bike & rider weight up.
The shocks are hydraulic dampeners & will not support weight. They can be valved to be soft & react
quick or be valved stiff & react slower. The anti roll bar is made with spring steel just as the coil spring is.
This spring comes into effect only as the bike leans as you go into a turn then goes away when you complete
the turn & come back onto the straight road.The tires can & will change handeling with air pressure,less air
more flex in the side wall & less help in turning,more air stiffer sidewall more turning help. You need to find the
correct pressure for your bike you & the way you ride. Ok,lets go back to the springs. If your bike has a very
good smooth ride in a straight line but leans to much in a turn you can stiffen the springs to control the lean.
Lets say the spring rate is 200# per inch & you changed to a 300# rate. Now the bike corners much better &
stays flatter through the turn but the straight line ride is to harsh.Now lets back the spring rate down some &
the straight line ride is good but we have more lean than we like. Now time to change the third spring rate the
anti roll bar. Lets say the stock bar has a rate of 200# like the stock springs so we change it to a 300# bar.
Now we still have a good smooth ride & the bike will corner a lot flatter through the corner. By now you should
be catching on to what the springs do verses what the bar does. Now back to the shocks.With a good spring &
bar combo we find the bike has a sensitive or over reacting fell so we take a look & find the bike to be very under
shocked for what we need. So we change the shocks to a stiffer valving ( lets say we have a soft 50/50 2 valved
shock & change to a stiffer 50/50 8 valve shock) with these shocks the bike should have a much more positive feel
& better handeling. Or you might need a 6 valve on compression & a 7 valve on rebound. That will also be the decision
of the rider & how aggresive he rides. I feel it best to make sure your tires have the correct air pressure & stiff enough
sidewalls to support the weight for what you are doing. Then spring & bar rate to control the amount of roll with the
shocks finishing the handeling package. Do this in a complete well tuned package deal along with a very good rider &
you might make a lot of people faint when you set a new record at the Dragons Tail.

[RAYYOU]

Go to ebay motors and put in Item 230711601167. There are six left as of 9:35pm

[spyder stryder]

Ok,back to the springs. If & when you order a set of shocks & springs for your bike tell the supplier
that you want a matched rated springs & settle for no less. What i mean by this is say you have a
set of factory springs on the bike & the guy tells you that you need a pair of 275# springs or what ever.
He should have a spring rater & check the springs so he can match them up on the rate. The spring
can be stamped 275 & rate at 260 with the other rated at 285 if so you just shot your whole deal.
I have seen quite a bit of off rated springs from every spring supplier out there. Just make sure you
get what you need on rates & shock valving. On these anti roll bars bigger the bar the stiffer it is
with the same length & arm length. With limited space where the bar mounts if you can't mount a
bigger bar then take a look at mounting it from the back side. You would have to fab up some chassis
brackets so you can bolt it on then use the stock mounts for the ends to mount back. Don't panic
it works the same no problem there if you have room at the back side. Guess i could take a look myself.
Also if you find a longer bar with the rateing you need you can mount it as long as the tire dosn't hit
it as the wheel is turned. The closer to the wheel the ends mount the better control it will have on roll.

[coz]

thats alot of good information spyder stryder, thanks for the education. it sounds like you're in the business. is the swaybar solid or a tube? i'll put it up on ramps tomorrow and take a real good look at it.

[MMcc]

spyder stryder ; Thanks for the good explanation on the front end geometry. I will reinstall the evo on my 2011 RT and play with the spring settings and also the tire pressure. I was surprised at the difference the bar made on the 2010 RT. I'll try to match the settings for this test. I was told that the front shocks are different between the 2010 and 2011. Not sure if that is true. The numbers on the shocks seem to be the same but the spring is definitely different. If I find an improvement I probably will remove the bar from the 4 sale forum.

[pro10is]

spyder stryder, You know your stuff, nice write ups and great info. Now that the Evo sway bar is history there is currently no plug and play option to change the OEM sway bar. Pity. We still have the option to change the shocks with offerings from Elka, Fox, Progressive and others though. You said when we order a set of shocks to "Just make sure you get what you need on rates & shock valving". I understand that this will be based upon vehicle weight, rider and passenger weight, and riding style, but given that we know this, how do we specify the spring rate and shock valving we need? Could you please expand on this a bit?

Also what is your opinion of the stock shocks vs performance shocks? It's a large investment for a set of performance shocks. Can we expect to see a significant improvement in suspension performance? If so which type of performance shock should we be looking for given those that are currently available? Elka alone has numerous options. Do we need the more expensive offerings or will the lower priced alternatives do?

Sorry for all the questions but your unbiased expertise in this area is very valuable and your opinions would be much appreciated. Answer only if you want. Thank you.

[dannymax]

This is some great information guys....thanks! Coz sent me a PM last night that is nearly word for word what Scotty said....did you guys collaborate?

Seriously, it seems obvious that tire pressure and shock settings need to be increased and I have the perfect corner to gauge results on....there is a long uphill climb with a 25 mph downhill right hander at the top, it unloads the suspension and reloads in the same corner....if it's going to under or oversteer it will do so in this corner.

I realize these things don't handle like an FJR but I should be able to hold a fairly good line without constant correction, I would think. And, I'm not talking about hi-speed road scorching stuff either, maybe 40 mph or so in this particular corner.

Now, if the glacier ever receeds, I'll be out there trying what you fine folks have shared with me! Thanks!!

[coz]

i don't know alot, but i'm glad to share what i do know, as it was shared with me when i was a new guy.i find this front suspension discussion very interesting

[SPYD1]

thats alot of good information spyder stryder, thanks for the education. it sounds like you're in the business. is the swaybar solid or a tube? i'll put it up on ramps tomorrow and take a real good look at it.

Solid

[NancysToy]

spyder stryder ; Thanks for the good explanation on the front end geometry. I will reinstall the evo on my 2011 RT and play with the spring settings and also the tire pressure. I was surprised at the difference the bar made on the 2010 RT. I'll try to match the settings for this test. I was told that the front shocks are different between the 2010 and 2011. Not sure if that is true. The numbers on the shocks seem to be the same but the spring is definitely different. If I find an improvement I probably will remove the bar from the 4 sale forum.

The 2010 and 2011 RT shocks are different, but the springs are the same. BRP increased the damping in the shocks for 2011, and beefed up the spring adjusters.

[NancysToy]

This is some great information guys....thanks! Coz sent me a PM last night that is nearly word for word what Scotty said....did you guys collaborate?

Seriously, it seems obvious that tire pressure and shock settings need to be increased and I have the perfect corner to gauge results on....there is a long uphill climb with a 25 mph downhill right hander at the top, it unloads the suspension and reloads in the same corner....if it's going to under or oversteer it will do so in this corner.

I realize these things don't handle like an FJR but I should be able to hold a fairly good line without constant correction, I would think. And, I'm not talking about hi-speed road scorching stuff either, maybe 40 mph or so in this particular corner.

Now, if the glacier ever receeds, I'll be out there trying what you fine folks have shared with me! Thanks!!

If your adjustments are not sufficient to deal with the conditions you want to overcome, you may still need to go with some aftermarket tweaks. Factory suspensions are a bit of a compromise, made for the comfort and cornering style the average rider needs or wants. There are limits to how far adjustments alone will go to improve performance. In the end, the front end design will also prove to be a limiting factor. You can change the components and spring/shock ratings and performance, but it isn't as easy to change the geometry.

[coz]

i would like to thank scotty, aka nancy's toy for his never ending effort to educate us knuckleheads on a daily basis. scotty your the best.