Do we owe Kenda an apology?

[ThreeWheels]

Do we owe Kenda an apology?
Not hardly.

[bigbadbrucie]

Do we owe Kenda an apology?
Not hardly.

I sure don't. The thought never crossed my mind!

[pegasus1300]

I don't owe them anything. I paid for the tires when I bought the machine, I used them up which did not take long on the rear. The fronts lasted long but I always felt like they were going to roll under in a hard corner and that was why I replaced them before they were worn out. I replaced them with the cheapest tire I could find and they were still better. My neighbor has a 2010 RT that he has ridden over 15,000 miles on the rear tire pulling a trailer, two up. I was amazed but it does happen. I have read of a few others doing that as well. Most times the rear is gone in under 10,000 mi. That is unacceptable. To me they looked at the milage touring motorcycles were getting on their tires and designed a rear tire that would get a similar milage. They succeeded.

[Peacekeeper6]

My cars either wear Michelins/Continentals/Pirellis.

Can't wait to replace my OEM Kendas with any offerings from these brands ........ if they make them.

[Cobwebs]

I don't owe them anything. I paid for the tires when I bought the machine, I used them up which did not take long on the rear. The fronts lasted long but I always felt like they were going to roll under in a hard corner and that was why I replaced them before they were worn out. I replaced them with the cheapest tire I could find and they were still better. My neighbor has a 2010 RT that he has ridden over 15,000 miles on the rear tire pulling a trailer, two up. I was amazed but it does happen. I have read of a few others doing that as well. Most times the rear is gone in under 10,000 mi. That is unacceptable. To me they looked at the milage touring motorcycles were getting on their tires and designed a rear tire that would get a similar milage. They succeeded.

Are you sure the cornering was tyres not suspension?

[Cobwebs]

My cars either wear Michelins/Continentals/Pirellis.

Can't wait to replace my OEM Kendas with any offerings from these brands ........ if they make them.

Probably not. Semi slicks may give you the compound your chasing if your going for performance tyres but few and far between in the correct size otherwise it's Kendas or rock hard car tyres that everyone recommends here.

[ARtraveler]

We are now kind of going round and round with the same subject matter.

Anyone with anything new, or should we go to sleep?

[BajaRon]

Probably not. Semi slicks may give you the compound your chasing if your going for performance tyres but few and far between in the correct size otherwise it's Kendas or rock hard car tyres that everyone recommends here.

How many car tires have you run on your Spyder?

[Cobwebs]

How many car tires have you run on your Spyder?

Enough to know that if I want to ride sedately down a straight flat highway loaded to the gills with passenger, saddle bags full, and possibly towing a trailer, I might come somewhere close (well not very) to the intended load capacity stamped on the sidewall and the performance characteristics that go with the compromised tyre selection I'd made. Counting pennies is not a reason I would entertain either.
I'm happy to replace Kendas when they hit the wear bars and if there's a deeper section of tread left on the edge of the rear so what, sheesh round here it does everyone's head in cause it's different to what they're used to. OOh they're crap, yet not one post about a reply from asking Kenda why they wear like that. It's automatic, oh they balloon out cause they're made in China or Vietnam, let's use something else, but we won't ever admit we're compromising cause then we are going to look dumb replacing one problem with another.
Yeah a few might be out of round or whatever, those that aren't where's the problem?
Just for interests sake I quizzed an AI bot as to the percentage of tyres that have manufacturing defects and the answer was 1-2%.
Asked it is Kenda a quality brand. Yes.
I've had an Avon tyre for my Harley develop a circumferal (is that a word) split in the rubber at about half life. Expensive supposed top of the range tyre.
Wife's Mustang, Pirelli P Zero's cracking at base of tread blocks. 500 bucks a piece.
Brand means nothing.
The base we have here would be so small as to not show up defects in the car tyres that have been fitted and followed up on. What if next week there's 10 guys start bitchin about their car tyres spearing them off the road in the wet and how useless they are what's the general consensus then?
Yes, we have people here with extensive tyre knowledge, doesn't mean there's a tyre that meets all the criteria Spyders require.

[Peter Aawen]

I wasn't going to contribute to this thread at all, as I have a fairly strong suspicion that even if I posted serious comments others would simply try to drag it into **** stirring and arguments, maybe even cause some of them to push the boundaries of the Rules here & possibly result in some being banned for suckering others into arguments/breaking the rules; but also to a fair degree because I've said very close to everything I feel the need to say on this subject more than once in the past, so I won't go thru it all again - you can search 'tires' plus my username/posts for it if you want to find it, then spend a couple of weeks reading.

However, this vid that I've linked below juuust might help those of you who aren't aware of what actually goes on in the industry understand a little more about the priorities of car/tire manufacturers and if/why it might not be such a smart idea to blindly select the OE tire as your replacements once the original tires are worn out or prove unsuitable for YOUR needs/wants (something that is implicity allowed in most countries of the World, and also something that OEM Manufacturers are expressly not permitted by law to 'force' upon owners in some countries too! ) Sure, the vid is about car tires fitted onto an EV, but then, our Spyders ARE UNDENIABLY running on car tires, and there are many parallels to be drawn with our situation from this vid - so please, check it out, especially the bit from around 48 seconds in thru to about 1 minute 35 seconds where he talks about one of the most significant reasons behind vehicle manufacturers specifying a particular tire as an OE Tire; and while you do that, just bear in mind that this vid is talking about a car company and a tire manufacturer where the manufacturers of each have worked closely together and put in a LOT of time, money, and effort into developing the absolute best tire/vehicle match they possibly can, something that clearly (to most anyway ) has not been the case with BRP & Kenda tires. Here it is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yi7dtd9cNQ8

And while you're there, consider that pretty much ALL of the testing for Spyders, and the development of the Safety Suite they run, affectionately called 'the Nanny', was not done on the OEM Spec Kendas, they only came along for the production models - pretty much all the prior testing and development work was done on bog standard, off the shelf car tires! Tires which, just like all of the other car tires out there, might have a MAXIMUM LOAD/MAXIMUM COLD PRESSURE specification printed on their sidewalls that should never be exceeded, but just like pretty much all other pneumatic tires, they DO NOT HAVE A MINIMUM LOAD/MINIMUM COLD PRESSURE specification there!! This is because, by International Agreements, Standards, and Regulations about tires, if these tires are going to be used on the road, they MUST be capable of working safely at less than the maximum levels of both, with the basic 'tenet' applicable to running at less than either being "lower the load, lower the pressure"; OR alternatively, "lower the maximum pressure, lower the maximum load!" And do watch thru to the end if the vid too, there's something worthwhile there too!

Just Sayin'

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

I wasn't going to contribute to this thread at all, as I have a fairly strong suspicion that even if I posted serious comments others would simply try to drag it into **** stirring and arguments, maybe even cause some of them to push the boundaries of the Rules here & possibly result in some being banned for suckering others into arguments/breaking the rules; but also to a fair degree because I've said very close to everything I feel the need to say on this subject more than once in the past, so I won't go thru it all again - you can search 'tires' plus my username/posts for it if you want to find it, then spend a couple of weeks reading.

However, this vid that I've linked below juuust might help those of you who aren't aware of what actually goes on in the industry understand a little more about the priorities of car/tire manufacturers and if/why it might not be such a smart idea to blindly select the OE tire as your replacements once the original tires are worn out or prove unsuitable for YOUR needs/wants (something that is implicity allowed in most countries of the World, and also something that OEM Manufacturers are expressly not permitted by law to 'force' upon owners in some countries too! ) Sure, the vid is about car tires fitted onto an EV, but then, our Spyders ARE UNDENIABLY running on car tires, and there are many parallels to be drawn with our situation from this vid - so please, check it out, especially the bit from around 48 seconds in thru to about 1 minute 35 seconds where he talks about one of the most significant reasons behind vehicle manufacturers specifying a particular tire as an OE Tire; and while you do that, just bear in mind that this vid is talking about a car company and a tire manufacturer where the manufacturers of each have worked closely together and put in a LOT of time, money, and effort into developing the absolute best tire/vehicle match they possibly can, something that clearly (to most anyway ) has not been the case with BRP & Kenda tires. Here it is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yi7dtd9cNQ8

And while you're there, consider that pretty much ALL of the testing for Spyders, and the development of the Safety Suite they run, affectionately called 'the Nanny', was not done on the OEM Spec Kendas, they only came along for the production models - pretty much all the prior testing and development work was done on bog standard, off the shelf car tires! Tires which, just like all of the other car tires out there, might have a MAXIMUM LOAD/MAXIMUM COLD PRESSURE specification printed on their sidewalls that should never be exceeded, but just like pretty much all other pneumatic tires, they DO NOT HAVE A MINIMUM LOAD/MINIMUM COLD PRESSURE specification there!! This is because, by International Agreements, Standards, and Regulations about tires, if these tires are going to be used on the road, they MUST be capable of working safely at less than the maximum levels of both, with the basic 'tenet' applicable to running at less than either being "lower the load, lower the pressure"; OR alternatively, "lower the maximum pressure, lower the maximum load!" And do watch thru to the end if the vid too, there's something worthwhile there too!

Just Sayin'

..... As usual Peter you nailed it ..... I agree with your assessment for paragraph #1. .... I stopped responding for exactly the same reason, I decided I was ...... just let add This should be a STICKY .....Mike

[Cobwebs]

For me dry grip is at the top of the list others will have other requirements. If it can be shown that leaving tread on the rear tyre edges is detrimental to wet grip, I'll change my opinion.
My current setup is Kenda fronts, Nankang rear. Rear needs warming up to reach acceptable adhesion (it is woefully inadequate and spins up immediately when leaving my driveway and has none of the instant or when hot bite the Kenda had. UTQG of the Nankang is 400 or so I think from memory if you want numbers to go by. I prefer feel, but whatever, that's my start point if Kendas become unavailable. Think I scored the last set of Kanines before the supplier went out of business, whether that translates to dealer availability who knows.
Understandable that BRP used whatever was laying around for prototypes, not like they would start with a tyre and work up I guess. Whatever they specified to Kenda we'll never know or why.

My opinion and mine only that's what we're here for.

[Snoking1127]

I final word for the day. Air or n2 AKA inflation is what allows a tire to carry weight. The tire/wheel combination is just a vessel for the air to be pumped into. Less psi = less weight to be carried, more psi = more weight to be carried. To carry a LOT of weight one needs a larger vessel and/or a vessel capable of handling higher PSI inflation. One can have three tires in a given size, a load range C tire rated to 50 psi, a load range D rated to 65 psi and and a load range E rated to 80 psi. The LRD will be rated for more weight carrying than the LRC, the LRE will be rated for more weight carrying than the LRD while the vessel remains labeled as the same size for all three. The construct and weight for the tire normally increases as the load rating goes up. If the Kenda and the car tire that Bajaron weighed were basically the same weight, then one can not really claim the NON Kenda tire was much more robust.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

I final word for the day. Air or n2 AKA inflation is what allows a tire to carry weight. The tire/wheel combination is just a vessel for the air to be pumped into. Less psi = less weight to be carried, more psi = more weight to be carried. To carry a LOT of weight one needs a larger vessel and/or a vessel capable of handling higher PSI inflation. One can have three tires in a given size, a load range C tire rated to 50 psi, a load range D rated to 65 psi and and a load range E rated to 80 psi. The LRD will be rated for more weight carrying than the LRC, the LRE will be rated for more weight carrying than the LRD while the vessel remains labeled as the same size for all three. The construct and weight for the tire normally increases as the load rating goes up. If the Kenda and the car tire that Bajaron weighed were basically the same weight, then one can not really claim the NON Kenda tire was much more robust.

I see where you are going with this ...... However weight per se' will not be the determining factor .... an example of this could be which would be stronger if using Weight as the determing factor - a Spider web or the same web made of Steel ????? .... Google it .....Mike

[BajaRon]

We are now kind of going round and round with the same subject matter.

Anyone with anything new, or should we go to sleep?

I want to thank you, ARtraveler, (and others) for being able to share what might be considered, by some, to be a contrary opinion. And this without any attempt to diminish the opinions and experiences of others. This is the way it should be. An asset to the forum. Just wanted to acknowledge it.

If we aren't willing to hear all sides. Then we will remain locked in place, and the learning process no longer functions. Everyone's opinion should count.

I see where you are going with this ...... However weight per se' will not be the determining factor .... an example of this could be which would be stronger if using Weight as the determing factor - a Spider web or the same web made of Steel ????? .... Google it .....Mike

Spider silk has 5 times the tensile strength than steel at the same diameter strand. Additionally, spider silk can elongate 35–50% its length before snapping compared to 8% steel. Maybe we should be using spyderweb in our tires!

[old Timer]

Believe it or not, my '20 F3 L has 25,000 on the original Kendas up front, the rear, not a Kenda, is a tired 2nd tire.

Will be changing them all out soon.

[Cobwebs]

Believe it or not, my '20 F3 L has 25,000 on the original Kendas up front, the rear, not a Kenda, is a tired 2nd tire.

Will be changing them all out soon.

Just shows how variable this whole thing can get. If you're not individualising your setup, you're going to miss something.

[old Timer]

Just went out and took a pic of the front tire on my '20 F3 L with 25,000 miles on the tire. Smooth up to above 80, OEM Kendas on front.