Exploring Options To Become Certified to work on Spyders

[CloverHillCrawler]

I am testing the waters to start up a side business and if I can get it up and running at a good pace and eventually become my own boss until retirement.

I hear a lot of frustration from people for how long they have to wait to get an appointment for oil changes, tires, accessories or mod installs.

There are a lot of Spyder Owners in the DMV and practically zero Spyder specialty service shops.

I was thinking of offering a mobile pick up and return of your Spyder with whatever work you need done by me within 24-48 hours of the arranged time for pickup.

Also I would do Oil Changes, Tires, and some mod installs onsite with no pickup necessary.

Would there be anyone out there that would be interested in this type of service if it was available?

I would also appreciate answers from outside of the DMV just so I could get a gauge of interest in general.

[USAF]

Great idea, I was thinking about doing it also but keeping it very minimal, but steady.

[PMK]

First off, when you use the term DMV, what does that stand for in your post.

Second, myself, having wanted to do similar to what you suggested, simply have not jumped in with both feet. Tool wise, I have that easily covered, including a ROLO laser alignment setup, BUDS and BUDS2, electronic tire balancing and more Having been a very long time licensed aircraft mechanic that started working on race bikes and tuning suspension 45 years ago, I find Spyders pretty simple to work on.

Why have I not jumped in. Compared to working on aircraft, the effort vs money is not there yet. Also, Spyders are essentially toys. When times are good, toys are popular, when times get tight, toys are less popular. Knowing that, I also learned long ago, when making a hobby your line of work, it can become a burden that loses the glamor.

Without any doubt, I could easily take in a lot of local work. But currently, not what I desire. Besides, when a person does have me sort out issues with their Spyder that a dealer or shop gives up on, typically I do it for free, simply to help another person. So far, each time, I never expected anything in return, but did make a friend, or helped a friend, and in some unsuspecting way reciprocate.

All the best in pursuing this. Maybe some day I will get serious about it, just not yet.

[ARtraveler]

The local aspect is very important. I note you are from Maryland. I live in Arkansas. Glad I have two independents close to me already.

I won't vote in the poll because it is a moot issue for me.

[CloverHillCrawler]

First off, when you use the term DMV, what does that stand for in your post.

Second, myself, having wanted to do similar to what you suggested, simply have not jumped in with both feet. Tool wise, I have that easily covered, including a ROLO laser alignment setup, BUDS and BUDS2, electronic tire balancing and more Having been a very long time licensed aircraft mechanic that started working on race bikes and tuning suspension 45 years ago, I find Spyders pretty simple to work on.

Why have I not jumped in. Compared to working on aircraft, the effort vs money is not there yet. Also, Spyders are essentially toys. When times are good, toys are popular, when times get tight, toys are less popular. Knowing that, I also learned long ago, when making a hobby your line of work, it can become a burden that loses the glamor.

Without any doubt, I could easily take in a lot of local work. But currently, not what I desire. Besides, when a person does have me sort out issues with their Spyder that a dealer or shop gives up on, typically I do it for free, simply to help another person. So far, each time, I never expected anything in return, but did make a friend, or helped a friend, and in some unsuspecting way reciprocate.

All the best in pursuing this. Maybe some day I will get serious about it, just not yet.

HI, DMV stands for DC, Md., And Va. Well this would be a Second time I turned a hobby into work, The first time was 23 years ago ago when I started doing IT work.

I was a Licensed First Grade Stationary Power Engineer at the Virginia Hospital Center in Arlington Va. for 10 years and turned my hobby of hacking and fixing and building computers into a job.

After switching careers to something I love I went on to get my A+ , MCP, MCSA, MCSE as well as obtaining numerous manufacturer certs to perform warranty work on their equipment, my last IT Job I was a tier 3 admin at Cisco until the pandemic hit ending my 23 year run in IT.

I work as a Gardener in a Medical Marijuana grow now once again taking something I love and doing it as work but as you may guess you have to work around a lot of sketchy people. I enjoy the work and being around the plants but the people are just really hard to deal with at times

thus why I was thinking of starting this as a side business to slowly be able to pull back and get something started on my own. I really just want to somewhat be able to control my hours and most of all quality control of the work that is being performed.

[CloverHillCrawler]

The local aspect is very important. I note you are from Maryland. I live in Arkansas. Glad I have two independents close to me already.

I won't vote in the poll because it is a moot issue for me.

I'm glad you have 2 nearby that can take you in when it needs to be done. There are multiple dealers in the DMV area but try calling one to get an oil change.

Better plan ahead because you are not getting it done without a 8-10 week wait time for an appointment so there are a lot of "toys" around here, also if you have ever driven around the DMV there isn't much patience.

[old Timer]

It would be fantastic if there was such an operation as Brother Crawler is talking about here in Alamogordo New Mexico

Being tool equipped as PMK above described would definitely be the secret plan.

[RayBJ]

I would love to have an independent shop with the tools and skills needed for the Spyder as an alternative.

I'm in central NJ. I rarely bring bikes to dealer except for major milestones requiring tools/skills beyond me. My Spyder has 25000 miles and hasn't seen the dealer since 9/20 purchase. I don't know the quality or availability of my dealer's service but I'm not optimistic based on local legend. The usual story is "The ace tech quit and the new guy is over his head".

As long has you can afford the lean times, I'd say do what makes you happy.

[CloverHillCrawler]

I would love to have an independent shop with the tools and skills needed for the Spyder as an alternative.

I'm in central NJ. I rarely bring bikes to dealer except for major milestones requiring tools/skills beyond me.

I did less than that with my Jet Ski's they never saw a dealership after the initial purchase. I did everything with them including a full tear down to repaint them to match the color scheme of the truck I used to tow them.

[ARtraveler]

I'm glad you have 2 nearby that can take you in when it needs to be done. There are multiple dealers in the DMV area but try calling one to get an oil change.

Better plan ahead because you are not getting it done without a 8-10 week wait time for an appointment so there are a lot of "toys" around here, also if you have ever driven around the DMV there isn't much patience.

Yes. I have never had any of my Spyders serviced at an "official" dealer since moving to AR. With Lamonster Garage and Spyderpops within driving distance I have had both work on my Spyders. Also bought two new ones since moving here. Did not use any of the "local" dealers. They did not want to negotiate. Bought both my F3L's from iMoto.

[RiderDuke]

Is Fredericksburg, VA too far for you.... I may come up and bring mine to you when needed... I think your plan is a good one.
Hopefully you will be able to make it profitable..

[Bfromla]

Like the idea good luck with it by all means Available dealerships have decreased a bit & unfortunately so has the customer service. Maybe once you get going could venture out to the deprived areas like Hawaii ”Working vacation” have read of spyders there.

[CloverHillCrawler]

Is Fredericksburg, VA too far for you.... I may come up and bring mine to you when needed... I think your plan is a good one.
Hopefully you will be able to make it profitable..

I'm am not doing anything yet I'm just exploring the options to be able to do it before I present it to the big boss for approval and I can pull my nuts off of the shelf to take out with me. Just ing honey!

But if you are in some need of some help I can assist , I have been looking for somebody else to ride around with in the area. Surprised we haven't met already through the DMV Spyder Ryders. So if you are in need with help with something PM me and we can setup a time to come by and as I have offered to other people I can show you some roads around here as I am just a couple of minutes away from Hamburg road that goes directly up to Gambrill Park road on Catoctin Mountain which opens up options to the valley roads between there and South mountain with gorgeous views.

I pretty much have almost everything I need in tools with the exception of buds. I was getting ready to pull the trigger on BUDS so for anything else is to disable my own DESS plus with my IT and Engineering skills dig deeper into the ECU.

This may become a service offered as well as long as I could make enough to justify to pay for the licensing.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

Some words from my own experience as a small business owner/operator from 45 years ago. They're still relevant.

1. People do not like to pay for labor as a line item. They always think you're charging too much. That's why car dealers sell an oil change or brake pad replacements as a job bundle with no breakout for labor.

2. The time spent on "overhead" activities such as getting the customer's information, determining what they want/need, dealing with suppliers, bookkeeping, researching for answers, and on and on, take up a tremendous percentage of the time you spend at and in the business. You will need to earn 100% of your income with about 50 to 60% chargeable time. And don't forget having income to cover time off for vacations, etc. When I tracked all my activities during the day for a week or two once, I discovered that for every 10 hours I spent in the print shop, I was generating revenue, i.e., running the printing press, or taking orders for wedding invitations and rubber stamps, about 4 or 5 hours a day.

3. Social security taxes, insurance, and so forth will eat up probably about 20% of your income. This doesn't include personal income tax. That eats away another big chunk.

4. Making connection with potential customers will a challenge. They don't just come to you out of the blue. Advertising is at best, a crap shoot. And as you may have seen even in this forum, the 15% of customers who are complainers out shout probably 10 to 1 the 85% of satisfied customers.

5. If anyone else in the area is doing the same business, but has an attitude of, "If I can just cover my expenses (pay my rent; make my equipment payment; etc.) I'll be OK," you'll be done for before you even start. You can't compete against someone who is dumb enough to work for nothing. And believe me, they are out there. And as soon as one folds another one pops up.

6. The fewer resources needed to enter the business, the lower the probability of success. The greater the required investment to get into a vocation, meaning time, education, and money, the greater the income one can realize from it. Why do suppose a brain surgeon makes a hell of a lot more money than does the local school janitor?

7. You will need to see yourself as a small business operator first, and a mechanic second. If you love Spyders, and love to work on them, you'll have to make that love subservient to being a business man. Otherwise your priorities will get all screwed up.

The greatest force that keeps small businesses alive is - - - - - HOPE! And you can't borrow money against hope! A great resource for business advice is SCORE, the Service Corps of Retired Executives. They're a service of the Small Business Administration. https://www.sba.gov/local-assistance...ess-mentoring. The best part is they don't charge for their consultations.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do. Doing this poll is a good start, but be careful how much you rely on it.

[hut1]

I live in Delaware, just outside of the DMV. My local dealer, Diamond Motor Sports, is only 25 minutes away, and is the only dealer on the whole Delmarva Peninsula. Although I've been very happy with DMS' service and availability, I fully support your pursuit of this venture. If you get it up and running, maybe you could bring mobile service over to the Eastern Shore during Delmarva Bike Week in September. There were several spyders around here then, but not much in the line of service, accessories, or installation. I'm probably getting way ahead of your possible plans, but I like the way you're thinking.

[Peter Aawen]

I think it's a great idea, and there probably should be more of it.... but do look carefully into the why's & wherefore's, costs, & the risks of it all first; and especially investigate the necessary steps/costs if you are ever planning on becoming 'certified' to work on Spyders &/or any other Can Am gear. Here in Oz, the ONLY way you'll get that certification is if you work for a dealer selling that particular model/product range, & it (still?) aint cheap!!

That's not saying that we don't have some very skilled technicians here who, while not specifically 'certified' to work on Spyders, are otherwise fully qualified mechanics/bike mechanics; are usually Spyder owners/ryders; and who have learnt hands-on the ins & outs of Spyder wrenching - learning things so well that I'd put most of them up against any 'certified' Spyder tech any day & know who'd do the best job hands down... and it isn't the Can Am qualified bloke!

But then there's the problem of access to things like BUDS, Bossweb, and even parts at a reasonable price - often BRP won't make these available or sell to anyone but their local dealer, who will probably just stick them in with their usual 'slow-boat' order & delivery service and will also want to charge the BRP Recommended Retail Price.... which means that any parts you need to carry out any work will come at a premium!

So while it's a great idea, it won't be easy, and it won't be cheap! But you'll likely get a LOT of custom!

[PMK]

Like the idea good luck with it by all means Available dealerships have decreased a bit & unfortunately so has the customer service. Maybe once you get going could venture out to the deprived areas like Hawaii ”Working vacation” have read of spyders there.

Fully agree, it seems the Spyder dealers that had capability beyond just selling units has seen many of those dealers drop the Spyder line.
A person does not need to research or read much, even talk to other owners, to learn about the poor quality of service many, many dealers fall into.
Like any toy, when fun and not broken they get used and praised. When broken, they get swept aside and often gotten rid of. Without good dealers, that have good techs, and deliver quality work in a timely manner, the downward spiral has begun.

[PMK]

I'm am not doing anything yet I'm just exploring the options to be able to do it before I present it to the big boss for approval and I can pull my nuts off of the shelf to take out with me. Just ing honey!

But if you are in some need of some help I can assist , I have been looking for somebody else to ride around with in the area. Surprised we haven't met already through the DMV Spyder Ryders. So if you are in need with help with something PM me and we can setup a time to come by and as I have offered to other people I can show you some roads around here as I am just a couple of minutes away from Hamburg road that goes directly up to Gambrill Park road on Catoctin Mountain which opens up options to the valley roads between there and South mountain with gorgeous views.

I pretty much have almost everything I need in tools with the exception of buds. I was getting ready to pull the trigger on BUDS so for anything else is to disable my own DESS plus with my IT and Engineering skills dig deeper into the ECU.

This may become a service offered as well as long as I could make enough to justify to pay for the licensing.

As a suggestion, based on your computer background, I would skip dirty work entirely. Meaning, do not bother with oil changes, alignments or tire changes. Use the skills you have and offer a specialty service to add on customer supplied accessories that require electrical knowledge. As examples, led lights, led headlights, trailer wiring, sound systems, navigation, heated gear, battery tender hookups, power panels and more.

Specialty services, such as those are not done by dealers, except maybe oem trailer stuff. Becoming a service and installation center for these products jumps you into competition with similar shops, and away from the drudge work dealers contend with. Doing this also avoids two of the most controversial Spyder topics, tires and oil.

[RiderDuke]

I'm am not doing anything yet I'm just exploring the options to be able to do it before I present it to the big boss for approval and I can pull my nuts off of the shelf to take out with me. Just ing honey!

But if you are in some need of some help I can assist , I have been looking for somebody else to ride around with in the area. Surprised we haven't met already through the DMV Spyder Ryders. So if you are in need with help with something PM me and we can setup a time to come by and as I have offered to other people I can show you some roads around here as I am just a couple of minutes away from Hamburg road that goes directly up to Gambrill Park road on Catoctin Mountain which opens up options to the valley roads between there and South mountain with gorgeous views.

I pretty much have almost everything I need in tools with the exception of buds. I was getting ready to pull the trigger on BUDS so for anything else is to disable my own DESS plus with my IT and Engineering skills dig deeper into the ECU.

This may become a service offered as well as long as I could make enough to justify to pay for the licensing.

Joining a group in Maryland and a group mostly on Facebook hasn't been on my Radar... I may have to check it out... I've done a great deal of wrenching on my previous bikes Yamaha's, Honda's and Harley's and only started on my Spyder.... I'll take you up on your offer for assistance.. Also We will have to meet-up for lunch one day... All my riding buddies are 2 wheel bikes. it would be nice to get out with a Spyder Rider... I think you are only a couple hours away...

[CloverHillCrawler]

Joining a group in Maryland and a group mostly on Facebook hasn't been on my Radar... I may have to check it out... I've done a great deal of wrenching on my previous bikes Yamaha's, Honda's and Harley's and only started on my Spyder.... I'll take you up on your offer for assistance.. Also We will have to meet-up for lunch one day... All my riding buddies are 2 wheel bikes. it would be nice to get out with a Spyder Rider... I think you are only a couple hours away...

The DMV Spyder Ryders are a great group to hook up with and the leaders have some amazing things planned for next year. But they primarily do their rides in the eastern part of maryland and it can be trek to meetup with them in Bowie. https://www.meetup.com/DMV-Spyder-Ryders/

Just PM me if you want to meet up for a Ride and we can setup the details.

I have gear to ride hot or cold so the only time when my Spyder is idle is when there is Snow or Salt on the road and it comes back out after the first or second rain that washes the salt off of the road.

[CloverHillCrawler]

As a suggestion, based on your computer background, I would skip dirty work entirely. Meaning, do not bother with oil changes, alignments or tire changes. Use the skills you have and offer a specialty service to add on customer supplied accessories that require electrical knowledge. As examples, led lights, led headlights, trailer wiring, sound systems, navigation, heated gear, battery tender hookups, power panels and more.

Specialty services, such as those are not done by dealers, except maybe oem trailer stuff. Becoming a service and installation center for these products jumps you into competition with similar shops, and away from the drudge work dealers contend with. Doing this also avoids two of the most controversial Spyder topics, tires and oil.

I hear what you are saying but I am no stranger to doing dirty work, while working at the hospital I would deal with plenty of "dirty stuff" I maintained various sizes of cummings emergency generators, several trane centravac 3 and 5 stage chillers, and 3 Cleaver brooks boilers (2 - 750 BHP water tube boilers and a 500 BHP fire tube boiler) along with all of the associated equipment for a Physical Plant. And the Oil change is probably the one thing that would get this going as the wait time for this amongst dealers in this area is absolutely ridiculous for one of the most easiest things to do with our Spyders.

[PMK]

I hear what you are saying but I am no stranger to doing dirty work, while working at the hospital I would deal with plenty of "dirty stuff" I maintained various sizes of cummings emergency generators, several trane centravac 3 and 5 stage chillers, and 3 Cleaver brooks boilers (2 - 750 BHP water tube boilers and a 500 BHP fire tube boiler) along with all of the associated equipment for a Physical Plant. And the Oil change is probably the one thing that would get this going as the wait time for this amongst dealers in this area is absolutely ridiculous for one of the most easiest things to do with our Spyders.

Fully agree, oil changes with filter are super easy. Logistically, the task is easy, having the parts is a bit of an inventory issue. Some run BRP oil and filter, others run BajaRon filters, with Shell Rotella, or Amsoil, or Mobil 1 or Motul or ??? This assumes you plan to profit on parts sales. Owners could always bring their own oil and filter.

[CloverHillCrawler]

Some words from my own experience as a small business owner/operator from 45 years ago. They're still relevant.

1. People do not like to pay for labor as a line item. They always think you're charging too much. That's why car dealers sell an oil change or brake pad replacements as a job bundle with no breakout for labor.

2. The time spent on "overhead" activities such as getting the customer's information, determining what they want/need, dealing with suppliers, bookkeeping, researching for answers, and on and on, take up a tremendous percentage of the time you spend at and in the business. You will need to earn 100% of your income with about 50 to 60% chargeable time. And don't forget having income to cover time off for vacations, etc. When I tracked all my activities during the day for a week or two once, I discovered that for every 10 hours I spent in the print shop, I was generating revenue, i.e., running the printing press, or taking orders for wedding invitations and rubber stamps, about 4 or 5 hours a day.

3. Social security taxes, insurance, and so forth will eat up probably about 20% of your income. This doesn't include personal income tax. That eats away another big chunk.

4. Making connection with potential customers will a challenge. They don't just come to you out of the blue. Advertising is at best, a crap shoot. And as you may have seen even in this forum, the 15% of customers who are complainers out shout probably 10 to 1 the 85% of satisfied customers.

5. If anyone else in the area is doing the same business, but has an attitude of, "If I can just cover my expenses (pay my rent; make my equipment payment; etc.) I'll be OK," you'll be done for before you even start. You can't compete against someone who is dumb enough to work for nothing. And believe me, they are out there. And as soon as one folds another one pops up.

6. The fewer resources needed to enter the business, the lower the probability of success. The greater the required investment to get into a vocation, meaning time, education, and money, the greater the income one can realize from it. Why do suppose a brain surgeon makes a hell of a lot more money than does the local school janitor?

7. You will need to see yourself as a small business operator first, and a mechanic second. If you love Spyders, and love to work on them, you'll have to make that love subservient to being a business man. Otherwise your priorities will get all screwed up.

The greatest force that keeps small businesses alive is - - - - - HOPE! And you can't borrow money against hope! A great resource for business advice is SCORE, the Service Corps of Retired Executives. They're a service of the Small Business Administration. https://www.sba.gov/local-assistance...ess-mentoring. The best part is they don't charge for their consultations.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do. Doing this poll is a good start, but be careful how much you rely on it.

Hey do you know my wife? I get this type of lecture from her each time I talk about starting my own business. The last time was when we were living in Raleigh I wanted to open a general store with the live in area above it that you could get your groceries like a quickie mart but also had PC repair available.

The one thing she puts emphasis on each time ... 50% of all small businesses go under! I don't think she will ever let me start a full blown business on my own or let me be my own boss.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

The one thing she puts emphasis on each time ... 50% of all small businesses go under! I don't think she will ever let me start a full blown business on my own or let me be my own boss.

She's partially correct. The percentages are something on the order of 50% the first year and 90% at five years. I managed to avoid going out of business. I sold it after 4 years while it was still functioning and left town. It continued on for several years with a succession of owners and business names. Not sure how long it lasted.

Another thing I forgot to add. On a dollars per hour worked basis, small business owners on the whole are one of the lowest paid workers in the country. There is no requirement to be paid overtime, be given paid vacation, be offered medical insurance, and every customer is your boss.

All the above is why for 21 years I chose a steady paycheck that gave me a decent retirement rather than trying to be a business owner again.

[UtahPete]

I don't see how pick up and return could work, economically. I think you need to go to them and do the work onsite. Get the local Spyder groups to set up enough work in one location for you to justify going there for a weekend. Talk to Joe and Ann of Squared Away for the lowdown on how that works.

BTW, unless you have the ability to deal with difficult, demanding people, you're not going to enjoy or become successful as a small business person.

I hope you can figure it out and make it work for you. The Spyder community needs more independent shops!