Results 1 to 24 of 24
  1. #1
    Very Active Member Haze's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Location
    Lynden, WA
    Posts
    1,209
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default Front Wheel Balance and Balance Beads

    What is the best way to balance the front tires/wheels on an F3T? It has new Vredestein tires that have ~3000 miles.

    Issue: Right now both fronts are bubble balanced. Both wheels have a significant
    number of weights tightly grouped together. There is still a bit of vibration from the front of the bike.
    I'm wondering if the tires were installed with the heavy spot (dot) in the wrong location.

    What is the best way to fix the vibration balance issue?

    Options:
    1. Scrape off the present weights and re-balance.

    2. Find a different installer to remount the tires on the wheels and re-balance.

    3. Leave the wheels and tires as is and add 1.5 oz of balance beads to each wheel.

    Thanks, David C.
    David C
    2016 F3T
    DIY Garage Door Opener & GPS Mount
    Battery tender cable
    Rear IPS Pack Rack



  2. #2
    Very Active Member BLUEKNIGHT911's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Central VERMONT
    Posts
    20,272
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Haze View Post
    What is the best way to balance the front tires/wheels on an F3T? It has new Vredestein tires that have ~3000 miles.

    Issue: Right now both fronts are bubble balanced. Both wheels have a significant
    number of weights tightly grouped together. There is still a bit of vibration from the front of the bike.
    I'm wondering if the tires were installed with the heavy spot (dot) in the wrong location.

    What is the best way to fix the vibration balance issue?

    Options:
    1. Scrape off the present weights and re-balance.

    2. Find a different installer to remount the tires on the wheels and re-balance.

    3. Leave the wheels and tires as is and add 1.5 oz of balance beads to each wheel.

    Thanks, David C.
    " Bubble Balance " as in Static balance ???? .... I just had my new Q-5's mounted and SPUN balanced ..... minimal weights and Spyder is smooth as Glass. ....... good luck .... Mike

  3. #3
    Very Active Member pidjones's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Location
    East TN
    Posts
    538
    Spyder Garage
    1

    Default

    Are you sure the old weights were removed when the new tires were installed?
    "Love 'em all.... Let GOD sort 'em out!"
    2021 RTL Dark Chalk Metallic with comfort seat
    1978 GL1000 w/'75 engine show bike
    1976 RD400c

  4. #4
    Very Active Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    indpls in
    Posts
    851
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    scrap weights off put ride on tire balance in

  5. #5
    Active Member Tourer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2022
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    131
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    I have used Dyna Beads on my last 6 bikes with tubes and tubeless tires. Haven’t had any issues.


    https://www.innovativebalancing.com/motorcycle.htm
    2015 F3S SE6

  6. #6
    Very Active Member RayBJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2020
    Location
    Middletown, NJ
    Posts
    1,321
    Spyder Garage
    1

    Default

    I'd start with old weights cleaned off rim and re-balance. Bubble Balance is better than nothing but Spun is best with Marc Parnes as 2nd choice.
    The dyna beads will work BUT, it may take a few minutes of riding before they loosen up and do their job. The other issue of beads is if you have to plug a flat, the beads will stick to the gooey plugs or tire sealant and will cancel any balancing ability.
    '20 Spyder RT: Bajaron swaybar. Vredestein tires, Pedal Commander, Elka front shocks, GPS/USB/12V handlebar mount, Heli-Bars, Radar Detector, KOTT grills & vents, Shad top case, chin & DRL LEDs.
    2020 RT base , Chalk White

  7. #7
    Active Member Tourer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2022
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    131
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    Interesting about the beads sticking to the glue from a tire plug. Never thought about that. But if a plug was installed, the tire should be replaced as soon as possible.
    2015 F3S SE6

  8. #8
    Ozzie Ozzie Ozzie Peter Aawen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Australia; Sth Aust, Adelaide Hills
    Posts
    9,515
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    Spin balancing by a competent & skilled operator is the best option you are likely to have; and if you get your tires re-balanced by such an operator, they'll remove all the old balance weights AND adjust the tire positioning on the rim if & as required to best match the heavy/light spots on both the rim & the tire & to reduce the impact of any (minor) radial runout that might be present. If you don't think your current installer would do that without you pushing for it, then by all means, find an installer/balancer who will! . Balancing the front tires of a Spyder should be a simple task, just so long as they've got the right size fittings for their machine, and since our Spyder rims have the same dia holes & stud set-up as some modern cars, they shouldn't really have any hassles or concerns with getting those so they can do a proper job for you...

    Using balance beads or fluid is a bit of a bandaid solution that may or may not work all that well that was invented to cater for tires that weren't made to the same standards of quality & balance that most modern auto tires are, so you shouldn't really need to use any of that with a properly balanced quality auto tire like the Vredesteins. If you do feel the need after a 'proper' spin balance, it might pay to get your tire tech to check the balance of the RIM alone - ie. take the tire off and spin balance the rim by itself just to check its balance & see if it's true.... there have been 'a few' dodgy rims from the factory hit the streets on Spyders/Rykers!

    Good Luck!
    2013 RT Ltd Pearl White

    Ryde More, Worry Less!

  9. #9
    Very Active Member troop's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Location
    Stoughton, WI
    Posts
    2,524
    Spyder Garage
    2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by fatboy View Post
    scrap weights off put ride on tire balance in
    And, according to the product tech at Ride-On, use the motorcycle product at regular dosage level, EVEN in car tires..


    2022 RT Sea To Sky
    --------------------------------
    2022 RT Seat To Sky , Mystery Blue

  10. #10
    Very Active Member Haze's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Location
    Lynden, WA
    Posts
    1,209
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    Thanks to all for the advice. Spin balance is my next option...
    David C
    2016 F3T
    DIY Garage Door Opener & GPS Mount
    Battery tender cable
    Rear IPS Pack Rack



  11. #11
    Very Active Member PMK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    SoFlo
    Posts
    4,300
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    Just FWIW, there are multiple methods to accomplish a static balance. The old and kind on antiquated method of the horizontal bubble balance setup is one method, a second method is vertical static balancing with the wheel mounted on cones and a spindle, then placed on a form of either rolling or true knife edges. Third is where the tire / wheel assembly is spun while in the static setting. Overall, the common factor in all three techniques and tooling is that no emphasis is done to prevent wobble or precession. Static balance, merely removes the tire / wheel assembly imbalance in regards to lessening hop. In the era of high aspect ratio tire / wheel assemblies removing hop was important and the aspect ratio naturally lessened chances of precession. In my opinion / experience, bubble balancing is least desired of the three, knife edge balancing is superior to bubble balancing, while machine spin static balancing is the better of the three.

    As aspect ratios decreased, true dynamic balancing became more important. This not only balances to remove vertical imbalance or hop, done correctly it will remove imbalance at each end of the rotating mass. This prevents wobble or precession type issues.

    In regards to will a tech remove a tire and find a better position on the wheel, maybe but unlikely, unless there is a huge amount of weight required OR the equipment they are using is the modern road force style that explains to the tech that the reposition is needed.

    The balancer I have here at home allows me to balance a multitude of automotive and truck setups and easily balance Spyder fronts to within one tenth of an ounce dynamically and spun for static imbalance. With oem Kendas front tires, I have sorted balance issues for local Spyder owners when their local dealer could not resolve the issues and refused to work on the Spyder any more. Balancing good tires such as Federal Formoza front tires typically requires very little weight. Our own Spyder, with Fomoza fronts, dynamically balanced and running centramatic balancers is stupid smooth.

    If you were nearby, 15 minutes and you would be dialed in, unless the tire was not round.

  12. #12
    Active Member RangerRick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2022
    Location
    Coos Bay, Oregon
    Posts
    207
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    When I had my set of Vredestein Quatrac SL tires put on the front I told the tire place to balance them, but there is no weights on them and there fine. Evidently these tires are made well enough, Just like the Avon's I used on my motorcycle as they had no mark for where the valve stem should be.

  13. #13
    Active Member T.P.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    APPLE VALLEY, MN
    Posts
    422
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RangerRick View Post
    When I had my set of Vredestein Quatrac SL tires put on the front I told the tire place to balance them, but there is no weights on them and there fine. Evidently these tires are made well enough, Just like the Avon's I used on my motorcycle as they had no mark for where the valve stem should be.
    Just a short note here, There is no such tire as a VREDESTEIN QUATRAC SL, The SL stands for Standard Load and has a max pressure of 35psi, XL's are to 41psi
    It is not a tire model

    T.P.

  14. #14
    Active Member RangerRick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2022
    Location
    Coos Bay, Oregon
    Posts
    207
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by T.P. View Post
    Just a short note here, There is no such tire as a VREDESTEIN QUATRAC SL, The SL stands for Standard Load and has a max pressure of 35psi, XL's are to 41psi
    It is not a tire model

    T.P.
    OK so it's a VREDESTEIN QUATRAC

    https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires...rtnum=755TR5QT
    Last edited by RangerRick; 08-28-2022 at 06:22 PM.

  15. #15
    Very Active Member PMK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    SoFlo
    Posts
    4,300
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RangerRick View Post
    When I had my set of Vredestein Quatrac SL tires put on the front I told the tire place to balance them, but there is no weights on them and there fine. Evidently these tires are made well enough, Just like the Avon's I used on my motorcycle as they had no mark for where the valve stem should be.
    I suppose it is possible to have two tires mounted and need no balance weights, but seems extremely unlikely. More possible is, as others here indicate, unskilled techs accomplishing important tasks. Then again, maybe you did get two perfectly balanced tire / wheel assemblies that needed no weight at all.

  16. #16
    Active Member Dmetcalf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    451
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    Centramatic wheel balancers is what I’m using.
    2016 RT-Ltd
    Bajaron swaybar
    Spyderpops trunk light
    Elka stage 2 front shocks
    Extra longbrake pedal
    brake modulator
    Centramatic wheel balancers on the front and rear.
    Rivco dual flag holder
    Tricled mirror turn signal indicators
    with American and Texas flags
    Lamonster Magic Mirrors
    missing belt guard
    Lambskin seat cover from Smokey mountain sheepskin.com
    Tricled 360 degree led Headlights
    Lamonster led fog lights
    Baker air wings
    2019 Silverado Duramax dually
    2019 Cyclone 4007 toyhauler
    Spyderpops bumpskid w led light
    Rivco brand footrest
    spydermanexhaust.com exhaust
    had my exhaust installed @ Spyder in the hills.

  17. #17
    Active Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2020
    Location
    CT and ME
    Posts
    257
    Spyder Garage
    1

    Default

    I tried the balance beads when I got my new Quatracs last year and they just didn't work well. Found out that the Quatracs don't have a smooth inner surface and the beads stick all over, not leaving enough loose beads to give enough balance. It maybe could have been fixed by using even more beads, but rather than doing that I removed the beads and balanced the tires with a Marc Parnes balancer kit for the Spyder. They are super smooth now.


    My Mods:
    Elka Stage 5 rear shock with spring preload adjust
    Monster Stage 2 ECU
    Pedal Commander
    RLS cat delete
    Baja Ron sway bar
    Baker Air Wings upper and lower
    Viking saddle bags
    Third pegs
    Vredestein tires front and rear
    Mad Stad windshield
    X-creen windshield deflector
    Front and rear drive cam
    Garmin Zumo XT
    Heated gear wiring
    Lamonster LED headlights
    Lamonster LED foglights
    Lamonster frame mount cupholder
    BRP heated handgrips
    Lamonster drivers backrest
    BRP passenger backrest
    Lidlock handlebar end helmet locks
    Barkbusters Storm handguards
    2020 F3S-SS , Titanium/Black

  18. #18
    Very Active Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    786
    Spyder Garage
    1

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Yabbadabbadoo View Post
    I tried the balance beads when I got my new Quatracs last year and they just didn't work well. Found out that the Quatracs don't have a smooth inner surface and the beads stick all over, not leaving enough loose beads to give enough balance. It maybe could have been fixed by using even more beads, but rather than doing that I removed the beads and balanced the tires with a Marc Parnes balancer kit for the Spyder. They are super smooth now.
    I was about to say just bung some more beads in after the first lot commit suicide on the glue. Must be like a creek bed inside those Quatracs.
    2017 F3S Daytona , Circuit Yellow Metalic

  19. #19
    SpyderLovers Sponsor BajaRon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Greeneville, TN
    Posts
    13,519
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    I agree with everyone who advises to start over. You need a spin balance. Then add your dynamic balancing ceramic beads, Ride-On or Lamonster balancing disks. The idea here is that you start with a good balance. But as the tire wears, that balance will start to go away. These dynamic systems aren't so much to FIX a bad balance job. But to keep it as the tire wears.

    Quote Originally Posted by troop View Post
    And, according to the product tech at Ride-On, use the motorcycle product at regular dosage level, EVEN in car tires..
    I know Ride-On says this now. But they used to recommend their Car Tire product in the car tires we have (OEM or Aftermarket) on our Spyder. I've tried both and I much prefer the Car Tire version in the Spyder. I can speculate that the change in Ride-On's advice is due to a CYA decision to avoid any liability for putting a 'Car Tire' product in a 'Motorcycle Only' Tire. I don't know.

    The Car Tire version of Ride-On focuses on balance with a lower priority on quick sealing properties. The Motorcycle version focuses on quick sealing and balance as a secondary attribute. When you think about it. It makes sense. A car tire/wheel assembly has much greater mass to balance. A motorcycle tire has a much smaller mass.

    A car tire has a much greater air volume at (usually) a lower tire pressure. Whereas your motorcycle tire has a much lower volume of air at a higher pressure.

    Lastly. A flat on a car tire, while not good, is not nearly as dangerous as on 2 wheels. Taken all together. Ride-On has taken a logical approach to their products. What doesn't make sense is the advise to put a motorcycle specific product in a car tire. Regardless of what it is mounted on. The tire/wheel assembly doesn't know what kind of vehicle it is carrying.

    For me. I want as much balance as I can get. The car version will give you reasonable puncture protection in the tread area. Nothing will protect you from a puncture in the sidewall.

    Just my 2 cents worth. You should do what you think best. It's your ride.
    Last edited by BajaRon; 08-30-2022 at 10:55 AM.
    Shop Ph: 423-609-7588 (M-F, 8-5, Eastern Time)

    Only SLOW people have to leave on time...





  20. #20
    Active Member Rocketman 2012's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Location
    Carthage, Missouri 64836
    Posts
    132
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tourer View Post
    I have used Dyna Beads on my last 6 bikes with tubes and tubeless tires. Haven’t had any issues.


    https://www.innovativebalancing.com/motorcycle.htm
    I have a 2021 RT SE6 with 2,500 miles and have a slight wobble felt in the handlebar @ 60 to 65 mph and then smooth as glass. I just ordered some E-Z tire beads from Amazon, that I will install soon. My question is, how many Ounces in the fronts and how much in the rear? Is 15 psi in front what is recommended? Rear? Thanks. Sam
    2021 Spyder RT ES6 PETROL metallic. Carthage, Missouri 64836

  21. #21
    Very Active Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    4,649
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    Go and Get the road force Balance if you can find one in your area. (fronts) The rear I never had done and only use the beads on the rear.

  22. #22
    Very Active Member Lew L's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    forrest above Reno, Nv
    Posts
    3,621
    Spyder Garage
    1

    Lightbulb Start from fresh

    .

    Hi Dave, Hope it wasn't our local dealer( who will go nameless at the moment). When I had my first auto rear tire put on my there, the tech rotated the tire on the rim and no weights needed.

    In any case, I'd start from fresh. old weights off and a road force balance if possible.

    We need a BattleBorn ryde over Monitor Pass before it closes 4 the winter............

    Lew L
    Kaos----- Gone but not forgotten.

    2014 RTS in Circuit Yellow, farkle-ing addiction down to once every few months. ECU FLASH IS GREAT.
    2014 RTS , Circuit Yellow

  23. #23
    Very Active Member BLUEKNIGHT911's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Central VERMONT
    Posts
    20,272
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocketman 2012 View Post
    I have a 2021 RT SE6 with 2,500 miles and have a slight wobble felt in the handlebar @ 60 to 65 mph and then smooth as glass. I just ordered some E-Z tire beads from Amazon, that I will install soon. My question is, how many Ounces in the fronts and how much in the rear? Is 15 psi in front what is recommended? Rear? Thanks. Sam
    Sam, how can a tire / wheel imbalance end or stop because you increase your speed ...... to me this defies logic...... JMHO .... Mike

  24. #24
    SpyderLovers Sponsor BajaRon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Greeneville, TN
    Posts
    13,519
    Spyder Garage
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BLUEKNIGHT911 View Post
    Sam, how can a tire / wheel imbalance end or stop because you increase your speed ...... to me this defies logic...... JMHO .... Mike
    OH! That's an easy answer Mike. If you go fast enough. You're so scared you don't notice!
    Shop Ph: 423-609-7588 (M-F, 8-5, Eastern Time)

    Only SLOW people have to leave on time...





Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •