This is a pretty long thread so pardon me if this has already been said. BRP wins because they have made the dealerships into their storage buildings. In my Houston area dealer Mancusos every RT is presold but sitting there missing parts and taking up space. Most have at least 2 Rykers in stock for sale but nothing else. I'm looking for a side by side and very few are available usually at a price I'm not willing to pay. Some say August is the soonest for 23s.
Not JUST BRP - we ALL win ED!!
Think about it... if BRP/CanAm didn't keep their factory open & producing even 'mostly but not completely finished' Spyders, they'd either hafta shut their factory down; which would mean they'd either hafta keep paying their workers until BRP/CanAm goes bust & shuts their doors permanently, in which case we all lose out; or they'd hafta stop producing products, meaning any Spyders etc (just cos they can't get all the parts! ) which would mean Spyder prices would go up until no-one or very few could afford them, and their factory workers would be doing so little work they'd be paid a pittance (so they'd lose out) & at least some would find other jobs or starve, meaning the company would lose out cos it'd need to employ & train more people to fill those jobs whenever they could get all the parts necessary to build a few, but then there'd be such a back log of orders for all their products and besides, who's to say Spyders would get priority or they'd be spread so thin that they couldn't satisfy demand so they'd lose their market & hafta increase costs so we'd all lose out and their sales would drop so they'd lose out and the end result would be that there's no Spyders next year or maybe the year after & even if there was it'd mean Spyder prices would go up until no-one or very few could afford them so ultimately, BRP/CanAm would go bust & shut their doors permanently, in which case we all lose out; and whichever scenario you chose ends up doing the same; loop back, rinse, then repeat again ad nauseum - in every other case BRP/CanAm ultimately goes bust & shuts their doors permanently, in which case WE ALL lose out!!
I know that at first glance it might appear that BRP is looking after their shareholders & business interests first, and from the dealers point of view and where those waiting for parts sit, this process might not seem to be a great way ahead, but I reckon they are doing pretty much the best thing they could do, given the difficult circumstances THE WHOLE WORLD is facing atm!! I know I've posted this or something very similar elsewhere before, and I know it's long, but the whole issue is not simple and there IS NO EASY SOLUTION Please consider:
Noting that I'm not specifically aiming this at [anyone], it's more so pointed at everyone who's frustrated & angry &/or questioning the usefullness of BRP & other manufacturers doing this sort of 'send em out partially completed' thing....
But taking BRP's 'incomplete Spyder' roll-out on first, as I understand it they're not producing too much (if anything! ) in the way of 'floor stock' for anyone; if you look closely at it, almost everything being sent to dealers incomplete is either already ordered/sold already or very close too it, because demand right now is so high but supply is so limited (which is why they can get away with charging what they do atm & the add-ons you have little choice but to pay - and you STILL wait!? ) So they're sending those 'substantially complete but missing some unavailable/in short supply components that are easy to install later' orders out in order to allow their production line to keep operating at all, even if some components will need to be fitted down track/when available. Not doing that would mean their holding yards would fill, closing down their production line again, and ultimately result in an even LONGER wait & likely higher demand, more competition, and so higher prices for those who are only now or soon will be looking at buying new Spyders/Rykers ..... if not leading to the complete closure of the business as it goes bust! And as an aside, I asked, and understand that all of BRP's holding yards/warehouses are already pretty full, so there's little if any scope to soak up some more of the excess 'already sold but not yet complete' stock there, either! !
Besides, I believe that like many others, BRP closed their production line during the peak of COVID in order to help minimise the damage a rampant pandemic disease could cause to their business long term; and arguably it did that, at least to some degree (not going into that here tho! ) but they couldn't stay shut down/closed forever & remain a viable business - that doesn't help anyone! Remaining closed now or even closing again leaves them effectively soon out of business &/or going bankrupt because they'd probably be servicing loans without any income; plus it leaves all their employees in a really hard place, without work &/or income; and it leaves suppliers of parts all around the World in the same situatuation; all their employees in a really hard place; & if none of all those people can buy anything, it'll impact on the livelihood of those working in the supply & production of foodstuffs & all the other commodities, services, etc that people need & ultimately, a significant drop in all that isn't going to be good for ANYONE!
So by re-starting their production line when they did in the only way they could, and sending out 'not quite complete' machines, BRP have at least minimised the impact on their business, shareholders, all of those people down the line, their employees & suppliers & suppliers employees directly, plus all the other businesses & employees down the food chain indirectly..... but if BRP now stopped producing Spyders again just because they can't get a few parts instead of continuing with producing Spyders as people order them & sending them out to dealers almost complete, it'd not only push their business right to the edge if not over, it'd ultimately be taking along for the ride all their employees; all their supporting suppliers & their businesses, all their employees; all the next level of supporting businesses & employees etc etc yad yada yada, right into the deep end of that pond full of brown smelly stuff we all know is down there waiting; and if you imagine enough similar companies doing the same sort of thing & extrapolate the impact that'd have far enough, I imagine that all of that could ultimately have similar 'unable to eat/live' ramifications felt around the ENTIRE World! .
So like many other responsible businesses, BRP have instead chosen to re-open their production line, keeping their business going, even if at less than peak capacity & without some parts; but it keeps their employees in a job & so able to eat/live; keeps their Supplier's businesses going & their employees in a job & so able to eat/live; and in turn keeps all their supporting businesses and the suppliers of the foodstuffs, services, & commodities that all these employees at every step down the line use still working and so able to continue to eat/live.... plus, it keeps (some of?? ) their dealers viable, paying their staff so they can eat/live, and spreading that income into the local communities, even if it comes at some cost - but if you follow this whole chain of keeping businesses viable & people paid so they can live/eat far enough, all of it eventually comes right back to benefiting YOU in some way and allowing you to continue to live in the manner you currently do, even if you're left waiting a while for what is, at it's most basic level, a non-essential commodity.
Sure, it's probably not ideal for anyone, and I bet the dealers don't really like having or paying for all these 'not quite complete' Spyders &/or Rykers stacked up in their yards awaiting parts that are held up somewhere in that loooong 'Just Isn't There (yet!)' Supply Chain that's been so easily disrupted (now there's gotta be a lesson in this re over-reliance on the JIT business model, doesn't there?!? ) but hey, it's keeping (most of??) the dealers still in business/operating, which in turn keeps their employees paid & able to eat/live; and the producers of all the goods & commodities that they need/use to do that in business so that they in turn can keep the next level of employees employed & able to eat/live; and ultimately, keeps the system & society that keeps YOU going & living comfortably all still functioning, even if not at the level you desire or at it's best! But it's FAAARRR BETTER than the alternative, isn't it?!! First World Problems 'n all that notwithstanding!
OK, I'll climb down off my hobby horse for juuust a bit now.... . but seriously, what's a little wait when ultimately, it means so much to so many??
Last edited by Peter Aawen; 06-25-2022 at 10:17 PM.
I agree with you ff73148 my dealer has no idea when my bike will be coming when I ask and they don't contact me unless I e-mail them which is once a month since January. It would be nice if they told me they had it and just waiting for parts but I get no info except no don't have it maybe next month.
It's not about the wait. It's the lack of communication to the dealer and then to us the consumer.
Maybe it's just your dealer not communicating? My understanding is dealers have access to a list of what parts are needed for each machine and are given an estimated ship date for those parts. My dealer was given a date of June 22 for the parts on my RT, but called me immediately when the ship date updated to late May, and I was off riding on June 1. The dealer may just be saying "late July/early August" because they've been given a ship date of July 29 (or whatever). If pressed, I'm sure your dealer could give you the estimated shipping date, but that estimated date could pull forward or get pushed back.
Regarding dealers having to pay off received units that are on hold due to missing parts, typically a dealer gets 30 day free flooring, (the unit being paid off to the Mfg by the dealer), typically as well, the dealer has a finite time to the MFG post sell, otherwise the dealer becomes what is called Out of Trust with either the Mfg or the Flooring financing company. I suspect strongly, but don't know for a fact in this case, but common industry practice is to extend the free flooring from the Mfg, thus reducing the burden placed on the dealer. The dealer also gets paid for the labor required to make the Spyder, Motorcycle, Car or anything whole (complete).
Hope this makes sense. Something I have experienced more than once.
Dean O
Gran Pa Hoon
Founder San Jose BMW
Builder of the Motorcyclist Cafe Barn and Bunkhouse
Alamogordo, NM
Maybe it's just your dealer not communicating? My understanding is dealers have access to a list of what parts are needed for each machine and are given an estimated ship date for those parts. My dealer was given a date of June 22 for the parts on my RT, but called me immediately when the ship date updated to late May, and I was off riding on June 1. The dealer may just be saying "late July/early August" because they've been given a ship date of July 29 (or whatever). If pressed, I'm sure your dealer could give you the estimated shipping date, but that estimated date could pull forward or get pushed back.
You are correct. That is when BRP ships the part. Prior to shipping the part the dealer is not updated.
Frank Ferrante
2022 Can Am Spyder RT Limited Deep Marsala Metallic Dark
2016 Moto Guzzi Eldorado
Think about it... if BRP/CanAm didn't keep their factory open & producing even 'mostly but not completely finished' Spyders, they'd either hafta shut their factory down; which would mean they'd either hafta keep paying their workers until BRP/CanAm goes bust & shuts their doors permanently, in which case we all lose out; or they'd hafta stop producing products, meaning any Spyders etc (just cos they can't get all the parts! ) which would mean Spyder prices would go up until no-one or very few could afford them, and their factory workers would be doing so little work they'd be paid a pittance (so they'd lose out) & at least some would find other jobs or starve, meaning the company would lose out cos it'd need to employ & train more people to fill those jobs whenever they could get all the parts necessary to build a few, but then there'd be such a back log of orders for all their products and besides, who's to say Spyders would get priority or they'd be spread so thin that they couldn't satisfy demand so they'd lose their market & hafta increase costs so we'd all lose out and their sales would drop so they'd lose out and the end result would be that there's no Spyders next year or maybe the year after & even if there was it'd mean Spyder prices would go up until no-one or very few could afford them so ultimately, BRP/CanAm would go bust & shut their doors permanently, in which case we all lose out; and whichever scenario you chose ends up doing the same; loop back, rinse, then repeat again ad nauseum - in every other case BRP/CanAm ultimately goes bust & shuts their doors permanently, in which case WE ALL lose out!!
I know that at first glance it might appear that BRP is looking after their shareholders & business interests first, and from the dealers point of view and where those waiting for parts sit, this process might not seem to be a great way ahead, but I reckon they are doing pretty much the best thing they could do, given the difficult circumstances THE WHOLE WORLD is facing atm!! I know I've posted this or something very similar elsewhere before, and I know it's long, but the whole issue is not simple and there IS NO EASY SOLUTION Please consider:
Noting that I'm not specifically aiming this at [anyone], it's more so pointed at everyone who's frustrated & angry &/or questioning the usefullness of BRP & other manufacturers doing this sort of 'send em out partially completed' thing....
But taking BRP's 'incomplete Spyder' roll-out on first, as I understand it they're not producing too much (if anything! ) in the way of 'floor stock' for anyone; if you look closely at it, almost everything being sent to dealers incomplete is either already ordered/sold already or very close too it, because demand right now is so high but supply is so limited (which is why they can get away with charging what they do atm & the add-ons you have little choice but to pay - and you STILL wait!? ) So they're sending those 'substantially complete but missing some unavailable/in short supply components that are easy to install later' orders out in order to allow their production line to keep operating at all, even if some components will need to be fitted down track/when available. Not doing that would mean their holding yards would fill, closing down their production line again, and ultimately result in an even LONGER wait & likely higher demand, more competition, and so higher prices for those who are only now or soon will be looking at buying new Spyders/Rykers ..... if not leading to the complete closure of the business as it goes bust! And as an aside, I asked, and understand that all of BRP's holding yards/warehouses are already pretty full, so there's little if any scope to soak up some more of the excess 'already sold but not yet complete' stock there, either! !
Besides, I believe that like many others, BRP closed their production line during the peak of COVID in order to help minimise the damage a rampant pandemic disease could cause to their business long term; and arguably it did that, at least to some degree (not going into that here tho! ) but they couldn't stay shut down/closed forever & remain a viable business - that doesn't help anyone! Remaining closed now or even closing again leaves them effectively soon out of business &/or going bankrupt because they'd probably be servicing loans without any income; plus it leaves all their employees in a really hard place, without work &/or income; and it leaves suppliers of parts all around the World in the same situatuation; all their employees in a really hard place; & if none of all those people can buy anything, it'll impact on the livelihood of those working in the supply & production of foodstuffs & all the other commodities, services, etc that people need & ultimately, a significant drop in all that isn't going to be good for ANYONE!
So by re-starting their production line when they did in the only way they could, and sending out 'not quite complete' machines, BRP have at least minimised the impact on their business, shareholders, all of those people down the line, their employees & suppliers & suppliers employees directly, plus all the other businesses & employees down the food chain indirectly..... but if BRP now stopped producing Spyders again just because they can't get a few parts instead of continuing with producing Spyders as people order them & sending them out to dealers almost complete, it'd not only push their business right to the edge if not over, it'd ultimately be taking along for the ride all their employees; all their supporting suppliers & their businesses, all their employees; all the next level of supporting businesses & employees etc etc yad yada yada, right into the deep end of that pond full of brown smelly stuff we all know is down there waiting; and if you imagine enough similar companies doing the same sort of thing & extrapolate the impact that'd have far enough, I imagine that all of that could ultimately have similar 'unable to eat/live' ramifications felt around the ENTIRE World! .
So like many other responsible businesses, BRP have instead chosen to re-open their production line, keeping their business going, even if at less than peak capacity & without some parts; but it keeps their employees in a job & so able to eat/live; keeps their Supplier's businesses going & their employees in a job & so able to eat/live; and in turn keeps all their supporting businesses and the suppliers of the foodstuffs, services, & commodities that all these employees at every step down the line use still working and so able to continue to eat/live.... plus, it keeps (some of?? ) their dealers viable, paying their staff so they can eat/live, and spreading that income into the local communities, even if it comes at some cost - but if you follow this whole chain of keeping businesses viable & people paid so they can live/eat far enough, all of it eventually comes right back to benefiting YOU in some way and allowing you to continue to live in the manner you currently do, even if you're left waiting a while for what is, at it's most basic level, a non-essential commodity.
Sure, it's probably not ideal for anyone, and I bet the dealers don't really like having or paying for all these 'not quite complete' Spyders &/or Rykers stacked up in their yards awaiting parts that are held up somewhere in that loooong 'Just Isn't There (yet!)' Supply Chain that's been so easily disrupted (now there's gotta be a lesson in this re over-reliance on the JIT business model, doesn't there?!? ) but hey, it's keeping (most of??) the dealers still in business/operating, which in turn keeps their employees paid & able to eat/live; and the producers of all the goods & commodities that they need/use to do that in business so that they in turn can keep the next level of employees employed & able to eat/live; and ultimately, keeps the system & society that keeps YOU going & living comfortably all still functioning, even if not at the level you desire or at it's best! But it's FAAARRR BETTER than the alternative, isn't it?!! First World Problems 'n all that notwithstanding!
OK, I'll climb down off my hobby horse for juuust a bit now.... . but seriously, what's a little wait when ultimately, it means so much to so many??
YIKES, how many words a minute can you type.. lol..i feel bad for the people waiting for machines, hope something happens soon to get these great machines out to you all..
2020 F3 limited, liquid titanium
grip puppies
Bajaron sway bar
lamonster belt dampener
battery tender
19 in freedom tinted windshield
matte black daytona frunk wrap
Quadtrac 165/60's
YIKES, how many words a minute can you type.. lol..i feel bad for the people waiting for machines, hope something happens soon to get these great machines out to you all..
Definitely one of his longer ones for sure
2022 Petrol Metallic RT Limited / 'PYDER'
Peter Pan has struck again!
YIKES, how many words a minute can you type.. lol..i feel bad for the people waiting for machines, hope something happens soon to get these great machines out to you all..
It's not THAT long! . Besides, a touch over half of this one was a cut & paste of an entire post from an earlier thread....
Still, I too do feel for those waiting, but I can also appreciate that BRP is trying to keep their business going/employees in a job AND getting some product out in a way that'll see their suppliers and dealers also able to keep going/retain & pay their employees too!
That said, it's not really an easy time for anybody, and that's especially so in some other parts of the World right now - so most of us in places where we've really got it pretty easy like North America & Australasia shouldn't complain too much about the relatively minor inconveniences we're facing when you look at the real life or death issues people are actually facing on a moment by moment basis elsewhere; but I'd still like to hope that we've learned at least some of the lessons about the dangers of overly relying on excessively long & vulnerable offshore Just In Time supply chains & production centres!
It appears there is hope. Just heard from a friend that his 2022 RTL can be picked up this afternoon. Like so many of you, his RTL has been gathering dust at the dealership waiting for a windshield motor bracket
Well some good new I suppose, just came from my dealer and they received the 2022 RTL on Monday but of course missing parts, so the agonizing wait continues,
Seems to be no average time for arriving missing parts, from what I have read in other posts 2 weeks up to 2 months?
At least you have to give BRP credit for keeping track of what needs to go where. No one has reported a dealer getting the wrong parts to complete a Spyder, AFAIR anyway.
2014 Copper RTS
Tri-Axis bars, CB, BajaRon sway bar & shock adjusters, SpyderPop's Bumpskid, NBV peg brackets, LED headlights and modulator, Wolo trumpet air horns, trailer hitch, custom trailer harness, high mount turn signals, Custom Dynamics brake light, LED turn signal lights on mirrors, LED strip light for a dash light, garage door opener, LED lights in frunk, trunk, and saddlebags, RAM mounts and cradles for tablet (for GPS) and phone (for music), and Smooth Spyder belt tensioner.
Had a deposit on a 22 F3T limited SS at a dealership in New Hampshire since October. Contact at the dealership was great, never blamed them for what’s going on. Same issues everyone was having, no real info on when the delivery would happen. Beginning of June, they called and said the bike was delivered but missing parts and again, no clue as to when it would be all together. In the meantime, established local car dealership opens a power and sport division and is a new Can Am dealer! Went last Saturday to check it out and there it was minus the driver backrest. I had received an email from BRP stating the backrest would not be available and that I would be credited $500. Dealer in New Hampshire was helpful and understanding of the situation, credited me back my deposit instantly. Drove it home Monday night! These are indeed crazy times, hopeful that everyone waiting gets theirs soon. Thankful for this community, always a great help when needed.
Last edited by Peter Aawen; 03-21-2024 at 09:05 PM.
I ordered a 2022 RT limited in April and came in on the 29th of June. It is missing the window motor also, at least that is what they told me lol... Who knows when it will be in and ready for pickup... lol It is what it is, and just going with the flow...
Last edited by Peter Aawen; 06-30-2022 at 10:54 PM.
Reason: Caps
Pre-ordered a white F3-T in September and I'll be taking delivery the 15th of July. Including the replacement rear axle to accommodate the trailer hitch.
Trb-- (Roger)
2014 Cognac STL:Ultimate Seat, Nelson Rigg Tail Pack, Nelson Rigg RS/ST Half Cover, TL fender lights, Squared Away Laser Alignment, BajaRon sway bar and links, Akropovic Sport Silencer
2022 White Pearl F3T
Gone but not forgotten: 2019 F3S Special Series Liquid Titanium
I ordered a 2022 RT L Marsala Red Chrome in October 2021. Delivery was to be in March, but the dealer only got the bike on May 4th, and it was missing the same 2 parts as everyone else. Dealer phoned today (July 6) to say they just got the parts. Hope to pick it up tomorrow. I sure hope BRP will do something to compensate people.
The wait is over, just received a call from my dealer, the parts have arrived as well as all the accessories, being installed today and picking it up tomorrow. Will post pictures in a few days.
2014 Cognac STL:Ultimate Seat, Nelson Rigg Tail Pack, Nelson Rigg RS/ST Half Cover, TL fender lights, Squared Away Laser Alignment, BajaRon sway bar and links, Akropovic Sport Silencer
2022 White Pearl F3T
Gone but not forgotten: 2019 F3S Special Series Liquid Titanium
Sold my 2020 F3-S Special. Picking up my upgrade tomorrow, F3 Limited Special Series. Wanted something with more storage for touring and the radio is a huge plus. The wife and 2 kids and I plan to take more riding vacations.
Met with my sales representative today. My Spyder (RT-L, Petrol Metallic) has arrived at the dealer and has been un-crated. It has the missing reverse sensor, windshield motor and (not heard from anyone else on the forum) the RT top case (rear trunk). Of course the parts are on order. The sales representative said he has a RT-L, Deep Marsala Metallic, Dark and a Sea-to-Sky (probably both with missing items) to sell, for any one still looking in this shorten season. The dealer is upstate NY south of Rochester.
Originally Posted by EDBLU
) which would mean Spyder prices would go up until no-one or very few could afford them, and their factory workers would be doing so little work they'd be paid a pittance (so they'd lose out) & at least some would find other jobs or starve, meaning the company would lose out cos it'd need to employ & train more people to fill those jobs whenever they could get all the parts necessary to build a few, but then there'd be such a back log of orders for all their products and besides, who's to say Spyders would get priority or they'd be spread so thin that they couldn't satisfy demand so they'd lose their market & hafta increase costs so we'd all lose out and their sales would drop so they'd lose out and the end result would be that there's no Spyders next year or maybe the year after & even if there was it'd mean Spyder prices would go up until no-one or very few could afford them so ultimately, BRP/CanAm would go bust & shut their doors permanently, in which case we all lose out; and whichever scenario you chose ends up doing the same; loop back, rinse, then repeat again ad nauseum - in every other case BRP/CanAm ultimately goes bust & shuts their doors permanently, in which case WE ALL lose out!!
Please consider:
) in the way of 'floor stock' for anyone; if you look closely at it, almost everything being sent to dealers incomplete is either already ordered/sold already or very close too it, because demand right now is so high but supply is so limited (which is why they can get away with charging what they do atm & the add-ons you have little choice but to pay - and you STILL wait!?
And as an aside, I asked, and understand that all of BRP's holding yards/warehouses are already pretty full, so there's little if any scope to soak up some more of the excess 'already sold but not yet complete' stock there, either! !
.
) their dealers viable, paying their staff so they can eat/live, and spreading that income into the local communities, even if it comes at some cost - but if you follow this whole chain of keeping businesses viable & people paid so they can live/eat far enough, all of it eventually comes right back to benefiting YOU in some way and allowing you to continue to live in the manner you currently do, even if you're left waiting a while for what is, at it's most basic level, a non-essential commodity.
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