Two wheels to three

[Pennyrick]

Back in the early days of this site, a member posted a response to some comments about the differences between steering on two wheels versus three.
I ran across it while reading some old posts and thought it was worth reposting. Here it is....."

Originally Posted by MarkLawson View Post
The main difference between 2-wheelers and the Spyder is the in steering input. Your 50 years of experience will both help and hurt you at first. You've developed a significant amount of steering memory in those arms. The brain says "turn right" & it happens. The arms already know what to do without having to think about every little act to get it done.

2-wheelers require a technique known as counter-steering, which involve inputs into the steering opposite the desired direction. You push forward on the right handlebar (in effect, turning the handlebars left) to initiate a right hand lean & entering into a right hand turn. Whether you've realized it or not, you've been using counter-steering for 50 years. Your arms know how to do it with you having to consciously think about how to do it.

The Spyder requires a direct steering input method: Steer right to turn right. I found I had to consciously think about how to make the turn on the Spyder because of all my years on the Goldwing. This is the case also while steering straight. You are constantly making small steering changes to stay in the center of the lane (BRP's recommended lane position, by the way). You might find this difficult at first because those arms are constantly wanting to steer you in the opposite direct you want to go. You'll have to reteach them new techniques to overcome so many years of muscle memory.

One more thing...

Timing on when to enter the turns is different than on 2-wheelers. The counter-steering technique requires you to begin the turn steering inputs before you actually want to start the turn. You steer left, which initiates a right hand lean and then a right hand turn. There's a slight delay between the the time of the initial steering input and before the turn actually start. Again, this is something you likely haven't thought about for years, but it happens. It's something your arms already know. If you use the same timing on the Spyder, you'll find you are entering the turn a little too soon and will have to make a course correction to make the corner correctly. Just be aware that when you enter steering inputs that is when the Spyder begins the steering change. You may have to consciously think about when to turn.

I hope this is helpful. When I realized why I was having difficulties, correcting it was much easier & riding more enjoyable. I still have the Goldwing and I have found that switching between the two is easy.
Mark

That's the best explanation of the difference between two and three that I've ever seen on here.

Well done.

[Snoking1127]

Or ride a snowmobile or jet ski for years and not have a problem with the Spyder.

[Rednaxs60]

I was just going to mention the snowmobile effect - realized this while doing my first demo ride. Very similar, especially in how you stabilize your body in a turn, turning left - squeeze the cowling/fairing with your left thigh, right turn similar. I rode the older style snowmobiles where you would also hook your foot in under the front cowling to assist as well. Adding a heavier duty sway bar and better shocks is also recommended - try to flatten out the roll. Did this in the snowmobiling community for years. Cheers

[RayBJ]

I raced Karts in the past so getting used to the spyder steering was a very short learning curve. I still miss the ease of cornering with 2 wheels.

[K80Shooter]

I used to ride a lot of 4-wheeler's and honestly to me it's the same except you gotta learn how to dodge dead animals and potholes with three wheels.

[wmjweber45]

Let me offer a counterpoint. I also rode 2 wheels for decades, about half the time on a Goldwing. In addition to the steering difference you will find the Spyder requires more physical effort - a LOT more physical effort. On the Spyder you have to turn and hold the bars through the entire tum. I am sure many do not consider this a disadvantage and enjoy muscling the beast through the twisties. I am not one of those people. In contrast, steering on two wheels is virtually effortless. A turn takes a slight push and lean to establish the bank angle, then the reverse to straighten out. Don't get me wrong - I enjoy riding the Spyder. Even after I got to the point where steering is second nature, it will never give the free and easy ride I had on 2 wheels. Unfortunately 2-wheels is no longer an option for me and the Spyder is WAY better than not riding at all.

[Rocketman 2012]

The effort reminds me of riding 3 wheel ATV's, the ones the Gubmit banned. My Family and myself had no trouble once we learned the proper leaning techniques. I raced high performance 3 and 4 wheel ATV's for years so learning to ride the Spyder was very easy.

Dodging 'roadkill' however takes some real concentration!

I have been riding Motorcycles and Maxi-Scooters for 58 years and have had 88 bikes but this 2021 RT SE6 is my first 3 wheel street ride.

The FUN is back again!

Sam

[hut1]

Having piloted a Goldwing/sidecar rig for several years prior to buying my first Spyder, it didn't take too long get used to steering the Spyder's 3-wheel configuration vs. the non-symmetrical hack. However, it took a little longer to get used to not seeing someone/something beside me when I looked down and to the right!

[rjinaz86323]

I came off a Harley TriGlide so no adjustment necessary. Sure appreciate the easy steering on the Spyder. Was the main reason I left Harley after many, many years. Some things I miss from my Harley days though, manuals, Infotainment System, turns signal switches, and hand brake.

[BertRemington]

I totally agree with wmjweber45 on steering. The other adaptation I found difficult was driving in the middle of the lane because a half-century ago that was to be avoided due to the oil streak. Old habits.

[RICZ]

I totally agree with wmjweber45 on steering. The other adaptation I found difficult was driving in the middle of the lane because a half-century ago that was to be avoided due to the oil streak. Old habits.

The center of the lane contains nails, screws, glass and other tire eaters that the two-trackers didn't pick up.

[fredgal]

well my 2020 F3-limited is waiting for a decent day to be delivered, i have a 1500 vulcan which is for sale. ive had many atv's, and still have one and always will have an atv. im sure i will adapt easily to 3 wheels, im having it delivered, so i can start out on a ride, from my house, in the country where there is no traffic, i will work up to busy roads as time goes on.. possible next week for a delivery as its snowing this morning,, arrrggggg...

[cruisinTX]

Let me offer a counterpoint. I also rode 2 wheels for decades, about half the time on a Goldwing. In addition to the steering difference you will find the Spyder requires more physical effort - a LOT more physical effort. On the Spyder you have to turn and hold the bars through the entire tum. I am sure many do not consider this a disadvantage and enjoy muscling the beast through the twisties. I am not one of those people. In contrast, steering on two wheels is virtually effortless. A turn takes a slight push and lean to establish the bank angle, then the reverse to straighten out. Don't get me wrong - I enjoy riding the Spyder. Even after I got to the point where steering is second nature, it will never give the free and easy ride I had on 2 wheels. Unfortunately 2-wheels is no longer an option for me and the Spyder is WAY better than not riding at all.

yup. I started biking in 1968 on a Honda 90 the progressed upward in size and power from there until 1980 when I had to sell my first BMW to pay off some medical bills. 20 years later I had a good enough job to get back into biking and started with a 1200cc boxer. Then along came a Spyder for my wife. We had read and been told they would be easy for her to ride. It didn't take long to figure out she tired very quickly on the Spyder. So much so that if we want to ride together for more than an hour, it has to be two-up on the Spyder as that is about as long as she has stamina for.

OH WELL, my creeping arthritis will some day dictate it's time to give up two wheels and just ride the Spyder. Meanwhile; when I go alone, it is almost always on one of the bikes. When we go together, it's on her Spyder and I get to sit back and relax while she drives for the first hour.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

Keep in mind the physics of the two systems. With two wheels there is a 'sweet spot' in cornering where the combination of speed, radius of the curve, bank, and lean of the bike, that will cause the bike to go around the curve with no steering effort required. It'll literally steer itself around the curve. Then there is gravity and centrifugal force. Obviously the center of gravity of you and the bike is off to one side when you are leaning. Stop instantly and you fall over. Centrifugal force going around the curve offsets the pull of gravity so the net force acting on you and the bike goes down through the vertical centerline of the bike to the pavement. Your body is pushed downward into the seat and not to either side.

With three wheels there is of course no lean. Gravity pulls your body down into the seat but the centrifugal force of the curve pushes your body outward. The net force pushes you to the side and down. If you lean your body you get that force in line with your body and so the sideways pull is reduced or eliminated. As has been said, you drive a Spyder through a curve because it's natural tendency is to go straight ahead.

You ride a two wheeler through a curve. You drive a Spyder through a curve.

[MKrone]

Excellent description. Spot on and full marks..