First oil change

[RykerRick]

I first changed engine and trans after one month/1,000 miles.

Fluids came out dark, trans drain plug was almost filled with sediment.

Drain plugs almost clean, ~5,000 miles later.

Photos in post 2 of this thread: https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/...nance-Schedule

Yep, thats what I'm talking about. For all of you who like to so religiously follow the manual recommendations, you go ahead and do you oil change at 6000 miles like the manual says. Thats why I dont buy used vehicles. There's a lot of people out there that really dont know what they're doing when it comes to vehicle maintenance.

[rakerrykerrider]

I guess the Can Am and Rotax engineers don't know what they're talking about but anybody on the internet is more knowledgeable. Right.

[Possible]

Well, whether the Can Am and Rotax engineers know what their talking about is anybody's guess. Lots of people take what they say with a grain of
salt. Many have issues with several of the designs by the Can Am and Rotax engineers. Heat issues with the early twins, up to and including fires.
The latest problem seems to be issues with the front pulley on some models. I also believe there have been issues with the DSS system and many
complain about the radiator drain plugs that have trouble with being removed.

These would all be designs of the Can Am and Rotax engineers that don't seem to have worked out well so far. There are others, but these are the
ones that came immediately to mind. Maybe that's part of the reason that some people don't put all their faith in what the Can Am and Rotax
engineers postulate.

[SportsterDoc]

I guess the Can Am and Rotax engineers don't know what they're talking about but anybody on the internet is more knowledgeable. Right.

I would view the Can-Am maintenance schedule, which likely has a marketing influence, to be the minimum to (a) maintain factory warranty and (b) for the drivetrain to survive the warranty.

Suggest 5W40 in cool climates and 10W50 pure synthetic where ambient exceeds 104F (limit stated by XPS for their synthetic blend) .
Change engine, trans and final drive fluids at ~1,000 miles (crud on magnetic drains).
Change all thereafter in 5,000 mile intervals
Change trans air filter in 5,000 mile intervals
Engine air filter may go 10,000

This is advice for long motor and trans life. Take it or leave it.

[SportsterDoc]

... Maybe that's part of the reason that some people don't put all their faith in what the Can Am and Rotax
engineers postulate.

Or the engineers were overruled by Can-Am's marketing staff.

[Possible]

Or the engineers were overruled by Can-Am's marketing staff.

Very likely with some things, especially styling cues, but things such as rapidly wearing front drive pulleys wouldn't seem to be
driven by the marketing division.

[SportsterDoc]

Correction: First fluids change was 1200 miles / 5 weeks
As for debris, the photos can speak for themselves, regarding both crud on the magnetic drain plug and suspended particles in the drained oil.
2-1200 miles.jpg
5-transmission magnetic drain plug dirty.jpg
6-transmission magnetic drain plug cleaned.jpg
7-fluid color at 1200 miles.jpg

[Highwayman2013]

I changed the oil in my 2019 Ryker at 1500 miles. Oil looked fine. I also have a 2020 Zong Shen (CSC) tt250. I changed the oil at 100 miles because of the dirt fear and had it analyzed. The oil was still clean and could have went farther.

[shakin_jake]

Correction: First fluids change was 1200 miles / 5 weeks
As for debris, the photos can speak for themselves, regarding both crud on the magnetic drain plug and suspended particles in the drained oil.
2-1200 miles.jpg
5-transmission magnetic drain plug dirty.jpg
6-transmission magnetic drain plug cleaned.jpg
7-fluid color at 1200 miles.jpg

~~~I had a much different experience w/crud or lack thereof on the magnetic drain bung of my 2020 Ryker Rally Doc. As I stated earlier in this thread I was impressed how translucent the motor oil has been for 4 K miles. FWIW I changed the oil in this Ryker for the first time less than 12 hours ago, @ approx. one year went by since I bought it new 3/15/20. And again, I was blown away w/how clean/clear/translucent the motor oil was coming out of the crank case

Before I changed the oil I thought about coming to the board here and asking if there were any gotchas, then I realized I could peruse what’s been written here & look it up myself. At that time I believe I fell asleep=:-). I’ve been at this (caring for my own chit) for far too long, so I dove right in. To the member who remarked about oil threads getting everyone’s britches in a pinch, please, no offense meant but, this is how we communicate. We can’t talk about politics (too much) for fear we’ll get cancelled=:-)

Anyways, the reason I don’t change motor oil early, here on the farm, I have way too many other tasks to fill my dance card. I can’t be bothered doing things prematurely, but hey, whatever floats your boat if someone here wants to change the oil early, it’s your jack Jack. Looking at how filthy the oil you show here Doc, I’m gonna guess your motor was built on a Friday or a Monday. Having been born & raised in Detroit, I had a lot of peeps that worked in manufacturing and assembly. One such character bolted tail light assemblies onto Lincoln’s at the Wixom plant. I actually visited him in the plant once (1980’s). That was before you had to show an ID badge to gain entrance. I smelt marijuana here and there on my way to Dave’s station. He relayed a story how he once saw a chicken bone tied to a piece of string dangling inside one of the car doors. Dave didn’t say if he removed the bone. I wonder if the eventual owners heard an annoying noise they could never figure out where it was coming from, which reminds me, go to U-tube to listen to a song called Rouge Plant Blues, by stix and stoned. The name Marcus comes to mind. I knew a Marcus when we lived in big D


Best,


Jake
Reddick Fla.

[BajaRon]

He didn't test Rotax motors and the test wasn't real world.

Some Aprilia motorcycles use Rotax engines. This is where the 998 V-Twin came from.

I always love how this forum has a habit of taking a simple question and turning it into a major discussion. Simple question, simple answer. Follow the guidelines given by BRP (make sure they are documented) and your warranty will cover it. After the warranty runs out, do whatever you want because you will be paying for the consequences either way.

Not sure anyone could raise a plausible argument against your statement that we are able to complicate the simple. And work hard to make the difficult impossible. Still, I don't think anyone is going to have buyers remorse over changing to a known substance (lubricant) before the prescribed time. I plan to do it myself. It will tell me a great deal about my engine internals (oil analysis). If the test comes back saying I changed too early, so be it. If it comes back saying I waited too long. Well, that's a completely different kettle of soup.

Everyone has a different version of 'Enjoyment'. Within reason, it's all good!

[Slider]

Last time I looked closely at engine manufacturing plants here in Oz (not that there's many left these days! ) one of the last steps on every one of those production lines was to fill them up with oil & connect to fuel & power etc, and actually run/test them..... Then once they'd passed their tests, they'd drain the oil, check everything out & then dispatch the engines off to wherever they were going to be installed... and I suspect ROTAX does this to most of the engines that leave their plant too - in fact, I believe doing that's mandated on many of their engines!!

So AFAIK, there's really no NEED for YOU to worry about draining that 'initial oil fill' in your new Spyder/Ryker to make sure there's no manufacturing debris left in there like there once may have been, simply cos you don't get to see the 'initial oil fill' - that has already been done & drained/relpaced! Still, if you've paid for it, then it's your engine, and you can do/throw whatever at it you feel like.

This! And common and modern manufacturing includes robust cleaning steps that practically eliminate FOD (Foreign Object Debris) such as chips and oils. The microscopic dust and larger particles created during initial starting and running during the testing phase are minor and are caught in the oil filter.

I follow the manufacturer recommendations. They designed it. They went to school to be expert engineers. And I'm not an armchair enginner or ASE certified mechanic. I am a pretty experienced machinist and sometimes I do my own maintenance but mostly...

I ride the f$#ker!

[Peter Aawen]

This! And common and modern manufacturing includes robust cleaning steps that practically eliminate FOD (Foreign Object Debris) such as chips and oils. The microscopic dust and larger particles created during initial starting and running during the testing phase are minor and are caught in the oil filter.

I follow the manufacturer recommendations. They designed it. They went to school to be expert engineers. And I'm not an armchair enginner or ASE certified mechanic. I am a pretty experienced machinist and sometimes I do my own maintenance but mostly...

I ride the f$#ker!

I've been talking to a few of our local 'Engine Manufacturing Engineers' since my last post in this thread, and they reminded me that this is one time when it REALLY CAN HURT to change the oil too early!!

Beyond Slider's post, they stressed that other thing to remember about WHY IT'S SO IMPORTANT to leave your 'initial oil change' in the engine until it's scheduled change time is that while that 'first run & oil change in the manufacturing plant' that should address any FOD issues has almost always ALREADY BEEN DONE, the next oil change period is pretty much ESSENTIAL to the proper bedding in of your new engine's rings & bearings, valves, valve guides, etc etc!!

That initial service period specified by the manufacturer has been calculated based upon the rate at which the 'as sold' oil fill collects all the microscopic contaminants & debris generated and then effectively shears down - so by replacing that oil early and putting in fresh oil that hasn't yet lost any viscosity/shear qualities or collected the microscopic bits that are essential for the proper bedding in of all those fairly important components, you are quite possibly (if not actually very likely! ) messing with their effective bedding in, and therefore you are quite likely harming your engine's potential life &/or performance, power output, & maybe even fuel economy, even if you don't ever recognise that because you'll never actually get to experience its full potential because you stuffed any chance of ever experiencing that full potential by changing the oil out TOO EARLY!!

Still, as I said earlier, you've paid for it, so it's your engine, and you can do/throw whatever at it you feel like. However, it might pay to remember that there's usually a few reasons for those 'recommended oil change periods', and especially for the first one, leaving the 'as sold' oil fill in for that length of time is quite important to achieving the full potential of the engine as part of its 'bedding in' process, even if we don't actually need to use special 'running in oils' &/or do too much in the way of 'babying' the engine &/or driveline these days!!

Good Luck!

PS:
Oh, and those previously mentioned Engineers also suggested that you should expect to see at least some fine metal debris (but hopefully not any chunks much larger than a fingernail cutting! ) collected by the magnet on the drain plug when you do (in the recommended course of time/distance travelled) get around to doing that initial oil change, cos that is evidence that your engine internals HAVE actually done what they need to do during that 'bedding in' process!! If there's NO sign of any of that metallic 'fur', then they suggested you may not have worked your engine hard enough to have done the 'bedding in' properly, or maybe you've just changed the oil out too early & it's still bedding in... or glazing in!

Just Sayin'

[Mikey]

[ziggy]

I've been reading ALL these good suggestions........and I will continue reading. BUT (BIG but) I'll go with Can-Am. Follow the leader, if it fails scream bloody murder
that it's all their fault..

[ARtraveler]

I just follow the manual recommendations on all of mine. I look at it as a CYA situation. Never had a Spyder engine grenade itself. 7 of them and almost 200,000 combined miles. Close enough for me.

[ted11]

the dealer i bought mine from said to change oil at 500 miles

[shakin_jake]

the dealer i bought mine from said to change oil at 500 miles

~~~follow the owners manual written by the engineers that spec’d the motor. On the 900 cc Ryker the first oil change is 6000 miles (not 600) or after every 12 months, whichever comes first. Change the oil at 500 miles?!? That’s insane. I wouldn’t let my local dealer change the oil on my machine @ 500 miles even if he said he’d do it @ no charge. That’s straight up foolish

Do yourself a favor and spend the time it takes to read the owners manual that is supplied with your Ryker

You bought the machine, do what you want. But!, you came to this board for advice and most here that have been around BRP products will tell you, these are robust machines. They aren’t meant to be babied

[ted11]

i was going to change the oil myself

[MudBug]

There are lots of well thought-out opinions in this thread. I am not trolling or trying to bring back an old thread for kicks (may as well though, given the low activity on this forum sometimes), but there was very little mention of the time vector to an oil change. I had a couple health problems in the year since I bought my 2021, so there were 2 6-week periods where it just sat. I have some really clean-looking oil, but it's now over a year old. I have always rolled my eyes at having to change clean oil well before the mileage interval because the machine hasn't been ridden very much. I'll admit I haven't always done it (no catastrophic engine failures). I understand the concept of moisture being trapped in the oil and not boiled off frequently enough leading to corrosion, but just how dangerous is "old" oil? I understand you don't want to leave the oil in your parade '68 Cadillac for 15 years, and chemicals obviously degrade over time, but I sense a little overkill sometimes regarding oil age. Thanks.

[DickB]

https://can-am.brp.com/on-road/us/en...in-period.html

"Small high-performance engines such as the ones found in the Can-Am Ryker models do require a “break in” period where the vehicle’s parts (specifically the engine internals) are allowed to become acclimated to the demands of use. This is a period of 200 miles or 300 KM. "

"It is typically recommended to perform an oil and filter change after the break in period to remove the resulting contaminants and small metal particles that result from the interaction of the new components working together."

[Beginner]

For all the people amazed at what they find on the magnetic plug on their bike, consider this: It is working as designed.

All my tractors (korean) have a huge magnetic plug for the hydraulic fluid going through, that thing is coated with metal on the initial fluid change. The initial fluid change on a tractor is very expensive, normally 150 plus depending on the size of the machine, oil types, and filters. Tractors have an exact time schedule for initial oil changes and then the regular service intervals. Normally it is after 50 hours, then every 200 or so.

I wondered why can am didn't list it, but I guess it has too many variables for can am to calculate. Tractors are supposed to operated at a specific rpm or higher, whereas bikes can be operated by a granny or a speed demon driven at 30-110 mph for 500 - 6000 miles a year

[MudBug]

https://can-am.brp.com/on-road/us/en...in-period.html

"Small high-performance engines such as the ones found in the Can-Am Ryker models do require a “break in” period where the vehicle’s parts (specifically the engine internals) are allowed to become acclimated to the demands of use. This is a period of 200 miles or 300 KM. "

"It is typically recommended to perform an oil and filter change after the break in period to remove the resulting contaminants and small metal particles that result from the interaction of the new components working together."

The statement on this page is confusing:

"This is common practice in the recreational vehicle and motorcycle industry where the smaller engines produce high power levels, as well as being designed and manufactured to exacting standards. It is typically recommended to perform an oil and filter change after the break in period to remove the resulting contaminants and small metal particles that result from the interaction of the new components working together. The first servicing on your Ryker should be done after 6,000 miles or 10,000 KM."

Should it be done after 200 miles or 6000 miles? BRP could have chosen better wording. 6000 miles is certainly *after* the 200 mile break-in period, but not *right* after

[MudBug]

For all the people amazed at what they find on the magnetic plug on their bike, consider this: It is working as designed.

All my tractors (korean) have a huge magnetic plug for the hydraulic fluid going through, that thing is coated with metal on the initial fluid change. The initial fluid change on a tractor is very expensive, normally 150 plus depending on the size of the machine, oil types, and filters. Tractors have an exact time schedule for initial oil changes and then the regular service intervals. Normally it is after 50 hours, then every 200 or so.

I wondered why can am didn't list it, but I guess it has too many variables for can am to calculate. Tractors are supposed to operated at a specific rpm or higher, whereas bikes can be operated by a granny or a speed demon driven at 30-110 mph for 500 - 6000 miles a year

I changed my oil today at 1862 miles, because it was over a year old. No, I didn't ride all that much over the past year. I had some setbacks and have no riding friends in the silly area I live in. Plus, my company has kept us out of the office going on 2 years, so I don't even have a commute. All that being said, I didn't have very much metal on the magnetic plug.

[Beginner]

I changed my oil today at 1862 miles, because it was over a year old. No, I didn't ride all that much over the past year. I had some setbacks and have no riding friends in the silly area I live in. Plus, my company has kept us out of the office going on 2 years, so I don't even have a commute. All that being said, I didn't have very much metal on the magnetic plug.

Awesome. I didn't pull mine yet, July will make a year. It's winter here so I only ride about once a month, and last time I nearly froze to death for my maintenance run. Two jackets, full helmet, gloves, boots etc, wind sliced through everything. 60mph winds at 20 degrees. I was so glad to get off the bike. I start it up, let it idle a while, take it out to the driveway for figure eights and circles, then drive it down the road and turn around and come back, let it idle a bit, then shut it down.

[javaspark]

Agreed, 100% - that statement is confusing. Brittany Morrow, in the video at the link DickB provided in his post, clarifies the difference between the break-in period and the "first servicing." Still, it doesn't explicitly say the oil change should be done at 200 miles, although that seems to be the implied recommendation.