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  1. #1
    Active Member ButterSmooth's Avatar
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    Default Kumho mounted, not balanced yet

    Today I had Vredestein Quatrac 5s mounted and balanced on the front wheel and a Kuhmo Ecsta mounted, but not balanced, on the rear. The local tire shop couldn't balance the rear, because the hub wouldn't fit on their machine.

    Two methods occurred to me: Drop balance the wheel using the axle and weights, or Ride-on. I think Ride-on is the way to go, but 30 minutes of web searches didn't find any car formula Ride-on in stock or available. I need 17oz -- anybody have a lead to some?
    Head in the game, eyes down the road... 2020RT
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  2. #2
    Very Active Member RICZ's Avatar
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    I had problems with Ride-On. It would put the tire out of balance and when I got a puncture, it didn't do its job of plugging the small hole. So I went to Counteract beads - less abrasive than Dyna Beads. The Counteract beads worked very well and don't make a mess inside the tires. Ask tire people what they think of it
    Ours is a red, black and chrome 2017 F3 Limited. Bought new in 2/2019. The avatar is my first bike back in 1952, a Simplex Servi-Cycle. Photo taken at the Barber Museum.
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  3. #3
    Ozzie Ozzie Ozzie Peter Aawen's Avatar
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    If your rear Kumho has been mounted properly, there's a better'n very good chance that you won't actually need any balancing done on it at all!

    So give it a ryde, run it up & down thru the gears a few times, take a few corners at speed (safely if you will, please! ) and if it's not giving you any grief, then don't buy yourself trouble that's not really there, just get on and Ryde!

    I have probably run more rear tires on my Spyder than just about anyone else here except maybe SpyderAnn & a couple of other 'high mileage' ryders, and I seriously cannot remember the last time I had any concerns re balancing my rear tires Modern tires from reputable manufacturers fitted/mounted properly on their rims & run on the rear of our Spyders/Rykers will rarely need balancing.
    2013 RT Ltd Pearl White

    Ryde More, Worry Less!

  4. #4
    Very Active Member BLUEKNIGHT911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Aawen View Post
    If your rear Kumho has been mounted properly, there's a better'n very good chance that you won't actually need any balancing done on it at all!

    So give it a ryde, run it up & down thru the gears a few times, take a few corners at speed (safely if you will, please! ) and if it's not giving you any grief, then don't buy yourself trouble that's not really there, just get on and Ryde!

    I have probably run more rear tires on my Spyder than just about anyone else here except maybe SpyderAnn & a couple of other 'high mileage' ryders, and I seriously cannot remember the last time I had any concerns re balancing my rear tires Modern tires from reputable manufacturers fitted/mounted properly on their rims & run on the rear of our Spyders/Rykers will rarely need balancing.
    .... I've had 7 rear auto tires on various Spyders .... I only balanced the first one, and discovered it only needed 1/2 oz. .... The next six I didn't balance and have not noticed a vibe or wear issue .... IMHO the way the swing arm is constructed, it provides a stronger more stable fixture for the rear axel / wheel .... No one who has driven my Spyders have ever mentioned they thought something wasn't right about the rear end or said there were any vibes ..... good luck ..... Mike

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    Quote Originally Posted by ButterSmooth View Post
    Today I had Vredestein Quatrac 5s mounted and balanced on the front wheel and a Kuhmo Ecsta mounted, but not balanced, on the rear. The local tire shop couldn't balance the rear, because the hub wouldn't fit on their machine.

    Two methods occurred to me: Drop balance the wheel using the axle and weights, or Ride-on. I think Ride-on is the way to go, but 30 minutes of web searches didn't find any car formula Ride-on in stock or available. I need 17oz -- anybody have a lead to some?
    I use Centramatic wheel balancers available from LaMonster.... takes all guess work out of the equation. They work!
    2019 F3L , Covid Blue

  6. #6
    Very Active Member Gwolf's Avatar
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    I just used the axle on 2 jack stands and taped the weights on until it didn't roll on the rear Kumho. Peeled the paper, stuck the weights on, and it doesn't vibrate enough to notice at any speed. Been on there for about 5,000 miles and showing no wear at all. Still no vibrations. Only used about 1/2 oz of weights. Don't have any beads in the tire.
    2019 F3-S , Black & Silver

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    Quote Originally Posted by RICZ View Post
    So I went to Counteract beads - less abrasive than Dyna Beads. The Counteract beads worked very well and don't make a mess inside the tires. Ask tire people what they think of it
    I went to the Counteract website. All I could find for motorcycles was some sort of innertube (I guess). Is that what you're referring to? Does it go IN the tire or on the back side of it like the Centramatic balancers?

    HAGO!

  8. #8
    Active Member ButterSmooth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MONK View Post
    I went to the Counteract website. All I could find for motorcycles was some sort of innertube (I guess). Is that what you're referring to? Does it go IN the tire or on the back side of it like the Centramatic balancers?

    HAGO!
    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...DX5J7QN2&psc=1
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  9. #9
    Active Member ButterSmooth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gwolf View Post
    I just used the axle on 2 jack stands and taped the weights on until it didn't roll on the rear Kumho. Peeled the paper, stuck the weights on, and it doesn't vibrate enough to notice at any speed. Been on there for about 5,000 miles and showing no wear at all. Still no vibrations. Only used about 1/2 oz of weights. Don't have any beads in the tire.
    That is my drop balance plan, but if Peter and Mike are to be believed (risky ) I shouldn't have to do anything. My plan at this point is to put it on the drop balance setup, just to see how far it's out of balance. Then I'll put it on the Spyder and if I feel anything, spend the $25 and add Counteract beads. Another worry eliminated.

    Supposed to be 50° tomorrow, so that will be the big new tire test!

    I truly appreciate the help guys!!
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  10. #10
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    Dont waste your time balancing it. It should be fine. I have installed 3 rear tires without balancing and had no issues at all.
    2021 Sea to Sky RT , Highland green

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    The shop that mounted and balanced (most of) my tires also could not balance the rear. When I got the wheels and tires back to my shop, I used the axle and jackstands method to check the balance on the rear. I could not find any need to add any weights, so I just put it back on the bike. 5200 miles on the Q5s so far, and nothing has changed my opinion that any weight needed to be added.
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    Very Active Member BLUEKNIGHT911's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve W. View Post
    The shop that mounted and balanced (most of) my tires also could not balance the rear. When I got the wheels and tires back to my shop, I used the axle and jackstands method to check the balance on the rear. I could not find any need to add any weights, so I just put it back on the bike. 5200 miles on the Q5s so far, and nothing has changed my opinion that any weight needed to be added.
    Just so we understand ....No balance weights on the REAR .... but did you have to balance the Q-5's ( the front tires ) .......... Thanks, Mike

  13. #13
    Very Active Member RICZ's Avatar
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    Quality tires do make a difference for the better. My front Kendas had a least 3 ounce of weights on each wheel. Had a pair of Federal Formoza mounted on the front and each got but 3/4 of an ounce to balance.
    Ours is a red, black and chrome 2017 F3 Limited. Bought new in 2/2019. The avatar is my first bike back in 1952, a Simplex Servi-Cycle. Photo taken at the Barber Museum.
    2017 F3 Limited , Red, Black & Chrome

  14. #14
    Active Member ButterSmooth's Avatar
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    Road force balancing my front Vredesteins resulted in forces of 8# and 10# remaining, which is well below the 20# threshold of perception. I don't know what the max acceptable force is, but the tech thought these tires were quite good.
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    Very Active Member IdahoMtnSpyder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ButterSmooth View Post
    Today I had Vredestein Quatrac 5s mounted and balanced on the front wheel and a Kuhmo Ecsta mounted, but not balanced, on the rear. The local tire shop couldn't balance the rear, because the hub wouldn't fit on their machine.

    Two methods occurred to me: Drop balance the wheel using the axle and weights, or Ride-on. I think Ride-on is the way to go, but 30 minutes of web searches didn't find any car formula Ride-on in stock or available. I need 17oz -- anybody have a lead to some?
    I'm surprised the tire guy didn't offer to put a liquid tire balance in it. My local tire shop put Liquid Balance in my rear tire, the same stuff they regularly use in large pickup and truck tires.

    2014 Copper RTS

    Tri-Axis bars, CB, BajaRon sway bar & shock adjusters, SpyderPop's Bumpskid, NBV peg brackets, LED headlights and modulator, Wolo trumpet air horns, trailer hitch, custom trailer harness, high mount turn signals, Custom Dynamics brake light, LED turn signal lights on mirrors, LED strip light for a dash light, garage door opener, LED lights in frunk, trunk, and saddlebags, RAM mounts and cradles for tablet (for GPS) and phone (for music), and Smooth Spyder belt tensioner.
    2014 RTS , Copper! (officially Cognac)

  16. #16
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    Last two rears I put on used Counter act beads , that is it and never had a issue.

  17. #17
    Very Active Member billybovine's Avatar
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    If it was my Spyder I would take off the Kuhmo and put on a better tire. I hate to say it but a crappy Kenda is better then the Kuhmo. As for balancing. Just put in some beads.

    2018 F3 LIMITED

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    Quote Originally Posted by BLUEKNIGHT911 View Post
    Just so we understand ....No balance weights on the REAR .... but did you have to balance the Q-5's ( the front tires ) .......... Thanks, Mike
    That is correct. I just checked, one front wheel required 1/2 ounce, the other required nothing.

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  19. #19
    Very Active Member jcthorne's Avatar
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    I recommend taking the tire and wheel to a motorcycle shop that has the correct tools to mount and balance that tire correctly. Do the job right.

    I also agree with the sentiment you can do far better than that Kumho for a tire. Those get rather squirrely in the rain and are pretty poor traction.

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  20. #20
    Very Active Member Lew L's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ButterSmooth View Post
    Road force balancing my front Vredesteins resulted in forces of 8# and 10# remaining, which is well below the 20# threshold of perception. I don't know what the max acceptable force is, but the tech thought these tires were quite good.
    +1...........
    Kaos----- Gone but not forgotten.

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  21. #21
    Active Member mully's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ButterSmooth View Post
    Today I had Vredestein Quatrac 5s mounted and balanced on the front wheel and a Kuhmo Ecsta mounted, but not balanced, on the rear. The local tire shop couldn't balance the rear, because the hub wouldn't fit on their machine.

    Two methods occurred to me: Drop balance the wheel using the axle and weights, or Ride-on. I think Ride-on is the way to go, but 30 minutes of web searches didn't find any car formula Ride-on in stock or available. I need 17oz -- anybody have a lead to some?
    https://www.ride-onshop.com/Dents_an..._-_Bottle.html If you go with the ride-on balancer/sealer here a link to the dent and ding section that they have instock at a discount.
    2018 F3s, 2016 versys 650LT, 2001 concours 1000

  22. #22
    Active Member ButterSmooth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mully View Post
    https://www.ride-onshop.com/Dents_an..._-_Bottle.html If you go with the ride-on balancer/sealer here a link to the dent and ding section that they have instock at a discount.
    Yeah, I was there and it look great until the cheapest shipping was twice as much as the product... Thanks, though!
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  23. #23
    Very Active Member JP58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by billybovine View Post
    If it was my Spyder I would take off the Kuhmo and put on a better tire. I hate to say it but a crappy Kenda is better then the Kuhmo. As for balancing. Just put in some beads.
    I have the kumho ecsta and it only took 1/4 ounce and is a way better tire then the crap kenda that had 3 ounces of weights out of the factory. I have 9k miles on it and still not half worn yet. Crap kenda was bald in the middle at 9k. For OP dont bother balancing it.
    2018 F3 Limited , Oxford Blue

  24. #24
    Very Active Member troop's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ButterSmooth View Post
    Yeah, I was there and it look great until the cheapest shipping was twice as much as the product... Thanks, though!
    I ordered (3) bottles of the auto formula awhile back from the scratch/dent. All arrived full/perfect shape. With the USPS Priority option, it was $50. That's about $16.75/bottle mailed. Not sure you can find it any cheaper..


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  25. #25
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    Most car tyre dealers are willing to fit the 225/50R15 tyre on the rear rim but cannot balance it. After a couple of recommendations to go a motorcycle shop, I did. They cannot do it either. Said they cannot do the big wheeled Harleys either. Bike dealer said owners just don't get their rear wheel balanced. After a discussion with the bike dealer, I suspect that the wheel is balanced in the factory. Apparently it's generally the rim that needs balancing, not the whole thing. Reckoned that a car tyre on the rear would be a lot tougher than the OEM Kenda and not getting the whole tyre/rim balance should not be an issue. I'm guessing when I got a Toyo on my last Spyder there was no balancing done.

    The only directional / symmetric tyre that I can get appears to be a Yokohama AVS ES1000 P225/50R15 91V. The Toyo in that size is no longer available. Can get more choice with a 225/45R15 but I'd prefer the correct size in case the VSS spits the dummy.
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