Every time I do something to my new 2020RTL it seems to me the Spyder lacks the quality I have gotten used to with Jap bikes. Yesterday I removed the rear seat to install the factory backrest and what I found was weird looking wiring harness. And to add to that the darn wires were just not dressed down good and could get into places that could cause them to get pinched. I spent additional time and effort to do what should have been done at the factory to route them to avoid these short comings. It still doesn't address the wired mickey mouse wiring harness that almost looks like old romax house wiring. To top it all off some of the wires are way to long and others are almost to short to reach. IMHO for the price they get for these machines the quality should be much better. I mean it isn't like this is the first or 2nd year for Can Am to be producing these machines.
While I am on the subject of quality how about those tires that come on these machines. Terrible and I noted the rear wheel on my machine had so many weights places on it they really should have rejected that tire and sent it back to Kenda. I guess to pull this thread all together I wouldn't be posting this but it is just this and that, and everywhere I look I am looking at poor quality. I want to like this machine and take ownership of it and call it my own and trust it but it's not easy.
IMHO, there are different kinds of cars/motorcycles that we are all accustomed to. Americans, Europeans, and Japanese/Koreans. I have owned and rode Japanese motorcycles for the last 45 years and they meet my expectations as far as quality goes and I get used to the design/manufacture. Yes, a 1972 Honda is much different than a 2013 Honda but quality is there. Couple years ago I was looking to get a BMW RnineT, the quality is there but the design is different, not in a bad way, but probably takes me a while to get used to. I ended up did not buy that BMW. We slowly switch from Japanese cars to German cars almost 20 years ago and I can say that the designs on these BMWs and Benzes are different than Japanese cars but I know how to work on them now. Quality is to be expected just like any high priced cars.Whereas my daughter's Hyundai has very similar design and quality to Japanese cars.
Now a different story. I have access to 3 different American vehicles at work and I can say that the quality and design are not the same as Japanese cars. I think American car companies are designing and manufacturing these vehicles to maximize the profits and not quality. The fit and finish on a 2018 Ford Explorer is not quite as good as 2018 Hyundai Tucson provided the Explorer is $13k more expensive.
I have a 2013 RTL and I think the design and quality is in the same boat with the American car companies. Can-am charge a lot for these Spyders because these are toys and because of the unique design. Sometime I just wonder how much profit BRP make for each of these Spyders. I think about $10k a piece. Spyder owners who own Japanese motorcycles should lower their expectations.
Cheers.
‘21 Honda Rebel 1100 DTC Burgundy
‘13 Spyder RT-L Pearl White
Sounds like you are cleaning up the wiring harness stuff. It is a shame that one has to do those things on a $30K machine.
Tires....you have hit that nail on the head also. We are still waiting to see if the Kanines are better...but most are not holding their breath on that one either. They are still sending out the new stuff with our least favorite tires as OEM.
Currently Owned: 2019 F3 Limited, 2020 F3 Limited: SOLD BOTH LIMITEDS in October of 2023.
Every time I do something to my new 2020RTL it seems to me the Spyder lacks the quality I have gotten used to with Jap bikes. Yesterday I removed the rear seat to install the factory backrest and what I found was weird looking wiring harness. And to add to that the darn wires were just not dressed down good and could get into places that could cause them to get pinched. I spent additional time and effort to do what should have been done at the factory to route them to avoid these short comings. It still doesn't address the wired mickey mouse wiring harness that almost looks like old romax house wiring. To top it all off some of the wires are way to long and others are almost to short to reach. IMHO for the price they get for these machines the quality should be much better. I mean it isn't like this is the first or 2nd year for Can Am to be producing these machines.
While I am on the subject of quality how about those tires that come on these machines. Terrible and I noted the rear wheel on my machine had so many weights places on it they really should have rejected that tire and sent it back to Kenda. I guess to pull this thread all together I wouldn't be posting this but it is just this and that, and everywhere I look I am looking at poor quality. I want to like this machine and take ownership of it and call it my own and trust it but it's not easy.
Agreed!!! Just take the drive pulley failures as one example. Folks like us buy these machines coz we simply want one. Many experience buyer remorse, or at least alarm, not too long thereafter. Some keep going back for more punishment. We are a niche market and BRP has us by the short & curlies and keep serving up the same levels of quality & reliability.
The best substitute for brains & knowledge is....................silence.
American quality has been dropping since corporate America decided to go for "rape-me" level profits. That's why so many things are foreign made - because corporate America doesn't pay it's workers enough to afford an American-built product of the same level of quality as foreign made.
As a newbe to Canam, I'm beginning to see a few flaws, and having been a rider since 1968, not new to the game. I like my 20 RTL, but BRP can't seem to get it together with the recall flaws of the rear panels and the ZIPs ties back there. I had passenger arm rests installed for the wife, now that's is a problem 'cause the dealer can't correct and make the recall fix with the passenger arm rest install, the recall fix won't fit. It's very odd to me that BRP has known about this for how long and they can't figure it out? I mean please, who puts a new machine on the showroom floor with ZIP ties holding it together? My dealer is aware and says BRP is aware and so I wait and hope that something good happens. I've posted this problem on another thread and I suspect that some are tired of reading it, and so I will just drop the subject.
As a newbe to Canam, I'm beginning to see a few flaws, and having been a rider since 1968, not new to the game. I like my 20 RTL, but BRP can't seem to get it together with the recall flaws of the rear panels and the ZIPs ties back there. I had passenger arm rests installed for the wife, now that's is a problem 'cause the dealer can't correct and make the recall fix with the passenger arm rest install, the recall fix won't fit. It's very odd to me that BRP has known about this for how long and they can't figure it out? I mean please, who puts a new machine on the showroom floor with ZIP ties holding it together? My dealer is aware and says BRP is aware and so I wait and hope that something good happens. I've posted this problem on another thread and I suspect that some are tired of reading it, and so I will just drop the subject.
Thank you for posting here. I encourage you and other folks to post things like this hopefully it will make a differences. I don't wish to be an rebel but I do think we as a group of owners need to post these short comings. I work part time in a Can Am dealership along with the big 4 from Japan and each year it seems BRP gains on quality but they need to hear back from their owners
Doug, maybe you have point, it's fine line it seems keeping 'the concern' on the soft side so others are not offended. I don't want to come across as a disgruntled owner, 'cause that is not the case. If I may add to my story, calling BRP for answers is difficult at best. I did call, waited 8 hours for a call back and the girl knew nothing, so in my opinion BRP could do a much better job of dealing with owners that have questions, but then, they want customers to call dealers which is reasonable I suppose. Which begs another question, why have a number to call?
The same types of issues have been posted on and off over the 10 years that I have been on the site.
Anyone who has been on site is aware and I know BRP is aware of most of the shortcomings. They have always been slow on the pick up to address issues.
They come on to the site to see what is happening and view the proceedings. They are listed as BRP.care for membership
In spite of the shortcomings, the site is called Spyder Lovers...not Spyder Haters. Let's not go there. They are not perfect, but last I know, we can still vote with our checkbook. We are a niche market, and the three wheels, and Y factor, make it possible for many of us to ride and continue our love with the open air. These are my personal feelings, not site propaganda from a moderator.
Currently Owned: 2019 F3 Limited, 2020 F3 Limited: SOLD BOTH LIMITEDS in October of 2023.
Roger that Traveler, I've tried to make clear that I love my Spyder and perhaps I am taking it a bit far in the grumble department. So I will let my dealer take care of the problem and not air the dirty laundry here. I note that the 2021s are on some show rooms, but I won't be thinking about trading mine in until I get it all fixed whenever that is.
Roger that Traveler, I've tried to make clear that I love my Spyder and perhaps I am taking it a bit far in the grumble department. So I will let my dealer take care of the problem and not air the dirty laundry here. I note that the 2021s are on some show rooms, but I won't be thinking about trading mine in until I get it all fixed whenever that is.
No problem bikerB.
Most of us have said a thing or two over the years. They are not perfect, but they are not so bad that people avoid them like the Yugo. Remember them?
Currently Owned: 2019 F3 Limited, 2020 F3 Limited: SOLD BOTH LIMITEDS in October of 2023.
I've purchased my second Spyder, and had full knowledge that my first one was designed on a cocktail napkin after several doubles of Beam and turned in like an overdue homework assignment.
The OP mentions a level of quality for price. You are getting exactly that. Long wires, short wires, the manufacturer doesn't care, the lady assembling the harness on a board doesn't care, the assembly line worker doesn't care, as long as when they plug stuff together, it's long enough and the light comes on, or the bell rings, or the doodad flashes.
You should see the wiring in an RV... A full house on wheels takes about 9 hours through the manufacturing plant. If you want organized wiring, neatly routed, tyrapped, color-coded and documented, you need to purchase a Lear, or a space shuttle.
This will not change until we as consumers stop the purchase process. At the end of the day, as long as we keep buying the product, they will keep making it so it works until 1 day after warranty.
CanAm does not subscribe to the statement "If you don't have time to do it right the first time, when will you have time to re-do it?" The time/space continuum is interrupted in the plant.
I've also complained about the quality of my new 2020 RT Limited in Asphalt Gray.
Some of you may remember my previous post, but for completeness, I'll repeat it here.
After the first two weeks of ownership, I found that the anti-dirt force shield has totally and completely failed with no warning of any kind.
AND, it appears that, despite my complaints, it's not covered under the warranty.
I've been reduced to using soap, rags and a bucket of water to keep the machine clean.
How humiliating.
If it ain't broke, don't break it.
IBA #47122
2020 RT Limited Asphalt Grey
I've also complained about the quality of my new 2020 RT Limited in Asphalt Gray.
Some of you may remember my previous post, but for completeness, I'll repeat it here.
After the first two weeks of ownership, I found that the anti-dirt force shield has totally and completely failed with no warning of any kind. AND, it appears that, despite my complaints, it's not covered under the warranty.
I've been reduced to using soap, rags and a bucket of water to keep the machine clean. How humiliating.
Can-Am Spyder is a 'niche' enthusiasts bike. Not built for the masses.
Think of it more like those iconic, enthusiasts' bikes that get the pulse racing because of style, performance or cult status. Owners accept the trade-offs (including unreliability or quirky quality control). Enthusiasts' bikes get part of their allure from requiring owners to know more about them than where the nearest mechanic is located.
I won't list the ones that come to mind, but most British bikes (and sports cars) from last century fall into that category. Any attempt to compare them to bikes made by the Japanese is silly for a variety of reasons.
It's also silly to claim that American manufacturers' products' failings are due to companies being unwilling to pay workers more. It has a lot more to do with cultural differences and work ethic in work forces in Asia vs. America.
The company already is under market pressure to build the best low-production product it can while keeping it 'affordable' for its intended (limited) market, so all this talk about with-holding your purchasing dollars to force change on the company is just wrong-headed.
And that's as far as I'll take this, because otherwise it will devolve, as any serious discussion inevitably does on this forum, into mindless flaming. My advice; save your passion for your Spyder.
I've purchased my second Spyder, and had full knowledge that my first one was designed on a cocktail napkin after several doubles of Beam and turned in like an overdue homework assignment.
The OP mentions a level of quality for price. You are getting exactly that. Long wires, short wires, the manufacturer doesn't care, the lady assembling the harness on a board doesn't care, the assembly line worker doesn't care, as long as when they plug stuff together, it's long enough and the light comes on, or the bell rings, or the doodad flashes.
You should see the wiring in an RV... A full house on wheels takes about 9 hours through the manufacturing plant. If you want organized wiring, neatly routed, tyrapped, color-coded and documented, you need to purchase a Lear, or a space shuttle.
This will not change until we as consumers stop the purchase process. At the end of the day, as long as we keep buying the product, they will keep making it so it works until 1 day after warranty.
CanAm does not subscribe to the statement "If you don't have time to do it right the first time, when will you have time to re-do it?" The time/space continuum is interrupted in the plant.
This is all unsubstantiated opinion, displaying a lack of understanding how large, complex organizations function.
American quality has been dropping since corporate America decided to go for "rape-me" level profits. That's why so many things are foreign made - because corporate America doesn't pay it's workers enough to afford an American-built product of the same level of quality as foreign made.
That is a very biased, ignorant and false assumption.
It would be nice to keep this civil. I hinted to this in post #10 above.
"the site is called Spyder Lovers...not Spyder Haters. Let's not go there."
I also gave the option of voting with your checkbook. If you think that they are so bad...don't buy them. One should do due dilligence on a $30K purchase. Don't drink the Kool-Aid. I like Kool-Aid and I am now on number six. Yes, they are not perfect, they do have some quirks...but I totally love my two Spyders. I would do the same thing all over again.
Last edited by ARtraveler; 08-16-2020 at 04:13 PM.
Currently Owned: 2019 F3 Limited, 2020 F3 Limited: SOLD BOTH LIMITEDS in October of 2023.
Every time I do something to my new 2020RTL it seems to me the Spyder lacks the quality I have gotten used to with Jap bikes. ....IMHO for the price they get for these machines the quality should be much better. I mean it isn't like this is the first or 2nd year for Can Am to be producing these machines.
...... and everywhere I look I am looking at poor quality. I want to like this machine and take ownership of it and call it my own and trust it but it's not easy.
I agree. The concept is excellent but some of the design, materials and finish is shocking. BRP should be embarrassed. Here's just a few pictures from the motley collection of faults. Two different rear sprockets, rear grease seal at less than 400 miles, rusted spacer, corroded rear wheel adjusters, the well known front driveshaft splines... theres plenty more too!
Regarding voting with our feet, we love the riding and I'll keep our present ones going but we won't be buying another.
Rule#2: Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level & then beat you with experience.
Rule#1: Refer to rule #2.
I have an older 2010 RS and so far it has been flawless and the design seems well executed. I've owned hondas and harleys and don't notice an unusual dropoff with the Spyder I own, which is amazing since their production numbers are much smaller than the bigger brands. I hope the troubles spoken of on here are anomalies. I have ridden the tri-glide and much prefer the spyder concept to that cobbled harley metal... even though I remain a Harley fan. If I hadn't broken a leg/ankle which makes a heavy bike not a good idea, I'd still be on my big bagger - riding a cushy sofa down the highways and byways
Retired from a vehicle manufacturing factory. We built class 8 trucks better known as semi trucks. Every vehicle is built to a price point. Want a better Toyota? Step up to a Lexus, but expect to pay more. Every part on a vehicle with the exception of government mandated stuff is constantly under scrutiny. How can we make this part lighter/cheaper/faster etc. Vendors are constantly being badgered to lower prices, work faster, or supply better quality. I like my RT and I realize if it had been built with the upgrades and quality that we want I wouldn't have paid the extra $$$ that Can Am would surely charge. I hate to throw out the cliche You Get What You Pay For, but it pretty much rings true when buying a vehicle.
Things do get better as they built more. Most of you don't remember the days when the Japanese first came in. They were only slightly more reliable then the British, but only because Joseph Lucas didn't build their electronics. And yet ask any 1200 Goldwing owner about changing the alternator when the plug that connected it to the Rectifier fried and took them both with it. Or Yamaha Venture owners about how long it took to correct the 3rd gear problem or the bad frame welds or the crummy rear shock, or early Suzuki and Bridgestone owners about rectifiers dying in less then 5 000 miles, or melted pistons in Bridgestone 175 that took the cylinder with them. Early K1 Kawasaki whose frame was so flexible that it should have been called the "Garden Gate" instead of the Norton it was applied to. There have been plenty of teething problems in the powersports industry to go around. Honda 3 wheel dirt atv so unstable they were banned from the US and ( BTW not applicable to converted trikes). Honda Goldwing with cracked/broken frames. BMW that can't keep a rear end in their bikes without special treatment. Kawasaki with their beautiful 1300 6 cyl, that was so hot you couldn't ride and you had to stop every 1000 miles and adj the cam chain or it became so loose that it would skip a tooth and not start. And the amazing thing is that in every case, the owners loved all of the above machines, corrected the faults themselves and went on. In most cases the company went on and still makes machines to. Well Bridgestone didn't but it was forced out, either make tires or make motorcycles, but not both. So do complain to BRP, loud, and often and yes they will hear. Sometimes it will make a difference sometimes not and sometimes it will take awhile. For me right now the Spyder is the only way to go. To better ride then a converted trike, better handling. 59,500 miles on a 2012. Some problems but I 'll just work with them as they come up. Happy TRAils Ryders
Happy TRAils/NSD
Paul
2012 RT L
AMA 25 years Life Member
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Originally Posted by Doug44
