Q5 Mounting Direction

[EdMat]

Got my Q5's delivered by the UPS man today. Quick response from Tirerack.com. 175/65/15 fronts and 205/65/15 rear. Is there a preferred mounted direction even tho they are non-directional?

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Got my Q5's delivered by the UPS man today. Quick response from Tirerack.com. 175/65/15 fronts and 205/65/15 rear. Is there a preferred mounted direction even tho they are non-directional?

Well non-directional means just that ..... there will be no difference ..... i have that tire in 160/65-15 ... mine had a blue line on one side of the tread ... this was to show you you Exactly how to match the left & right side .... this means don't have one blue line on the inside and the other on the OUTSIDE ...or vice versa .... you can go to their web site for further info .... good luck .... Mike

[EdMat]

Well non-directional means just that ..... there will be no difference ..... i have that tire in 160/65-15 ... mine had a blue line on one side of the tread ... this was to show you you Exactly how to match the left & right side .... this means don't have one blue line on the inside and the other on the inside also ...or vice versa .... you can go to their web site for further info .... good luck .... Mike

Could not find any mounting direction info on the Vredestein website. So you are saying mount them so looking from the front (or rear) they look exactly the same, not opposites?

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Could not find any mounting direction info on the Vredestein website. So you are saying mount them so looking from the front (or rear) they look exactly the same, not opposites?

Did you miss the part " blue line " ???? AND I corrected my post please re-read ...... Mike

[EdMat]

Thanks Mike, that's what I thought. Looking forward to putting them to use. My fronts still look good at 12,000 miles but the rear has a 1 foot long section that is worn out. There rest of the rear tire could go several 1,000 miles. It should ride sooooooooooooooooooooooo much better.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Thanks Mike, that's what I thought. Looking forward to putting them to use. My fronts still look good at 12,000 miles but the rear has a 1 foot long section that is worn out. There rest of the rear tire could go several 1,000 miles. It should ride sooooooooooooooooooooooo much better.

And because these are AUTO tires myself and Peter recommend about 16-17 psi for the fronts ..... if you are really cranking it 18 psi ..... with auto tires and the lightweight of the spyder front end a small change in psi can really change performance ..... good luck ... Mike

[EdMat]

It's going to be real interesting to see if this size fits on the front of a 2019 RT. Just laying the tire up beside the old one ....................uh. Don't remember seeing anyone running it on anything later than a 2018. Worst case, someone is going to get a great deal on two front tires for an older Spyder and I'll reorder for mine. Hopefully I can break away from work tomorrow and get them mounted.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

It's going to be real interesting to see if this size fits on the front of a 2019 RT. Just laying the tire up beside the old one ....................uh. Don't remember seeing anyone running it on anything later than a 2018. Worst case, someone is going to get a great deal on two front tires for an older Spyder and I'll reorder for mine. Hopefully I can break away from work tomorrow and get them mounted.

Most folks on this forum who bought the 175 size , bought the 55 aspect ratio and they worked fine .... why did you get 65 aspect ratio ???? .... Mike

[EdMat]

The wrong click syndrome. Looks like it was a mistake I made sometime back when i was keeping track of different tires folks were using. Oh well, at least the fronts can run a while longer.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

The wrong click syndrome. Looks like it was a mistake I made sometime back when i was keeping track of different tires folks were using. Oh well, at least the fronts can run a while longer.

Well don't panic ... I have Altimax 175/65-15 tires on my RT ( with basic fenders ) I did have to use washers on the lugs to bring the tire out from the brackets a bit ... and it worked ..... the Altimax is the largest 175/65 -15 I have encountered .... so yours may well fit ..... but see if you can exchange them ... I have done this with TIRERACK and they didn't charge return shipping .... if that is where you bought them call them or whoever you did buy them from .... Mike

[Peter Aawen]

Well non-directional means just that ..... there will be no difference ..... i have that tire in 160/65-15 ... mine had a blue line on one side of the tread ... this was to show you you Exactly how to match the left & right side .... this means don't have one blue line on the inside and the other on the OUTSIDE ...or vice versa .... you can go to their web site for further info .... good luck .... Mike

Another way of looking at 'which direction' to mount your asymetrical front tires - have a look at the tires as if they were already mounted on the Spyder and you are looking at them from in front of the Spyder.... and make sure the majority of the larger tread 'grooves' that channel water off a wet road and out to the sides of the tread as the tires roll are angled UP & OUT from the inside of both tires. It's not quite so visible on the Q5's, but the majority of the angled grooves of the pair of tires together should effectively make a (sort of) wide 'V' shape, with the point where the tires join at the ground being the lower/middle point of that 'V' and the outer/upper points of each side of the 'V' being on the outside of each tire. Admittedly, with the Q5's, it's more of a 'very flattened V with only slightly raised outside points', but I hope you get the drift!

Anyhow, if the tread grooves do this, then as the tire rolls forwards, the inner edge of each tire with those grooves on it will hit the ground first and as the tire contact patch is rolled forwards when the tire rolls forwards, any water or other dispersable debris on the road surface will be pumped OUT & AWAY from underneath the tire as well as away from being blasted in & underneath the Spyder - and this is VERY IMPORTANT for our Spyders (&Rykers too!) because if you pump any water etc IN & UNDER them instead, then sure, it'll tend to keep any spray bothering other road users down a bit, but guess what's coming along just behind where all that 'extra water' ends up?!? It's your REAR TIRE!!

So by pumping all that water etc OUT & AWAY instead of IN & UNDER, you are avoiding creating a deeper layer of water over the road & therefore a greater traction risk for your rear tire & as any puddle/standing water etc will immediately try to run into the lower level area your front tires just created, you may even be improving the rear tire's chances of avoiding some high speed hydro-planing.

[EdMat]

Thanks guys.

Mike, it was Tirerack.com. I will probably exchange if possible, if not then someone around here is going to get a great deal on a couple of tires.

Peter, If this pic displays correctly it would be of a left side tire, viewed from the front and I think it shows what you are talking about.

2020-06-17_5-09-15.jpg

[Wahrsuul]

Hmmm, I got my Q5s in over the weekend. No blue line on them. So I guess I just guessimate?

[EdMat]

Wahrsuul, See the pic of the left side above then mirror image the right side to that. What size fronts did you get?

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Hmmm, I got my Q5s in over the weekend. No blue line on them. So I guess I just guessimate?

I don't know why mine has the " blue line " and yours didn't. I bought mine 8 mos. ago ..... but looking at the tread , there is a small difference in the tread bands ..... I would just make sure when they are mounted that the patterns are OPPOSITE from the other.... and if Vredestein lists them as " non-directional " .... they are .... PS, the Q-5 has one of the best " wet " road traction of any tire ( that fits spyders )...... Mike

[Steve W.]

Even better than the "blue line" and "groove direction" instructions, just read the sidewall.

One side of my tires says "INSIDE", so it is obviously mounted toward the bike.

The rear tire has the "INSIDE" mounted to the left, but it's non-directional, so it doesn't matter.

.

[Peter Aawen]

Even better than the "blue line" and "groove direction" instructions, just read the sidewall.

One side of my tires says "INSIDE", so it is obviously mounted toward the bike.

The rear tire has the "INSIDE" mounted to the left, but it's non-directional, so it doesn't matter.

.

Actually, if you look at the siping & grooves, you may well find that ON YOUR SPYDER front end, it might be smarter to put the side labelled INSIDE facing OUT & AWAY from the Spyder!!

I must admit that I don't specifically know if this is the case for the Q5's, but most auto tires are designed to spray most of the water they force out from between the contact patch and the road surface IN & UNDER the auto (minimising road spray for other road users) which is exactly where you DO NOT WANT IT to go while ryding your Spyder on wet roads, or your traction may suffer!

So as always, it does pay to check & carefully consider your specific application!

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Even better than the "blue line" and "groove direction" instructions, just read the sidewall.

One side of my tires says "INSIDE", so it is obviously mounted toward the bike.

The rear tire has the "INSIDE" mounted to the left, but it's non-directional, so it doesn't matter.

.

Thanks my old eyes missed that ............. Mike

[Wahrsuul]

Wahrsuul, See the pic of the left side above then mirror image the right side to that. What size fronts did you get?

I went with the 175/55 fronts. So what direction does the rear go?

[Peter Aawen]

I went with the 175/55 fronts. So what direction does the rear go?

It doesn't really matter which way you put an asymetrical/non directional tire on the rear of your Spyder/Ryker, altho I have a tendency to put the side labelled INSIDE facing AWAY from the disc brake, purely because I like my brakes to work as well as they can, and I'd rather not spray any 'extra lubricant' onto the disc - altho any degradation a disc &/or pad wet with just WATER would make is going to be fairly minimal, but who's to say that whatever I might hafta drive thru is always going to be water?!? It could be contaminated water, with oil &/or other solvents/lubricants that don't work well with discs & pads, or maybe it could be a neat lubricant of some sort?!?

That sorta stuff has been known to happen, and by inspecting the tread pattern & mounting the tire to direct the 'clearing spray' AWAY from the disc (which usually means running the INSIDE label facing the mounted riders' left hand side) I like to think I'm just minimising the risk!

Of course, YMMV, as might your preference; but you did ask, and that's my preference & the reason for it.

[Steve W.]

I don't think it matters much which way you mount the rear tire.

As I mentioned in post #16, the guy that mounted my tire put the INSIDE on the left side, but he had no idea whether it was belt side or brake side, and I was not aware that it could possibly make a difference.

.

[Wahrsuul]

Well, got the Q5's mounted and installed on Saturday. Seems the blue line was there, it was just down in the treads so the fronts are in the correct direction. Don't recall which direction on the rear.

All I can say so far is WOW, what a difference... and most of it bad. I've got 18psi in all three, and the rear has become uncontrollable. Its tried to come around on me several times, and without much effort will spin off the line. My Kumho didn't do that when worn unless I really tried. Diving into corners doesn't inspire much confidence - the tires seem ok till they hit a certain point, then grab way too much.

Maybe they just need to burn in, so I rode it to work this morning. Guess we'll see after some more miles since I don't have the $ to replace them any time soon.

In case you're wondering - 175/55-15 front and 205/60-15 rear.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Well, got the Q5's mounted and installed on Saturday. Seems the blue line was there, it was just down in the treads so the fronts are in the correct direction. Don't recall which direction on the rear.

All I can say so far is WOW, what a difference... and most of it bad. I've got 18psi in all three, and the rear has become uncontrollable. Its tried to come around on me several times, and without much effort will spin off the line. My Kumho didn't do that when worn unless I really tried. Diving into corners doesn't inspire much confidence - the tires seem ok till they hit a certain point, then grab way too much.

Maybe they just need to burn in, so I rode it to work this morning. Guess we'll see after some more miles since I don't have the $ to replace them any time soon.

In case you're wondering - 175/55-15 front and 205/60-15 rear.

Interesting ..... I discovered the Q-5 about 6 mo +/- ago, and follow every tire Thread .... and because it has very high Ratings in Wet, Dry, even Snow I recommended it as a first choice ..... Approx. 50 or so on this forum are using that tire ..... so far you are the ONLY person who appears to be having issues with how it makes your Spyder handle.... although you also said " they Grab too much ". A tire that has Excellent traction can seem to be " squirrelly " ie. hard to handle, because any operator inputs get Quick results ...... maybe try a lighter grip and gentler inputs ..... also at 18 psi, that is usually the Sweet spot for most operators ....... good luck .... keep us posted on your testing .... Mike

[Wahrsuul]

It's not that they felt squirrelly - if I'm in a corner and have to tighten the line, they'd feel ok, then suddenly seem to get a whole lot more traction almost pulling on the bars.

After burning it up some on saturday, the rear seems to have settled in better. I didn't push it much, but I wasn't pushing much saturday and it kept breaking loose. Supposed to rain later today so no riding.

[Peter Aawen]

Have you done anything else to your Spyder lately Wahrsuul??

I am very aware that new tires generally need some 'use', ie. at least one heat up/cool down cycle, sometimes quite a few more, before the tread actually starts to work properly for you in the way it's designed/intended to, and what you've described could be at least partially attributed to that.... . But then what you described also sounds very much to me what I've experienced just lately on my 2013 RT - which incidentally, has a set of tires on it that are very well worn in, so well worn that the rear is very close to replacement, and definitely not so new that the tread isn't working as well as it should yet!!

Let me explain - just recently, after only 7 years & 5 months of stalwart service, my OE battery finally gave up the ghost, suddenly and completely, blank screen type fritz whenever I pressed the starter button dead!! . Sooo, after much angst & rending of cloth, I bit the bullet & replaced it with slightly stronger battery - fitted it myself fairly easily, just a little bit of difficulty keeping the ground wire where it needed to be as the battery went in instead of catching in behind the battery case & stopping it all from sliding into the right spot. Buuut, no biggie, got the job done, did a short test ryde, all OK, so the next day put the Child Bride on the back & went for a bit of a ryde to visit some friends, only a couple of hundred kms all up for the day. Great ryde down, took the gentler more scenic route, enjoyed the visit, had a great long lunch, & started back home via the far more technical & twisty route, expecting a really enhpjoyable run.... only it was baaad, very, VERY BAD!!


Initially, it just occasionally felt like I had a flat rear tire, or maybe a slow leak on one of the fronts, depending on which way I was turning, but I stopped & checked - pressures were all fine? Then as we went on it all started getting worse - the steering would be sorta OK on the straights, altho it still sometimes felt like I had a flat somewhere; it even felt pretty good entering the corners, but then it'd suddenly seem to grab traction & dive in, occasionally almost off the road or into oncoming traffic; or worse, it'd suddenly haul out of the curve hard, just as tho the outside wheel had caught on a railway track!! But strangely, it felt better/happened less if I changed down early, going down an extra gear, & keeping the revs waay up??!? Still, it wasn't a very comfortable or nice trip home, & I was more than just a bit concerned about the possibilities of things like ball joint failures, shot upper 'A' arm bushes, even thinking about the possibility of bent suspension or steering arms, or maybe it could be a stuffed DPS....

BUT, the battery was the last thing I'd touched, so I checked it first! Terminals were all tight (I put star washers on them before I even rode it home from the dealer when it was new... & I replaced them with the new battery too!) but the ground lead did feel a bit odd & sorta floppy on the other (hidden) end.... . So I chased it down & found that the cable was quite loose in the crimp fitting where it bolts onto the frame!! I must've loosened it a bit as I pushed it around while fitting the new battery, & then our 'spirited ryding' loosened it up even more; so it was making a 'less than adequate' connection for the power hungry DPS & the 'very sensitive to voltage fluctuations' steering angle/torque sensor!! Easy fix tho, big crimper, solder, & some heat and all the odd steering worries were gone! We've done well over 1000 km on the RT since and absobloodylutely NO recurrences!

So it's now obvious to me that in my case, it was the loose ground on the frame that was making the DPS play up &/or provide erratic steering assist, nothing at all to do with the tires or the suspension or bent arms or anything else!! Aaaand what you are describing sounds very much like it could be something similar - maybe even a mis-behaving DPS or Steering Angle Sensor, possibly just because they aren't getting a proper power supply??! Or maybe it is just that you do need to work those new tires a bit, ryding 'carefully', sure, but don't 'baby' them; aim to get them properly heated up & run them for maybe 20-50 miles or so, including some fairly fast straights, some fairly firm stops or rapid slow downs, and running reasonably hard thru some twisties; then doing the same sort of thing again next time you ryde?! You might even need to do this a few times, maybe over as much as a couple of hundred miles to bed them in & pack the compound down properly.... but because NO others have reported this sort of 'bedding in' issue with their new Vredesteins, I'm fairly strongly suspecting that what you are experiencing is something that's not strictly tire related.... you haven't touched the battery or wiring lately, have you??