Front Tires: Federals vs. Vredestein

[Arcamguy]

I have decided to upgrade my front tires on my 2019 F3. After searching and reading many posts concerning front tire upgrades, I have narrowed down my choices to the following.

Federal Formoza -165/55R15 42.47 per tire on Amazon
Vredestein Quatrac 5 - 165/60R15 81.61 per tire on Tire Rack

Please give me any pros/cons concerning each tire and any additional concerns to help me make my decision.
The size I currently have on my F3 is 165/55/15

Thanks Arcamguy

[ARtraveler]

Vredestein seems to get the most action here.

I will leave the pros/cons to the tire experts. And there are a few on board.

[Arion]

As ARtraveler says, the Vredersteins are very popular on this forum. I replaced the stock fronts on my 2015 RT-S with the 165/60R 15 and am very pleased. Can't speak to the Federals but if I had it to do over I don't believe I would change my mind. But that's just my opinion - I'm not a tire expert by any stretch of the imagination.

Hopefully someone who has experience with both tires will chime in and offer better insight. It may also be possible that the choice is a case of "you get what you pay for" although it would be necessary to add to that comment your particular riding style. Yes, no?

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

I have decided to upgrade my front tires on my 2019 F3. After searching and reading many posts concerning front tire upgrades, I have narrowed down my choices to the following.

Federal Formoza -165/55R15 42.47 per tire on Amazon
Vredestein Quatrac 5 - 165/60R15 81.61 per tire on Tire Rack

Please give me any pros/cons concerning each tire and any additional concerns to help me make my decision.
The size I currently have on my F3 is 165/55/15

Thanks Arcamguy

I was a certified " accident investigator " as an LEO .... tires were a very large part of my training .... the most important thing about tires on Spyders, are the traction they provide...... Spyders are pretty unique because of the VSS system they have .... which is great at preventing loss of control ..... however that system can negate having the " best traction " .... the VSS largely depends on " traction " sensors, which means when your traction limits are exceeded the VSS kicks in, in milli-seconds..... So how does this relate to the above tires,.... I discovered the Q-5 about 5 mos. ago ... it has the best all-around performance rating of any tire that will FIT the Spyder oem wheels, especially in the WET ..... many here are using the Q-5, and report they love it ..... many also have the Formoza and love them also. .... I have the Q-5, is it worth twice as much as the Formoza .... in the Rain, I think they are ..... that's where traction is very important..... Ideally a side by side comparison would be great , however that has not been done ( and probably won't be ) ....... Mike

[Rattlebars]

Q5s are more attractive, ImHo

[wingit3611]

You probably need to mention the pressure you run them at. It has a lot to do with the traction. Even though it is subjective.

[troop]

Put the Vredestein Q5 165/60R15's on the front of my 2019 F3-S about 6 weeks ago. Only had 3K miles on the Kenda's. Running them with 17.5# PSI. DRAMATIC difference ! Plus, they have the snowflake winter rating. Being in WI, you just never know

[PinkRosePetal]

...Plus, they have the snowflake winter rating. Being in WI, you just never know

And that's the thing, being an all weather tyre it will go out of its performance envelope at high temperatures. Given that Arcamguy is in Texas, it probably isn't the best choice.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

You probably need to mention the pressure you run them at. It has a lot to do with the traction. Even though it is subjective.

" subjective " ..... the pressure used for Spyders with AUTO tires isn't really " subjective " ..... there are psi's that are significantly better than others, see what Peter Aawen hs to say about this ..... personally ( for many reasons ) I use 16-17 psi for fronts and 18 psi rear ..... and this is using auto tires ..... Mike

[MONK]

And that's the thing, being an all weather tyre it will go out of its performance envelope at high temperatures. Given that Arcamguy is in Texas, it probably isn't the best choice.

So what do folks do who live in fairly temperate climates? I live in NC. It's gets hot during the summers but I ride in the mountains, too, so I might start out @ 40* and end up @ 90* during an all day ride. I ride year round so in the middle of winter, the highs might be in the upper 30s all day. In the summer, the highs might be in the 90s all day. I don't need new tires yet but I might as well ask these questions now so I'm prepared for a tire sale or something.

[troop]

I knew going in that a snow rated tire would have a softer compound, there for, less than ideal for a hot weather tire. I also figured that it won't nearly be put to its limit on the front of a 1000# vehicle, with far less weight over the front tires than any automobile. In WI, I ran Goodyear Ultra Grip snow tires year round on my state trooper squads for the added traction, for many years. They were much better than the standard A/S tires. Replace when necessary. Plenty of high speed, plenty of high temperatures and lots of maneuvering. I had plenty of flats from road debris, but never a heat/tire related failure. I'm not worried.

[SpyderAnn01]

Get what you want and I’m sure you will get double the tread life out of either one vs the Kenda. I run the Federal Formoza. I ride 30,000 miles a year and have every year for the last 10 so I do have a lot of experience with Spyders. The Formozas handle great in all temperatures and road conditions and I get 40,000 miles out of them. They are asymmetrical so they can be rotated without the need to unmount the tire.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

And that's the thing, being an all weather tyre it will go out of its performance envelope at high temperatures. Given that Arcamguy is in Texas, it probably isn't the best choice.

...... if this were True ( which it isn't ) tire manufacture's would only make two types ...Full Winter and summer tires , but we all know that isn't how it works...... google Consumer Reports and see what they said about the Q-5 ..... Mike ....PS, as far as the Q-5's are concerned their tire compound formulation gives that tire very good COLD temp. abilities, but it doesn't take away what it can do at 100 + F temps.....

[T.P.]

I put Q5's on both front and back last August and have 2000 miles on them now. Because of the recomendation of BLUEKNIGHT911 and many others here. There was no second guessing just getting the OEM Kenda's off. I put 175/55-15's on the front and run 17 psi, on the rear I have a 205/60-15 and run 19psi. the last weekend of September 2019 we did an 800 mile ride in the rain and I thought they were great tires.

T.P.

[PinkRosePetal]

...... if this were True ( which it isn't ) tire manufacture's would only make two types ...Full Winter and summer tires , but we all know that isn't how it works...... google Consumer Reports and see what they said about the Q-5 ..... Mike ....PS, as far as the Q-5's are concerned their tire compound formulation gives that tire very good COLD temp. abilities, but it doesn't take away what it can do at 100 + F temps.....

I'm afraid you're wrong again. Tyres are made with a range of hysteresis. Tyres for true winter operation use a rubber with a hysteresis range totally unsuitable for use as hot weather tyres; similarly, hot weather summer tyres use a rubber compound with a hysteresis range which is totally unsuitable for full winter use. An all season tyre is a compromise between these extremes and is designed for use where extreme cold is not experienced but neither is extreme heat experienced. Consequently they have operational limits with regard to usage just as do the winter and summer tyres. This, of course, is without considering the suitability of the tread pattern for the different applications.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

I'm afraid you're wrong again. Tyres are made with a range of hysteresis. Tyres for true winter operation use a rubber with a hysteresis range totally unsuitable for use as hot weather tyres; similarly, hot weather summer tyres use a rubber compound with a hysteresis range which is totally unsuitable for full winter use. An all season tyre is a compromise between these extremes and is designed for use where extreme cold is not experienced but neither is extreme heat experienced. Consequently they have operational limits with regard to usage just as do the winter and summer tyres. This, of course, is without considering the suitability of the tread pattern for the different applications.

Dear PRP ... I doubt you are afraid of Anything .... The Kenda Spyder tires are .... " all season tires " and I'm fairly certain 99+ % of all AUTO tires on Spyders are ..... wait for it .............................. ALL Season tires ..... so are you suggesting Everyone needs to change their tires to Summer tires ............. ?????? ............. because according to Your theory anyone using All season tires above say 85 F might be putting themselves and their Passenger in danger .... this would also apply to passenger car and light truck owners, who probably have " all season tires " on their vehicles. I'm sorry if this offends you, but my knowledge of tires requires me to push back on your tire " theories "....... ride safe - ride happy .... Mike

[PinkRosePetal]

Well you've kinda got the gist of it, yes it is indeed true that tyre application for passenger cars follows the same rules, that's why there are winter, all-season and summer tyres available!

Tyre grip is directly related to the hysteresis of the rubber compound and this follows a typical curve where, at the lower temperatures the grip is considered unacceptable and it rises to a point of acceptability then on to peek where it is maximum then is begins to fall until it is again out of the range of acceptability.

The acceptable temperature range is engineered by the rubber compound designers and is different for different tyres as well as different for the various season's application.
A particular tyre manufacturer will have their own ideas about what compromises they make during the tyre's production.

Tyre rubber is a visco-elastic material so it does not follow 'normal' rules of friction and load.

If you really want to know about tyre theory there is a super publication released by the Michelin tyre company. It has been around for a number of years in a few different versions. It is available to download but be prepared to do some math for full understanding. However, it is good because it gives explanations also for the lay person so doesn't need to be considered only as technical treatise. I don't have a link for it at present but if I come across it I'll let you know.

Meanwhile, here's a little puzzler for you: when you're travelling down the road at 50mph on your Spyder, the top of your tyre is travelling at 100mph and the bottom is standing still at 0mph.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Well you've kinda got the gist of it, yes it is indeed true that tyre application for passenger cars follows the same rules, that's why there are winter, all-season and summer tyres available!

Tyre grip is directly related to the hysteresis of the rubber compound and this follows a typical curve where, at the lower temperatures the grip is considered unacceptable and it rises to a point of acceptability then on to peek where it is maximum then is begins to fall until it is again out of the range of acceptability.

The acceptable temperature range is engineered by the rubber compound designers and is different for different tyres as well as different for the various season's application.
A particular tyre manufacturer will have their own ideas about what compromises they make during the tyre's production.

Tyre rubber is a visco-elastic material so it does not follow 'normal' rules of friction and load.

If you really want to know about tyre theory there is a super publication released by the Michelin tyre company. It has been around for a number of years in a few different versions. It is available to download but be prepared to do some math for full understanding. However, it is good because it gives explanations also for the lay person so doesn't need to be considered only as technical treatise. I don't have a link for it at present but if I come across it I'll let you know.

Meanwhile, here's a little puzzler for you: when you're travelling down the road at 50mph on your Spyder, the top of your tyre is travelling at 100mph and the bottom is standing still at 0mph.

From what you just wrote about your theory on tires, .... I gather it's your contention that the engineers who formulate " tire compounds " don't take the climactic conditions the tires are used in..... You should consider " enlightening " them about your theories , I'm sure many, many lives could be saved....... Mike

[PinkRosePetal]

From what you just wrote about your theory on tires, .... I gather it's your contention that the engineers who formulate " tire compounds " don't take the climactic conditions the tires are used in..... You should consider " enlightening " them about your theories , I'm sure many, many lives could be saved....... Mike

Oooo..... Now you're resorting to sarcasm! Nice!

[Peter Aawen]

Now c'mon everyone, play nice!

[CJDavis]

So.. What did you pick? I'm in the same boat!

[Arcamguy]

I went with Vredestein Quatrac 5 in 165/60/15. Best mod so far as I now have a smooth ride and Hugh difference from the factory Kenda's.

[Steve W.]

I installed Vred Q5s (175/55 on the front, 206/65 on the rear) a couple of weeks ago.

Saying that the difference is dramatic is a bit of an understatement.

.

[trikermutha]

Anything you install will be dramatically different than stock..

Same goes for the Federals to Achilles ATR-K Economist. Much less resistance on the steering and less road noise.

Not trying to get into a debate.

[sandman53]

I an running the Formosa's. 32,000 on them, and still look great!