Bleeding Brakes and ABS unit?

[Revalden]

I'm getting ready to bleed the brakes and the ABS unit and I've been reading some archived posts on the subject and have a few questions.
1. Can the ABS unit be bled without BUDS, and how?
2. What is De-Gassing the new fluid, and how?
3. Is DOT 4 required?
4. I have a power bleeder with a one-way valve (that I haven't used before but I've read the Destructions and it's ready to go) is pumping the pedal necessary to get a firm pedal?

Thanks for your help

[Freddy]

1. Yes, but not completely. There's a bleed valve on top of it also.

2. Allowing it to sit for some time to allow bubbles to rise and dissipate after transport/shaking.

3. Yes.

4. Yes but ensure the ignition key remains in the OFF position. I doubt your power bleeder will work for you on this application but lets know.

[RICZ]

For a stupidly simple bleed, install Speed Bleeders. When ordering, do it by phone so you get the correct ones. There have been mix-ups.
http://speedbleeder.com/bikechart.htm

[Bfromla]

ONLY DOT4 fluid. Please :& fresh fluid every 2 years

[PMK]

Degassing fluid is a simple process to remove micro bubbles, unable to be seen at ambient pressure, such as while the fluid is sitting there in a glass jar.

Freddy mentioned, allowing the fluid to sit will degas it. Actually, that is not quite accurate. His method removes major bubbles which is easily done by letting the fluid sit.

True degassing involves applying vacuum on top of the fluid. Typically, for degassing more than 27 in hg works best. Since degassing requires a rigid container, often a glass jar works best and also allows a visual reference of when the fluid is degassed.

Degassed fluid removes micro bubbles, and provides two things. First would be a true solid column of fluid resulting in a firmer brake pedal feel. Second is that degassed fluid has no entrapped air, other gases or moisture. This will give higher performance, longer fluid life, and avoid possible corrosion concerns.

[Freddy]

Simple process but it's like hens teeth.

[Revalden]

Well, I had almost everything setup and ready, then I took the caps off and the fluid was almost as clear as new. Aborted the process. At least I hadn't already jacked it up and taken the wheels off. But thanks for all the info and insight ya'll.
Maybe I'll just bleed my pick'em up. Whatever is in there has been there since 2006.

[Freddy]

Get one of these and you'll know what's what.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/...esters-reviews

[PMK]

Well, I had almost everything setup and ready, then I took the caps off and the fluid was almost as clear as new. Aborted the process. At least I hadn't already jacked it up and taken the wheels off. But thanks for all the info and insight ya'll.
Maybe I'll just bleed my pick'em up. Whatever is in there has been there since 2006.

Entirely your call on not flushing the brake system.

For comparison, our bike had oem brake fluid in it. Was less than 2 years old. Removed the fluid from the reservoir by pulling it out with a vacuum bleeder. Poured the used rezzy fluid into a Mason jar. Actually looked very clean and good.

Setup as needed and flushed the entire brake system. The fluid that came out of the brake system itself was horribly dark and contaminated. Accomplished two complete system flushes that day, then a final bleed. Huge improvement in the brake performance and pedal feel.

Two years later, accomplished another complete flush. This time, again the rezzy fluid looked pristine, while the system fluid was slightly darkened by calendar timed out. As before, the complete flush and proper bleed restored brake pedal feel and performance.

[Revalden]

Entirely your call on not flushing the brake system.

For comparison, our bike had oem brake fluid in it. Was less than 2 years old. Removed the fluid from the reservoir by pulling it out with a vacuum bleeder. Poured the used rezzy fluid into a Mason jar. Actually looked very clean and good.

Setup as needed and flushed the entire brake system. The fluid that came out of the brake system itself was horribly dark and contaminated. Accomplished two complete system flushes that day, then a final bleed. Huge improvement in the brake performance and pedal feel.

Two years later, accomplished another complete flush. This time, again the rezzy fluid looked pristine, while the system fluid was slightly darkened by calendar timed out. As before, the complete flush and proper bleed restored brake pedal feel and performance.

Thanks Flo, I'll probably do it later this year on both the truck and Spydie.

[RICZ]

How does one get to the bleeder on the ABS unit in an F3L? I have a Speed Bleeder I want to install on it and bleed it. I have a rather mushy pedal and have bled all three calipers. A very good Spyder tech said my pedal was OK and all Spyder brake pedals are a little soft. What say you??

[Peter Aawen]

AFAIK, that 'mushy pedal' thing only applied to the 2012's and earlier.... Once Spyders got the Brembo Brakes in 2013, if the brakes are properly bled & adjusted, & don't any other concerns or issues, then the pedal should be as firm if not firmer than the pedal on a modern car with fully functional brakes!

But I don't think your Speed Bleeder on the ABS unit will help you much unless you have access to BUDS to activate the ABS Pump with the engine stopped & the Spyder not moving....

Besides, I think a 'mushy pedal' really isn't going to have much to do with an ABS Unit that's not giving you all sorts of warnings that it won't work properly, so I'd be looking elsewhere for any causative problem first.... and I strongly suspect that your 'very good Spyder tech' just didn't want to be bothered with the job, cos tracing that sorta problem can be a bit tedious & hard to get right, so maybe the tech's not quite as 'good' as you initially thought?!

[RICZ]

Thanks Peter. You got me thinking that what I should do is a rip snortin' monster bleed on the three calipers. DOT4 doesn't cost that much that I can't afford it and Lord knows I have the time.

[RICZ]

Took er out today--no more brake squeak! Bought some caliper grease and will apply it to all friction surfaces.

[Big Arm]

I'll start out by saying I've had a brake failure warning for the last several weeks, so yesterday was a good day to install new brake pads on the rear and bleed my brakes, at least it started out that way. A few weeks ago, I had ordered four speed bleeders for the three wheels and the clutch, and also one for the ABS system. I have the '08 GS manual shift. I had no problem installing the three bleeders on three wheels, but when it came time to install the one on the ABS, I think this had to be one of the hardest jobs I've ever done on my bike. I thought at first I would attempt to reach it through the left front wheel opening, but that proved to be not doable. Next best thing was to remove the frunk for better access. No problem there, but once that was done, it was a real fight getting my small hands in to remove and installed the new bleeder. ( my advice ....Let It Go....) I really don't think it's worth the trouble, trying to bleed the ABS.
I bled the two front wheels, then the rear, and then the ABS. After assembling everything back together I was able to clear the low pressure message. The clutch can wait for another day.

[RoughRyder]

I know I am going to get blasted for this being an old post, but some of us still look through these for info.
The search for "brakes" just doesn't pull up info I need. Sorry.

I had just developed mushy brakes and talked to my dealer. I know this doesn't solve your issue, but someone
new reading this might get the help they need. The dealer told me that the culprit to most mushy brakes was the
rear. I bled both front brakes and then the rear (which was very difficult to get to without taking everything apart).
The fluid was really bad in color (I used an old pickle jar for clarity). Had my son keep fluid in the reservoir and pump
the brakes while I made sure everything down below was good. After purging until I got clear fluid, took her for
a spin and instead of coasting through stop signs without double pumping, it will throw you through the windshield.
I did not do anything with the ABS. Just kept it simple. It did the trick. Anyone reading this...you can do it.
Just start with the basics and try that. Then you can move to more complicated things if the simple one don't work.
KISS!! Keep it simple stupid.

[Peter Aawen]

I know I am going to get blasted for this being an old post, but some of us still look through these for info.
The search for "brakes" just doesn't pull up info I need. Sorry.

.....

But you only put up your post today!? So IT's not old...

And Threads don't really even start to get old until they've been around without any more posts being added for at least a couple of years, so this thread barely qualifies as 'old', if at all And that applies especially now that you've added a post with further info in it!

Besides, it helps a whole lot if people DO try a search first and then add to or expand upon an earlier thread rather than starting yet another thread on any given subject! . It helps keep all the associated info in one place/thread; it lends itself to finding a more complete answer in a given thread; and it reduces the number of similar threads readers/searchers might hafta wade thru to find the snippet of info that resolves their particular problem!

One of the reasons searching on 'brakes' by itself doesn't help much is that there are so many threads discussing very much the same or similar issues/info that you can't tell which thread is going to help most!! If only everybody who'd started a new thread on something already covered had simply added to the existing thread it'd be a whole lot easier for all!! And so many just don't even TRY doing a search first! . .

Still, since you were interested specifically in BLEEDING brakes, a basic search with "bleeding; + brakes" entered in the search field and the 'Search Titles Only' box ticked would've returned this thread as the fourth thread in the results list! And if you'd wanted to include ABS in that search criteria, entering "Bleeding; + brakes; + ABS" & ticking the 'Search Titles Only' box would've brought back a list with only THREE threads in the results, with this one right at the top!

So please, keep on adding to 'old' threads as well as adding to younger threads like this one; and keep on doing those searches before starting a new thread too - altho it might pay to try adding another key word or two if you can in order to narrow down the results a little! . And if you ever have hassles doing that or just need a hand searching for a thread that you know is on the boards somewhere, there's usually at least one Moderator around the place, and you are most welcome to ask for a hand at any time! If you can't see a Green Username in the recent posts, you can always click on 'Forum' up the top left of the page, just inboard of the 'Home' button, then go down to the 'Currently Active Users' list about 4/5ths of the way down the Forum page & look for a Green username there! Once you can see which of us has been on the boards most recently, or even if you just pick a Moderator at random to ask; just Pick a Moderator, click on their username, and send a PM.... we'll get back to you as soon as we can after getting the message!

Cheers!

[davev1pa]

I have bled the 12 rt and 14 rt. Brake pads as well on both. I use speedbleeders.com. I don't do the ABS unit. No BUDS. My 12 is a mush pedal but that's the nature of the beast. The 14 has the Brembo and is rock solid... my wife complained about the 12 so we switched and now its mine. I contemplated new rotors and calipers from other sources for the 12 but it's not really feasible. Spoke with BAJARON but if I can't exchange every component I don't want to piecemeal a new brake system for the 12..It does stop decently but nowhere near the feel of the 14.My wife is inexperienced and she noticed so there is something lacking in the earlier models.

[UtahPete]

I have bled the 12 rt and 14 rt. Brake pads as well on both. I use speedbleeders.com. I don't do the ABS unit. No BUDS. My 12 is a mush pedal but that's the nature of the beast. The 14 has the Brembo and is rock solid... my wife complained about the 12 so we switched and now its mine. I contemplated new rotors and calipers from other sources for the 12 but it's not really feasible. Spoke with BAJARON but if I can't exchange every component I don't want to piecemeal a new brake system for the 12..It does stop decently but nowhere near the feel of the 14.My wife is inexperienced and she noticed so there is something lacking in the earlier models.

Mine is due. You got me thinking about it now...