Tire balancing

[spyder01]

As the former owner of a shop that installed a lot of tires I always hated beads bc after a few thousand miles they would get dusty and then when you checked or adjusted your pressure a little of that dust would get stuck in the valve causing a leak.Front wheels are easy for any shop to balance but this can be tough bc the bearing hole is smaller than most every tire machine except for ones made for these type wheels.When I put my Kanine rear on 2 days ago I put rear axle in bench vise and slid tire on it.These tires will spin with almost no friction by doing this,then you can find heavy spot and use sticky weights to balance out.Seems a little old school but it works great on the rear.

[triplethreat]

As the former owner of a shop that installed a lot of tires I always hated beads bc after a few thousand miles they would get dusty and then when you checked or adjusted your pressure a little of that dust would get stuck in the valve causing a leak.Front wheels are easy for any shop to balance but this can be tough bc the bearing hole is smaller than most every tire machine except for ones made for these type wheels.When I put my Kanine rear on 2 days ago I put rear axle in bench vise and slid tire on it.These tires will spin with almost no friction by doing this,then you can find heavy spot and use sticky weights to balance out.Seems a little old school but it works great on the rear.

I have a static balancer and a NoMar tire changer in my garage....it has been used over the last 13 years for changing and balancing motorcycle tires. If I were to make a guess on the number of tires that I've changed and balanced, I would guess that the number is over 150 tires. At one time, we had two or three race bikes, two street bikes, and a Sport Touring bike. The static balancer, if done correctly will perfectly balance a motorcycle tire and I've tested that with speeds up to 175 MPH on my race bikes over the years. I'm not sure if this setup will allow me to try and do my Spyder tires when the time comes, but more than likely I will attempt it and see what the results will be. Since I've not gotten to the point that I need tires yet (new Spyder in late February) it may be a while before I find out the results, but I certainly hope the static balancer setup will work as it is a known/proven method to tire balance for me. These types of bikes go through tires like water through a screendoor. I've had rear tires that had a total of around 350 miles or less on them when they had to be changed and new rubber put on. Over the years of track riding and Instructing, I've probably logged close to 40,000 miles on the race bikes......and lots and lots of tires.

[trikermutha]

So, are you using the beads in addition to the 'road force' balance?

Only beads on rear. Road force only on the front wheels.
Just changed to the Kanine tire so far dont feel any vibration just with the beads on the rear.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Only beads on rear. Road force only on the front wheels.
Just changed to the Kanine tire so far dont feel any vibration just with the beads on the rear.

For my last 5 REAR tire changes, I didn't do any balancing , other than using the red or yellow dot in conjunction with the valve position ...... NO vibes .... Mike

[Lew L]

My General Altimax rear tire needed NO weights to balance.

[Jetfixer]

To be able to get a tire properly balanced, you must start with the right mounting technique. From Yokohama:

To facilitate proper balancing, Yokohama places red and yellow marks on the sidewalls of its tires to enable the best possible match-mounting of the tire/wheel assembly. There are two methods of match-mounting Yokohama tires to wheel assemblies using these red or yellow marks:

Uniformity (red mark)
Weight (yellow mark)
1) UNIFORMITY METHOD
When performing uniformity match-mounting, the red mark on the tire, indicating the point of maximum radial force variation, should be aligned with the wheel assembly's point of minimum radial run-out, which is generally indicated by a colored dot or a notch somewhere on the wheel assembly (consult manufacturer for details). Radial force variation is the fluctuation in the force that appears in the rotating axis of a tire when a specific load is applied and the tire rotated at a specific speed. It is necessary to minimize radial force variation to ensure trouble-free installation and operation. Not all wheel assemblies indicate the point of minimum radial run-out, rendering uniformity match-mounting sometimes impossible. If the point of minimum radial run-out is not indicated on a wheel assembly, the weight method of match-mounting should be used.

2) WEIGHT METHOD
When performing weight match-mounting, the yellow mark on the tire, indicating the point of lightest weight, should be aligned with the valve stem on the wheel assembly, which represents the heaviest weight point of the wheel assembly. After match-mounting by either of the above methods, the tire/wheel assembly can be balanced.

[Bensonoid]

I use a bubble balancer for the front's and a static balancer for the rear. I was amazed at how many weights were needed to balance the stock tires, the new rubber needed way less.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

I use a bubble balancer for the front's and a static balancer for the rear. I was amazed at how many weights were needed to balance the stock tires, the new rubber needed way less.

Yep.... Kenda's are poor tires for too many reasons for me to type ( at the moment ) ......Mike

[Peter Aawen]

Yep.... Kenda's are poor tires for too many reasons for me to type ( at the moment ) ......Mike

Not that it hasn't already been said too many times to count earlier/elsewhere on this Forum & others, Mike!

The sad thing about all this is that while some might avoid the 'out of round', impossible to balance, or tire delamination issues that these Kendas are so prone to experiencing; others might even get 'sorta OK' performance & handling from them; and some of the front tires & a even few rear Kendas might even return reasonable mileage (largely cos the load up front is so light & relatively gentle ryding sometimes doesn't appear to stress the more recent rears as much either!) for those who avoid the major issues with these Kendas, it can seem that they are 'alright tires' BUUT, it's really only once people have swapped over to a better quality tire run at an appropriate pressure for the load imposed upon them by our Spyders/Rykers that they realise how POOR the OE Spec Kendas actually WERE & seemingly still ARE, even if they are juust a little better than they have been in the past!

Just like many people ryde their Spyders & Rykers with the stock sway bars fitted and wonder why everyone raves about upgrading their sway bars and how BajaRon's (or ISPYD's &/or Fagan's alternatives here in Oz) are SOOO much of an improvement, many of those who are reasonably happy ryding as they are on the OE sway bars and simarly those persisting with the OE Spec Kenda tires really won't ever know how much they are short-changing themselves on their ryding experience... at least not until they DO actually make the change and experience the improvements these things bring for themselves!

It might be that the explanations on Forums just don't/won't ever do it for some; it's probably hard for others to even catch a glimmer of understanding that sorta stuff without really experiencing it for themselves, but I'm a stubborn bar steward, so I'll try once again....

I reckon it'd be very much like putting a set of el-cheapo rag tires from a down-town knock-off shop on a Nascar & then letting these 'un-believers' do a couple of laps of the Brickyard, as fast as they like &/or are prepared to go!! For many, that's gonna be bloody fantastic and thrilling and the most wonderful thing they've ever experienced.... But that's only cos they just can't tell from that 'little taste' how much GREATER & BETTER & MORE THRILLING & all the rest it'd be if they did the same thing on a set of race spec tires!! And for those who can feel or sense the capabilities of that Nascar even on the rag tires, just imagine how it's gonna be such a let down when they're told by the pit-crew (or the Dealer/BRP) that the rag tires are the ONLY black round things that are 'approved' for that car (or Spyder/Ryker!! ) And for those of us lucky enough to have experienced 'the Nascar with race spec tires' being let loose on a track &/or its Spyder/Ryker analogy, that 'only approved tire' thing is just so much BS!!

But we can only lead the horses to water, people - we can't make them drink, especialy if they don't WANT to!! Well, I 'spose if they're 'boy horses' and you are standing behind them with a brick in each hand, then maybe you could try..... But if you do that, you hafta remember 2 things - the first is - keep your thumbs outta the way when you smash them together on that sensitive anatomy; and the second is - that you'd better bloody well get it right on your first shot, cos horses can REALLY KICK!! Especially if you're standing right behind them when you try to crush their n**s between those two bricks so they'll suck in, hard - and if you miss or just hit a glancing blow....

So, the point is, how many Spyder/Ryker ryders have you seen here or elsewhere who've made the switch to 'the dark side' and have been so disappointed that they've gone back?!? Sure, there've been a few who've mad the switch & then gone back for other reasons, there are even some who've made the switch but haven't followed the load/pressure advice & been a little disappounted, but by far the majority of those who HAVE made the switch and experienced the difference, they are more than happy and wouldn't willingly go back if you paid them!!

[trikermutha]

Well finally got a good right in on the new tires. Rear is the Kanine and fronts are Achilles ATR-K Economist.

The fronts are much quieter and seem to have less resistance at the steering . Had the Federal Formoza until I blew out the right tire. Had them balance at the firestone center but brought my own cone hub for there machine
The rear had no issue with balancing and seemed well planted to the ground. Only have Counteract balance Beads in the tire. Per the Kanine tire on the sidewall , states (standard J rim) for those wondering about the rim and car tires.

Had it up to 85 MPH and ran perfectly.

[Geep]

Just got a new General Altimax rear tire and there are no color spots on either side???? What to do???

To be able to get a tire properly balanced, you must start with the right mounting technique. From Yokohama:

To facilitate proper balancing, Yokohama places red and yellow marks on the sidewalls of its tires to enable the best possible match-mounting of the tire/wheel assembly. There are two methods of match-mounting Yokohama tires to wheel assemblies using these red or yellow marks:

Uniformity (red mark)
Weight (yellow mark)
1) UNIFORMITY METHOD
When performing uniformity match-mounting, the red mark on the tire, indicating the point of maximum radial force variation, should be aligned with the wheel assembly's point of minimum radial run-out, which is generally indicated by a colored dot or a notch somewhere on the wheel assembly (consult manufacturer for details). Radial force variation is the fluctuation in the force that appears in the rotating axis of a tire when a specific load is applied and the tire rotated at a specific speed. It is necessary to minimize radial force variation to ensure trouble-free installation and operation. Not all wheel assemblies indicate the point of minimum radial run-out, rendering uniformity match-mounting sometimes impossible. If the point of minimum radial run-out is not indicated on a wheel assembly, the weight method of match-mounting should be used.

2) WEIGHT METHOD
When performing weight match-mounting, the yellow mark on the tire, indicating the point of lightest weight, should be aligned with the valve stem on the wheel assembly, which represents the heaviest weight point of the wheel assembly. After match-mounting by either of the above methods, the tire/wheel assembly can be balanced.

[Peter Aawen]

Just got a new General Altimax rear tire and there are no color spots on either side???? What to do???

No colour spots could mean either of two things:

1). The tire didn't have any detectable lighter section (no yellow dot) &/or there's no significant radial run-out (no red dot) so just mount away; or

2). General don't/didn't bother doing the dot thing on that batch of tires, not all manufacturers do, not all batches of tires get checked &/or marked, so just mount away!

You should ONLY consider the dot/s and mount accordingly IF they are there, and not all brands &/or tires will have them. If they don't, do your best to balance anyway! That said, with most modern reasonable quality auto tires, you really shouldn't need much in the way of balancing for the tire alone....

[spyderwing57]

I used balance beads in my Goldwing tires love them. When I just had car tires installed on the spyder They didn't have a small enough adapter to speed balance they put 3 ounces of beads in each tire. Only had it up to 75mph no problem.

[spyderwing57]

On my Goldwing I used an engraving tool it vibrates. The small tube allowed the beads to go in slowly thru the valve with shrader out and the vibrating tool dropped them right in be patient.

[triplethreat]

To be able to get a tire properly balanced, you must start with the right mounting technique. From Yokohama:

To facilitate proper balancing, Yokohama places red and yellow marks on the sidewalls of its tires to enable the best possible match-mounting of the tire/wheel assembly. There are two methods of match-mounting Yokohama tires to wheel assemblies using these red or yellow marks:

Uniformity (red mark)
Weight (yellow mark)
1) UNIFORMITY METHOD
When performing uniformity match-mounting, the red mark on the tire, indicating the point of maximum radial force variation, should be aligned with the wheel assembly's point of minimum radial run-out, which is generally indicated by a colored dot or a notch somewhere on the wheel assembly (consult manufacturer for details). Radial force variation is the fluctuation in the force that appears in the rotating axis of a tire when a specific load is applied and the tire rotated at a specific speed. It is necessary to minimize radial force variation to ensure trouble-free installation and operation. Not all wheel assemblies indicate the point of minimum radial run-out, rendering uniformity match-mounting sometimes impossible. If the point of minimum radial run-out is not indicated on a wheel assembly, the weight method of match-mounting should be used.

2) WEIGHT METHOD
When performing weight match-mounting, the yellow mark on the tire, indicating the point of lightest weight, should be aligned with the valve stem on the wheel assembly, which represents the heaviest weight point of the wheel assembly. After match-mounting by either of the above methods, the tire/wheel assembly can be balanced.

This isn't always the case. I've mounted many motorcycle tires on wheels and the valve stem location is sometimes the heaviest part of the wheel, but not always. I finally got to the point that I would put just the wheel on the balancer and find the "real" heavy spot on the wheel before trying to mount the tire on the wheel. On my personal bikes, I would use a spring loaded center punch and mark the heavy spot with a little indentation so that I knew where it was at the next time. It happened more often than you would think that the heavy spot WASN'T at the valve stem.

[h0gr1der]

This isn't always the case. I've mounted many motorcycle tires on wheels and the valve stem location is sometimes the heaviest part of the wheel, but not always. I finally got to the point that I would put just the wheel on the balancer and find the "real" heavy spot on the wheel before trying to mount the tire on the wheel. On my personal bikes, I would use a spring loaded center punch and mark the heavy spot with a little indentation so that I knew where it was at the next time. It happened more often than you would think that the heavy spot WASN'T at the valve stem.

I did exactly the same thing, then to add to that I put the wheel and tire assembly on the balance shaft before popping the beads, and almost got a perfect balance without weights. When I got it to move the least, I popped the beads and balanced as normal. Not a road force balance, but still smooth as can be.

[triplethreat]

I did exactly the same thing, then to add to that I put the wheel and tire assembly on the balance shaft before popping the beads, and almost got a perfect balance without weights. When I got it to move the least, I popped the beads and balanced as normal. Not a road force balance, but still smooth as can be.

I guess two great minds think alike...I've done the very same thing....tire and wheel together on the balancer....rotate the tire around the wheel and then set the beads. Thanks for sharing

[Bensonoid]

I do that with the bubble balancer also. It's a pain in the butt lifting it off, spinning, and putting it back on, but worth it.

[FastOldGuy]

I have Stayed at the Holiday In Express and was part owner in a Tire shop in the 1970's and early 1980's.

I bought my Spyder 2 weeks ago with 2,500 miles on the clock. Last week I went alllll over it and Cleaned it Top to Bottom. (Removed the front wheels and cleaned the backsides.)

The first weekend we rode it about 350 miles in 2 days. My opinion of the Kenda tires were they are Crap. Checking them when I cleaned it, they have Flat Spots that will Not come out. This bike sat for over a year when the original owner Passed Away. I expected after the tires got Hot and had a few miles on them they'd be OK. NOT!

If YOUR Tires Are Not Round, Balancing them is Not going to do Squat. You Can Balance a Square but it's going to ride like Crap. I see on need to try to do anything to my Kenda's but replace them. Before you start spending money on Balancing, ride your Spyder a few miles and quickly jack it up and check to see how Round your tires are.

[_..stiffler..]

I bought the counteract balancing beads. They have a kit specially for spyder. 2 oz in front and 3 oz in rear.

They suck. I get a wobble now at 75-85 km/h. I put them in through valve stem. It was easy and I didn't drop a bead. I'm thinking of adding another oz to each front to see if that works. But if not I have to take both front tires in and remove the tires, dump out the beads and rebalance. What a pain and a waste of money.

I hope I don't have to remove the rear again for this.

I wont use beads ever again.

Stiff

[bikerbillone]

My experience with Ride-On has been good, Lamonster Garage also has another product that he recommends.

[troop]

Ride-On also acts as a tire balancer. It looks like the Lamonster (AmerSeal) product is a sealant only.. I have been using Ride-On for many years in many different bikes. Like Ron, I haven't had any flat related issues, but I know the bikes (and Spyder) track nice and true balance wise..

[bikerbillone]

I would go to the Ride-On web site, it's a good read, then to Amazon to read the comments for other's experience. Here's a thought, put the Ride-On in the tires on top of the beads to save time trying to get them out. Having said that, I've never done it, I have no idea how it would work out, you could call Ride-On and get their professional opinion. Just a crazy idea, don't accept it as gospel, it may be a 'bad' idea.