I got one of LaMonsters between the bars RAM mounts today and decided to install it on my 2018 RTL. How frickin' difficult could this be, right? Remove the top 2 bolts, install the mount with the 2 (supplied) longer bolts and spacers and that's it. Yeah. NOT the story of MY life. I wanted to break both the top bolts free before I got busy removing them. Got the right one just barely loose (1/16th of a turn) and went to work on the left one. I twisted and grunted and finally the wrench turned! Yea! Crap. The bolt didn't move but it stripped out the inside of the bolt head.
Obviously, once I'm able to remove the bolt, I have the replacements that came with the LaMonster mount. How in the living f*** do I remove that bolt? There's not enough room to get in there with a Dremel and cut a groove so I can use a flat head screwdriver and obviouly no way to get a set of channel locks around it, either.
Does anybody have any suggestions, please? It's not like I can't ride but I need to get that friggin' bolt out of there (preferably without damaging anything else).
(How about a DEAL? If someone comes over to remove the bolt (while I stand every bit of 6' away, inside my house, with the door closed, wearing a face mask, and gloves), I'll give them a brand new roll of generic TOILET PAPER!)
Get a good quality Allen socket. Heat up the head of the bolt.Insert the Allen socket into the head of the bolt. Tap it with a hammer then turn it out with a ratchet.
Here's a pic of the bolt head. Not sure what good an Allen wrench/socket will do. I don't have a torch but I suppose I can buy one. I've got a good set of Allen's. I sure don't want to destroy 1 just to try to get this friggin' bolt out. I still don't know why it wouldn't turn. I get using blue loctite but could it have red loctite on it? Superglue? A new glue made with oxyniacilathatium? (I just made that up.)
I'd use the allen wrench and strike it a few hard times with a hammer. Pick up a cheap allen wrench if you don't want to wack your good set.
Next, use the appropriate allen socket and try to TIGHTEN it a wee bit. Then go for a full on removal. You don't want to cut into the bolt to try a screw driver. You will weaken the head and it might shatter.
You have time on your side. Try some penetrating oil too.
Tim
Current - 2010 Spyder RTS
1) Experience is something you don't get until after you need it.
2) A closed mouth gathers no foot.
3) IF YOU DON'T HAVE TIME TO DO IT RIGHT, WHEN WILL YOU HAVE TIME TO DO IT OVER??
___
Horsepower is an illusory mathematical equation; Torque is REAL, and is the source of all good things in the world.
The problem is not the problem. The problem is your attitude about the problem. Do you understand?
First I'll state that I have had a food machine repair biz for over 40 years and had to deal with way too many seized, stuck, frozen and corroded fasteners.
BRP set you up for this as they are to generous with Loctite. Here's how I'd deal with your problem....
+ Place a punch that just fits in the allen recess and with hammer, give it a few whacks.
+ Loctite will soften with heat - if using a torch be super careful you don't scorch finishes surround the bolt. Could be a hair dryer might suffice.
+ It can't hurt to put a good penetrate in the hole - not WD-40 - Liquid Wrench, or PB Blaster in that order of preference.
+ I hope you have an allen socket for this step; place the socket on a wrench handle (non ratcheting is preferable) and tap the handle with a hammer.
+ If the above doesn't do the job, then it's time to drill the thing out, but you REALLY need to know what you're doing.
+ In the future, when removing fasteners that fight back, use the above steps.
Ours is a red, black and chrome 2017 F3 Limited. Bought new in 2/2019. The avatar is my first bike back in 1952, a Simplex Servi-Cycle. Photo taken at the Barber Museum.
First I'll state that I have had a food machine repair biz for over 40 years and had to deal with way too many seized, stuck, frozen and corroded fasteners.
BRP set you up for this as they are to generous with Loctite. Here's how I'd deal with your problem....
+ Place a punch that just fits in the allen recess and with hammer, give it a few whacks.
+ Loctite will soften with heat - if using a torch be super careful you don't scorch finishes surround the bolt. Could be a hair dryer might suffice.
+ It can't hurt to put a good penetrate in the hole - not WD-40 - Liquid Wrench, or PB Blaster in that order of preference.
+ I hope you have an allen socket for this step; place the socket on a wrench handle (non ratcheting is preferable) and tap the handle with a hammer.
+ If the above doesn't do the job, then it's time to drill the thing out, but you REALLY need to know what you're doing.
+ In the future, when removing fasteners that fight back, use the above steps.
Ricz, couldn't you heat the allen wrench in the bolt head to transfer the heat to keep from affecting the surrounding Tupperware?
2015 RTS SE6 Special Series Red/Black w/Magnesium front fenders(bought in Nov. 2018 w/9,400 miles)
Dynojet Power Commander V, Power Commander POD-300 Display, PCV Map Switch, Pedal Commander (WOW)
Passenger Arm Rests, Windshield Air Wing
Baja Ron's Sway Bar & Spring Adjusters
Air Scoops, LaMonster's Hiway Pegs
Magnetic Mirror Mounts, Air Innovations Seat Cushion
Red Chrome pin striping on Black hood
Federal Formoza AZ01 front tires (they're GREAT)
Kumho Ecsta AST KU25 All-Season Tire - 225/50R15 91H
LED bars above radiator inlets
LED brake/running/turn signals on license plate frame
Tag-Along trailer
LED headlights LED fog lights (WOW)
2" x 2" Road Lights inside front fenders
7' x 10' Cargo trailer
Garmin 396 LM GPS
RLS Cat-delete resonator with China Akropovic muffler
New Banshee AGM
M3 TPMS on front tires
Remote Control for Heated Jacket and Heated Riding Pants
Analog Clock and Analog Volt Meter
Loose Nut Behind Handlebars
then take out the other 3 bolts(hopefully),remove the cap and use a heat gun on the remaining stud,before you undo with multigrips(the locking kind)
those bolts are too tight otherwise......you do need a heat gun imho
russ
pres ride
2014 RT-S
bike is WIP
bike has endured elect spike (was jump started incorrectly)
still a WIP but bike is now running and registered....swapped out 5 modules mostly sourced from Canadian wrecker
Here's a pic of the bolt head. Not sure what good an Allen wrench/socket will do. I don't have a torch but I suppose I can buy one. I've got a good set of Allen's. I sure don't want to destroy 1 just to try to get this friggin' bolt out. I still don't know why it wouldn't turn. I get using blue loctite but could it have red loctite on it? Superglue? A new glue made with oxyniacilathatium? (I just made that up.)
had similar problem on rear brakes while back & seriously worried about whacking caliper with hammer. Thankfully was resolved with good couple soak & sit overnight with marvel mystery oil
(great at penetrating) & EZ out opted to drill 1 size up for a better bite, a medium tap from hammer , fair amount of torque (short T handle came with ez kit) IMG_9376.jpg & luckily found replacement on eBay came with springsIMG_9379.jpg *note* few threads & no locktight.
2013 STL SE5 BLACK CURRANT
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T r * * LED:foam grip covers, Tricrings, FenderZ,
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BRP fog lights, trailer hitch
SENA 20S EVO
A couple of tries... Firstly, as you know it's really tight so no Micky Mouse gentle heating or using an easy-out is going to do it. The real solution is as Merlot suggests, drill off the head and remove the other bolts and the bars then use a stud extractor to remove the remains of the bolt. There will be plenty of length for you to get a purchase on and you will have room to apply serious heat.
But before doing that you could try using a torx bit just one size up from the hex size. Whack it in really hard, you may find a combination of the tight fit and hammer blows will get it done. Grind the small lead taper off the torx bit to give you a cutting edge and also to get it deep into the hex hole. An impact driver might help.
It might be possible the weld a larger nut into the top of the bolt by welding down the hole, the welding heat will help too but you're definitely into dangerous territory....
From your picture it looks as though you still have a small bit of hex within the hole and also you've not kept the tool square to the bolt shank while pulling, it's come out with a twist and pasted the hole edge. The hex size is 7mm, nothing else will do, don't try removing the other bolts unless you've got the exact size in a quality hex driver. No Imperial equivalent!
Good luck with it...
Rule#2: Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level & then beat you with experience.
Rule#1: Refer to rule #2.
You can add heat to the equation though it would be tricky. If you use a mini torch you can add heat to it in a precise manor.
Mini torches may not have a huge flame but they can produce a small, manageable hot flame. Aiming this into the bolt head will transfer heat down the bolt shaft. You may have to cycle it as in 20 second heat and 20 seconds off repeated if you feel that something may be damaged. Doing that along with a set of "easy outs" that that Bfromla had shown above should work.
1) Experience is something you don't get until after you need it.
2) A closed mouth gathers no foot.
3) IF YOU DON'T HAVE TIME TO DO IT RIGHT, WHEN WILL YOU HAVE TIME TO DO IT OVER??
___
Horsepower is an illusory mathematical equation; Torque is REAL, and is the source of all good things in the world.
The problem is not the problem. The problem is your attitude about the problem. Do you understand?
Thanks for the replies, guys and gals. A bit more info about me. I don't have a garage (or carport) and my tools are limited. I don't have a torch although I can get one of those mini torches MrMagicFingers mentioned. I've got some decent Torx bits so maybe between heating up the bolt head and beating the crap out of the Torx bit, I can get it free.
merlot mentioned something about removing the other bolts and then removing the bars. I didn't think the bars could be removed on an RT w/o removing most of the front tupperware?
Unfortunately, I'm one of those guys who can bugger up even the simplest task. I wouldn't dare try to drill anything out. The modifications I've done/are doing are simple unbolt the old/bolt on the new kind of things. It was all simple until this.
You can add heat to the equation though it would be tricky. If you use a mini torch you can add heat to it in a precise manor.
Mini torches may not have a huge flame but they can produce a small, manageable hot flame. Aiming this into the bolt head will transfer heat down the bolt shaft. You may have to cycle it as in 20 second heat and 20 seconds off repeated if you feel that something may be damaged. Doing that along with a set of "easy outs" that that Bfromla had shown above should work.
You can do this safely and without setting fire to your Spyder!
All that needs to happen is enough heat to be transferred down the shaft of the bolt. You do NOT need to make that bolt head cherry red or anything remotely like that. 20 second on and 20 off... repeated. All that need s to happen is the locktight needs to soften, if that's whats going on here. You only make things real hot if you dealing with stuff that's been bonded by rust.
Once you figured that it had properly heated up... try the allen key again. If that does not work... heat cycle again and try again.
The torches are cheap. We can get them at Princess Auto (very much like your Harbour Freight) for $10-$15.
Don't use any penetrating oil at this point as that is usually flammable. Clean it up first if you have.
Let us know how you do!
Tim
Current - 2010 Spyder RTS
1) Experience is something you don't get until after you need it.
2) A closed mouth gathers no foot.
3) IF YOU DON'T HAVE TIME TO DO IT RIGHT, WHEN WILL YOU HAVE TIME TO DO IT OVER??
___
Horsepower is an illusory mathematical equation; Torque is REAL, and is the source of all good things in the world.
The problem is not the problem. The problem is your attitude about the problem. Do you understand?
Good luck. I installed that mount a while back.
My bolts were tight, but I had really good allen bits on a 3/8 breaker bar. After the initial break, they backed right out with a ratchet.
You have to have good bits though. Any deviation, wiggle, slop on the bolt, and you'll round it or deform it because the bit will always be harder than the fastener.
I like my set of VIM bits. They have never failed.
I agree you need heat at this point. The micro torch is a good idea.
i started with the impact driver, hitting a few times. then turned it out with a breaker bar.
look at your Allen key socket. some have a chamfer on the end which limits the contact surface area. i think a more square end has better contact.
the impact driver keeps the bit seated to the bottom while the bolt is turned. it may also break the thread sealant loose.
i had an electric soldering iron ready to heat up the bolt in case it seemed like i was failing.
good luck
ba
2019 F3-T Liquid Titanium
“we are all products of those to whom we have chosen to listen”
i started with the impact driver, hitting a few times. then turned it out with a breaker bar.
look at your Allen key socket. some have a chamfer on the end which limits the contact surface area. i think a more square end has better contact.
the impact driver keeps the bit seated to the bottom while the bolt is turned. it may also break the thread sealant loose.
i had an electric soldering iron ready to heat up the bolt in case it seemed like i was failing.
good luck
ba
I too have used an impact driver and allen key socket.
David C
2016 F3T
DIY Garage Door Opener & GPS Mount
Battery tender cable
Rear IPS Pack Rack
if you do end up trying to drill the head off be sure the other bolts break free FIRST. You should heat them up before trying. Good luck.
2015 RTS SE6 Special Series Red/Black w/Magnesium front fenders(bought in Nov. 2018 w/9,400 miles)
Dynojet Power Commander V, Power Commander POD-300 Display, PCV Map Switch, Pedal Commander (WOW)
Passenger Arm Rests, Windshield Air Wing
Baja Ron's Sway Bar & Spring Adjusters
Air Scoops, LaMonster's Hiway Pegs
Magnetic Mirror Mounts, Air Innovations Seat Cushion
Red Chrome pin striping on Black hood
Federal Formoza AZ01 front tires (they're GREAT)
Kumho Ecsta AST KU25 All-Season Tire - 225/50R15 91H
LED bars above radiator inlets
LED brake/running/turn signals on license plate frame
Tag-Along trailer
LED headlights LED fog lights (WOW)
2" x 2" Road Lights inside front fenders
7' x 10' Cargo trailer
Garmin 396 LM GPS
RLS Cat-delete resonator with China Akropovic muffler
New Banshee AGM
M3 TPMS on front tires
Remote Control for Heated Jacket and Heated Riding Pants
Analog Clock and Analog Volt Meter
Loose Nut Behind Handlebars
I don't know who I've thanked and who I haven't so let this substitute for individual "thank you"s.
I have one of those little torches on order. I'll pick it up Saturday along with a can of butane and I guess one of those impact hammer things. I might pick up another 7mm Allen bit if I can find one individually.
I have another unanswered question. If I remove all 4 of those damnable bolts, can I remove the handlebars? I was under the impression that the only bars that were simply unboltable were the F3s and 2020 RTs, not the 2010-2019 RTs.
You are correct only the F3 and 20 RT have regular, easily removable bars. It’s a big project on your RT. Good luck!
2017 F3T-SM6 Squared Away Mirror Wedgies & Alignment
2014 RTS-SM6 123,600 miles Sold 11/2017
2014 RTL-SE6 8,600 miles
2011 RTS-SM5 5,000 miles
2013 RTS-SM5 burned up with 13,200 miles in 13 weeks
2010 RTS-SM5 59,148 miles
2010 RT- 622
Thanks for the clarification/confirmation, SpyderAnn01. There were a few posts up there ^^^ that suggested removing the "good" bolts, drilling the head of the "bad" one and removing the bars. I just wanted to eliminate that line of thinking before I did something (else) dumb.
If it were me, and obviously I am not nearby to actually see how bad the fastener head has become, yes, heat can help.
But this can work also. Use coarse grit lapping compound into the hex opening. Not a lot, simply a thin film as needed applied with a Q Tip. Reinsert a good quality 7mm Allen socket, seat it fully with a couple light taps, then install the breaker bar, wiggle a couple times then reseat the Allen socket. Ideally the compound adds grip and tightens the fit allowing tne bolt to remove at this point.
I too have used an impact driver and allen key socket.
Me too! Me too! Seriously, it was the ONLY way I was able to get those bolts out. Bonus: You can really get all of your frustrations out by pounding the living c#$p out of it!
If you use a manual impact driver, remember you're pounding the top of the steering too!
I'll be interested to know whether you get anywhere with the heat because the bolt is stainless steel and it is a very poor heat conductor. The bolt head is hard fast against the metal of the bars and they are aluminium which is a very good heat conductor. I bet you heat the bars considerably more than the bolt thread.
PMK's grinding past idea is a good one.
Rule#2: Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level & then beat you with experience.
Rule#1: Refer to rule #2.