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  1. #1
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    Default Gearbox Position Sensor

    Greetings all,

    Will a bad gearbox position sensor cause a Spyder to run rough? I know mine needs to be replaced as the gear indicator constantly jumps around. But I have a lot of sputtering and sometimes a check engine light. I have even had the bike shut off mid-ride. I can replace the part myself, but before I do, are there any other areas I should look as well? Fuel delivery system maybe? The Spyder is a 2008 GS SM5. Thanks folks.

  2. #2
    Very Active Member Snowbelt Spyder's Avatar
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    Hey Jay. I just looked through all of your previous posts and I see that you've already replaced the vacuum lines and done the canisterectomy. So, I can delete that paragraph. However, I did notice that you mentioned a long time in storage a few years ago. So, maybe you just need to get aggressive with some fuel system / injector cleaner such as Seafoam or Techron. I'm also liking that Lucas Complete Fuel Treatment a lot. Also, do an inspection of the rubber boot that the throttle bodies mount in. Check that for cracks. Did you happen to replace the fuel filter and inspect your intake system?

    If you replace that gear box position sensor yourself, the manual calls for a reset procedure that will require BUDS. So, you could try just unplugging it and hitting the plug and harness connector with some contact cleaner first. However, some folks have replaced the sensor and had everything work fine without the BUDS reset. It's hit or miss perhaps. And anytime you get the check engine light, it will help you to troubleshoot if you pull up the codes while the light is on and the codes are active. I'd go over how to do that , but I don't have an 08 GS and I know I'd get it wrong. Someone else will be able to get you through that.

    I have no knowledge or memory of anyone having rough running or stalling issues which were solely caused by the gear box position sensor. I don't think it would cause that. I believe you probably have more that one issue going on. Do a forum or Google search on this forum. There's a ton of info on here regarding the V-Twin motor that will help you get up to speed. Plus, a repair manual on CD can be had - if you don't already have one - from a couple of vendors on eBay for 20 bucks. Good Luck.


    Doug

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  3. #3
    Very Active Member Freddy's Avatar
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    As Doug says, it's unlikely the 2 issues are related. See the thread below on how to retrieve fault codes. I'd be inclined to think that the rough running is caused by faulty spark plug leads, which was a common problem on the early trike especially. BahaRon has much better ones available. I have the same model trike as you. I had to replace the GBPS sensor years ago due to erratic operation, which is located behind the drive pulley. Inspect the splines of wear/damage. I had no issues needing BUDS after doing so. Retorque the pulley bolt to 110ftlb if splines are ok. There's some new type of lube to apply but I used Loctite 7471 Primer and 660 retaining compound about 8 years ago and it's still all good.

    Merry Christmas.



    https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/...code+retrieval
    Last edited by Freddy; 12-24-2019 at 10:00 PM. Reason: typos
    The best substitute for brains & knowledge is....................silence.

  4. #4
    Very Active Member BLUEKNIGHT911's Avatar
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    A friend had His GBPS re-placed …. didn't need anything done with BUDS ….. it ran fine …… Mike

  5. #5
    Very Active Member SNOOPY's Avatar
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    Having a similar issue on a ‘13, but engine runs fine, no stumbling.

    Trying to find the part or part name.

  6. #6
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    My 2008 GS SE5 had the GBPS go bad. It ran TERRIBLE for some reason. Not sure why. After I replaced it, it still ran awful and barely made it to the shop for the BUDS reset - bucked and snorted the 10 miles to get there. They charged me $40. Driving away from the dealer ran great, after a few stops & starts (key off/on) ran like a champ. I assume nanny adjusts something based on the feedback, can't say. My old one was busted and easy to see what piece of garbage it is! It is just a potentiometer inside a plastic case, no real bearings.

    One bit of advice - you have to pull the front pulley off to replace GBPS. I would strongly suggest you order a new front pulley & bolt - $130ish from cheapcycleparts.com. My pulley flew off into a field not long after doing all the work to replace the GBPS. I didn't pay attention to the brown dust on it - should be shiny black. The splines near the engine do go bad, and once they start it takes only about 100 miles or so (on my other 2008 GS!). That one "growled" when taking off or whenever the pulley under load accelerating. Pulley job on both GS's for me, save yourself a headache and replaced them IMHO!

    Also good to check rear pads & tire when you have it up

    Just my two cents!
    Steve

    P.S. item #22:

    https://www.cheapcycleparts.com/oemp...hifting-system

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snowbelt Spyder View Post
    Hey Jay. I just looked through all of your previous posts and I see that you've already replaced the vacuum lines and done the canisterectomy. So, I can delete that paragraph. However, I did notice that you mentioned a long time in storage a few years ago. So, maybe you just need to get aggressive with some fuel system / injector cleaner such as Seafoam or Techron. I'm also liking that Lucas Complete Fuel Treatment a lot. Also, do an inspection of the rubber boot that the throttle bodies mount in. Check that for cracks. Did you happen to replace the fuel filter and inspect your intake system?

    If you replace that gear box position sensor yourself, the manual calls for a reset procedure that will require BUDS. So, you could try just unplugging it and hitting the plug and harness connector with some contact cleaner first. However, some folks have replaced the sensor and had everything work fine without the BUDS reset. It's hit or miss perhaps. And anytime you get the check engine light, it will help you to troubleshoot if you pull up the codes while the light is on and the codes are active. I'd go over how to do that , but I don't have an 08 GS and I know I'd get it wrong. Someone else will be able to get you through that.

    I have no knowledge or memory of anyone having rough running or stalling issues which were solely caused by the gear box position sensor. I don't think it would cause that. I believe you probably have more that one issue going on. Do a forum or Google search on this forum. There's a ton of info on here regarding the V-Twin motor that will help you get up to speed. Plus, a repair manual on CD can be had - if you don't already have one - from a couple of vendors on eBay for 20 bucks. Good Luck.


    Thanks for the reply. Without being long-winded, I did everything you mentioned above. The bike was ridden all this summer with those symptoms showing up sporadically. After doing some Google searches, i think it may be the Mass Airflow Sensor or maybe cracked vacuum line connected to it. I am no mechanic, but I am going to give it a go and see what happens. I have pulled the codes and P0107 comes up. Manifold air pressure sensor voltage too low. Yes, no, maybe? Well before spring hits, i will be tearing it down to clean the air filter, check plugs and wires and an oil change. Because its an 08, the bike pretty much has to be striped down anyway. If you have any other suggestions, I am open to them. Thanks.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevencovert View Post
    My 2008 GS SE5 had the GBPS go bad. It ran TERRIBLE for some reason. Not sure why. After I replaced it, it still ran awful and barely made it to the shop for the BUDS reset - bucked and snorted the 10 miles to get there. They charged me $40. Driving away from the dealer ran great, after a few stops & starts (key off/on) ran like a champ. I assume nanny adjusts something based on the feedback, can't say. My old one was busted and easy to see what piece of garbage it is! It is just a potentiometer inside a plastic case, no real bearings.

    One bit of advice - you have to pull the front pulley off to replace GBPS. I would strongly suggest you order a new front pulley & bolt - $130ish from cheapcycleparts.com. My pulley flew off into a field not long after doing all the work to replace the GBPS. I didn't pay attention to the brown dust on it - should be shiny black. The splines near the engine do go bad, and once they start it takes only about 100 miles or so (on my other 2008 GS!). That one "growled" when taking off or whenever the pulley under load accelerating. Pulley job on both GS's for me, save yourself a headache and replaced them IMHO!

    Also good to check rear pads & tire when you have it up

    Just my two cents!
    Steve

    P.S. item #22:

    https://www.cheapcycleparts.com/oemp...hifting-system


    Its time for a belt change too so I will definitely check those splines. Thanks for the reply.

  9. #9
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    I've been without me GS Se5 for about 2 months now while the workshop searches for a fix, following the gear indicator working its way up and down from 5 to R on numerous occasions. When it hits R the engine starts cutting out but recovers when the indicator goes back into forward gears. All this goes on while the bike happily cruses at whatever speed in 5 without a quiver until R indicates again for a moment or two. Eventually, after a couple of R flicks, the engine cuts out all together.

    The Spyder workshop can't find a cause. They replaced the gear sensor which appeared to cure the problem for about 100km, and have ordered a replacement computer. Even if the new computer doesn't fix the cause I'll be happy to have it in my 10 year old Spyder.
    2020 F3 Ltd , Brake Pedel lowered. Liquid Titanium

  10. #10
    Very Active Member Freddy's Avatar
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    The Spyder workshop can't find a cause. They replaced the gear sensor which appeared to cure the problem for about 100km, and have ordered a replacement computer. Even if the new computer doesn't fix the cause I'll be happy to have it in my 10 year old Spyder.



    I had the very same issue on mine some years ago. Before the trikes got sold in Oz the dealer had to install a reversing light and 'black box' to the SE5 models to comply with Aus Design Rules. The SM5 had a simple micro switch added to the reverse lever on the side of the transmission. Some dealers installed the 'black box' upside down, allowing it to fill with water even tho they were located under the left side/rear panel. The black box and wiring was removed to returned it to stock form and solve/remove the problem. Obviously, there's no reference to this in the FSM (factory service manual) as it was locally designed, made and fitted. My trike is an SM5 but the dealer had installed the SE5 black box to it for some unknown reason - so they told me when I took it in for repair as it was still under warranty at the time. The black box takes the signal from the GBPS (gear box position sensor). My trike would go into limp mode when it showed R on the dash.

    Search is a nice function.

    http://www.spyderryders.net.au/forum...55.msg95#msg95

    http://www.ozspyderryders.com/index.....html#msg25445
    The best substitute for brains & knowledge is....................silence.

  11. #11
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    Jay,

    One more thing to look at. The '08's had an issue where noise got on the transmission control Unit (TCU) CanBus (the wires that the three computers use to talk to each other). BRP issued a grounding wire kit to ground the coil frame to the radiator, then to the big ground bolt above the TCU. If you pop off the left side cover to check oil, the coils are right there. Be sure there is a black wire bolted to the coils that goes off to the places mentioned. This noise would make the TCU stop working and the bike would get stuck in a gear and not shift at all and show an "E" for the gear on dash; or blinking transmission. You have to key off for 30 seconds to reset computers, then bike will shift back to 1st when started. If you have this wire present you might remove the bolts/nuts and wire brush the metal to clean the ground points. Then tighten up good and spray with WD40 or coat with grease to seal. Just another thought!

    Steve

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevencovert View Post
    Jay,

    One more thing to look at. The '08's had an issue where noise got on the transmission control Unit (TCU) CanBus (the wires that the three computers use to talk to each other). BRP issued a grounding wire kit to ground the coil frame to the radiator, then to the big ground bolt above the TCU. If you pop off the left side cover to check oil, the coils are right there. Be sure there is a black wire bolted to the coils that goes off to the places mentioned. This noise would make the TCU stop working and the bike would get stuck in a gear and not shift at all and show an "E" for the gear on dash; or blinking transmission. You have to key off for 30 seconds to reset computers, then bike will shift back to 1st when started. If you have this wire present you might remove the bolts/nuts and wire brush the metal to clean the ground points. Then tighten up good and spray with WD40 or coat with grease to seal. Just another thought!

    Steve
    Hi Steve and Happy New Year. I have an SM5 so I hope the above mentioned wont be an issue for me.

  13. #13
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    A note of encouragement about the GBPS switch : My recently acquired RS-S was jumping from gear to gear and displayed the dreaded "E" on the display. Of course, the first thing I did was to go to Spyderlovers.com to investigate possible causes and remedies. Everything pointed to replacing the Gear Box Position Sensor. But, one poster mentioned trying the spraying of the switch contacts before attacking the difficult task of removing the sprocket, belt and rear wheel in order to access the GBPS switch itself. Of course, I took the easiest path first and am glad I did. After removing the necessary "Tupperware", I pulled the plug and sprayed the contacts liberally with brake cleaner, reasoning that oil seepage might be the culprit. I replaced the plug, and BINGO !! It has shifted perfectly since ! I just thought that relating my experience might save other Spyder owners some unnecessary grief --- and ---- the expense of $150 [for a $10 switch] that the replacement path would require ! Thanks again to whomever it was for the advice ! [I just checked, and it was "Snowbelt Spyder".] Many thanks ! Cheers !! Bob
    Last edited by Terraplane8Bob; 10-12-2020 at 04:32 PM. Reason: new info

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