100kph slide, is nanna nuts or saviour ???

[askitee]

At 100kph, 2up, riding through corners & you upset the nanny, there is a lot going on. I may be wrong, but do we really know the 'TECH Nerds" covered all the parameters that a rider can throw at this bike & not confuse even momentarily something in the safety systems.
The indicators not cancellation properly is an indication of the steering not centered. BUDS will centre it...treva

Thats my question. Nanny has decided to straighten the handlebars and spear us (Wife an I) into the oncoming traffic a few times now to the point that it is the single biggest fear I have riding the thing. 1st one was at 100-110 km / hr into an unsignposted corner in a line of Spyders, the RTL in front went thru ok, mine decided to lock the back wheel and straighten the handlebars. We came to rest on the "outer edge line" on the oncoming lane. During it I was wondering how I was going to avoid two huge gum trees in my path.

The 2nd happened in poor conditions, 2 up slowed for a corner and two two wheelers in front cornered ok, where mine Nanny decided "lets go have a look over here" Luckily the driver of the Toyota Landcruiser coming towards us had a great reactions time.

[Snowbelt Spyder]

With all of these issues in Australia, I wonder if the Nanny thinks that the Spyder is upside down.

Kidding.

On a more serious note, askitee, the VSS system in no way, shape, or form, can take control of the steering. It did not straighten the handlebars. If you are convinced that the Spyder's handlebars produced a steering input that was un-commanded by you, better have that thing looked at ASAP. Steering Angle Sensor and DPS Torque Sensor to start. More than likely, however, your muscle memory responded to try to correct the skid without you thinking about it. Proper rider / steering technique in corners, at high speed, is also essential.

[PinkRosePetal]

On a more serious note, askitee, the VSS system in no way, shape, or form, can take control of the steering.

But it might stamp a brake on on one wheel where you might not be able to prevent the bars turning.

[Cobwebs]

With all of these issues in Australia, I wonder if the Nanny thinks that the Spyder is upside down.

Kidding.

On a more serious note, askitee, the VSS system in no way, shape, or form, can take control of the steering. It did not straighten the handlebars. If you are convinced that the Spyder's handlebars produced a steering input that was un-commanded by you, better have that thing looked at ASAP. Steering Angle Sensor and DPS Torque Sensor. More than likely, however, your muscle memory responded to try to correct the skid without you thinking about it. Proper rider / steering technique in corners, at high speed, is also essential.

When nanna gatecrashes the party would the abs function tend to pull the steering one way or another giving the impression she has grabbed the bars? I know in a straight line panick stop mine has an initial pull to one side or another as it computes the wheel causing the trouble.Could be we have a safety system that meets regulations but not every scenario quickly enough.

[Snowbelt Spyder]

Yeah, I was just going to do an edit to clarify that. But, the rider still maintains control at all times and can continue steering, which you want to do. ABS is not intended to stop you in a straight line. I guess it depends on what he meant by that or thought was the cause. in his case for example, if the Stability Control System activated in order to prevent lifting a front wheel, it could apply the brake on the opposite front wheel. That could cause a perceived steering change. But remember that the intention of the SCS system is to prevent the machine from tipping over - which it seems to do very well. Where you end up in the road may not be ideal - and it cannot control that - but at least you're still on three wheels. However, and it goes back to my earlier post, some of those VSS sensors have reset functions in BUDS in order to ensure they are calibrated and operate as designed. If there are questions, have them checked out.

[h0gr1der]

So reading back through the wheel lock up threads, with the exception of one (Batmobil-F3) I think the common denominator is a second person on board. I did read that when the pillion switch is activated, the VSS uses more conservative parameters. Maybe something to look at?

[treva]

Were you heading up the hill or down? If down, & those marbles [ well chosen word ChicagoSpyder ] were there when you rode through, they would be right on line. It's hard to remember every little detail when you've been "close to the edge...treva

[Cobwebs]

Were you heading up the hill or down? If down, & those marbles [ well chosen word ChicagoSpyder ] were there when you rode through, they would be right on line. It's hard to remember every little detail when you've been "close to the edge...treva

Heading up the hill treva.
Just as an explanation those marbles are there because to run over them if coming down the hill you would have to be flirting with the gravel edge anyway which no one does unless forced over by a bad driver coming up of course.It's a reasonably quiet country road with good through the corner vision hence no one runs over them much to clear them.I'm can't give a 100% there were none on the road when I passed same as a blob of grease which would disperse pretty quickly if I've spread it like butter across the road.It was a beautiful crisp clear winters day and I was on song and at one with Spyder after 100kls of high concentration corner carving preceding the holy crap moment.This was a nothing corner challenge wise with no sign of marbles, oil sheen, foreign blobs,animal carcases,I heard no rattling of stones off the tyres or any warning at all just the abs going nuts which i initially thought was the back wheel disintegrating it was that severe and wondered why i wasn't seeing shrapnel in my peripheral vision in the mirrors followed by the tyre howl as we got tossed sideways.

[treva]

Heading up the hill treva.
Just as an explanation those marbles are there because to run over them if coming down the hill you would have to be flirting with the gravel edge anyway which no one does unless forced over by a bad driver coming up of course.It's a reasonably quiet country road with good through the corner vision hence no one runs over them much to clear them.I'm can't give a 100% there were none on the road when I passed same as a blob of grease which would disperse pretty quickly if I've spread it like butter across the road.It was a beautiful crisp clear winters day and I was on song and at one with Spyder after 100kls of high concentration corner carving preceding the holy crap moment.This was a nothing corner challenge wise with no sign of marbles, oil sheen, foreign blobs,animal carcases,I heard no rattling of stones off the tyres or any warning at all just the abs going nuts which i initially thought was the back wheel disintegrating it was that severe and wondered why i wasn't seeing shrapnel in my peripheral vision in the mirrors followed by the tyre howl as we got tossed sideways.

It sounds like you have all bases covered. As h0gr1der mentioned, most incidents have been 2up, which leads me to believe that when the nanny has been triggered, maybe more so if triggered a few times on the same ride, & the circumstances all line up, causes an anomaly some where in the safety systems...treva

[Batmobil-F3]

The problem is not that the VSS intervenes, but how it intervenes. If it locked up a wheel (despite ABS), then dangerous situation arises and one loses confidence in the VSS.
I've ridden 7,000 miles now and I never had any problems with the VSS until the incident. In about 70% of the curves, the VSS intervenes, because I drive very sporty. I do not notice the interventions, only the VSS LED shows them to me.

[h0gr1der]

https://money.usnews.com/investing/n...tended-braking

Read this and thought of this thread. What's your take?

[Spyderlass]

If nothing else, it shows the importance of reporting an issue to the dealer and insisting that BRP is made aware of it.

[Cobwebs]

I can't throw any more light on my skirmish.No codes shown and hasn't done it again since so at this stage I think nanna is possibly slightly wacky but she won't let you down completely.As Spyderlass says at least they know about it one way or the other.

[treva]

I can't throw any more light on my skirmish.No codes shown and hasn't done it again since so at this stage I think nanna is possibly slightly wacky but she won't let you down completely.As Spyderlass says at least they know about it one way or the other.

Yes they know about it, but are they doing anything about it?

[Freddy]

At best, the complaint has been forwarded to 'head office.' If you have a safety complaint there is only one way to deal with it that gives feedback and that's thru:

https://www.infrastructure.gov.au/ve...ing/index.aspx

At least you get a reply eventually to advise what the manufacturer is doing about it, if anything.

[Revalden]

We've had a few close calls doing twisties too fast but haven't had the nanny kick in. If something happened like you're describing here ,my wife would be on her phone getting it sold before we even got home.

[h0gr1der]

I'm just raising awareness with this as there have been a small number of incidents that are unexplained. Just keep your eyes and ears peeled for similar cases, I have read of 4 so far. Most people involved with these kind of cases think thy're all alone and it doesn't get widely discussed. See how long it took Toyota to go from a few reported cases to a recall. My Spyder, despite all the fiddling I've had to do on it, hgas what I believe is one of the better Nannies. I had to lift a front wheel before it even pulled the throttle back (a smidgen).

[vondalyn]

This sounds very much like an incident that I experienced in 2017. Going through a right-hand sweeper at 60+mph and had the nanny suddenly brake on me sending me into the oncoming lane of traffic -- luckily no cars coming towards me at that moment. I had wheel balancers on my F3. I removed them as soon as I got home and have never reinstalled them. I took it to the dealership and there were no codes. I still ride that canyon all the time, but not as aggressively as that trip. Since removing the wheel balancers, I've never had any more issues (over 50,000 miles on it now), but this (and similar threads) make me wonder. My original thread was this one: https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/...29#post1256829.

[h0gr1der]

This sounds very much like an incident that I experienced in 2017. Going through a right-hand sweeper at 60+mph and had the nanny suddenly brake on me sending me into the oncoming lane of traffic -- luckily no cars coming towards me at that moment. I had wheel balancers on my F3. I removed them as soon as I got home and have never reinstalled them. I took it to the dealership and there were no codes. I still ride that canyon all the time, but not as aggressively as that trip. Since removing the wheel balancers, I've never had any more issues (over 50,000 miles on it now), but this (and similar threads) make me wonder. My original thread was this one: https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/...29#post1256829.

Mr Vondalyn,
Was your incident referenced in post #12 of this thread? If not, that makes 5 total reported incidents with unintended braking.

Edit- Make that 6, the last one on the list had 2 separate incidents.

[Sputter]

I am wondering if there was some fuel on the road? I have seen truck drivers leave fuel caps off many times and drop fuel in the corners. Very difficult to see and as slippery as ice. It only takes a little to induce a slide in a corner!

[vondalyn]

Mr Vondalyn,
Was your incident referenced in post #12 of this thread? If not, that makes 5 total reported incidents with unintended braking.

Edit- Make that 6, the last one on the list had 2 separate incidents.

My incident was not referenced in any of the previous threads. For my situation, there was no oil on the road, though in our canyons it's always possible that there's loose gravel. There was a motorcycle behind me and he didn't have any issues other than probably wondering what the heck I was doing. I was shaken up enough to wave him around me.

[h0gr1der]

My incident was not referenced in any of the previous threads. For my situation, there was no oil on the road, though in our canyons it's always possible that there's loose gravel. There was a motorcycle behind me and he didn't have any issues other than probably wondering what the heck I was doing. I was shaken up enough to wave him around me.

This is how a recall progresses. Almost everyone will try to explain away the problem, often forgetting it happened. Nobody thinks to report the aberrant behavior to the NTSB for tracking, so it goes unnoticed and flying below the radar until someone dies. Just like the GM recall, anytime you have a huge amount of code there is inevitably some glitches that only manifest in very specific instances, so they may go unnoticed for years. My question is, if one of the wheel sensors fails, is the software program robust enough to recognize a failure from an actual even and take an appropriate action. Apparently GM, with all it's money and R&D departments didn't have the appropriate program in the recalled vehicles.

I will reiterate, my 2018 RTL has impeccable road manners, the nanny acting very appropriately and reducing the throttle when I lifted a front wheel, but I read all manner of stories of different behaviors for similar models. Wonder what causes this?