Had laser alignment done--- doesn’t feel right.

[always young]

I had a laser alignment done on my 2016 F3 Ltd at Route 1 motorsports in Palm Bay a month ago (7230 miles) and things haven’t felt right since then (500 miles later). It initially had a slight drift to the right which was the reason for the alignment check. I finally remembered to take a serious look at things after the last ride this weekend and I found that both front wheels have severe wear on the outsides of the tires along with scallop ridges facing to the center. I consistently run 18 PSI and prior to the alignment they were wearing evenly, also, I’ve never hit anything which would have knocked the alignment off. Here are some other things that I’ve noticed. Steering is very light, and I feel every ripple and bump which yanks the bars. The bike tends to jog side to side over small ripples and bumps. Steering is light when going around corners and it reacts very quickly then suddenly increases the turn action as if you applied more steering. At first, I thought the steering sensitivity had been adjusted causing the lighter steering. Can it even be adjusted? Also, can anyone give me the numbers that the wheels should be adjusted to (toe-in, camber etc)? I’m making an appointment to take it back in and have them re-do it and would like to know the numbers beforehand to compare them to what it’s currently set at. I’m suspecting that they’ll want to charge me again for it which I’ll ague against. They should warranty their work. I appreciate any input on this. Thanks.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

I had a laser alignment done on my 2016 F3 Ltd at Route 1 motorsports in Palm Bay a month ago (7230 miles) and things haven’t felt right since then (500 miles later). It initially had a slight drift to the right which was the reason for the alignment check. I finally remembered to take a serious look at things after the last ride this weekend and I found that both front wheels have severe wear on the outsides of the tires along with scallop ridges facing to the center. I consistently run 18 PSI and prior to the alignment they were wearing evenly, also, I’ve never hit anything which would have knocked the alignment off. Here are some other things that I’ve noticed. Steering is very light, and I feel every ripple and bump which yanks the bars. The bike tends to jog side to side over small ripples and bumps. Steering is light when going around corners and it reacts very quickly then suddenly increases the turn action as if you applied more steering. At first, I thought the steering sensitivity had been adjusted causing the lighter steering. Can it even be adjusted? Also, can anyone give me the numbers that the wheels should be adjusted to (toe-in, camber etc)? I’m making an appointment to take it back in and have them re-do it and would like to know the numbers beforehand to compare them to what it’s currently set at. I’m suspecting that they’ll want to charge me again for it which I’ll ague against. They should warranty their work. I appreciate any input on this. Thanks.

I have BAD news for you - that DEALER ( Tech ) screwed up what you had because they either don't have a Lazer alignment device or just doesn't know how to use it …….. in either case it would be a miracle if they got it right now..... I would demand the money back ( plus damages to your tires ), then check the list of independent Lazer Aligners near you. Also post it here that you want info on whoever you find, maybe another member has used them and got better results …… Mike

[JayBros]

Camber is not adjustable on Spyders; it is built into the machine. I assume from your post the tires were not worn & scalloped before the alignment, correct? If they were, the dealership should have recommended rotating which, with directional tires means remounting on opposite rims, before doing the alignment. The steering angle sensor must be reset With B.U.D.S. after the alignment. I don't know if the sensitivity of the steering can be adjusted; have never heard any discussion that would lead me to believe it can be adjusted. Sorry, don't know the toe-in spec for your model. In general, to me it smells like a poorly done job the dealership should redo on their nickel to your satisfaction.

[Jarred]

That’s very odd. That dealer is listed on the main website (Spyder Comfort) so they should know what they’re doing. I hope that dealer stands by their service and does a new alignment for you, free of charge. If not, maybe contact Spyder Comfort. Please let us know what the outcome is. Best of luck.
http://www.spydercomfort.com/dealersfl.htm

[PMK]

As mentioned, camber is not adjustable. Caster is not adjustable either. The only adjustment is toe in and on some setups ride height, which indirectly changes toe in.

Sounds as if they have set the toe with too much toe out. Base this on how you described the light feel and quickness in reacting.

Obviously you can see if they will redo it. I do not use a laser setup but have aligned Spyders. If you care to ride south we can check it and adjust if needed.

[Easy Rider]

I consistently run 18 PSI and prior to the alignment they were wearing evenly,

Low air pressure is a common cause of scalloping.
Are these stock tires ?

[Chupaca]

If it doesn't feel right and the wear on the tires is showing it was not done right and you need to go back and have them deal with it... Hard to say not knowing the equipment, tech or dealer....

[always young]

Thanks everyone for your comments and insight. I called them and made an appointment for Dec 1st to have them do it again. This time I'm going to stand by and watch what they do. I'll do some research before hand to find out what they should be setting it at and ask for a print out of their settings. When I saw what had happened to the tires I was really pissed. With the Thanksgiving weekend coming up, next week is the earliest that I could get it in. I'll post my outcome when I get it done.

[PMK]

Thanks everyone for your comments and insight. I called them and made an appointment for Dec 1st to have them do it again. This time I'm going to stand by and watch what they do. I'll do some research before hand to find out what they should be setting it at and ask for a print out of their settings. When I saw what had happened to the tires I was really pissed. With the Thanksgiving weekend coming up, next week is the earliest that I could get it in. I'll post my outcome when I get it done.

Best to go to the ROLO sight and even Lamonster posted long ago about it. There is no print out like on cars. There is no computer telling them how to make adjustments. Pretty basic method of using a huge ruler basically, set a determined distance in front of the Spyder, and similar to the rear.

In my experience aligning vehicles, they do not alugn to thrust angle, but the guys doing say they do. After they set the toe dimensions, the only computer hookup will be to reset the steering angle sensor.

[PMK]

I hope Route 1 offered to take you right away for the redo on the alignment and you had to turn them down. Not good when the dealer is scheduling warranty appointments.

Warranty issues should be handled immediately at the customers first available convienience.

[JayBros]

You might consider calling Joe Meyer who could perhaps give you the list and sequence of exact steps the tech must follow to do a correct alignment so you can veryfy when watching.

[Highwayman2013]

If you aren't sure of the dealers work the inventor of the system is about 73 miles up the coast from you.

http://www.spydercomfort.com/

[jcthorne]

Not entirely true.

We use an excel worksheet with the calculations embedded. Measurements are taken and calculated in fractional inches as read so no conversions required. The worksheet is step by step the measurements, the adjustments and then the cross check. Initial measurements and final adjusted setpoints as well as technician notes so I can remember what I did if I need to see this bike again. We furnish a printed copy of the worksheet to each alignment customer. I gave the spreadsheet to Rolo years ago and even went back and built a new one for Slingshots ( they have camber to calculate in). I know they have given the sheet file to other shops as I have seen it in use so we are not the only shop that does this.

If any Rolo shop wants a copy of the excel worksheets, pm me and I'd be happy to share.

[PMK]

Very cool that you are doing this.

For clarity though, it is a manually entered set of numbers, not the settings obtained directly from the alignment equipment as is done with cars.

[always young]

Thanks again for the inputs. I re-scheduled my appointment for the Saturday after Thanksgiving, 24th. I'll review the references mentioned before then and see how it compares with what they do. I'll post afterwards with the outcome. Everyone have a safe and bountiful Thanksgiving with friends and family.

[deer30084]

I never saw the need to rebuild my Spyder with an aftermarket swaybar nor have it laser aligned just as I never saw the need to rebuild the front end of my Chevy truck. I'm sorry guys, but that's the truth.

[Easy Rider]

I never saw the need to rebuild my Spyder with an aftermarket swaybar nor have it laser aligned just as I never saw the need to rebuild the front end of my Chevy truck. I'm sorry guys, but that's the truth.

Of course it is.
Not everybody is identical.
Some are more sensitive to things than others.
Some ride on better roads than others.
It is great that YOU have not had a problem.
But that has NO bearing on the vast number of people who DO have a problem.

Now.....whether or not modifying things on the machine will really fix those problems or not is a different discussion.

I see that you DID think you needed a different rear shock.
And you didn't base your decision on the fact that millions of other riders didn't find that necessary.

[PMK]

I never saw the need to rebuild my Spyder with an aftermarket swaybar nor have it laser aligned just as I never saw the need to rebuild the front end of my Chevy truck. I'm sorry guys, but that's the truth.

Lightweight riders are less likely to induce toe out and handling drawbacks from a poor alignment compared to a moderate or heavy rider. That is simply the design of the Spyder basic steering geometry design.

As for swaybars, again, lightweights are less likely to see an i provement those that are heavier or ride two up experience. Again, merely basic suspension design and tuning.

Comparing your Spyder to a truck, I like that. Seriously, the truck is probably 4000 pounds without a load in it. Based on your photo, you appear a petite 125 pounds. That truck does not even notice you in it. Your Spyder at around 1000 pounds, you as the rider are 12.5 % of the vehicles empty weight. Big difference. In the truck you are 3%.

[jcthorne]

I never saw the need to rebuild my Spyder with an aftermarket swaybar nor have it laser aligned just as I never saw the need to rebuild the front end of my Chevy truck. I'm sorry guys, but that's the truth.

Chevy gave your truck a very precise alignment when it was near the end of the production line. CanAm does NOT.
Your Chevy dealer has a very precise Hunter (or equivelent) computerized 4 wheel alignment rack to handle issues which got by the assembly line or to correct issues that happen after the truck was built. Your CanAm dealer does NOT.

There are ample aftermarket suspension accessories for your chevy truck on the market. FAR more of them are sold than for Spyder.

Perhaps CanAm should do a proper alignment of the bike when its built, we can argue that one all day but the FACT is they do not. The aftermarket has developed a great solution to the OEM shortcomings. BRP has even acknowledged it and accepted its use. Better than 90% of all Spyders benefit from having a Rolo Laser Alignment done. The very few that do not need it are generally not charged for the checking. The idea that you do not THINK your bike needs an alignment without having had it measured is just an opinion not based on fact. Statistical data says you are very likely wrong and even if correct, its bad advise for the vast majority of owners.

[Easy Rider]

Back off, ER. Your sarcastic posts are not at all helpful.

And your opinion counts exactly the same as mine does.
You need to fix your "sarcasm detector".

[ARtraveler]

Two people, differing opinions, just keep it from being nasty with each other.

[SpyderAnn01]

That’s very odd. That dealer is listed on the main website (Spyder Comfort) so they should know what they’re doing. I hope that dealer stands by their service and does a new alignment for you, free of charge. If not, maybe contact Spyder Comfort. Please let us know what the outcome is. Best of luck.
http://www.spydercomfort.com/dealersfl.htm

Unfortunately just because they have the equipment doesn’t mean they know how to use it. Dealers sometimes buy the equipment you then rarely, if ever use it. It takes practice to use it and this dealer obviously hasn’t done any.

[SpyderAnn01]

Back off, ER. Your sarcastic posts are not at all helpful.

I saw nothing sarcastic at all in his post. Maybe you should back off.

[deer30084]

When I first bought my F3 and joined this site, I saw an aftermarket swaybar was available. I thought a swaybar was a good idea, then I found that Can Am already put a swaybar on it. I am not convinced, nor will I blindly replace the swaybar that's on the bike with the hopes that it will improve the ride "before I even leave the driveway" as one poster put it. It seems whenever a product is offered, entrepreneurs come out with aftermarket products. Some improve the original product and some don't. It's the capitalist way to make money and that's a good thing. So far, I have not been suckered (yes, I said that) into the new swaybar fad. Nor have I been convinced I need a laser alignment. If YOU want to spend money on those things, by all means, do so. I read on here someone's comment that the laser alignment was money best spent. I bet his mechanic said the same thing. Yes, I put a different rear shock on it. When we ride 2 up, it would bottom out. It doesn't now.

[UtahPete]

I am not convinced, nor will I blindly replace the swaybar that's on the bike with the hopes that it will improve the ride "before I even leave the driveway" as one poster put it. It seems whenever a product is offered, entrepreneurs come out with aftermarket products. Some improve the original product and some don't. It's the capitalist way to make money and that's a good thing.

So far, I have not been suckered (yes, I said that) into the new swaybar fad. Nor have I been convinced I need a laser alignment. If YOU want to spend money on those things, by all means, do so. I read on here someone's comment that the laser alignment was money best spent. I bet his mechanic said the same thing. Yes, I put a different rear shock on it. When we ride 2 up, it would bottom out. It doesn't now.

Well said. I have one bone stock 2014 RTL that I purchased new and now has 18k miles. I've never had it aligned or upgraded the sway bar. I occasionally drive it pretty aggressively in the twisties and haven't felt the need to improve over the OEM setup (original Kendas on front).

The other 2014 RTL we bought used with 9k miles on it. The previous owner had the upgraded sway bar mounted already, and had the laser alignment done at some shop in the midwest. Have the receipts to prove it. I didn't notice any difference in the way that bike handles in the corners compared to the other stock bike. However, the front tires weren't wearing evenly and it seemed a little more twitchy on the freeway, so I had Joe Meyer check it out last Spring. The alignment was WAY off; either the previous alignment was not done properly or something had happened to the bike between alignments to throw it out of alignment.

Sometimes a new or used bike needs an alignment and sometimes it doesn't. It's a good idea to have it checked out by a reputable company if you have any suspicions or concerns about an alignment-related issue.