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Thread: Whats wrong?

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    Lightbulb Whats wrong?

    I have a 2013RT with 7000 miles.. Took it out after winter break ran great. Filled up will premium gas. Next ride out it could not get out of its own way until it warmed up, then ran fine. Thought I got some bad gas. Filled the tank again at a different station. Rode home fine. Next time out it sound like a machine gun coming from the engine and the bike barely moved when turning the throttle. Then it would take off like a turbo charger had kick in for a second then bog down again.
    Kept repeating this action while riding. Ran smooth for some time. Then when I had to stop for a light and every time after stopping, it happened again. Sputtering some back firing, no pickup. Then take off, then bog down? Maybe a clogged fuel filter? Not sure.
    Has anyone else experienced this problem? Any ideas as to what could be causing this problem?

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    Very Active Member SPYD3R's Avatar
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    Default FILTER

    i'm thinking you answered your own question....
    sounds to my like a clogged fuel filter....
    hope you solve this issue since it's ride time in the northeast....
    Dan P
    SPYD3R

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    Ozzie Ozzie Ozzie Peter Aawen's Avatar
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    Sounds very much like you got some contaminants in the fuel, either while it was in storage or in that first tankfull!! A new fuel filter should be revealing, and does it really hurt if you didn't really need that??

    Another possibility is deteriorated vacuum lines - even if they 'look OK' to the naked eye, bend them double to see if there are tiny cracks in them that will only let air in when the hoses are vibrating.... new silicone hoses are another thing that certainly won't hurt, but may well solve your running problems!

    Good Luck!
    2013 RT Ltd

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    Default Vacuum Lines

    As Peter stated replace the 2 rubber vacuum tubing that runs from the MAP sensor to each throttle body. My 2012 RTS ran bad and the two new vacuum tubes fixed the problem

    Jim
    Last edited by Peter Aawen; 05-10-2019 at 01:35 AM. Reason: Fixed quote display

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    Very Active Member Chupaca's Avatar
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    Default Agreed....

    20150726_160909.jpg looks good at first glance...20150726_160929.jpg but....and they tend to seal up some when engine warms up..
    Gene and Ilana De Laney
    Mt. Helix, California

    ​2012 RS sm5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Aawen View Post
    Sounds very much like you got some contaminants in the fuel, either while it was in storage or in that first tankfull!! A new fuel filter should be revealing, and does it really hurt if you didn't really need that??

    Another possibility is deteriorated vacuum lines - even if they 'look OK' to the naked eye, bend them double to see if there are tiny cracks in them that will only let air in when the hoses are vibrating.... new silicone hoses are another thing that certainly won't hurt, but may well solve your running problems!

    Good Luck!

    Thanks. i will change out the fuel filter and check the vacuum lines as suggested.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chupaca View Post
    20150726_160909.jpg looks good at first glance...20150726_160929.jpg but....and they tend to seal up some when engine warms up..
    Thanks for the pics. Very helpful.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JimboRTS View Post
    As Peter stated replace the 2 rubber vacuum tubing that runs from the MAP sensor to each throttle body. My 2012 RTS ran bad and the two new vacuum tubes fixed the problem

    Jim
    Thanks will take a look at those.
    Last edited by Peter Aawen; 05-10-2019 at 01:34 AM. Reason: Fixed quote display

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    Quote Originally Posted by SPYD3R View Post
    i'm thinking you answered your own question....
    sounds to my like a clogged fuel filter....
    hope you solve this issue since it's ride time in the northeast....
    Dan P
    SPYD3R
    Thank you. Conformation is a good thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rawspyder View Post
    Thanks. i will change out the fuel filter and check the vacuum lines as suggested.
    And.....add some multi-purpose fuel system cleaner to the gas just for good measure.
    Best to do that before changing the filter but either way is OK.

    It makes me a bit nervous putting in "premium" fuel every time I do it .......because the turn over in that tank at the station has to be a lot less.
    Going to a high volume station where "sports cars" are in evidence should reduce the chance of getting "bad gas".

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    Ozzie Ozzie Ozzie Peter Aawen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Easy Rider View Post
    .......

    It makes me a bit nervous putting in "premium" fuel every time I do it .......because the turn over in that tank at the station has to be a lot less.
    Going to a high volume station where "sports cars" are in evidence should reduce the chance of getting "bad gas".
    Actually, (at least in this country, & I reeaallly can't see yours being that much different! We tend to share many of the same or similar practices in things like this...) apart from the 'less used' bulk tank having the possibility of delivering a little slightly older fuel (but usually not anywhere near 'old enough' to have degraded any or be 'stale', because that takes months or more to occur, & gas stations selling that small a quantity of gas are generally required to take other steps to turn over their inventory) the fuel from a less used tank is likely to be LESS contaminated than that from a frequently topped up & continually disturbed tank, except in the rare instance that you might get the very dregs from the lowest levels of fuel remaining in the bottom of a nearly empty tank!! But then, that is another thing more likely to happen far more often in at a high turnover gas station rather than a low turnover station, where they tend to be very aware of how much (or little) premium gas they've sold!!

    The less used tank has little movement to continually stir & lift/mix in all of the contaminants that end up settling into the bottom of bulk gas tanks, while the frequently used tank, which has its pick-up pipe inlet down fairly low in the bottom third of the tank anyway, is going to be ALWAYS getting its contents stirred & mixed up - cos every time ANY gas gets pumped out of that tank, it creates eddies & currents in the contents & thereby mixes into the good stuff some of the contaminants that invariably end up trying to settle into the depths of those bulk tanks, so that the buyer ends up with a somewhat greater chance of getting crap fuel pumped into their vehicle from the MORE FREQUENTLY USED tank than they do from the bulk tank that only gets a small amount pumped out every now & then!! The gas in the less used tank settles all the crappy stuff down into the very bottom of the tank, where there is a 'depression' or deeper curve carefully designed into the shape of the tank base especially to collect & contain all that crappy stuff, & when someone does buy gas from that tank the pick up lifts that gas from above that contamination level; ie from the well stettled, even temperature of the low/mid level depths (but well clear of the crappy fuel collection level) without any of the regular eddies & currents always mixing in the rubbish stuff like they do in the often used tank!

    You want to see this for yourself?? Well you can see this happen for yourself fairly easily, just get a largish glass jar (1 litre or so capacity should work) with a tight fitting & sealing lid, then fill it almost full of gas (or better yet, use diesel - it's easier to see the distinct layers as things settle) & add saaay, a half a cup full of water with some light dirt or mud or something similar mixed into it, then put the lid on the jar tight & shake it reasonably vigourously, which is pretty much what happens when a nearly empty bulk gas tank gets filled - everything gets dumped in & mixed up fairly vigourously. Then set that jar carefully on its side on the table so that it cant roll or move any & leave it there to settle for a while, noting that it might take 6 or more hours for the mixed in contaminants to settle out fully. But eventually, you'll see the contaminants settle into the bottom arc of the jar, much like the fuel in the less often used bulk tank will - aren't you glad you didn't fill your Spyders tank from THAT bulk tank until all the fuel had settled?!? Or did you?? How often does that high usage gas station get premium gas bulk deliveries?? Once a day, or once a week?? When was it last done??

    Anyhow, once it's all settled & you can see the layer of dirty water/contaminants settled in the bottom of the tank, now imagine your fuel being sucked out from about 1/3rd the way up from the bottom/side of the jar resting on the table - well clear of the contaminants settled down low in the less used tank; that's gotta be pretty good fuel, doesn't it?? And if it's less than about 6 months old, it's going to be perfectly fine, cos it's kept at a relatively stable temp & largely blocked away from moving air (altho it is vented thru a snazy vent system that limits moving air & therefore loss of all the important aromatics & esters & other stuff etc that make it stay 'fresh'! But in the case of the regularly used bulk tank, the one refilled at least weekly if not more often, to replicate THAT, you'd need to pick up the jar & gently shake it once or twice every few minutes or hours, maybe even use a straw to suck out a few mls of gas from the 1 litre jar every couple of minutes or so, remembering to suck it out from about 1/3rd deep down in the tank, but not from the dodgy stuff right in the bottom!! It doesn't need much removed or much of a shake to replicate regular usage, but if it happens just often enough to make the 'settled out contaminants' move a little & mix in with the clean fuel due to the eddies & currents that DO get created EVERY SINGLE TIME some gas is pumped out into a vehicle!! Check out how the contaminants mix into the good stuff - it doesn't take much gas going or it happening too often, but the more often the jar (or the tank) is agitated (or has some gas sucked out) the more active those eddies & currents will be & the more mixed in the crap that should settle out in the bottom of the less used jar (or tank) becomes in the frequently used tank! And then in addition to that, the tanks contents get REALLY mixed up every time it gets down to about half empty, bringing in more fuel to top it up and aggressively stir everything up & mix in all the crap that should've been in the bottom that might've just started to settle out!!

    Now tell me again WHICH bulk gas tank you want the fuel going into YOUR Spyder to be pumped from??
    2013 RT Ltd

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rawspyder View Post
    Thanks. i will change out the fuel filter and check the vacuum lines as suggested.
    .....and if this doesn't fix it .....I think the spark plug wires might be bad now ....if they are the OEM ones .....get some from BAJARON ..............jmho .... Mike

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Aawen View Post
    Now tell me again WHICH bulk gas tank you want the fuel going into YOUR Spyder to be pumped from??
    Do you feel better now, after imparting that bit of wisdom upon all the rest of us ??

    In the US, filters are required in the delivery hoses to trap solid contaminants. I sometimes wonder if they are really in place though.

    And in many/most places here now, the price of "premium" is 15 to 20 cents a gallon more and I think that is a good mechanism to suppress some of the "optional" use. So I believe that with smaller stations in non-urban areas, the premium tank could indeed have a majority of it's contents that is a month old or more; maybe WAY more.

    So.......I basically dismiss most of your theory as pure unsupported speculation and would indeed rather use the fuel that "everybody" else is using.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BLUEKNIGHT911 View Post
    .....and if this doesn't fix it .....I think the spark plug wires might be bad now ....if they are the OEM ones .....get some from BAJARON ..............jmho .... Mike
    Spark plug wires might be the source of the problem...


    ...But I kind of doubt it. When they start to fail: you usually notice it when the bike is under a pretty decent load. (Like climbing a steep Hill, or trying to accelerate quickly.)
    Mike is definitely right about getting plug wires from Baja Ron!

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    Although it doesn't sound like this is your problem totally, be aware that the clutch plates of the 2013 are prone to chattering on cold slow startup. BRP's recommendation is to let the bike warm up a fair bit, or put in gear and hit throttle firmly. No pussy footing on the takeoff until the engine is warmed up.

    2014 Copper RTS

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    Quote Originally Posted by JimboRTS View Post
    As Peter stated replace the 2 rubber vacuum tubing that runs from the MAP sensor to each throttle body. My 2012 RTS ran bad and the two new vacuum tubes fixed the pronlem

    Jim
    Would you happen to have any pics of the vacuum lines on the bike? Also recommend a brand of hose and where to buy them. Thanks
    Last edited by Peter Aawen; 05-10-2019 at 01:36 AM. Reason: Fixed quote display

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    So did you get to the bottom of this problem? Was it the vacuum hoses, fuel filter or even the plug high tension wires?
    Last edited by Peter Aawen; 05-10-2019 at 01:27 AM. Reason: Fixed quote display

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    Quote Originally Posted by BLUEKNIGHT911 View Post
    .....and if this doesn't fix it .....I think the spark plug wires might be bad now ....if they are the OEM ones .....get some from BAJARON ..............jmho .... Mike

    I agree, had the same symptons on my 2011 RT, replaced plugs and plug wires and fixed the problem. These things produce so much heat under all the tupperware that causes all rubber products to dererioate faster than on a convential bike.
    Last edited by Peter Aawen; 05-10-2019 at 01:30 AM. Reason: Fixed quote display

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    What was the issue mines doing exactly this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by utahspyder View Post
    What was the issue mines doing exactly this.
    As pretty much covered in this thread. There are a number of things which can create these symptoms. I always like to start out with a good dose of Sea Foam fuel treatment. Can't hurt and may solve the problem. You can start throwing parts at the problem like fuel filter and ignition wires. But I would check the vacuum hoses first. Then, while you're into your Spyder that far, start your Spyder up when cold and in the dark. Moisture can build up in the ignition wires when cold creating a miss. Then burn off as the Spyder heats up and the problem goes away. In a dark environment you may be able to see arcing from the ignition wires. The OEM wires are of notoriously poor quality.

    Clogged fuel filters are pretty rare, in my opinion. But it does happen. Replacing the fuel filter can be cheap piece of mind, especially if nothing else seems to help.
    Last edited by BajaRon; 05-10-2019 at 08:41 AM.
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    Very Active Member safecracker's Avatar
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    Alot of great info here. I had a similar problem. My 2011 RTS Sm5 would run great on full tank of gas, but once it got down to below half and I stopped for awhile. Mine would start and run rough, twist the throttle and it would barely run. Most times it would stall. It would work out of problem if i could get started down the road. Any way it was my purge valve. Has run great ever since. Bruce
    RTS 2011 SM5


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