Companies dumping the NRA

[kep-up]

Are you really trying to sell that fact that laws against:
Murder
Rape
Robbery
Aggravated Assault

...and a whole bunch of others; are "Asinine"?

The only asinine thing is the post. By an opinionated poster who will not ever listen to the opposing viewpoint and just maybe concede a point or two!
Remainiing civil is extremely difficult with posters such as he.

[r1100rider]

Gun owners/buyers are NOT a "protected class".

Cake buyers are protected class? Point being dicks can refuse a legal sale but we sue a baker into bankruptcy for doing the same?

[kep-up]

Cake buyers are protected class? Point being dicks can refuse a legal sale but we sue a baker into bankruptcy for doing the same?

Personally, I get the point. And I see the hypocrisy there. As well as the hypocrisy in screaming about the deaths of 17 school children, and I agree it is terrible, but failing to recognize the terribleness of over 2400 human babies being killed each day in 2016.

Go ahead, RcR, blast me for this comparison. That's OK. I know you willnever concede that at 12 weeks a human is fully formed and able with some help to live outside the mother and grow into a productive person.

This is not a post to compare the deaths by gun or the deaths by scalpel, but only to expose the hypocrisy of the of the political progressives.

[r1100rider]

Which are the ones that you think, if properly enforced, would reduce gun violence in the US to somewhere near the rate in other civilized societies?

government agencies cross checking there own data base for one ,the 911 plane hijackers got there pilots licence in the mail 6 months after the attack ,the new school policies have the teachers so afraid to say anything they can't suppend a student or they will be called out they get threatened and the student is sent home with no repercussions and no paperwork then they are back in class the next day, this is what happened in Florida there were 20 plus police calls to the students home the school was scared enough he wasn't allowed a back pack everyone thought he was crazed if anyone of the dozens of red flags would have been written up he wouldn't have passed background check and people would be alive today

[bscrive]

Turns out that we Canadians have a right to bare arms......




In Ontario, we can also legally bare breasts as well.......

Sorry, no pictures since this is a family friendly site.

[loisk]

Meantime, our news here in oz showed us a church in Pennsylvania full of apparently God-fearing "good" Christians with their fancy evil looking assault weapons, some "worshippers" with a garland of bullets on their heads, blessing their weapons.

As long as attitudes stay that way, there are no laws which would ever be accepted which could significantly reduce the death by gun epidemic. An attitude change would be needed first. Worth a try though.

To the poster who introduced abortion as somehow related to this debate ..hmm, the right to bear arms is, at base, all about personal autonomy ... A clear contradiction in this comparison...

[Bob Denman]

Turns out that we Canadians have a right to bare arms......




In Ontario, we can also legally bare breasts as well.......

Sorry, no pictures since this is a family friendly site.

Does this mean that you all act like books; around guns?

[kep-up]

Meantime, our news here in oz showed us a church in Pennsylvania full of apparently God-fearing "good" Christians with their fancy evil looking assault weapons, some "worshippers" with a garland of bullets on their heads, blessing their weapons.

As long as attitudes stay that way, there are no laws which would ever be accepted which could significantly reduce the death by gun epidemic. An attitude change would be needed first. Worth a try though.

To the poster who introduced abortion as somehow related to this debate ..hmm, the right to bear arms is, at base, all about personal autonomy ... A clear contradiction in this comparison...

It is obvious that I am not eloquent enough to make my point regarding the hypocrisy of the people who hate killing by guns but do not have a problem with killing by scalpel. Since I am unable to make a comprehensible point, I will now and forever shut up about this topic.

[johnsimion]

It is obvious that I am not eloquent enough to make my point regarding the hypocrisy of the people who hate killing by guns but do not have a problem with killing by scalpel. Since I am unable to make a comprehensible point, I will now and forever shut up about this topic.

Abortion is another complicated topic but for me "personal choice" in the matter is actually a conservative position: I can personally oppose abortion and so can you. In fact, we can and probably should encourage others not to have abortions, but it's not our decision. More importantly, it should not be Big Government's decision. It should be the decision of the woman who is pregnant. She should have the personal freedom to make the moral choice, right or wrong, without Big Government looking over her shoulder and interfering. Furthermore, whether you like it or not, abortions reduce the incidence of unwanted welfare babies. Freedom from Big Government and reduction in welfare are CONSERVATIVE values, not "progressive" ones.

Practicality intrudes into both situations: Let's be realistic here. You can write gun laws until you are blue in the face and some people are going to disobey them and misuse the guns; nobody is ever going to confiscate all the guns in the U.S., and abortions are going to happen whether they are legal or not. I would rather have my government spend its money on enforcing the laws and protecting us than on writing new laws that will never be complied with.

[RinconRyder]

Are you really trying to sell that fact that laws against:
Murder
Rape
Robbery
Aggravated Assault

...and a whole bunch of others; are "Asinine"?

No, apparently you did.

[RinconRyder]

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2018/03/02...by-police.html

Yup, that's what I'm talking about. Now put that incident in a chaotic situation with hundreds of people, some armed, running around and you expect that poor cop to figure out, in mere seconds, who the bad guy is?

What could possibly go wrong?

[Bob Denman]

RinconRyder[/COLOR];1340713]How about we make laws directed at today's problems? We don't need asinine laws passed in the 19th century that don't apply to today's crisis.

Originally Posted by Bob Denman
Are you really trying to sell that fact that laws against:
Murder
Rape
Robbery
Aggravated Assault

...and a whole bunch of others; are "Asinine"?

RinconRyder[/B];1340774]No, apparently you did.

Would you care to reconsider your statement?

[r1100rider]

Yup, that's what I'm talking about. Now put that incident in a chaotic situation with hundreds of people, some armed, running around and you expect that poor cop to figure out, in mere seconds, who the bad guy is?

What could possibly go wrong?

Funny thing about that statement is people want everyone unarmed and unprotected then call the cops and wait for several minutes and trust they can handle the situation ,but then try and show where the cops make the wrong call when they get there, if there were armed teachers they would be well listed and the cops would know who should be there so which is it we trust the authorities or we don't?

[RinconRyder]

Cake buyers are protected class?

Only the gay ones.

[UtahPete]

Funny thing about that statement is people want everyone unarmed and unprotected then call the cops and wait for several minutes and trust they can handle the situation ,but then try and show where the cops make the wrong call when they get there, if there were armed teachers they would be well listed and the cops would know who should be there so which is it we trust the authorities or we don't?

I sure hope you're not an LEO. .

[RinconRyder]

I know you willnever concede that at 12 weeks a human is fully formed and able with some help to live outside the mother and grow into a productive person.

A fetus is NOT a "baby".

According to medical experts a fetus is deemed viable outside the womb in the range of 24 to 26 weeks. No state currently allows abortions after this time period.

[RinconRyder]

Funny thing about that statement is people want everyone unarmed and unprotected then call the cops and wait for several minutes and trust they can handle the situation ,but then try and show where the cops make the wrong call when they get there, if there were armed teachers they would be well listed and the cops would know who should be there so which is it we trust the authorities or we don't?

As most lawyers would say "your facts are not in evidence". This means that a teacher list of armed teachers would be almost impossible to keep current and the cops change beats regularly so it wouldn't make any difference. Nobody would know who the good and bad guys are except those in uniform.

The answer, of course, is to prevent undesirables from gaining access to these weapons (or all weapons). It will never be a perfect system but it will be galactically better than that today.

[r1100rider]

As most lawyers would say "your facts are not in evidence". This means that a teacher list of armed teachers would be almost impossible to keep current and the cops change beats regularly so it wouldn't make any difference. Nobody would know who the good and bad guys are except those in uniform.

The answer, of course, is to prevent undesirables from gaining access to these weapons (or all weapons). It will never be a perfect system but it will be galactically better than that today.

a computer data base would be easy to keep current only a few
would be armed , and of course everyone keeps denying the fact that if there was possible armed resistance inside the attacker’s would pick a soft target in a gun free zone

there are millions of guns already out there you can buy one from the truck of a gang guy in any city so when guns are out lawed only outlaws will have guns

I don’t know about you but I want to have some protection when a guy is crawling into my house at 3 am if you don’t that’s your choice

[blitzkreig]

A fetus is NOT a "baby". .

LOL ... what is it a frog? A bird? A panda bear?

A fetus is a baby which is legal to kill. Just live with it ...

[johnsimion]

As most lawyers would say "your facts are not in evidence". This means that a teacher list of armed teachers would be almost impossible to keep current and the cops change beats regularly so it wouldn't make any difference. Nobody would know who the good and bad guys are except those in uniform.

The answer, of course, is to prevent undesirables from gaining access to these weapons (or all weapons). It will never be a perfect system but it will be galactically better than that today.

I don't agree with either one of you. Arming teachers would be just great until (a) a teacher goes postal, (b) a student disarms the teacher (or steals the gun) and the student goes postal, or (c) a cop mistakes an armed teacher for a crazed killer, which could easily happen in an adrenaline-filled situation. And even if you had a really great database of what teachers are armed, and even if the cops read it and memorized it, how would the cops identify who is who? The cop may know that "Bill Johnson" is an armed teacher but how does he identify "Bill Johnson" when the bullets are flying? Ridiculous. RoboCop couldn't do that.

OTOH, neither is it feasible to keep "undesirables" from gaining access to weapons. Not only is there a massive problem of defining who is "undesirable," but enforcing such a law would just be impossible. There are too many guns out there and too many criminals.

The only school solution I've heard yet that makes any sense would be to change the structure so there is only one way in or out ("hardened" as Bob says) and that is through a metal detector and past ONE armed security guard who is behind a bulletproof wall, wearing a vest and with a hotline to the SWAT team. That might not stop a crazed kid with an AR-15 but it might deter him from trying. This would be an expensive solution but I wonder if it would be any more expensive than the cost of fully implementing and enforcing gun control proposals or the loss of rights of honest, law-abiding people who make up the VAST majority of gun owners.

[r1100rider]

Meantime, our news here in oz showed us a church in Pennsylvania full of apparently God-fearing "good" Christians with their fancy evil looking assault weapons, some "worshippers" with a garland of bullets on their heads, blessing their weapons.

As long as attitudes stay that way, there are no laws which would ever be accepted which could significantly reduce the death by gun epidemic. An attitude change would be needed first. Worth a try though.

To the poster who introduced abortion as somehow related to this debate ..hmm, the right to bear arms is, at base, all about personal autonomy ... A clear contradiction in this comparison...

the only reason abortion was brought up is to show the the progressives double standard ,they are outraged by the shooting and someone should take away people's right to defend themselves, but it's ok the use millions of tax payer dollars to fund 1000's of killings a year because it's a persons choice and we have a legal shield because a court decided at so many weeks it's not a person yet , and inconvenient facts like more baby's of a certain minority are aborted each year than are born in New York City ,and the group we fund sells baby parts but o well those dam guns that keep jumping off the self and killing people lets go fix that

[r1100rider]

I don't agree with either one of you. Arming teachers would be just great until (a) a teacher goes postal, (b) a student disarms the teacher (or steals the gun) and the student goes postal, or (c) a cop mistakes an armed teacher for a crazed killer, which could easily happen in an adrenaline-filled situation. And even if you had a really great database of what teachers are armed, and even if the cops read it and memorized it, how would the cops identify who is who? The cop may know that "Bill Johnson" is an armed teacher but how does he identify "Bill Johnson" when the bullets are flying? Ridiculous. RoboCop couldn't do that.

OTOH, neither is it feasible to keep "undesirables" from gaining access to weapons. Not only is there a massive problem of defining who is "undesirable," but enforcing such a law would just be impossible. There are too many guns out there and too many criminals.

The only school solution I've heard yet that makes any sense would be to change the structure so there is only one way in or out ("hardened" as Bob says) and that is through a metal detector and past ONE armed security guard who is behind a bulletproof wall, wearing a vest and with a hotline to the SWAT team. That might not stop a crazed kid with an AR-15 but it might deter him from trying. This would be an expensive solution but I wonder if it would be any more expensive than the cost of fully implementing and enforcing gun control proposals or the loss of rights of honest, law-abiding people who make up the VAST majority of gun owners.

there are already private colleges with teachers that are allowed to carry it works fine no attacks no postal teachers

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

the only reason abortion was brought up is to show the the progressives double standard

And the conservatives don't have a double standard??? You're responsible for yourself when it comes to eating and exercising to keep healthy and don't expect me to help pay your doctor when you're sick, but I can tell you how to treat that being that is growing inside you. Conservatives are hell bent to keep the embryo/fetus/baby alive from conception to birth, but ask them to fund programs to help ensure that child grows up healthy and educated properly, hell no.

I'm sorry, even though I do not condone abortion, except maybe in extreme health injurious situations, I do not find any provision in the Constitution or the Holy Bible that gives me the right to impose my moral standards on someone who does not share my beliefs. I can, and should, share them, but impose them, no. The challenge that most evangelical Christians avoid is to properly balance love and empathy with a standard of conduct. Imposing a standard is easy, practicing love is hard.

[loisk]

the only reason abortion was brought up is to show the the progressives double standard ,they are outraged by the shooting and someone should take away people's right to defend themselves, but it's ok the use millions of tax payer dollars to fund 1000's of killings a year because it's a persons choice and we have a legal shield because a court decided at so many weeks it's not a person yet , and inconvenient facts like more baby's of a certain minority are aborted each year than are born in New York City ,and the group we fund sells baby parts but o well those dam guns that keep jumping off the self and killing people lets go fix that

I have no idea of the meanings of American definitions of progressives, conservatives, liberals etc. Best not give me any such label.

Obviously hit a sore point - but could you please explain how and why "the group we fund sells baby parts" - sounds very third world to me. On second thoughts, please do not try to explain, I really no longer want to know.

[r1100rider]

I have no idea of the meanings of American definitions of progressives, conservatives, liberals etc. Best not give me any such label.

Obviously hit a sore point - but could you please explain how and why "the group we fund sells baby parts" - sounds very third world to me. On second thoughts, please do not try to explain, I really no longer want to know.

Planned parenthood caught on undercover videos