2008 Spyder manual shift, starts rough after hot 33,00 miles

[dschaub]

starting to have an issue once its hot and shut off for say 15 minutes I have to turn the throttled and crank before it starts. Then runs rough for a couple minutes. I tried putting new OEM NGK plugs in, didn't change. Been through a couple tanks of gas so it not bad fuel. When cold or cooled down all the way its fine. Have Hindle and K&N air filter. Saw something about running some fuel injection, have not tried that yet. Anyone else having this issue ??

[Firefly]

starting to have an issue once its hot and shut off for say 15 minutes I have to turn the throttled and crank before it starts. Then runs rough for a couple minutes. I tried putting new OEM NGK plugs in, didn't change. Been through a couple tanks of gas so it not bad fuel. When cold or cooled down all the way its fine. Have Hindle and K&N air filter. Saw something about running some fuel injection, have not tried that yet. Anyone else having this issue ??

Check your vacuum hoses.

[dschaub]

if a vacuum hose was bad wouldn't it run bad all the time. Its starts and runs fine when cold or cooled down.

[quasi]

purge valve sticking maybe

[Bob Denman]

Plug wires: have they been replaced?

[BajaRon]

if a vacuum hose was bad wouldn't it run bad all the time. Its starts and runs fine when cold or cooled down.

You should check and replace your vacuum hoses even if they are not the cause of the current issue. Because, at some point, they will be.

Changing just your spark plugs without changing the ignition wires almost always creates a problem with starting (though not necessarily the exact problem you describe). The stock spark plug wires are of poor quality. And they use a very high resistance, carbon core conductor. This core breaks down with heat and vibration. Over time this increases the already high resistance causing less and less spark energy being delivered to the spark plugs. (It is also hard on the coils).

Manipulating the ignition wires during the spark plug change almost always results in your Spyder running even worse after the spark plug install. Also, when changing spark plugs in the Spyder it is important to use thermal paste (Not Anti-Seize) on the spark plug threads. This helps the heat transfer process from the spark plug to the cylinder head which is important to maintain the correct temperature in the spark plug.

[Chupaca]

Those vaccum hoses can be tricky as when cold they are tight fitting and when heated up become loose and the cracks open up...
20150726_160909.jpg can look good at rest and cold....20150726_160929.jpg heated up those cracks tend to leak.
regardless you should replace them with the silicone hoses...The oem plug wires work in a similar fashion and once hot can arch. As BajaRon has suggested to many fire her up in a dark garage with the plastics off and see if there is arching or a change if you move the plug wires around.(don't use your bare hands or it will light you up) Things to check anyway along with when you cleaned or changed your air filter and fuel filter.....

[dschaub]

I replaced the wires and plugs at around 19,000 miles. Used the BajaRon wires which is way better than OEM (as you guys mentioned). I had my dealer in Ct looks at them before I put them on and he said "these are much better than OEM". I have to think they are still good. When they were bad at 19K the bike ran terrible (arcing out like crazy, hot or cold), problem was fixed with the new plugs and wires. I got 4 plugs then so figured I would put the new ones in (front plug is no fun to change) but made no difference. So sounds like the vacuum hoses may be the issue. I have another friend with a Auto Tran 2011 Spyder (RSS) and he had that problem and vacuums hose fixed it. His stores outside under a cover, mine is garaged.

[dschaub]

the fuel filter has never been changed, I was thinking I would do that before I started this thread. its right in the open with some of the top plastics off and not expensive. Will have that done by this weekend, normally out on Saturdays.

[dschaub]

K&N was recharged in the spring, thinking that should be fine... looks good

[Warlock]

K&N was recharged in the spring, thinking that should be fine... looks good

Sounds like valves needs attention. Most will crank good while cold and harder to crank when hot.
David

[BajaRon]

I replaced the wires and plugs at around 19,000 miles. Used the BajaRon wires which is way better than OEM (as you guys mentioned). I had my dealer in Ct looks at them before I put them on and he said "these are much better than OEM". I have to think they are still good. When they were bad at 19K the bike ran terrible (arcing out like crazy, hot or cold), problem was fixed with the new plugs and wires. I got 4 plugs then so figured I would put the new ones in (front plug is no fun to change) but made no difference. So sounds like the vacuum hoses may be the issue. I have another friend with a Auto Tran 2011 Spyder (RSS) and he had that problem and vacuums hose fixed it. His stores outside under a cover, mine is garaged.

You're right. If you have the BajaRon ignition wires the heat and vibration really make no difference. Of course even my wires will eventually wear out and need replacement. But most are getting about 50k miles from them so you should be good there.

If the vacuum hoses don't fix your problem it could be valve adjustment. But this is so rarely needed it isn't usually the solution. But it does fit the symptoms.

Let us know what the final fix turns out to be.

[Warlock]

You're right. If you have the BajaRon ignition wires the heat and vibration really make no difference. Of course even my wires will eventually wear out and need replacement. But most are getting about 50k miles from them so you should be good there.

If the vacuum hoses don't fix your problem it could be valve adjustment. But this is so rarely needed it isn't usually the solution. But it does fit the symptoms.

Let us know what the final fix turns out to be.

One other thing I thought about. Could also be the coil. Once you find it please give us a up date.
David

[dschaub]

I had my bike in to Columbia Motor Sports spring 2016, had a coolant leak I could not find, ended up being the collector and hoses needed replacement ($300ish to repair). I asked the mechanic about the valve adjustment. The manual says its needed (about 15k miles or something) and his response was "valve's are fine, we really never adjust them, don't care what the manual says". My friend with a Spyder and a BRB Quad was saying you know when the valve's need adjusting "when you pull the clutch in coming to a stop if the engine stalls, its time to have re-shimmed". His quad had that issue, rotax engine I believe. My Spyder is not doing that. I will be changing the fuel filter and working on the vacuum hoses Saturday. Someone said to use silicone hoses. Hope this fixes my issue. Season coming to an end here in CT. WINTER SUCKS !! Thanks Guys really appreciate the assistance.

[Warlock]

I had my bike in to Columbia Motor Sports spring 2016, had a coolant leak I could not find, ended up being the collector and hoses needed replacement ($300ish to repair). I asked the mechanic about the valve adjustment. The manual says its needed (about 15k miles or something) and his response was "valve's are fine, we really never adjust them, don't care what the manual says". My friend with a Spyder and a BRB Quad was saying you know when the valve's need adjusting "when you pull the clutch in coming to a stop if the engine stalls, its time to have re-shimmed". His quad had that issue, rotax engine I believe. My Spyder is not doing that. I will be changing the fuel filter and working on the vacuum hoses Saturday. Someone said to use silicone hoses. Hope this fixes my issue. Season coming to an end here in CT. WINTER SUCKS !! Thanks Guys really appreciate the assistance.

Hate to say it, but that mechanic needs to study more. One of the main characters of valves is hard to start when hot. Not seeming to have the power it use to have. I hope it is a simple vacuum lines and fuel filter. When they set it at the factory if the valves was set on the upper end of the allowed clearance you may be ok. But if set to the lower end very possible could need looking at. But also a weak coil can do the same thing. But hoping you have luck and not spending the money at a dealership.
David

[Warlock]

Got to reading some old post. Some of their problems was, battery needing change, ground wire on the frame was a tiny bit loose, evap canister bad due to topping off tank to extreme level. Injectors needing treatment. Just giving you a few items to check. Didn't think about the ground wire or battery until I read some of the old post.
David

[dschaub]

33k and she still runs like a bear. Have not noticed any lose of power (thing loves triple digit speeds on the hwy). My buddy that tuned me on to this awesome machine back in 2008 (he has a premier edition as well, mine is #3528). he has 45k miles on his and never touched his valves. Battery has been changed, when it was going bad it started to crank slow, not cranking slow at all so I don't think that is an issue. I just removed both the battery connections to check them as well, so not thinking its that either. Will see what the vacuum hoses and fuel filter and also some fuel injector cleaner does. Will advise on Monday. Thanks David !!

[Warlock]

33k and she still runs like a bear. Have not noticed any lose of power (thing loves triple digit speeds on the hwy). My buddy that tuned me on to this awesome machine back in 2008 (he has a premier edition as well, mine is #3528). he has 45k miles on his and never touched his valves. Battery has been changed, when it was going bad it started to crank slow, not cranking slow at all so I don't think that is an issue. I just removed both the battery connections to check them as well, so not thinking its that either. Will see what the vacuum hoses and fuel filter and also some fuel injector cleaner does. Will advise on Monday. Thanks David !!

I also have a 08 model. Only thing I've had to do to mine is power steering unit went out. I'm a retired chief mechanic so I do all my work except when it comes to buds.
David

[dschaub]

I had my DPS changed from a recall many years back. About 6 weeks ago I noticed it was cutting out a little on a short ride. I did a battery re-set and all the DPS plugs I could get to I unplugged air hosed them clean (they looked clean already) put it back together, hasn't done it again (I'm knocking on wood right now). It looks like about a $700.00 part I think what I could find on-line. Looked like a little bit of a challenging job to replace but definitely do it myself. Did you change yours or the dealer and how much did it cost ?? What does "buds" mean ??

[dschaub]

Getting back to you guys on my problem. Had nothing to do with a valve adjustment like I thought. I pulled the fuel filter off and could barely blow through it. I got one that fit from napa, wasn't the oem one but fit the fuel lines (Napa Gold 3032 fuel filter, less than $5.00), it does not fit in the OEM mounting bracket but there is plenty of room for it to place with the OEM bracket removed (no wire ties needed). Will get the OEM one eventually. The bike runs and starts fine now when hot, its also not popping as much. I have a Hindle on no fuel management controller (i know i need that just never spent the $$$). I pulled one of vacuum hoses off and didn't realize the two were different ID sizes, so only replaced one. They were clearly not an issue, no cracking or failing at all, will replace the smaller one over the winter just to say "both were replaced".. Hope this helps some of you all.

[Chupaca]

On the vaccum hoses.... there are three.. one larger which is not the problem and two smaller ones. One is clearly visable close to the larger one and the other is behind the canister...just so you change both and we recommend the silicone hose...
Thanks for following up and letting us know...

Getting back to you guys on my problem. Had nothing to do with a valve adjustment like I thought. I pulled the fuel filter off and could barely blow through it. I got one that fit from napa, wasn't the oem one but fit the fuel lines (Napa Gold 3032 fuel filter, less than $5.00), it does not fit in the OEM mounting bracket but there is plenty of room for it to place with the OEM bracket removed (no wire ties needed). Will get the OEM one eventually. The bike runs and starts fine now when hot, its also not popping as much. I have a Hindle on no fuel management controller (i know i need that just never spent the $$$). I pulled one of vacuum hoses off and didn't realize the two were different ID sizes, so only replaced one. They were clearly not an issue, no cracking or failing at all, will replace the smaller one over the winter just to say "both were replaced".. Hope this helps some of you all.

[dschaub]

I actually did replace a larger hose as well (maybe like a 1/2 ID hose) that comes off the bottom of the air box (left side) to the throttle body (maybe like 8 inches long), didn't look bad but replaced it with new real hose clamps too. I'm not even sure now what hose you mean (near the canister), the two I was mentioning are both right next to each other on the left side of the throttle body, only a few inches long). Do you have pictures possibly ??

[Warlock]

I had my DPS changed from a recall many years back. About 6 weeks ago I noticed it was cutting out a little on a short ride. I did a battery re-set and all the DPS plugs I could get to I unplugged air hosed them clean (they looked clean already) put it back together, hasn't done it again (I'm knocking on wood right now). It looks like about a $700.00 part I think what I could find on-line. Looked like a little bit of a challenging job to replace but definitely do it myself. Did you change yours or the dealer and how much did it cost ?? What does "buds" mean ??

The unit has to have the computer on it once the unit is replaced. Not only was my DPS bad the position sensor was bad. Total bill including parts and labor was $1895.00. hope it doesn't go out again. It had already been replaced once before under the recall.
David

[Warlock]

Getting back to you guys on my problem. Had nothing to do with a valve adjustment like I thought. I pulled the fuel filter off and could barely blow through it. I got one that fit from napa, wasn't the oem one but fit the fuel lines (Napa Gold 3032 fuel filter, less than $5.00), it does not fit in the OEM mounting bracket but there is plenty of room for it to place with the OEM bracket removed (no wire ties needed). Will get the OEM one eventually. The bike runs and starts fine now when hot, its also not popping as much. I have a Hindle on no fuel management controller (i know i need that just never spent the $$$). I pulled one of vacuum hoses off and didn't realize the two were different ID sizes, so only replaced one. They were clearly not an issue, no cracking or failing at all, will replace the smaller one over the winter just to say "both were replaced".. Hope this helps some of you all.

Buddy of mine runs the same exhaust for years and no fuel processor. Also check your 2 exhaust gaskets on the y pipe. That will make it pop some when letting off the gas.
David

[dschaub]

I have replaced those gaskets at least 4 times. I try to keep those clamps tight as my deal has recommended to check and keep them tight. This makes them last much longer, as soon as they have a little possible play in there exhaust gases start to get by then they get start to get sections fail on them. You can start to hear some exhaust noise as well, I have a very keen ear for that over the years. I saw some posts where folks are using a Honda Gasket set and they are less expensive and last longer.