stalling issue getting worse along with idle

[heyharris1]

I posted a while ago that the spyder just randomly stalled. Today, me and the wife went for a ride (75 miles) and it stalled 6 times and when I got home I just let it idle in the driveway and it was jumping between about 900 -1700 rpms for about 30 second to a minute then just sputtered and died. It fired right back up and idled like it should for about a minute then started doing the eratic idle again then sputtered and died. When I bought it the dealership told me it was serviced but is there something else I should look for. It has just over 17k on the odometer. Maybe fuel filter, air filter, replace plugs. Just strange the way it started all of a sudden. looking for advice, hate to pay the dealer 125 an hour to tell me the spark plugs are shot or something retarded like that.

[trikermutha]

Just throwing my three cents out there but did you check your vacuum line for leaks yet?

[heyharris1]

no, not yet. Just took a shower to cool down my fustrations. I have learned not to work on things when I am irritated or I usually end up breaking things. I am going to pull off some panels when I get home tomorrow to see if i can visually spot anything. Sad thing is on sept 11th I got a long trip planned and nowI'm not sure how trust worthy the spyder is. I may end up taking the camaro (even though I don't want to) just so I know for sure I am gonna mane it there and back.

Jim

[DGoebel]

Curious as to what fuel you're using, is this the first time you've emptied the tank as low as it currently is, I remember my used Spyder having a similar issue last fall, and was suggested to me to run the tank as dry as I dared and then top off with a full tank of no ethanol gas (we're in MN where there's more 10 - 15% mixed ethanol pumps than not). When I was prepping for my Iron Butt ride I carried a spare gallon of real gasoline and ran my spyder dry, put the spare in and filled up with real gasoline and haven't had the issue since. Mine idle's at 1400 iirc.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

with the other poster on this ....AND if you see the cracks in the vacuum lines you have Superman vision .... you usually can't see them until you remove and bend into a " U " shape ...... PS replace with SILICONE hoses , they will last the life of the Spyder ......Mike

[Chupaca]

they can fool you...replace them with silicone hose here are the examples Mike mentioned...
20150726_160909.jpg at rest..20150726_160929.jpg the "U" Stress test...

[SpyderAnn01]

Your purge valve may be the culprit. I had a bad one on my 13 and the rpm would race up and down and then it would die.

[heyharris1]

We'll, here I sit at work pondering the issue so I started looking up parts and I noticed BRP has a new part number for the purge valve as spyderann suggested may be the problem. The old part number was 709000108 while the new part number is 709000443. Wonder if there is a way to find out if BRP was having problems with the purge valve and made changes to it, otherwise, why would they have a new part number. Not even sure that's the problem, gonna go home today and test the purge valve and check each and every vacuum line. One other note my wife said she was able to smell gas fumes but I didn't which also seems to be a problem with the purge valve letting fuel into the canister I guess. I so wanna take this on my vacation but not till I figure this out for sure.

Jim

[youngers]

hey harris ! hope your mystery is an easy fix , please take some photos , as best as possible , I have a 2012 , so one day this might be my mystery as well ! {what was the price on the - purge value ? }

[heyharris1]

if they do end up being the issue the purge valve is 48.99 and the canister which I will replace as well cost 69.99. Total will be about 120. Not to bad if they end up being the problem. Oh I forgot to answer Dgoebel, I am not sure what fuel I am running. I just pull up and fill it with premium, I think its 91 or 92 octane. I just figure in a high performance machine why run the 87.

Jim

[Bob Denman]

Please let us know how all of this works out; good luck!
(I'm betting on the Vacuum lines and/or Purge valve also...)

[Easy Rider]

One other note my wife said she was able to smell gas fumes but I didn't which also seems to be a problem with the purge valve letting fuel into the canister I guess. I so wanna take this on my vacation but not till I figure this out for sure.

I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned the canister yet.

It might be full of liquid fuel and causing the problem you describe.
Doing a search on here for "canister" should find posts describing the problem .......and a couple of "fixes" without buying a new one.

Filling the tank too full is one thing that can cause this to happen.

[H2O]

In regards to the part number changing, don't put too much thought into that. Maybe there was an improved version, or it could just be they are buying it from a different supplier.

H2O

[heyharris1]

well, I got it tore apart, the purge valve and canister appear to not be the problems, started looking for vacuum lines, found a few that looked questionable so i replaced them with silicone, still no luck still a constant stall. Tomorrow I am going to replace the spark plugs so my question is does anybody know what the ohms resistence is for the wires so I can test them. With 17k miles should I just replace them. Other than the two questionable hoses I have found nothing so far that would justify it stalling.

Jim

[SpyderAnn01]

This is from the 2010 RT service manual, I don't have one for the 12. I hope it helps.

SPARK PLUG CABLES
Spark Plug Cable Resistance Test
Inspect each spark plug cable condition. If cable
ends, sheath (insulator) or contacts are in poor
condition, replace them.
If cables are in good condition, carry out a resistance
check as per following.
Disconnect each spark plug wire from the coil assembly
and from its spark plug.
Measure each cable resistance and compare to
following chart.
CABLE POSITION CABLE RESISTANCE
Front cylinder 5.11 to 8.72 kn
Rear cylinder 3.24 to 5.53 kn
If cables do not meet specifications, replace cables.
SPARK PLUGS

[Easy Rider]

I have found nothing so far that would justify it stalling.

If there is a fuel filter, you should change it.

And I haven't seen much about a plugged tank vent causing a vacuum in the tank with Spyders.......but that is fairly common with some bikes.

And even if the canister looks OK, I would do the part of the removal procedure that disconnects and blocks off the hose to effectively remove it ......before taking it to a shop.

And a healthy dose of a multi-purpose fuel treatment might help rule out bad fuel.

[Bob Denman]

This is from the 2010 RT service manual, I don't have one for the 12. I hope it helps.

SPARK PLUG CABLES
Spark Plug Cable Resistance Test
Inspect each spark plug cable condition. If cable
ends, sheath (insulator) or contacts are in poor
condition, replace them.
If cables are in good condition, carry out a resistance
check as per following.
Disconnect each spark plug wire from the coil assembly
and from its spark plug.
Measure each cable resistance and compare to
following chart.
CABLE POSITION CABLE RESISTANCE
Front cylinder 5.11 to 8.72 kn
Rear cylinder 3.24 to 5.53 kn
If cables do not meet specifications, replace cables.
SPARK PLUGS

Since you're already hip-deep into it: get yourself some new plugwires from BajaRon. His are the best!

[Highwayman2013]

While you are looking around, check the rubber boots that connect the throttle bodies to the intake.

[Machinegunner]

I talked to my mechanic yesterday about your problem. He said he just had one in with the same. He said go to the canister and pinch the hose while it is running. In his case, that isolated the canister and it ran better. Said the canister was full. In the early days BRP had the wrong program for the purge valve, making it stay open too long making the bike run lean. Sounds more like fuel than spark to me.

[ByronM]

well, I got it tore apart, the purge valve and canister appear to not be the problems, started looking for vacuum lines, found a few that looked questionable so i replaced them with silicone, still no luck still a constant stall. Tomorrow I am going to replace the spark plugs so my question is does anybody know what the ohms resistence is for the wires so I can test them. With 17k miles should I just replace them. Other than the two questionable hoses I have found nothing so far that would justify it stalling.

Jim

Jim, let me tell you my tail, earlier this summer I had the same symptoms, I had already changed plugs and wires several hundred miles before, I changed the vacuum hoses, did see some crack after I bent them, still stalled, plugged purge valve, still stalled, check checked thottle boots and changed fuel filter, still stalled, even though I had rode over 1/2 tank of fuel out I poured in some sea foam to rule out water in my tank, still was stalling at idle, kept restarting it and held the thottle open to keep it running, after about 5 min it started idleing again, figured nothing to lose so took it out for a short ride, got home and it was idleing fine and still is.


The only thing that I can think of is I had a dirty injector and the sea foam cleaned it up, I am not saying that it will fix yours but what do you have to lose? There are better injector cleaner out there than sea foam but that what I had on hand.

Good luck

[BajaRon]

if they do end up being the issue the purge valve is 48.99 and the canister which I will replace as well cost 69.99. Total will be about 120. Not to bad if they end up being the problem. Oh I forgot to answer Dgoebel, I am not sure what fuel I am running. I just pull up and fill it with premium, I think its 91 or 92 octane. I just figure in a high performance machine why run the 87.

Jim

Why not save a lot of grief and money and just eliminate both the canister and the purge valve? Even if you spend all this time and money who's to say it won't just happen again? These unnecessary attachments are just a problem waiting to happen.

Even if this does not fix your problem you'll be way ahead!

[heyharris1]

Update...
I have decided to eliminate the canister since the machine looks like it was hit by a bomb anyways. What do I have to lose so I watched the video on canisterectomy and am confused on one section. In the video he talks about cutting all 3 lines but then he only shows how to connect 2 of them back up. there is no mention of the third one. Has anybody done this than can explain what I do with the 3rd hose. Also, I did go ahead an order new wires from Baja ron. I saw no need to put the old wired back in. After I get them and put it all back together I will run some seafoam through it as will. Before i tore it all apart as long as I kept the throttle slightly cracked, 1800-2000 rpms it would run all day long. Now i just get to wait and ponder until the plugs show up....

P.S. Here's how my baby looks right now, she aint to happy.......MEDIC....

unhappy spyder.jpg

[ByronM]

Update...
I have decided to eliminate the canister since the machine looks like it was hit by a bomb anyways. What do I have to lose so I watched the video on canisterectomy and am confused on one section. In the video he talks about cutting all 3 lines but then he only shows how to connect 2 of them back up. there is no mention of the third one. Has anybody done this than can explain what I do with the 3rd hose. Also, I did go ahead an order new wires from Baja ron. I saw no need to put the old wired back in. After I get them and put it all back together I will run some seafoam through it as will. Before i tore it all apart as long as I kept the throttle slightly cracked, 1800-2000 rpms it would run all day long. Now i just get to wait and ponder until the plugs show up....

P.S. Here's how my baby looks right now, she aint to happy.......MEDIC....

unhappy spyder.jpg

While you still have it apart make sure that you looked at the correct vaccum hoses, the problem ones are on the left side of the bike, they are about 1 1/2" long and are run from the MAPs sensor to the thottle bodies, I found it easier to unbolt the sensor to replace the hoses.

Also your in so far you may want to check the valve clearances, if you do pay attention on reinstalling the valve cover gaskets if you don't want to be taken it apart again, you don't have to ask why I know this. I ended up glueing the gasket to the valve cover to keep it in place.

[heyharris1]

Well, I got most of it back together, got it fired up and low and behold it ran and purred like a kitten, I am going with either the plugs were bad (Cause they looked terrible) or a wire issue. Just when I think I got it back together I go to put the mirrors on and low and behold the little clips things in the back are broken. SIGH. Once again it has to sit while I order parts. I may just duck tape the damn things on then when people ask why I will simply tell them because the duck tape is better then the garbage Can am is putting out.

Fustratred all to hell,

Jim

[ByronM]

Well, I got most of it back together, got it fired up and low and behold it ran and purred like a kitten, I am going with either the plugs were bad (Cause they looked terrible) or a wire issue. Just when I think I got it back together I go to put the mirrors on and low and behold the little clips things in the back are broken. SIGH. Once again it has to sit while I order parts. I may just duck tape the damn things on then when people ask why I will simply tell them because the duck tape is better then the garbage Can am is putting out.

Fustratred all to hell,

Jim

At least you got the hard part done, consider installing the Magic Mount For the mirrors, than you will not have that frustration every time you remove the mirrors.