ECU Flash---Who has ORDERED YET?

[Yukonf3]

The spyder back pressure changes within the stock rpm usable range are not all that drastic.

This is true up to 5000 rpm. After that the stock system becomes progressively restrictive under WOT to redline. I consistently measured it at over 3.5 psi. A Two Bros exhaust, in comparison, registered about .5 psi under the same conditions. If the ECU can be mapped to accommodate that change, that would be great.

[Dennis in Lodi]

I have my RT flashed with the 8,600 rpm rev limit. I use Lamont's cat delete with the sound insert, Two brothers Exhaust with the P1 performance tip. My bike pulls so hard after 5,000 rpm that I can't believe it's the same bike. Check out this video of my test RT bike. https://monsterfuelinjection.com/spyder/ It show my RT going from 0 to 90 mph in about 10 seconds as it still has the stock speed limits in place.
Notice how one of the three speed runs the nanny didn't kick in, and my front end unloads and floats. Also notice at the end of the video for the roll on test where I say and show 5,000 rpm to 7,000 rpm roll on. I'm accelerating from 48 mph to 88 mph in 8 seconds shifting at only 7,000 rpm which is well short of peak power at 8,600 rpm. This is where the Stage One Monster flash really shines. My pathetic stock RT times were only getting to less than 70 mph with the same test. Blows me away that a flash gets that much performance.

This is true up to 5000 rpm. After that the stock system becomes progressively restrictive under WOT to redline. I consistently measured it at over 3.5 psi. A Two Bros exhaust, in comparison, registered about .5 psi under the same conditions. If the ECU can be mapped to accommodate that change, that would be great.

[Dennis in Lodi]

I took my Monster fuel flash bike to my dealer and told the service manager the throttle is sticking at 8,600. After a puzzled look he grinned from ear to ear and took my RT for a test ride. 2 & 1/2 hours later after every service tech went for a ride and the guessing game began. Only two of the four techs made it past 7,500 rpm and all four were certain I did head work.
When I asked the manager if my warranty was now void, he said " Relax Dennis, the customer pays our bills here not Can-am". It would be a pretty foolish business decision to throw a well known customer under the warranty bus.

I agree, not only do I have a factory warranty currently but I have an extended warranty. At the end of the day, one must choose. If you worried just don't do it. For me its a gamble but I chose to take it because it won't kill me either way. Playing it safe has never really gotten me far, but taking risk has. Just my take...

[DriftersWay]

I got 2 more questions:

1 if my bike goes into the shop for maintenance and they do an update with BUDS,
would that erase my flash??

2 Right now I normally shift around 3500 RPM. Would flashing my ECU change my normal
shift pattern??

Thanks

[jcthorne]

I got 2 more questions:

1 if my bike goes into the shop for maintenance and they do an update with BUDS,
would that erase my flash??

2 Right now I normally shift around 3500 RPM. Would flashing my ECU change my normal
shift pattern??

Thanks

1. Yes but Monster will re-do it for you if required. Do not have the dealer reflash.

2. No, for normal driving there will be no change in shift point as the engine will behave at low throttle position the same as it always has.

[HayRog]

When I asked the manager if my warranty was now void, he said " Relax Dennis, the customer pays our bills here not Can-am". It would be a pretty foolish business decision to throw a well known customer under the warranty bus.

Marina Boats and Powersports ?

[NVERLAST1]

Once more people have these running around we will need a real comparison between Jase and Monster Fuel Injection. Then those of us interested can make an educated decision.

Bump....Any updates on which one is better?

[nealperkins]

Yes, I'd like to know as well as I will shortly use the monster option if we don't hear back.
Thanks!

[Pirate looks at --]

Marina Boats and Powersports ?

Not Lodi California. I think Dennis is in Wisconsin!

[Wildrice]

And, if you have received the unit back, what was your whole experience like? I'd like to know more about disassembly to get to the ECU, shipping, total order turn around, other issues, etc.
Maybe you could also comment on what parameters you ordered on the ECU as well?
Thanks!

I've had mine remapped by Monster Fuel almost 2 months ago. I had the rev limiter changed to 8600, gas in my area is 93 octane. My 2015 F3's SE6 performance has increased--I really notice it in 1st thru 4th gear--traffic congestion in my area prevents top end testing--I've had it to 110 mph in 5th.

I've done a fair amount of ECU or ECM modification on the Suzuki Hayabusa. Basically we changed the Air to Fuel ratio, timing, & top RPM limit. There is a lot that can be modified--on the Hayabusa we removed all the Add on stuff--Power Commander, shift time delay module--Top Speed Restrictor. The Spyder doesn't need all possible ECM changes due to basic design. As time progresses we may see a few using NOS (Nitrous), turbo or supercharger. At that time ECM adjustment will become necessary & I'm sure Monster Fuel will be up for the task. All in all it cost approx $400 to gain some HP & torque--that's a real good deal considering the other add ons I've installed--F&R Elka Shocks, suspension, lighting, seat gel/padding, windshield --appearance mods--I haven't added up my total upgrade costs but I'd guess they would exceed $3000 excluding the BRP stuff like saddle bags, back rests. $400 is a great deal for a performance increase 15%-25%. I'm not familiar with any Spyder dyno shops--the Nanny wants to see all 3 wheels moving. Most of my trips are short thus mpg is around 30 mpg before & after. My only regret was the Cat Delete pipe & baffle--It really hurt my off the line acceleration--probably improved top end acceleration but I prefer the power from the stop light.
Except for one rider who claimed it made no difference I haven't heard any other negative feedback on the ECM flashing upgrade.
Good Luck,
Darrell

[Peter Aawen]

I'm just over a full weeks ryding into a re-flash done by Jase at ECU Xtreme (rotaxracing@gmail.com) and I'm STOKED!!

Admittedly, I did have a bit of trouble getting at the ECU, cos my Spyder is a 2013 RT Ltd & on them, BRP in their wisdom moved things around somewhat in preparation for the 1330 motor, then when that wasn't available in time, reverted to shoe-horning the V-twin back in without considering how difficult that would make it to get at some components &/or pull them out; but once I got it out, sent it off for the re-flash & then put it back in & got it running again, it's been nothing short of FANBLOODYTASTIC!! Goes well too!! And even with all the extra GO, I'm still getting better fuel economy than I was ever able to get out of it stock!!

Fuel range here in Aus is a significant issue, there are heaps of places that I frequently ryde where the distance between fuel stops significantly exceeds the standard range that the V-twins could get out of just a tank full of gas (using about 20 'safely useable' litres) but not any more!! I already scored a wad of mid range grunt & about 50 km extra range by fitting a Cat Elim & modding the muffler, and now I've picked up well over another 100 km of useable range regardless of how hard I ryde it; in fact the cumulative mods have almost doubled my Spyder's original 'sedate touring' range, AND the ECU upgrade/tune not only significantly improves the GO, but it also takes into account & removes any hesitation or lack of grunt caused by removing the air trunking & changing the exhaust/cat elim etc. So now, not only do I have sufficient power to show just about anything a clean pair of heels, especially thru the twisties, but I also have access to almost double the original fuel range, and that's even if I'm full on fanging it!! Not only can I do way better than just stick with the 1330's performance wise but I can still stay with them when it comes to touring range, despite the smaller fuel tank the V-twins run!!

Even while I'm ryding 2-up & loaded, all the stock tune 1330's are now left eating my dust, along with all the other Saturday arvo bikes & ryders when we are out there punting thru the twisties, and I have yet to find a car that can keep up with us at any speed in the twisty stuff!! I'm still looking for a track or 'safe place' to do some speed runs, & I have had to re-learn the 'safe throttle settings' to avoid lighting up the rear tire every time I take off & to match those & steering angles to minimise lifting a front wheel on cornering, but overall the Nanny has been relatively unobtrusive, except when I've clearly done something silly! Even so, I don't believe this tune is a great idea for someone still coming to terms with ryding a Spyder at all, let alone yet to enjoy ryding 'spiritedly' & closer to the limits; nor for that matter do I believe it is a great idea for anyone still learning to ride anything with waaay better than 'normal street' performance levels - this particular ECU Upgrade comes on strong from the word Go & has made my Spyder the performance machine that I used to wish it was! It is NOT for the faint of heart, but if you want GO &/or can resist the temptation enough to access the better fuel economy that can come with it, then I believe Jase is your man! Or at least his tune is!

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Peter , now that you can go BLOODY MUCH faster , what you need is something that will give you a lot more Stability in the Handling Dept..... So PM me your address and I will send you a set of front shock adjusters ( I designed ) for your 13 RT that will BLOW YOUR MIND ..... it changes the way the Spyder handles in ways that have not been believed possible.... and info was learned from an Ohlins shock engineer .... Angle change 16% ..... firmness ( not stiffness ) 20 to 22% ........Lenny @ Pitbull did something similar a few years ago - His moved the top shock mount ....7/8ths on an inch ....... Mine are ...2 1/2 inches .....Peter these are Game Changers and for you - FREE ........PM me ...... Mike

[Peter Aawen]

Just sent that PM Mike!

[torquehound]

Print flash form, send with ecu.

https://monsterfuelinjection.com/spyder/

Just watched the RT video. Wow. I would love to feel this on my F3! My wife and I have a pair of 2016s. Hers an RT mine an F3. The power difference is so noticeable between the two already. I can only imagine how much better it would be after.

[Peteoz]

I'm just over a full weeks ryding into a re-flash done by Jase at ECU Xtreme (rotaxracing@gmail.com) and I'm STOKED!!

Even so, I don't believe this tune is a great idea for someone still coming to terms with ryding a Spyder at all, let alone yet to enjoy ryding 'spiritedly' & closer to the limits; nor for that matter do I believe it is a great idea for anyone still learning to ride anything with waaay better than 'normal street' performance levels - this particular ECU Upgrade comes on strong from the word Go & has made my Spyder the performance machine that I used to wish it was! It is NOT for the faint of heart, but if you want GO &/or can resist the temptation enough to access the better fuel economy that can come with it, then I believe Jase is your man! Or at least his tune is!

But you don’t have to have the tune you got, do you, Peter? Someone who rides sensibly (unlike you ) who just wants a bit more get up and go and quicker throttle response and fuel economy can get a tune along those lines from Jase?

Pete

[Peter Aawen]

But you don’t have to have the tune you got, do you, Peter? Someone who rides sensibly (unlike you ) who just wants a bit more get up and go and quicker throttle response and fuel economy can get a tune along those lines from Jase?

Pete

I reckon Jase could well do that Pete, & if you feel you are close enough to the Gold Coast to make it worth your while to make the trip, he can probably do yours via the UBD Port too (not that your ECU would be at all difficult to get out.... unlike the boxed in 2013 RT ECU!)

[Peteoz]

I reckon Jase could well do that Pete, & if you feel you are close enough to the Gold Coast to make it worth your while to make the trip, he can probably do yours via the UBD Port too (not that your ECU would be at all difficult to get out.... unlike the boxed in 2013 RT ECU!)

Might be a good excuse for a bit of a road trip, Peter. It’s only 500km away......no.....wait... I’d HAVE to go via the Oxley Hwy and Armidale.....better make that 800kn

Pete

[Peter Aawen]

Sounds good... Easy ryde over, do the upgrade, ryde a little locally to get the feel of it & let the computer learn it's new parameters, then an easy ryde home!

Couldn't be a better way of doing it even if you'd designed it that way!

[duncan]

So which is best jase or monster fi

[nwrider]

This thread has been about the 1300 ACE motor, but I'd like to find out more about an ECM flash for the Bosch unit in the Rotax Twin. I've tried a number of searches without really getting any specific information similar to what's available for the ACE motor. I'd like to see some responses from others that have had their twin ECM flashed by either or both Jase and Monster FI. I have a 2013 ST-S SE FWIW.

[k7xi]

You can see Peter in Australia has a 2013 RT-L, which is a 998 twin.

[nealperkins]

So, I am finally about to order the ECU flash as I've procrastinated as long as I can...And, I see some additional commentary that spawns these questions.

I have a cat delete which I removed because it was interfering with my hearing my music (I still have it.) Question: How much of the potential power do I lose by not having the cat delete installed. (Let me note that the low end is more important to me than the very top end.)

And, how much potential power increase is sacrificed if I select the 91 octane option vs. the standard 93?? It annoys me to pay the $ premium to select that top grade. But, I'll certainly continue to do it if it is substantially worth it.

Thanks

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

So, I am finally about to order the ECU flash as I've procrastinated as long as I can...And, I see some additional commentary that spawns these questions.

I have a cat delete which I removed because it was interfering with my hearing my music (I still have it.) Question: How much of the potential power do I lose by not having the cat delete installed. (Let me note that the low end is more important to me than the very top end.)

And, how much potential power increase is sacrificed if I select the 91 octane option vs. the standard 93?? It annoys me to pay the $ premium to select that top grade. But, I'll certainly continue to do it if it is substantially worth it.

Thanks

I don't have one YET !!!, however I have read every post/thread about it ..... Depending on which Flash you use ( Monster or Jase in Australia ) ..... they can / will tailor the Flash based on your set-up .... I don't think 93 oct. was ever the requirement because it's not always available ....I think it was 91 oct. as the base amount ..... the folks who do your flash need to know exactly what your engine /trans/sprocket tec. are so they get the best possible results for you,.I'm sure you can even request 89 as your normal fuel ( but then less improvement ) . I would strongly suggest TALKING with the folks who are doing them , rather then getting opinions here ....... JMHO .... Mike

[Dennis in Lodi]

So, I am finally about to order the ECU flash as I've procrastinated as long as I can...And, I see some additional commentary that spawns these questions.

I have a cat delete which I removed because it was interfering with my hearing my music (I still have it.) Question: How much of the potential power do I lose by not having the cat delete installed. (Let me note that the low end is more important to me than the very top end.)

And, how much potential power increase is sacrificed if I select the 91 octane option vs. the standard 93?? It annoys me to pay the $ premium to select that top grade. But, I'll certainly continue to do it if it is substantially worth it.

Thanks

I have tested three different cat deletes and ALL LOOSE POWER . Starting power and low end suffer. I challenge ANYONE to show me proof that a cat delete gains any usable power. With close to 10,000 testing miles on two different bikes, I am a BIG fan of leaving the original cat in place.
The flashed ECU still uses the closed loop fueling parameters. I did not find any performance advantage using premium gas vs fresh 87 octane. Nor did I detect any ping. But, given the value of these machines, pure premium gas is what I use.
I sent you a pm with more info. here is some info on a different post.

I put on some Elka Shocks and installed the flashed ECU. Holy Crap what a transformation of speed and control.
Went to the test track and put up the following numbers today.
Stock 2016 F3L with the 89 tooth sprocket 102 mph: Flashed F3L 116 mph = 14 mph gain
last summer the RT did this.
Stock RT 89 mph: flashed RT 102 mph + 13 mph gain over stock; Summer time testing

Braking conditions sucked today and I had to pull up early on the flashed F3L. The Elka shocks inspired my confidence to safely test today under poor track conditions. As with the RT flash there is a huge USABLE power surge starting at 4000 rpm that really picks up at 5000 rpm and throws me back in my seat at 6,200 to red line. I have the cat in place with a Spyder1Attitude pipe which is quiet when needed and not too loud when piping it. While rolling along at 15 mph I can easily smoke the rear tire. Of course, I can smoke the rear wheel at will off the line.
What an F3S owner will notice is 3rd and 4th gear will pull to red line just as freely as your 1st and 2nd gear do now. My F3 Limited starts to load up with wind resistance in 5th gear around 7,600?? or 115 mph?? Kind of needed to keep two eyes on the road while in warp drive.

This is not about red line and top end but the USABLE FUN power gains in your real driving rpms. Like Hyperone says and I agree, I rode over 200 test miles today and I rarely found the need or space to shift above 6,200 rpm. I have to dissect the test video but 3rd or 4th gear now pulls from 30 mph to 90 mph really fast. In the real world for both the F3 and RT the need to down shift to get going is a thing of the past.

Baffles me why there isn't more interest in this product vs a $350 USD investment? For me, I'm just giddy and grin from ear to ear every time I open up the new bike. But reality is, I spend most of my miles just tooling around in low rpms. It sure is FUN to have it on tap without down shifting if a situation arises.
Dennis

[nealperkins]

Dennis, as I said in the PM, thanks so much for all the solid info!!