Stabil Blue & Marvel Mistery Oil: Don't laugh!

[TRLBLZR1]

The past 15 years, I've learned firsthand that small engines (like 6.5 hp. Honda engines) that are worked HARD all summer long in extreme heat etc. love a concoction of Marvel Mistery Oil & Stabil Blue (marine.)

30 years ago, my grandfather (engineer) swore by the Marvel Mystery oil additive in an old century inboard boat (nobody believed him. And more recently, my service guy (about a decade ago) suggested I begin adding Sta-bil Blue (marine) to my small engines. (I started adding both years ago in an attempt to get longer life out of small engines used in a commercial environment.) 10 years later I'm astounded by the results. The small engines seem to last 2x as long without valves sticking. (Valves used to sick rendering engines useless long before the clutches and rings wore out.) And also: In they the spring, engines now always startup with a few pulls and carbs are pretty darn clean. ~ No BS or lies here! And I'm not talking about 1 or 2 machines. I'm referring to a "fleet" of (14 lol) commercial go-karts/engines.

As a result, I've become a believer in this cocktail mix I make up almost daily in the summer months. And I'm thinking it might be a good idea for the 1330?
Seeing the results over the past decade: I won't even get fuel for the small engines (go-karts) if I'm out of EITHER Marvel Mystery Oil OR Sta-bil Blue. ~ And I'm feeling guilty I haven't added either to the 1330.

[Tango]

I start using Stabil Marine the last 2-3 tanks of fuel before putting Mushu away for the winter. I also use a Ethanol additive from Lucas every fill up. But I look for non ethanol fuel when possible. Especially near the end of the riding season. Non ethanol stores better, and longer. Tom

[KX5062]

I assume you're making this recommendation for the fuel and not the oil?

[kywinger]

MMO in the oil and fuel. Been using MMO for over 35 years in all my engines, small or large engines.

Sta-Bil Marine is just a more concentrated formula. If you have the Red Sta-Bil just use twice the dose.

MMO and Sta-Bil keeps the carburetor clean of the goo that forms from the junk Petrol that is sold now a days.

Had to replace the head gaskets on my old 1984 GoldWing with over 200k miles. Checked the valves and hardly any carbon build up.

[Easy Rider]

MMO in the oil and fuel. Been using MMO for over 35 years in all my engines, small or large engines.

Sta-Bil Marine is just a more concentrated formula. If you have the Red Sta-Bil just use twice the dose.

Where exactly did you get all of that mis-information ?

MMO is OIL. It is an effective upper cylinder and valve lubricant.
Since it is very LIGHT oil, it also has some limited solvent properties.

The ingredients in MMO are entirely different than either of the Stabil products, which should never be put into your oil.

[Chupaca]

Have used marvel mystery oil on many things and engines too. Don't know about injectors but has gotten me out of several fixes...

[Deer Slayer]

I have used MMO and 100 LL aircraft pogo gas in my air cooled and old tractors for years. Great stuff.

[KX5062]

Whether MM is good or not I won't debate, but I will say that oil additives of any kind should be avoided in a motorcycle wet clutch type of engine because that can lead to clutch problems. Wet clutch plates can be very delicate in terms of oils and additive packages.

As to Stabil, I've read several reports that the standard red Stabil has recently changed their formulation to make the smog sniffers happy, so I doubt it's the same as the Marine product. Many knowledgeable people recommend Star Tron enzyme additive rather than Stabil. I've tried both and can't say one is better than the other, but from the on-line research I've read, it seems that Star Tron is the real deal.

[TRLBLZR1]

Just so everyone is on the same page here: When using Marvel Mystery Oil, I'm referring to using it as a fuel additive, not oil additive.

[BoilerAnimal]

What ratio do you use when mixing this concoction?

[SPYD3R]

YUP, been using MARVEL MYSTERY OIL for the better part of my 70 years... I put 6 oz. in my 5 gal. gas jug... I don't us the BLUE because we have REAL GAS here in South Carolina.... and my dad was using MARVEL for many years prior to passing this little secret onto me... MARVELOUS stuff that MARVEL...
Dan P
SPYD3R

[TRLBLZR1]

What ratio do you use when mixing this concoction?

Can't answer you with any precision. I've been "eye-balling" my "go-kart cocktail" for nearly a decade. Best guess maybe 4 oz. MMO and maybe 2 oz. of the StaBil (blue) to 6 gal. fuel. Real hot days I'm sure I go a little on the heavy side with the Marvel. (I know Sta-Bil specifies less than what I add, but this seems to work well in small Honda 6.5 hp. engines. Extremely well.) Found a few sellers over the years who have sold gallon "4-packs" of Sta-Bil blue for as little as $49 per gallon! (on amazon) But those deals seem to have dried up recently.

Only thing I can say for certain is: Each spring I pull 14+ karts out of "cold" inside storage, let the sun hit them for a few hours and usually they start with just a pull or two. (Of course they then go into a full spring servicing, but the carbs almost never have to be touched.)

[carbonation]

Nothing wrong with MMO in fuel. MMO will keep the fuel pump happy, and injectors lubed up in the presence of ethanol in fuel.
Nothing wrong with Sta-Bil over the winter.
No reason for Sta-Bil if you are going through fuel regularly.
How about this for a try... MMO and Techron.
(Don't ask how I know this is a great combination....)

[WDAVEY]

My concern would be how the combustion products of this combination would affect the catalytic converter? I assume you're adding to the fuel?

[Woodenfish]

I’m not a believer of mechanic in a can products. Today’s gasoline has top grade cleaners in it and across all grades. There is zero need for “fuel stabilizers” or other chemicals to be added to your gasoline tank. Comparing what you did to your 40 year old boat engine and trying to use that to help you in the modern day doesn’t make any sense. Trust the science.

[carbonation]

I’m not a believer of mechanic in a can products. Today’s gasoline has top grade cleaners in it and across all grades. There is zero need for “fuel stabilizers” or other chemicals to be added to your gasoline tank. Comparing what you did to your 40 year old boat engine and trying to use that to help you in the modern day doesn’t make any sense. Trust the science.

Sorry, I disagree, and think you are living in a bubble.
Today's pump swill is a commodity and made up mainly of unstable compounds from cracking heavier stocks and reforming lighter ones. Pump fuel will degrade at 60 days, gets worse going forward, and absorbs water immediately from the air via the ethanol content. Fuel stabilizers are vital unless you go through fuel regularly. MMO can help keep pumps and injectors happy with it's lubricant qualities... helps offset the damage from ethanol. And independent fuel outlets probably only have the bare minimum of cleaners as required by EPA. Phillips66 says they use 3x the additive in every grade, but to get the full monty of additive in almost every other major, you gotta buy the premium swill. BP says 3x in premium, Shell VPower Nitro+ says 7x what EPA requires. The difference across all fuels and brands is literally about a quart of additive in 5000 gallons of fuel in regular grades. Premium grade will almost always get more.
MMO and Techron works pretty well if you use fuel up quick. Sta-Bil is needed for winter storage. And double what the bottle says.
Even better for full time use is Bell Performance Ethanol Defense.

[Jetfixer]

The past 15 years, I've learned firsthand that small engines (like 6.5 hp. Honda engines) that are worked HARD all summer long in extreme heat etc. love a concoction of Marvel Mistery Oil & Stabil Blue (marine.)

30 years ago, my grandfather (engineer) swore by the Marvel Mystery oil additive in an old century inboard boat (nobody believed him. And more recently, my service guy (about a decade ago) suggested I begin adding Sta-bil Blue (marine) to my small engines. (I started adding both years ago in an attempt to get longer life out of small engines used in a commercial environment.) 10 years later I'm astounded by the results. The small engines seem to last 2x as long without valves sticking. (Valves used to sick rendering engines useless long before the clutches and rings wore out.) And also: In they the spring, engines now always startup with a few pulls and carbs are pretty darn clean. ~ No BS or lies here! And I'm not talking about 1 or 2 machines. I'm referring to a "fleet" of (14 lol) commercial go-karts/engines.

As a result, I've become a believer in this cocktail mix I make up almost daily in the summer months. And I'm thinking it might be a good idea for the 1330?
Seeing the results over the past decade: I won't even get fuel for the small engines (go-karts) if I'm out of EITHER Marvel Mystery Oil OR Sta-bil Blue. ~ And I'm feeling guilty I haven't added either to the 1330.

Sorry, but I DO have to laugh. Show me the independent laboratory analysis of the results of this concoction and then maybe I'll believe. There are too many Internet based engineers here that know far more than the people that designed and built these machines. The only acceptable PROOF is a lab analysis of the oil after the recommended interval. BTW, when you send in this oil sample for analysis, also send in a fuel sample with Seafoam in it. Until then, I'll put both in the Snake Oil category.

[Woodenfish]

Sorry, I disagree, and think you are living in a bubble.
Today's pump swill is a commodity and made up mainly of unstable compounds from cracking heavier stocks and reforming lighter ones. Pump fuel will degrade at 60 days, gets worse going forward, and absorbs water immediately from the air via the ethanol content. Fuel stabilizers are vital unless you go through fuel regularly. MMO can help keep pumps and injectors happy with it's lubricant qualities... helps offset the damage from ethanol. And independent fuel outlets probably only have the bare minimum of cleaners as required by EPA. Phillips66 says they use 3x the additive in every grade, but to get the full monty of additive in almost every other major, you gotta buy the premium swill. BP says 3x in premium, Shell VPower Nitro+ says 7x what EPA requires. The difference across all fuels and brands is literally about a quart of additive in 5000 gallons of fuel in regular grades. Premium grade will almost always get more.
MMO and Techron works pretty well if you use fuel up quick. Sta-Bil is needed for winter storage. And double what the bottle says.
Even better for full time use is Bell Performance Ethanol Defense.

My basis for the statement is based upon decades of experience working in the automotive field and information about gasoline supplied by Mobil oil. I have never seen water being immediately drawn into ethanol gasoline that is in a proper gasoline storage can or the fuel tank of a vehicle fitted or not with a gas cap. Nor have I ever witnessed any sealed gasoline storage can or tank have the fuel quality diminish in 60 days. All fuels include the latest cleaners which are demanded by manufacturers and government. Purchase of aftermarket fuel stabilizers have not been proven to aid in extending the fuel life for any amount of time. There are some fuel system cleaners that can help clean the system but in professional use they are not effective to produce what is needed to repair a problem.

I have used specialized fuels and equipment that was able to break the carbonization very quickly and completely. With use of this product we were able to measure the exhaust gas on a 4 gas analyzer in real time before, during and after the service was performed. During the treatment on the special fuel and equipment we were able to reduce hydrocarbon emissions to zero and decarb the engine in a few minutes. No mechanic in a can product could ever do anything close no matter the dosage or attempts.

Finally, you can’t compare the fuel damage endured in small engines by ethanol with fuel-injected vehicles. Everything in a modern vehicle fuel system is protected against ethanol. The last time I saw an automotive engine with carboned up valves so severely it caused drive ability concerns that required partial engine disassembly to remove the valves and physically clean them off of heavy carbon build up was in the late 1980’s.

[larryd]

My basis for the statement is based upon decades of experience working in the automotive field and information about gasoline supplied by Mobil oil. I have never seen water being immediately drawn into ethanol gasoline that is in a proper gasoline storage can or the fuel tank of a vehicle fitted or not with a gas cap. Nor have I ever witnessed any sealed gasoline storage can or tank have the fuel quality diminish in 60 days. All fuels include the latest cleaners which are demanded by manufacturers and government. Purchase of aftermarket fuel stabilizers have not been proven to aid in extending the fuel life for any amount of time. There are some fuel system cleaners that can help clean the system but in professional use they are not effective to produce what is needed to repair a problem.

I have used specialized fuels and equipment that was able to break the carbonization very quickly and completely. With use of this product we were able to measure the exhaust gas on a 4 gas analyzer in real time before, during and after the service was performed. During the treatment on the special fuel and equipment we were able to reduce hydrocarbon emissions to zero and decarb the engine in a few minutes. No mechanic in a can product could ever do anything close no matter the dosage or attempts.

Finally, you can’t compare the fuel damage endured in small engines by ethanol with fuel-injected vehicles. Everything in a modern vehicle fuel system is protected against ethanol. The last time I saw an automotive engine with carboned up valves so severely it caused drive ability concerns that required partial engine disassembly to remove the valves and physically clean them off of heavy carbon build up was in the late 1980’s.

I "THINK" within the last year I read here on the SL forum that there were several owners of 2020 and newer Spyders with the 1330 engines that had valves carboned up so bad that the engines would not start due to lack of compression caused by carbon holding the valves from closing??? "I think" larryd

[Woodenfish]

I "THINK" within the last year I read here on the SL forum that there were several owners of 2020 and newer Spyders with the 1330 engines that had valves carboned up so bad that the engines would not start due to lack of compression caused by carbon holding the valves from closing??? "I think" larryd

Was it “Joel the Biker” when he posted this —> https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/...ht=Engine+blew

I read it then and reread it now. In my opinion what was reported then was inconclusive and not evidence supported. Maybe someone else?

[Mikey]

Was it “Joel the Biker” when he posted this —> https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/...ht=Engine+blew

I read it then and reread it now. In my opinion what was reported then was inconclusive and not evidence supported. Maybe someone else?

You can think what you want, that's the nice part of living where we live, but other people, me included, may have our own opinion on this subject! And my opinion comes from real life happenings of my own in my door yard in REAL life. Yes, I will put a little shot of stabil in my gas can before I fill it up. Why? Because of this great ethanol crap we are getting served, it does help! Gas will start to break down, I've seen it in my chain saw - it would not start one time but was full of gas & I'd cranked the snot out of it; dumped that out & put fresh fuel in it and guess what, first two pulls' it fired and ran like a top! The gas I'd had in it came from a friend who didn't use Stabil, and had been sitting in my tank for a couple months. I too have worked in the tank farms and seen how this SWILL gets served to us and I've seen that everyone's gas comes from the same tanks, but some companies will pump their additives in at the loading dock as it's shot into the trucks for delivery! So, I will get off my soap box and keep on wasting my money for the peace of mind that I get knowing I will not have troubles down the road!!! Have a good day! Oh, P.S this was an old thread from 2017 - a while back!!!

[larryd]

Was it “Joel the Biker” when he posted this —> https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/...ht=Engine+blew

I read it then and reread it now. In my opinion what was reported then was inconclusive and not evidence supported. Maybe someone else?

Yes it was Joel's post I remember reading...His dealer said they had another one with the same problem??? I think I remember reading about another??? WHAT I'D LIKE TO KNOW, IF IT WAS CARBON, HOW DID THEY REMOVE IT WITHOUT DISASSEMBLING THE ENGINE???

PS, And I have a Stihl trimmer that needs the exhaust port cleaned of carbon periodically...I use only Stihl synthetic oil and mix it properly...larryd

[Woodenfish]

The intake manifold can be removed and the engine crankshaft rotated to close the valves on a cylinder. The technician then can use chemicals, solvents, brushes and compressed air to dissolve and clean out the carbon before rotating the engine to do the same for the next cylinder. Again, my above explanation was not for small engines or two stroke engines. I stand by my statement as for modern fuel injected vehicles and will further clarify it to only add “in proper standard operating conditions.”

Your Stihl trimmer oil is the problem and not running the engine at a constant wide open throttle. There have been many reports of landscapers having this issue using the Stihl brand of oil. If I recall right they either switched brands of two-cycle oil or used Tru-Fuel’s pre-mixed fuel to resolve the issue. I purchased a new Stihl hedge trimmer and the dealer had me purchase a 6-pack of Stihl oil at the time because if I did I received an extended warranty. I have only used Tru-fuel pre-mix in the trimmer and the Stihl oil I use in the winter for my Toro snowblower and have yet to have any fuel related problems in either machine. I would not risk using the above mentioned process of chemically cleaning carbon in a two-cycle engine for fear of washing out the cylinder walls of oil and the loose hard carbon deposits possibly damaging the cylinder wall.

[Jetfixer]

If you know what a MSDS is, here's what you're putting in your oil...

msds.jpg

[Jetfixer]

And for an interesting read on todays' gas, here's what Popular Mechanics has to say....

https://www.popularmechanics.com/car...0Non%20Openers