New leftover SE6 slipping - i only made it 34 miles

[Slowpoke387]

All loaded up in the trailer. Found a dealer about half an hour away who im hoping i can call in the morning and drop it off to. Website says they do the laser alignments although i know its not going to be the ROLO. Nearest ROLO is about 3 hours out so im going to roll the dice while the dealer has it anyway. If it still pulls to the right i will swap the front tires around just for a test. The trans is the bigger issue now anyway.

[jcthorne]

Be careful with statements like this. I have had two RTs and neither has been out of alignment. I have four friends with RTs and with one exception (self inflicted) none have had alignment issues. I know there was a time when many were screwed up but, probably not "all".

I
can tell you having personally measured many. Less than 1% are correctly aligned from the factory. I have not yet had the pleasure of one coming through my shop. Some of the other laser alignment teams have seen one or two. VERY few.

[PMK]

All loaded up in the trailer. Found a dealer about half an hour away who im hoping i can call in the morning and drop it off to. Website says they do the laser alignments although i know its not going to be the ROLO. Nearest ROLO is about 3 hours out so im going to roll the dice while the dealer has it anyway. If it still pulls to the right i will swap the front tires around just for a test. The trans is the bigger issue now anyway.

Transmission will not be a big deal in my opinion. You mentioned it was a left over you bought, guessing 2015 and they are known to have, and there is published bulletins about the gear position sensor being botched from new. They can either clean out the debris that was left from manufacturing or replace the gear position sensor. Probably best to get it replaced.

While they have the computer hooked up to it, have them verify the centering position for the steering sensor. Not common but sometimes they are off. As mentioned, verify tire pressures are accurate with a good gauge.

As far as laser aligning, was not aware any others except ROLO existed. Regardless, while a nice tool, it still requires a skilled person to understand it and properly align the machine. Not difficult, but takes some understanding.

All the best with it.

[Slowpoke387]

Transmission will not be a big deal in my opinion. You mentioned it was a left over you bought, guessing 2015 and they are known to have, and there is published bulletins about the gear position sensor being botched from new. They can either clean out the debris that was left from manufacturing or replace the gear position sensor. Probably best to get it replaced.

While they have the computer hooked up to it, have them verify the centering position for the steering sensor. Not common but sometimes they are off. As mentioned, verify tire pressures are accurate with a good gauge.

As far as laser aligning, was not aware any others except ROLO existed. Regardless, while a nice tool, it still requires a skilled person to understand it and properly align the machine. Not difficult, but takes some understanding.

All the best with it.

Its a 2016. My main concern is that is was slipping to the point of not being able to move. Also it was slipping before all the lights came on. In my experience (with cars) the lights usually come on if the ecu sees a mechanical condition outside of certain parameters (mechanical issue) or if a sensor is bad. So i guess im wondering if a bad sensor on these can actually cause slipping (in which case wouldnt the light be on first?) or is it seeing the slipping and then tripping the codes.

[Highwayman2013]

Good luck with getting your problems solved. We love our 2016 F3 Limited. A belated welcome as well!

[PMK]

Its a 2016. My main concern is that is was slipping to the point of not being able to move. Also it was slipping before all the lights came on. In my experience (with cars) the lights usually come on if the ecu sees a mechanical condition outside of certain parameters (mechanical issue) or if a sensor is bad. So i guess im wondering if a bad sensor on these can actually cause slipping (in which case wouldnt the light be on first?) or is it seeing the slipping and then tripping the codes.

Suspecting, the computer was seeing two gears at once selected based on the gear position sensor, confused it did not know and threw the light, also, confused the clutch actuator.

No doubt I may be wrong.

If you do a quick search about the problem 2015 units with bad Gearbox sensors, they had all sorts of confused problems.

[irvin48]

went through the gps sensor disaster as soon as we picked ours up last year.
1st time the sensor was installed. the second time they found out it hadnt gotten programmed
correctly. almost 7000 miles of smiles since.--irv

if it hadnt been for reading about the problem here we wouldnt
have known. even the dealer hadnt had one pop up.

[Slowpoke387]

went through the gps sensor disaster as soon as we picked ours up last year.
1st time the sensor was installed. the second time they found out it hadnt gotten programmed
correctly. almost 7000 miles of smiles since.--irv

if it hadnt been for reading about the problem here we wouldnt
have known. even the dealer hadnt had one pop up.

Good to know. No doubt this will be fixed im sure. Was yours actually slipping?

[Slowpoke387]

Suspecting, the computer was seeing two gears at once selected based on the gear position sensor, confused it did not know and threw the light, also, confused the clutch actuator.

No doubt I may be wrong.

If you do a quick search about the problem 2015 units with bad Gearbox sensors, they had all sorts of confused problems.

Yeah ive been thinking maybe its confused about what gear its in but im not sure if that would result in a slipping trans. Maybe so if the clutch actuator was working incorrectly. Im kind of worried about the severe heat that undoubtably resulted from all the slipping. Slipping so badly that after less than a mile it wouldnt move. After a few hours of letting it cool down it moved fwd and rev and i was able to load it into my trailer and drop it off this am. But its clearly confused right now. R and n are flashing, theres a big E reading out on the dash which flashes along with a flashing engine light. As well as another constant engine light lol. These things are loaded with sensors.

[billybovine]

Alternating flashing N & R lights with an E in the gear display means the gear position sensor is bad, disconnected or incorrectly calibrated.
Slipping clutch would cause a "Transmission Failure" message to scroll across the screen.

[PMK]

Others will know for certain, but I believe the clutch clamp and lock up is hydraulically actuated but computer dictated based on engine parameters.

Not sure so much it was slipping as opposed to not knowing to clamp or lock up.

Granted, a wet clutch can be trashed, but it does take a good bit of effort and HP run through it.

If they are replacing clutch plates, demand they soak the new plates in oil before installing. It does make a difference in performance and longevity.

[SteveE]

Welcome to the Spyder world. When I got my Spyder I was coming from a Kawasaki 2000. I had the same issues that you are having. Twitchy, drifts back and forth on the road etc. etc.. Corners that I would take at 50 on the Vulcan, were lilies to no more than 15 mph. 200 miles later, those corners are once again back up to 50 and I have learned the "feel" of the Spyder so unless the cross winds are up, there is no longer any twitch. Stay with it...it gets wonderful.

[Slowpoke387]

So i just talked to the dealer. They said there were obviously numerous codes that tripped one another once the slipping started. What they they cant tell me is why it happened. They cleared the codes and rode it, rode fine. So they called BRP who told them to change the oil and test it after. So they want to change two oil filters to be safe and do the oil change and ride it. I told them i was concerned about any possible internal clutch damage and to ride it 100 miles if they have to once they change the oil. I want it to get nice and hot under a load.
So im wondering if BRP has encountered this before and had a bad batch of oil, or if this is step one of a diagnosis process or ...

[dpetrick]

Good to hear they are making progress. Hope the problem is solved for good and you can enjoy the Spyder.

[SpyderNeil]

So i just talked to the dealer. They said there were obviously numerous codes that tripped one another once the slipping started. What they they cant tell me is why it happened. They cleared the codes and rode it, rode fine. So they called BRP who told them to change the oil and test it after. So they want to change two oil filters to be safe and do the oil change and ride it. I told them i was concerned about any possible internal clutch damage and to ride it 100 miles if they have to once they change the oil. I want it to get nice and hot under a load.
So im wondering if BRP has encountered this before and had a bad batch of oil, or if this is step one of a diagnosis process or ...

I would be worried about clutch disc wear, since you said the clutch was slipping badly. See if you can get some kind of assurance (In Writing) that if you have clutch issues in the future, they won't try to say that it's normal wear and therefore Not covered under warranty.

Neil

[Slowpoke387]

I would be worried about clutch disc wear, since you said the clutch was slipping badly. See if you can get some kind of assurance (In Righting) that if you have clutch issues in the future, they won't try to say that it's normal wear and therefore Not covered under warranty.

Neil

I specifically mentioned this and they said not to worry and that it will all be documented. but of course I'm wondering about premature clutch wear now.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

I would be worried about clutch disc wear, since you said the clutch was slipping badly. See if you can get some kind of assurance (In Righting) that if you have clutch issues in the future, they won't try to say that it's normal wear and therefore Not covered under warranty.

Neil

... Clutch - disks etc. are considered NORMAL wear items and are NOT COVERED in the warranty - so if you have trouble down the road ( especially if you are not at home with your selling / servicing dealer ) you may a real problem getting this fixed under warranty no matter how many papers you have stating it's COVERED BECAUSE yada yada yada ......just sayin ......... Mike

[Slowpoke387]

... Clutch - disks etc. are considered NORMAL wear items and are NOT COVERED in the warranty - so if you have trouble down the road ( especially if you are not at home with your selling / servicing dealer ) you may a real problem getting this fixed under warranty no matter how many papers you have stating it's COVERED BECAUSE yada yada yada ......just sayin ......... Mike

I'm sure you're right but I guess if it goes before the two year warranty is up ill be sure to raise a little hell about it lol. I still don't even know what the problem is yet.

[Slowpoke387]

Dealer just called and said there was a defective (mangled? damaged?) oil filter installed. Apparently there are two filters on these motors? This one was restricting oil flow to the hydraulics that work the clutches causing them to slip. Says they replaced it, changed the oil, and opened a case with BRP so that its documented. When asked about the pulling to the right he said it rides perfect and theres no pulling.
Looks like another chasing my tail to get it riding straight episode. Although i did just buy a spare set of factory Limited wheels/tires from a dealer who had them cheap because they were nicked and couldnt leave them on a new machine. I think ill swap them on and see if it changes.
Picking it up tomorrow and will do a shakedown ride then.

[SteveLaoyster]

Dealer just called and said there was a defective (mangled? damaged?) oil filter installed. Apparently there are two filters on these motors? This one was restricting oil flow to the hydraulics that work the clutches causing them to slip. Says they replaced it, changed the oil, and opened a case with BRP so that its documented. When asked about the pulling to the right he said it rides perfect and theres no pulling.
Looks like another chasing my tail to get it riding straight episode. Although i did just buy a spare set of factory Limited wheels/tires from a dealer who had them cheap because they were nicked and couldnt leave them on a new machine. I think ill swap them on and see if it changes.
Picking it up tomorrow and will do a shakedown ride then.

I would hope that since they found a bad factory part that BRP will cover for a limited time any parts that could have been damaged during your ride. Good luck!

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Dealer just called and said there was a defective (mangled? damaged?) oil filter installed. Apparently there are two filters on these motors? This one was restricting oil flow to the hydraulics that work the clutches causing them to slip. Says they replaced it, changed the oil, and opened a case with BRP so that its documented. When asked about the pulling to the right he said it rides perfect and theres no pulling.
Looks like another chasing my tail to get it riding straight episode. Although i did just buy a spare set of factory Limited wheels/tires from a dealer who had them cheap because they were nicked and couldnt leave them on a new machine. I think ill swap them on and see if it changes.
Picking it up tomorrow and will do a shakedown ride then.

I doubt highly that a DAMAGED oil filter was installed ....... a while back there was a THREAD on a COLLAPSED OIL FILTER ...... end I really can't see how the transmission filter could even collapse at all ...... I t will be interesting to see how the different wheels and tires do . ............... Mike

[Slowpoke387]

I doubt highly that a DAMAGED oil filter was installed ....... a while back there was a THREAD on a COLLAPSED OIL FILTER ...... end I really can't see how the transmission filter could even collapse at all ...... I t will be interesting to see how the different wheels and tires do . ............... Mike

Hmmm youre prob right. How do they collapse?

[irvin48]

any updates to report yet ?

[Slowpoke387]

any updates to report yet ?

Figured while i had it there i would have them install a BRP belt tensioner so we had to wait for it to come in. Got the call yesterday to come pick it up. $88 for parts and labor. Seems fair.
Trailer is hooked up and ill be picking it up sometime today whenever my work schedule allows. Then a good long shakedown ride. I'll post up after that.
Next up will be addressing the pulling to the right that the dealer says is not happening. Why am i not surprised.

[ARtraveler]

We will be waiting for the evaluation ride update.