:popcorn::popcorn: Can't wait to see how his tires balance out!!
:popcorn::popcorn: Can't wait to see how his tires balance out!!
Agree...long thread...windshield. front kendas were supposedly balanced...2 diff dealers ck'd them. These new continentals I have on there that replace the Kendas we're supposedly balanced.
I still really think you need to concentrate on the rear wheel drive system. You haven't answered any of my questions, or have you and I missed your response?Quote:
Originally Posted by bayoumanPIBE
This might be a silly suggestion, but...
If you're going to remove the belt and inspection BOTH pulleys, try reversing the direction of the drive belt?
No it's not a Silly suggestion. Taking a GUESS about something and advising someone else to do it, is not something anyone should do ...JMHO ..... I have a spare BRP belt and it has an ARROW indicating the direction of travel. ( this advice is FACT not a Guess )..... Mike :thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by GrampaEJ
Maybe I missed it, but did this guy get a road force balance on the front tires or just a regular. I’m still a big believer that road force is far superior to regular balance job.
IMHO, most of the issues described at the speeds mentioned sound like wind buffeting to me. But there is also the likelihood of multiple issues happening at the same time. Wind buffeting along with unbalanced or defective tires, some belt vibrations added in...
I would make sure the tires do not have balance beads installed and are clean and dry inside. Then have them re-balanced by a good shop or do them yourselves with a Marc Parnes balancer for the Spyder. It worked great on my bike. Belt vibrations are minor but I can understand that added into the mix of other vibrations it is frustrating. I would also carefully look at the front fairing for cracks or looseness. I added an X-creen wind deflector on my windshields. I tried 4 different windshields and found that they all have buffeting at different speeds depending on the height and characteristics of the shield. The X-creen helps you adjust for that. For example the Blue Ridge windshield is awful at anything over 50mph but with an X-creen on it and adjusted the buffeting went away. Now I'm using a MadStad windshield. I like its adjust-ability but I still found that it was even better with an X-creen on it.
I wish you good luck with solving your problems, you'll get there eventually!
@spyder01 - The wheels were upgraded to PPA's using the stock Kendas during the build-from-crate process. I'm currently on new Continental fronts hoping it was the Kendas causing the issue. Both sets of front tires (Kendas and Continentals) were 'standard' balanced at least 2 times each.
I researched Hunter's road force balancing last year. There are local places (tire shops, car dealerships) who do offer road force balancing...however, none have the setup for this small of a wheel or their insurance liability will not allow them to work on wheel which are not car/trucks. I'm currently trying to look out further around the mid-west for a road force, but life's rather restricting making it harder to keep this scooby doo mystery going at all.
I did swap wheels with a friend who rides stock (but, non Kenda rubber) and the shaking was still there. So, road force balancing might help, might not based off this...still want to try though.
@Yabbadabbadoo - I totally agree about the large # of many variables. My size, weight, height, riding style, wind, shocks...on and on and on...guess I was too much of an overachiever getting aftermarket items added before ever riding it fully stocked. My setup could work perfectly for someone else...there are a few who said they don't feel much out of the ordinary...and they said I was crazy or smoking 'weed'. I am not making this up...very frustrating.
I knew I was going to have to dial this bike in to fit me, but crap...wish I'd kept the stock items (instead trading them for labor costs) so I can put them all back on...make sure it's working, and then start adding the aftermarket items 1 at a time. I asked the orig dealer to do this, but did not happen. I asked the local dealer; won't happen. BRP will not enforce with any dealership as well. I was told by BRP they won't go any further or enforce the dealer to go further due to the amount of aftermarket parts even though I (myself) did not build the bike or add the aftermarket parts on the thing.
I've been doing what the dealer and BRP should have done.
I'll see how the wheel checks out this week and go from there...hate it the thread is so long...just reinforces how messed up this all is and how wordy I am. I'll try to update ya'll again.
Thanks for the luck wishes...my finances, time and sanity are not going to allow me to do this much longer which sucks because riding helps the sanity.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Aawen
Given everything you've been through/tried/had done to this & what you've told us so far, altho it has been mentioned earlier, I'm now beginning to think even more than before that there's a good chance that the real cause of all this shaking since the very beginning has been a dodgy rear tire!?! :dontknow:Quote:
Originally Posted by IdahoMtnSpyder
The rear tire seems to be pretty much the only thing that hasn't been addressed in some way/to some degree, and you wouldn't be alone if you now discovered that simply changing the rear tire for a good quality a/mkt car tire in a suitable size (saaay 205/60 or 65??) and then running it at 16-18 psi didn't resolve the shaking you've been experiencing.... More than just a few frustrated Spyder Owners have eventually found their dodgy OE spec Kenda REAR tire to be the cause of all sorts of elusive shaking & vibration issues initially thought to be front tires, or dodgy bearings, ball joints, etc, etc! :banghead:
Has ANYONE ever seriously looked at the rear tire &/or wheel assembly?? :dontknow: Has anyone ever checked the rear wheel &/or tire for run-out & roundness? How much total balancing weight is there on the rim? Where is that weight located? Does the tire have even tread wear both across the face & around the wheel? Is there any scalloping or any flat spots evident on the tread? How worn over-all is the tread? And the list goes on..... and on..... :p .
At this stage of your saga, checking this sorta stuff has gotta be at least worth a shot; and even if you don't feel inclined to replace the OE Kenda with a proper car tire (it IS still a Kenda, isn't it?? :dontknow: ) at least give it a thorough inspection, preferably off the rim - it might be very enlightening! :rolleyes: And as others have discovered, it might even finally resolve your elusive shaking &/or steering issues too! Good Luck! :cheers:
:agree: .... part of the problem is the amount of info the OP has put on this Thread .... remembering what has and hasn't been tried plus what can be eliminated gives me a headache ..... Knowing what you and I and others about the Crapenda's it's hard to eliminate itQuote:
Originally Posted by Peter Aawen
/ them as the cause ..... JMHO ./... Mike :thumbup:
Agree Mike...it's a lot. I'd rather be sharing vacations or helping other ryders. I appreciate ya'll reading and keeping up...weird journey for the bike alone on top of personal life. I'm trying to use less words to make it smoother.
No, Peter...no one has blinked at the rear. I have an appt for tomorrow morning for the local dealer to take it off and scour it, the tire, etc. as detailed as possible. I'm not against any idea, if I can do it myself and/or afford it...been doing that up to this point.
So, if the rear wheel balances and the rubber is fine and they can't find anything...just as what happened with the fronts (Kendas), what then...mark the rear off the list of possibilities? I'm not against buying another tire...but, I already hate I spent more money for front rubber when I didn't have to...was planning on replacing all Kendas after a while of riding on them...since I already spent so much money on the bike and aftermarket items.
If the REAR tire is checked for BALANCE ....IMHO it Must be done on a high speed SPIN balancer .... Road Force would be nice , but not necessary ..... all the BEST .... Mike :thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by bayoumanPIBE
I'm not at all convinced that too many Spyder dealers will have the knowledge let alone the skills & experience to truly inspect any tire for anything more than obvious & superficial defects/failures.... :rolleyes: and if no-one's jumped up & down about it already, then any issue with the rear tire isn't all that likely to be obvious &/or superficial! :banghead:Quote:
Originally Posted by bayoumanPIBE
Whoever does it, they'll need to check for run-out & roundness BEFORE removing the wheel assy from the Spyder, and if they don't find any issues there, check it for balance & any associated 'on the rim' issues before stripping the tire and carefully inspecting it inside & out for any defects in construction &/or damage - and that will take a knowledgeable AND skilled & experienced tire technician, not just a mechanic or tech who's mounted a few tires, or even a couple of hundred tires - it's a whole 'nuther world of training & 'honed thru practice on-the-job' skills !! And finding a tire tech with that level of training & on-the-job skills might not be all that easy - they just don't train 'em these days like they used to! :lecturef_smilie:
That's why most people just bite the bullet at the 'checked everything else except the physical condition of the tires' stage & just swap them out - it's generally easier & often cheaper than finding an appropriately trained & skilled tire tech.... which probably should answer the questions in the last para I quoted above. But maybe you might be comforted by the fact that you aren't alone in this - there are a number of threads on the Forum, albeit many of them older now, where people have chased similar shakes/vibrations &/or handling & ride issues, altho some just change out all the tires early on & most of those seem to have no further issues; while others continue in much the same way you have, expending quite a bit of money in the process, only to end up (finally... ) changing out ALL the tires to something (anything! :p ) other than Kendas - and for pretty much all of those, miraculously, the 'untraceable' shakes/vibrations disappear with the last of their Kendas! :ohyea:
Now I'm not saying this is a sure thing for you, but I really don't recall anyone else having this sort of 'untraceable' shake/vibration issue that's eventually been driven to changing out all the tires as a last resort because every other option has been exhausted who has continued to have said issues.... :rolleyes: Generally, the result is something along the lines of 'Why didn't I just do this FIRST?!?'... :gaah:
And really, since you were going to swap out the Kendas eventually anyway, why not do it now on the chance that it WILL resolve those shakes?? At the very least you'll then KNOW that it's not the tires, and the list of potential causes will have been reduced by one item that's proven to be the cause of similar shakes in numerous instances.... :dontknow: But hopefully, like in so many of those other instances, it'll resolve your issues too?!? :thumbup:
Here's hoping! :cheers:
:agree: ........I see you have a 21 F-3 .... it's still under warranty ... If that rear Kenda is defective it Should re-placed under warranty ..... good luck .... Mike :thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Aawen
Update: She rides really smooth now. But, she can be better. Thus far, it's like a washing machine that's back on balance, and now needs a wedge under a leg...was shaking that bad.
The fix: @Peter Aawen - The rear wheel was out of balance. The local dealership said there was 6.25oz of weight on it. They could not get it balanced with or without the weights. They flipped / 180'd the tire on the rim, balanced it twice getting the weight down to 2.75oz. They said anything over 3oz is not good (idk if it's true).
They could not test drive due to the snow, but I could and did...as well as yesterday all day in high winds. I still can't get over the fact of how much smoother she is... I test rode leaving the belt tensioner raised...rode smooth, but she had a bit of that emphasis grinding sound and vibrations under me. Then lowered the tensioner back on the belt...as expected, it eliminated the grinding sound / vibration.
So, almost to the point of where I should've started day 1. The dealer balanced it out, but there's still some shaking. So, I'm getting a new rear to replace the already factory new rubber like the fronts.
All I can find are these Kumho Ecsta AST 225/50R15. I rode on this for a while on my ST-S...tread wore faster than the Kendas though...so, looking for another brand. This size is hard to find.
I'm not gone, but just need to say ya'll are wonderful and much appreciated...going out of ya'lls way to read this long unnecessary legacy tale while being virtual mechanics respectfully suggesting possible tests and fixes. Thank you friends...look forward to future SpyderLovers comms and rydes with all I get the pleasure to meet.
That's right. The OEM size pretty much does not exist in any tire brand other than Kenda and Kumho. Don't get hung up on looking for an OEM size. There is NO benefit to sticking with it. Look for a 215/60R15. That size fits quite nicely, and will bring the speedo closer to actual speed. As you have undoubtedly read here the General Altimax and Vredestein Quatrac are quite popular. I'm running a Cooper CS5 Grand Touring. It's been working good. As far as changing sizes my local tire dealer says there is no issue going up or down one width size, and seldom any problem going two sizes up or down. But don't go three sizes. That's when you risk the tire to rim fit.Quote:
Originally Posted by bayoumanPIBE
Hahaha…..I read the thread heading, and thought I’d get some belt tension tips……and it has turned into a tyre thread:roflblack:
Those tyre threads manage to pop up everywhere. :dontknow:
Pete
@Peteoz - sorry about the title...this thread did go around the world. I cannot find a way to edit it...if someone knows, please let me know.
The subject line did make sense in the beginning as that was the rabbit you thought you were chasing! Use the contact button at the bottom of the page to ask the admin to change the title.Quote:
Originally Posted by bayoumanPIBE
Some members have had success using these to help balance their tires, https://www.lamonstergarage.com/cent...ster-approved/
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peteoz
Just added to the thread title... ;) Does the amended title (see below) work for you now?? :dontknow:Quote:
Originally Posted by bayoumanPIBE
Why does lowering the belt tension help shaking? Now on to Tires!
Got my rear tire mounted/balanced last week. Weather and life has prevented thorough test riding. There's not much of a difference...still shakes, but not near as bad as the almost entire 1st year of owning. The tread on the not-old former rear Kenda was worn pretty bad as well...fyi.
There's nothing more I 'personally' can do other than tweak the shocks, tire pressures and belt tension. If I can find anyone with a road force balancer within a reasonable distance who has the parts (cone, etc.) for balancing, I'll do that...
For now, I'm enjoying the ryde even though it's not what I paid for...just wanted to update all.
cya.
Thanks for updating the header!Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Aawen
You use the term " Shaking " .... to me this is way more serious than " vibes " ..... you have issues that can't :thumbup:be fixed from a computer keyboard .... I hope you can get it solved , .... good luck .... MikeQuote:
Originally Posted by bayoumanPIBE
Wasn't aware of the direction of travel ARROW. Is his installed properly?Quote:
Originally Posted by BLUEKNIGHT911
****************************
Hey, PIBE, after revisiting this thread, I noticed your video of the 'noise'. If you still have some vibrations, after changing the rear tire, I would investigate the front rotors. It sounds like the brake rotor(s) may be warped. HTH