Batteries are Good ... Until They're Not

My husband has always used the title phrase. WELLLL ... I got bit by just that very phrase this morning. Did my normal pre-ride checks (tires, turn signals, brake lights, belt, a walk around, etc.) with the F3 still on the tender. Then unplugged about 30 minutes before we were to take off this morning. This is a 2018 F3 Ltd with the original battery .. so, almost four years old. Gear up, turn key, push mode and all is good ... UNTIL, I hit the start button, then everything went dark. What!? So, plan B ... hop on the 2016 RT and off we go. Once we were home, checked the battery and a static test (no load) showed 12.5 volts ... still dead when the key is turned. So, hubby had me take the battery out and he load tested it ... dropped below 10 volts and he also observed a possible hairline crack in the top case. HMMMM ... so, I have checked all the fuses and all test good (continuity). I'm thinking that the battery just doesn't have enough left to open the necessary relays to show anything on the console. But, to be honest, I am troubled that nothing was seen at all (not even some of the odd, crazy, displays that have come up here).

Could I have a bad relay? Is there any way to test the relays (there are several in both fuse boxes, as you well know).

New battery on order from Lamonster Garage .... but in the meantime, I sure would like to feel more certain that the battery is my only problem. Anyone have some sage advice on how to troubleshoot and make sure I've not got something else wrong?

Thanks .... Ann

I've had the same situation and it was the battery. I was tempted to troubleshoot it but the new battery arrived quickly, I popped it in and voila ... fired right up. This was a 2 year old Yuasa, but for some reason it just died.

Batteries die just like people do. Some go slowly and slow down with age. Some expire with no obvious warnings. I have experienced both (with batteries that is). For some unknown reason we tend to "overthink" bad batteries and look for other potential problems. "(My battery can't be bad because it's only X years old and it was fine the last time I rode the bike)"..... Jim

If we had a volt or amp gauge in place of those screwy temp and fuel gauges, when we turn on the key it would show us that there's a problem if we had a low battery. These spyders take a lot of juice when you first turn the key and before you hit start.

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Originally Posted by Spyder_Cowgirl

....... HMMMM ... so, I have checked all the fuses and all test good (continuity). I'm thinking that the battery just doesn't have enough left to open the necessary relays to show anything on the console. But, to be honest, I am troubled that nothing was seen at all (not even some of the odd, crazy, displays that have come up here).

Could I have a bad relay? Is there any way to test the relays (there are several in both fuse boxes, as you well know).

New battery on order from Lamonster Garage .... but in the meantime, I sure would like to feel more certain that the battery is my only problem. Anyone have some sage advice on how to troubleshoot and make sure I've not got something else wrong?

Thanks .... Ann

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It's most likely gonna be just the battery, but regardless, the very first thing you'd need to do before being able to check for anything else or troubleshoot beyond what you've already done is to replace the battery with a 'known good' battery! :thumbup: . So you're well on the way towards troubleshooting for anything else already! :ohyea:

The next step to troubleshoot for anything else is this - once you get your new battery and BEFORE you install it, check it's voltage (altho if it comes from them without needing to add anything, then I'm pretty sure Lamonster Garage will have likely done this already. ;) ) and if it shows voltage of anything much less than 13.5 or so, put it on a charger for at least a few hours, and not just on a tender - but a battery 'charger/maintainer' should work! Then, and only THEN, once you know it's been properly charged before its first use (& should have 13+ volts showing ;) ) you can install it. :yes:

And funnily enough, after installing it, the next step in troubleshooting is to try starting it - only put your multi-meter across the battery terminals & watch how low the voltage drops as it cranks over. Normally, anything less than about 10.6 volts while cranking means the battery isn't in good nick, but with our power hungry Spyders, I've found that if your battery drops much below 12 volts (a little lower is OK, but not much! :lecturef_smilie: ) then you are at a high risk of having further battery related problems! And if everything starts fine & there are no dodgy warnings or lights on the dash, check the voltage going into the battery as the engine idles (should be 12.5+ volts ;) ) and then check again with the engine running at 2600 revs or more, where the voltage displayed should get up over about 13.6 volts, possibly even just a bit over 14 volts, but not as high as 15 volts! :sour: ) If all that pans out & your Spyder's running fine, the alternator is charging fine, you can check all the fuses & relays for proper operation again if you want to take the time, but if there was nothing else obviously wrong before you did all this, there's really nothing more to troubleshoot, you're good to go!
Just go Ryde more & Worry Less! :thumbup:

Over to you! Good Luck! :cheers:

New batteries seem to do better with a good overnight charging before installation. Out in open on some cardboard or papers if happen to leak.
In meantime take a wire brush & get to cleaning the terminals on bike:popcorn:find some star washers for when ready to install. :2thumbs:

I would not waste another minute on testing anything, just wait for the battery and everything will back to normal!!

my battery lasted about 3 months after i brought my new F3 home from dealer last yr. they warrenty it, gave me a new one, all good since..

10 volts under load and probably drops more. Change the battery as suggested.

Batteries Plus has Spyder Batteries too.

In fact my battery is in its 9th season. Still starts up.

May pop a new one in soon myself.

I took a short ride and stopped at friends house. Went to start-nothing. Dead battery. Replaced, good to go. BTW, I took my temp and gas guage out and installed a volt meter on the ride side and a blank off on the left. I like the digital gauges better.

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Originally Posted by Spyder_Cowgirl

My husband has always used the title phrase. WELLLL ... I got bit by just that very phrase this morning. Did my normal pre-ride checks (tires, turn signals, brake lights, belt, a walk around, etc.) with the F3 still on the tender. Then unplugged about 30 minutes before we were to take off this morning. This is a 2018 F3 Ltd with the original battery .. so, almost four years old. Gear up, turn key, push mode and all is good ... UNTIL, I hit the start button, then everything went dark. What!? So, plan B ... hop on the 2016 RT and off we go. Once we were home, checked the battery and a static test (no load) showed 12.5 volts ... still dead when the key is turned. So, hubby had me take the battery out and he load tested it ... dropped below 10 volts and he also observed a possible hairline crack in the top case. HMMMM ... so, I have checked all the fuses and all test good (continuity). I'm thinking that the battery just doesn't have enough left to open the necessary relays to show anything on the console. But, to be honest, I am troubled that nothing was seen at all (not even some of the odd, crazy, displays that have come up here).

Could I have a bad relay? Is there any way to test the relays (there are several in both fuse boxes, as you well know).

New battery on order from Lamonster Garage .... but in the meantime, I sure would like to feel more certain that the battery is my only problem. Anyone have some sage advice on how to troubleshoot and make sure I've not got something else wrong?

Thanks .... Ann

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If your battery is testing 12.5 volts, that should spin the motor over at least some. But on the other hand, if it has a hairline crack by all means get rid of it. For those who don't know, a battery must be able to put out at least 12.1 volts for it to spin the starter on a 12 volt system. If a new battery doesn't activate the starter, then tests are required. Start at the starter button and work your way through. There are a number of reasons for a no-start on a Spyder including several lockout and safety circuits.

Batteries usually die at the most in-opportune time. Think of "Murphy's Law."

I have read many posts of batteries lasting over five years...but when they go...you know it is not going to be nice or convenient. I replace mine every four years whether they need it or not. Never had one leave me stranded in the middle of nowhere. And I lived there for 18 years. (Alaska).

Only folks who own a certified and verified " Crystal ball ", should try and answer this question. The timeline on this is very,very wide. ..... that's why when my OEM 2014 Battery started getting Old I bought a Lithium battery starter ..... I never had to use it for myself , but I did jump a few other Spyders .... I often hear of folks trashing their batteries because they " think it is about to fail ", it's possible, however it could last another FIVE years or more .... JMHO .... Mike :thumbup:

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Originally Posted by ARtraveler

Batteries usually die at the most in-opportune time. Think of "Murphy's Law."

I have read many posts of batteries lasting over five years...but when they go...you know it is not going to be nice or convenient. I replace mine every four years whether they need it or not. Never had one leave me stranded in the middle of nowhere. And I lived there for 18 years. (Alaska).

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Yup ... This " I replace mine every four years whether they need it or not."

Don't guess. Know

https://optimate1.com/product/optima...ng-alternator/

I have a 2017 F3 Limited with original battery still in it. But no telling what the true age of the battery is. So I went ahead and ordered a new Yuasa battery just to be on the safe side. Should be here sometime this week.

Through Amazon, or an auto parts store??

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Originally Posted by Spyderman2018

Through Amazon, or an auto parts store??

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I bought mine online at Ebay.

I always buy a quality AGM battery that you have to add the acid and then do an initial charge. Who knows how long the ones with the acid installed have been sitting on the shelf.

Below 10.5 (some will state 10.0) on a fully charged battery is an indication of a bad cell.
AGM batteries are 2.13 volts per cell (12.8 for 6 cells)
12.8 - 2.13 = 10.67 maximum volts with a dead cell

4 years is a good life in hotter climates.

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Originally Posted by Tourer

I always buy a quality AGM battery that you have to add the acid and then do an initial charge. Who knows how long the ones with the acid installed have been sitting on the shelf.

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They usually have a sticker for month/year of manufacture.

If you can find a factory vacuum filled AGM, as Dekka did for H-D, they have a longer life than atmospheric filled...the plates absorb more.

The problem is determining which are vacuum filled.

When not in use for a long period I keep my battery on a maintainer. Yesterday, 5 days before leaving on an extended tour, I unplugged the maintainer. Today I started the bike and let it run for an extended period. On Thursday, the day before I leave for my trip, I will start the bike again to make sure the battery is up to snuff. The reason I do this is because the maintainer can produce a false sense of security. The bike may start well when unplugging the maintainer just before a trip. But actually be done for, and not give any indication until the next day. This happened to me several years ago. Unplugged the maintainer and rode off for a trip. 300+ miles later stopped at a motel. Next morning I had zero battery. No light, no click, nothing. It was if the battery had been removed from the bike. Bike towed to a dealer who replaced battery, checked charging system and sent me on my way with no further problems..... Jim

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Originally Posted by troop

Yup ... This " I replace mine every four years whether they need it or not."

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And an AGM seems to give less (or no) warning compared to a wet lead-acid.

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Originally Posted by canamjhb

When not in use for a long period I keep my battery on a maintainer. Yesterday, 5 days before leaving on an extended tour, I unplugged the maintainer. Today I started the bike and let it run for an extended period. On Thursday, the day before I leave for my trip, I will start the bike again to make sure the battery is up to snuff. The reason I do this is because the maintainer can produce a false sense of security. The bike may start well when unplugging the maintainer just before a trip. But actually be done for, and not give any indication until the next day. This happened to me several years ago. Unplugged the maintainer and rode off for a trip. 300+ miles later stopped at a motel. Next morning I had zero battery. No light, no click, nothing. It was if the battery had been removed from the bike. Bike towed to a dealer who replaced battery, checked charging system and sent me on my way with no further problems..... Jim

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Yes, it is exactly that “constant maintainer plug-in” scenario that caught me out on an overnight trip, Jim.
Fortunately, we were only 20km out of town and I was able to start the F3 with Lamont’s jump pack, and there was a motorcycle shop in town that had the correct replacement battery. Otherwise it would have been a REAL inconvenience as there was no phone reception. I now constantly preach about the “gotcha” of plugging in the maintainer every time you pull into the garage.:thumbup:

Pete

I put a Might Max in mine back in late 2020 and its holding up fine for what I paid...$67. Looks like this one but did not buy from Ebay ...I think it was a Walmart vendor:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/13378079293...c6c3508320bd09