Looking for 'increased load' shock suggestions - 2023 F3-S

I searched and read a ton of threads regarding replacing shocks. Most threads I found are based around racing, riding through twisty roads, and even some scary info about shocks that have failed as well as arguments made by some regarding how some company's products raise ride height and how this negatively impacts alignment or handling. All points to consider, but I cannot find information specific to use based on load or weight.

So here is my situation. I don't race and I don't drive like "Martin the Vlogger" :D but what I do have to contend with is weight. I'm a big boy weighing in around 280lbs with gear on. I likely will ride 95% solo, and commute to work with the occasional weekend trip (under 30 miles) with the wife who comes in around 150lbs with gear. With a weight range of about 280-430lbs I’m concerned with bottoming out the rear over bumps, especially when riding two up.

Being my first Spyder, I have no comparison on what a bad ride is vs a good one. I would like easy adjustability with minimal tools that can be adjustable on the fly for the occasional two up ride. I'm not interested in sway bars or links. I’m not opposed to swapping springs if there are viable options.

I’ve looked at the usual suspects as an upgrade:

• Elka
• M2
• Race Tech
• Ikon
• Fox
• Wilbers
• BRP Occasional Two Up shock

The forum would have me believe the stock shocks are crap, (I have KYB on the front and SACHS on the rear). So, given the criteria above, does anything stick out as the best bang for the buck?

Here’s some info to kick you off, Broderp.

One you can eliminate from further consideration is the BRP occasional two up. I had that shock on my ‘16 F3-L, and it just didn’t do the job. (I’m 30lbs heavier than you).

Ikon only show a rear for the F3, so I don’t know if they make fronts, so check with your US supplier. They may simply not have updated their product list yet. They are a good shock, well made, but are pretty cheap as they only have 3 position adjustability, unlike the others mentioned, which have significant adjustability, hence their higher price. Mind you, I have never found a need to adjust the setting once I found position 2 suits me. (I also never adjusted my Wilbers once I was happy with them).

Pete

I had a Wilber 640 HPA shock on the back of my F3S. It would be convenient for you to get a hydraulic preload rear shock. And yes, Elka does make both front/rear shocks for the F3S. I am a fan of Wilbers, but they will take (8) weeks to get. They are not only sprung to your spec's, but also valved to your specs. About $1200. Ted Porter Beemer USA is a USA vendor. Good guy.

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Originally Posted by Peteoz

Here’s some info to kick you off, Broderp.

One you can eliminate from further consideration is the BRP occasional two up. I had that shock on my ‘16 F3-L, and it just didn’t do the job. (I’m 30lbs heavier than you).

Ikon only show a rear for the F3, so I don’t know if they make fronts, so check with your US supplier. They may simply not have updated their product list yet. They are a good shock, well made, but are pretty cheap as they only have 3 position adjustability, unlike the others mentioned, which have significant adjustability, hence their higher price. Mind you, I have never found a need to adjust the setting once I found position 2 suits me. (I also never adjusted my Wilbers once I was happy with them).

Pete

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I agree, I'll likely need to brush up suspension adjustments, what they do and decide what I really need. Once I'm 'dialed in' I'd only want to make minimal adjustments when I go two up. I'm thinking preload and dampening would be all I need, but will need to dig deeper. I'm not sure if just the rear will suffice or if a full set would be beneficial. Thanks for the information!

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Originally Posted by troop

I had a Wilber 630 HPA shock on the back of my F3S. It would be convenient for you to get a hydraulic preload rear shock. And yes, Elka does make both front/rear shocks for the F3S. I am a fan of Wilbers, but they will take (8) weeks to get. They are not only sprung to your spec's, but also valved to your specs. About $1200. Ted Porter Beemer USA is a USA vendor. Good guy.

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Thanks for this information. I get information overload when looking at Elka's website, and very little on Wilbers.. lol I agree the hydraulic preload would be very much in line with what I would want in terms of simple to adjust. Does the 630 HPA have dampening adjustment?

EDIT found this on Wilbers site.... 3K for the set of 3 with hydraulic preload. :shocked:
https://www.wilbers.de/shop/en/Motor...ur=3&year=2023

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Originally Posted by broderp

I agree, I'll likely need to brush up suspension adjustments, what they do and decide what I really need. Once I'm 'dialed in' I'd only want to make minimal adjustments when I go two up. I'm thinking preload and dampening would be all I need, but will need to dig deeper. I'm not sure if just the rear will suffice or if a full set would be beneficial. Thanks for the information!



Thanks for this information. I get information overload when looking at Elka's website, and very little on Wilbers.. lol I agree the hydraulic preload would be very much in line with what I would want in terms of simple to adjust. Does the 630 HPA have dampening adjustment?

EDIT found this on Wilbers site....
https://www.wilbers.de/shop/en/Motor...ur=3&year=2023

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If you want some free info look at the accelerated technologies site: they have several videos explaining how they set up the different rides based on a number of factors. None specific to the Spyder.

I asked them via email if they have a spring package for the front of my 22 F3S but haven't heard back yet. I think a new front spring package if available with dual rate springs would be all I need for now; if not I may consider an Elka stage 3 which is pricey even in Canadian dollars.

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Originally Posted by broderp

I agree, I'll likely need to brush up suspension adjustments, what they do and decide what I really need. Once I'm 'dialed in' I'd only want to make minimal adjustments when I go two up. I'm thinking preload and dampening would be all I need, but will need to dig deeper. I'm not sure if just the rear will suffice or if a full set would be beneficial. Thanks for the information!



Thanks for this information. I get information overload when looking at Elka's website, and very little on Wilbers.. lol I agree the hydraulic preload would be very much in line with what I would want in terms of simple to adjust. Does the 630 HPA have dampening adjustment?

EDIT found this on Wilbers site.... 3K for the set of 3 with hydraulic preload. :shocked:
https://www.wilbers.de/shop/en/Motor...ur=3&year=2023

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https://www.beemershop.com/?gad_sour...hoCtREQAvD_BwE

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Originally Posted by troop

https://www.beemershop.com/?gad_sour...hoCtREQAvD_BwE

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Those are almost just as expensive as the wilbers only a couple of hundred cheaper, I would just stick with tried and true and get the wilbers if you are going to spend that much. Not only I enjoy them but my wife who rides on the back is very happy with the ride now.

And the hpa lets me choose between fun or none. (Just kidding honey!)

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Originally Posted by troop

https://www.beemershop.com/?gad_sour...hoCtREQAvD_BwE

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Nice Product, I even like the white and orange color of the rear. Elka money though. :gaah:

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Originally Posted by CloverHillCrawler

Those are almost just as expensive as the wilbers only a couple of hundred cheaper, I would just stick with tried and true and get the wilbers if you are going to spend that much. Not only I enjoy them but my wife who rides on the back is very happy with the ride now.

And the hpa lets me choose between fun or none. (Just kidding honey!)

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I'm finding good things about Wilbers but at that price, I may as well consider Elka. Anyone have any experience with M2 shocks? M2 Spyder Shocks (2 Front + 1 Rear) are $1965 a set plus shipping and handling + it looks like they still have a $225 discount making the price $1740 for a complete set.

Sometimes too many choices is not a good thing!

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Originally Posted by broderp

.... Anyone have any experience with M2 shocks? M2 Spyder Shocks (2 Front + 1 Rear) are $1965 a set plus shipping and handling + it looks like they still have a $225 discount making the price $1740 for a complete set...

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When I was in my 275lb to 300 lb days (no more since going keto) I had to replace my 2013 RTL's shocks with M2 shocks (Front and back) and both my wife and I loved those M2 shocks. Marcus quizzed me about our weights, riding style, and wants and we got a perfect set of shocks for a reasonable price.

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Originally Posted by broderp

Nice Product, I even like the white and orange color of the rear. Elka money though. :gaah:



I'm finding good things about Wilbers but at that price, I may as well consider Elka. Anyone have any experience with M2 shocks? M2 Spyder Shocks (2 Front + 1 Rear) are $1965 a set plus shipping and handling + it looks like they still have a $225 discount making the price $1740 for a complete set.

Sometimes too many choices is not a good thing!

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Don''t know why you are stuck on elka's...do some research and you will find a good number of people are having to rebuild them after 3-5 years and the cost of a rebuild is almost just as much as a new set.

I had a hard time with eating the cost of the wilbers but I figured if I was spending that much that I wanted to make sure it lasted for a while so I saved up to spend the extra money.

I am not attempting to sway your choice or denigrate it I am just attempting to give you some info you are looking for.

The fact that Wilbers are the same cost as Elka is a good thing. The Wilber shock has outstanding quality and is 100% built for you. If you don't want to wait, buy the Elka. They'll spring it to your weight, but valving will be standard.

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Originally Posted by CloverHillCrawler

Don''t know why you are stuck on elka's...do some research and you will find a good number of people are having to rebuild them after 3-5 years and the cost of a rebuild is almost just as much as a new set.

I had a hard time with eating the cost of the wilbers but I figured if I was spending that much that I wanted to make sure it lasted for a while so I saved up to spend the extra money.

I am not attempting to sway your choice or denigrate it I am just attempting to give you some info you are looking for.

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Truth be told, my preference is actually not to have Elka, but I have to balance function, reliability, durability, warranty and cost. Not sure which factor matters the most to me at this point, but I'm thinking reliability and warranty are at the top since any brand on the list will likely meet my needs and surpass the OEM shock(s)

I appreciate everyone's info and POV on the subject. Thanks.

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Originally Posted by troop

The fact that Wilbers are the same cost as Elka is a good thing. The Wilber shock has outstanding quality and is 100% built for you. If you don't want to wait, buy the Elka. They'll spring it to your weight, but valving will be standard.

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I was not aware that valving changes are made and unique to Wilbers shocks. I have a lot to to learn. My concern with them is price (not sure I'm making a like for like comparison with any of the brands) and service issues if I have a problem. Having my ride down during the riding season would be terrible, but as I said i will need to research more. Thanks for the input. I think it's time to break out Excel and start spread sheet. :read:

Just heard back from Accelerated T and they do not carry an in house front spring package for the F3 so I will probably order the Elka Stage 3 through them and see what they recommend.

Your original post said you were concerned about bottoming out the rear; have you considered contacting a service dept and see if a factory automatic air ride from a higher end F3 can be installed & see what it would cost?

I had Elka full set on my F3 Limited. I was looking for a more comfortable ride than stock. Right out of the box they were stiff and hard over the same bumps I was trying to smooth out. I was very specific with them on my stated goals. There reply was "its like a new pair of shoes, they have to break in. They will be fine!" Well, they were never what I was trying to do. On the good side they did improve aggressive sport riding performance. They held corners better and tracked truer over rough stuff. I got the comfort ride I was looking for with my STOCK 2021 RTL. No way I'm going to change this suspension based on my Elka experience

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Originally Posted by spyderdave

Your original post said you were concerned about bottoming out the rear; have you considered contacting a service dept and see if a factory automatic air ride from a higher end F3 can be installed & see what it would cost?

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I wouldn't do that!! :yikes:

Spend some time reading all the threads & posts about them; many are problematic at best; almost as many just never work properly if at all and are a right pain where you sit, if not also your back, neck, and probably rear inner fender when the ACS once again fails & you end up riding on the bones of your arse! :opps:

Best thing I ever did with my ACS was to fit a shock/coil that meant the air bag is effectively neutralised - sure, I've left it there, and it still 'functions', for now! But now that I've proven the concept to my satisfaction, I'm thinking that I'll probably pull it completely & toss it next time I have the rear tire off, and good riddance to it! :bdh:

While an Air Ride Height control like the ACS (it's NOT an 'Air Shock'!!) might be a great concept, on our Can Am Spyders, the ACS has been very poorly executed and for many is far more of a problem than they're worth.... And despite the complaints starting pretty much the day they were first released, here we are 14 years down track and BRP [I]STILL[/I ] doesn't give a rats about this piece of *** :cus: They just keep pumping them out basically unchanged as if they were something helpful & desirable, despite the many, many complaints about them and the number of people either converting them to full manual or neutralising &/or tossing them entirely! :lecturef_smilie:

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Originally Posted by Dennis in Lodi

I had Elka full set on my F3 Limited. I was looking for a more comfortable ride than stock. Right out of the box they were stiff and hard over the same bumps I was trying to smooth out. I was very specific with them on my stated goals. There reply was "its like a new pair of shoes, they have to break in. They will be fine!" Well, they were never what I was trying to do. On the good side they did improve aggressive sport riding performance. They held corners better and tracked truer over rough stuff. I got the comfort ride I was looking for with my STOCK 2021 RTL. No way I'm going to change this suspension based on my Elka experience

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What stage of Elkas did you have on your Limited?

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Originally Posted by spyderdave

Your original post said you were concerned about bottoming out the rear; have you considered contacting a service dept and see if a factory automatic air ride from a higher end F3 can be installed & see what it would cost?

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I agree with Peter A on this one, Dave. I had the two up shock and airbag on my F3-L and it still bottomed out. I installed a Wilbers rear and let the airbag run down to 0psi, but still no bottoming out. The aftermarket shock is definitely the way to go:thumbup:

Pete

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Originally Posted by AndysF3S

What stage of Elkas did you have on your Limited?

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If you're the type of person that can't leave things alone and think that you're going to adjust the heck out of it, stage 3 or 4 would be the way to go. But I for one would go with the stage 2, you can still adjust it, it will not cost you as much, and most people after they find their happy spot will never touch it again.

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Originally Posted by Mikey

If you're the type of person that can't leave things alone and think that you're going to adjust the heck out of it, stage 3 or 4 would be the way to go. But I for one would go with the stage 2, you can still adjust it, it will not cost you as much, and most people after they find their happy spot will never touch it again.

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Yes, that’s the Lamonster philosophy too, Mikey.:2thumbs:

Pete

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Originally Posted by AndysF3S

What stage of Elkas did you have on your Limited?

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Stage 2 front. Stage 3 rear. I had to soften the spring tensions as far as I could up front. Even though the rear had the remote adjuster knob, I could not notice any difference in the ride when I turned it in or out. Previous threads had comments from Elka users about leaking fluid almost right out of the box and others stated they had to frequently mail them in for a rebuild because of leaks. I never had this problem. My Elks never bottomed out even while riding 2 up. I have determined that a softer and plusher ride and aftermarket shocks are not what the shock replacement industry is geared to deliver. A younger me would have loved my Elka just from the improved aggressive riding performance. Dennis

Thanks Dennis, I will go with the Elka 3 for the front only because they have the compression adjustment, if I think I need to do a tweak to find the sweet spot and this is a step up over the KYB not adjustable that it came with.

The Elka 3 are 6-8 weeks behind on delivery from order date if anyone is considering them. I have all four on an Outlander quad and will be ordering the accelerated dual rate spring package only for my 22 Renegade XRS. I would like to have tried the spring package only for the F3S but unfortunately they are not available.

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Originally Posted by spyderdave

Your original post said you were concerned about bottoming out the rear; have you considered contacting a service dept and see if a factory automatic air ride from a higher end F3 can be installed & see what it would cost?

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As others stated this is likely not a good idea in practice. Issues of the OEM aside, and after looking at the electrical connections and such from the SM, there is no way this will be cheaper and less evasive of an upgrade than aftermarket shocks. If the OEM air suspension was rock solid and an all around best in class performer over a wide range of adjustability, then to me anyway, it would potentially be worth the cost. That's just not the case.

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Originally Posted by Dennis in Lodi

I had Elka full set on my F3 Limited. I was looking for a more comfortable ride than stock. Right out of the box they were stiff and hard over the same bumps I was trying to smooth out. I was very specific with them on my stated goals. There reply was "its like a new pair of shoes, they have to break in. They will be fine!" Well, they were never what I was trying to do. On the good side they did improve aggressive sport riding performance. They held corners better and tracked truer over rough stuff. I got the comfort ride I was looking for with my STOCK 2021 RTL. No way I'm going to change this suspension based on my Elka experience

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This is a factor not usually talked about and part of the reason I started this chain. Brand loyalty, fanboy-ism and different riding styles make soliciting answers difficult. I'll throw in that in all likelihood, the stiff ride you experienced was likely PERFECT in someone else eyes. Maybe even Elka's. And me asking for a shock that wont bottom out under my weight/ load is a loaded question because I know in all likeliness the answer will result in a harder ride. I'm looking for a comfortable but supportive ride that wont bottom out but it seems most options within the range I am willing to spend will be compromise. Thanks for your opinion.

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Originally Posted by Dennis in Lodi

Stage 2 front. Stage 3 rear. I had to soften the spring tensions as far as I could up front. Even though the rear had the remote adjuster knob, I could not notice any difference in the ride when I turned it in or out. Previous threads had comments from Elka users about leaking fluid almost right out of the box and others stated they had to frequently mail them in for a rebuild because of leaks. I never had this problem. My Elks never bottomed out even while riding 2 up. I have determined that a softer and plusher ride and aftermarket shocks are not what the shock replacement industry is geared to deliver. A younger me would have loved my Elka just from the improved aggressive riding performance. Dennis

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Mind me asking how much you weigh? I'm curious if this would be my experience with Elka, should I go this route (soften the spring tension so much). I'm researching the Elka line and considering the Lamonster Garage kit: https://www.lamonstergarage.com/can-...nsion-package/ that has Stage 3 fronts and a Stage 4 rear. Since I hope to ride two-up with the wife, the remote preload was a very nice selling point I put a lot of weight on when making a buying decision. Its very off putting to hear of leaking issues as I will not have the time (or patients) to remove and replace shocks with down time during the season. I had heard of this on Elka's as well as M2 shocks, but overall, most seem happy with them.

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Originally Posted by Dennis in Lodi

Stage 2 front. Stage 3 rear. I had to soften the spring tensions as far as I could up front. Even though the rear had the remote adjuster knob, I could not notice any difference in the ride when I turned it in or out. Previous threads had comments from Elka users about leaking fluid almost right out of the box and others stated they had to frequently mail them in for a rebuild because of leaks. I never had this problem. My Elks never bottomed out even while riding 2 up. I have determined that a softer and plusher ride and aftermarket shocks are not what the shock replacement industry is geared to deliver. A younger me would have loved my Elka just from the improved aggressive riding performance. Dennis

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I certainly agree with you on this one, Dennis. Both my Wilbers (F3-L) and Ikon (‘21 RT) vastly improved my clearance and control over potholes etc, but at no time did I feel a softer/plusher ride. I was quite happy with my stock ‘21 RT shocks for comfort, but they just weren’t “doing it” with our shocking roads. It’s great to hear that someone else experienced the same. I thought it must just be my imagination.;)

Pete

Yeah ... My Wilber 640 HPA rear shock and Fox Podium 1.5/Ohlins springs were certainly not plush. I'd would call them controlled firm :)