Highest octane available and Top Tier if available. In my bikes and car.
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Highest octane available and Top Tier if available. In my bikes and car.
I run premium.
I did an experiment with a Acura rsx type S that required Premium only fuel. Guess what - it pinged like crazy at idle with just 89 octane in it and luckly I didnt use 87 and I only added a few gallons so I was able to top off with premium and it was quit again. I know the spyder is not this picky But I follow the owners manual.
My f150 eco boost recomeends 87 normal and premium towing or high temps.
A lot of independent testing shows my truck gets over 20 more HP on premium vs running regular fuel...........so I run premium when towing.
I tend to go with the highest octane available without ethanol. We were in Iowa a couple weeks ago, and I needed gas, so, I filled up with their best non-ethanol grade. The bike ran like CRAP until I could get a tank of good gas back in it. Maybe I got the bottom of the barrel.....That gas was only rated 87 octane/ethanol free...that seemed a little weird to me. They also had it labeled "recreational use". When gas in WI is labeled recreational use, it's typically the best ethanol free stuff they got, and it usually works great in the Spyder. I'm guessing that the bike "learns" what kind of gas it's burning after so many miles and makes the proper adjustments. In my case that day, going from premium to crap.....it kicked the bike right in the cahoonies and it fell on its face. So, burn what you like, but I think it's best to stick to that grade and not jump back and forth between grades to save few cents now and then
Any gas that sits is subject to deterioration. Though ethanol free fuel will last a lot longer in storage. Sometimes fuel stations just don't sell enough to keep fresh fuel in their tank. Sometimes filters can be left too long and get contaminated. And sometimes the wrong fuel can get dumped into a tank or frankly, the fuel station or the delivery company may just be cheating. There are a number of reasons you can experience something like this beyond a simple octane change.
Interesting, FWI I have a 2019 F3t and run premium.
In years past I worked for a BRP dealer on Ski-Doo snowmobiles and Can Am atv's and went to several of their service schools. The later Rotax motors had a knock sensor on them to retard the timing for various reasons 1 of which was spark knock. We would test the knock sensor if we had one that showed signs of detonation by drawing a line on the clutch with a magic marker and making a pointer with a coat hanger, then tapping the side of the motor with a small hammer to see if it retarded the timing while it was running.
So the 1330 has a knock sensor on it. One of the ways it will now the difference in fuel is when it gets pre ignition or detonation. I don't know about you guys but I don't want to run my 1330 with the risk of either condition. Thats the reason you would never hear spark knock also. Other things like air Temp, altitude, etc also contribute to detonation as well as octane.
I'm an equal opportunity octane user. When I'm on long trips with long freeway stints, I'll use 87/10% ethanol to save $$ at upper 20's mpg. Blasting around locally, I'll alternate between 87/89/93 with 10% ethanol and 91 at 100% gas. I do get a warm/fuzzier feeling with premium :) . Transitioning to fall weather, with rides less frequent, I use 91 oct/100% gas. I start adding fuel stabilizer around this time of year (I'm in WI). I cannot feel any difference in performance, but do get the slight mpg improvement with 100% gas. Now, is it worth the .80/ga difference in cost to feel warm/fuzzy?
From what I know of the Spyder computer fuel mapping …. switching Octane's is not a good idea ….. the computer can actually learn what octane it's getting, and will makes changes to it's mapping …. It's takes a bit of time to do this …. and if you change what you are using even sometimes, the computer won't be able to give you maximum performance. If someone knows better please chime in ….. Mike :ohyea:
You are not going to get 'Knock' or 'Pre-Ignition' with your F3. As you say, the computer will compensate by retarding ignition.
But even with the lower octane fuels, the computer does not always have to compensate. It is just more likely to happen with a lower octane fuel. Again, as you say, it has to do with a combination of things including interior cylinder and spark plug temperature (which will be higher with a lower octane fuel in a high compression engine like the Spyder has). This is one reason it is important to apply thermal paste to the spark plug threads.
Originally, BRP went with a colder spark plug to help prevent negative ignition issues due to low octane. But people tended to lug the 998 which fouled plugs. So BRP went to a hotter spark plug to remedy this, though it brings with it the down side of the computer having to compensate for low octane fuels more than they did with the colder plug. But over all a good trade-off. Because everyone will detect a fouled spark plug. But few will detect retarded ignition timing.
Here in the Great White North only PetroCannabis and Esso/Mobil have a grade above 91 (94 at PC and 93 at Esso) ..... so it's 91 for me. So far so good.
All true and good info. I was trying to keep my post short so people would read it.
Something I noticed when testing knock sensors on Ski-Doo motors with a timing light is the timing would try to return to normal after the tap with a hammer. All of this was a bigger problem on 2 stroke than 4 stroke also.
I don't know how the 1330 does all this either, but it does have a knock sensor and Rotax built it.
For what this may be worth :dontknow:... In my 08 GS and 11 RSS ( the V-twins ) I used 87*, they ran fine, no issues. When I purchased my new 2014 RT, it had the 1330 engine and a different ( higher ) octane recommendation.... My best friend is a Master mechanic and knows more abut the internal combustion engine than one I have EVER known ( a lot of mechanics )( He also owned a Spyder )… I asked Him about the " new " Octane thing. He hadn't ridden a Spyder with the 1330, so He took mine out for His ( torture ) tests. …. long story short … He said my RT would run fine on 87*, but He did say if He were to ride it with the Max weight capacity ( rider + passenger ) and a Max weight loaded trailer ( 400lbs. ) in very Hilly terrain He would use 91*, 89* if it was non-ethyl gas …… I have done this with good results ..... good luck …. Mike :ohyea:
93 on Both. Nothing but the Best for my babies!!!
Hi Gom,
Running Premium (91 octane). Regular (87 oct) contains ethanal - at least in Canada it does. Try to avoid. Ethanal tends to draw water in from atmosphere.
Johnny
2017 RTL
:roflblack::roflblack::roflblack: ….. There are many, many, many things in those BRP manuals that are absolutely false, like the size of the headlight bulbs …… Those manuals also state " If you get a code on the instrument cluster " ….IMMEDIATELY have your Spyder TOWED to the nearest Dealer for service …..How many times have you done that Jack ???? …. just sayin …. Mike :ohyea:
I was guided to this awhile back (from the manual). Kinda misleading, as where can you find premium unleaded at 87 octane? Bottom line is minimum octane rating of 87, with 91/+ octane being recommended. I take it that the bike will run fine with 87 octane, but will likely perform better with 91/+ octane. I can't see BRP allowing a fuel that would cause harm to your motor...
Type Premium unleaded gasoline
87 Pump Posted AKI (RON+MON)/2 Minimum octane
92 RON
91 Pump Posted AKI (RON+MON)/2
Fuel - Refer to
FUEL REQUIREMENTS
Recommended octane
95 RON
Fuel tank capacity 27 L (7.1 U.S. gal.)
'Premium' gasoline is a relative term and just another way to describe the octane recommended. I've seen octanes between 91 and 93 being called 'Premium' depending on the market and brand. They are recommending whatever is designated 'Premium' in your area or for the brand fuel you are using. Then they give a minimum octane recommending that you not drop below 87. Obviously, you can fudge this a bit at high altitude where many times, 86 octane is the best you're going to get.
The 1330 owners manual says (US) 91 octane.
Is there a reason so many don't use what the manual says? Not trying to store the pot just asking the question.
Maybe I'm missing something.