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I've been away for a couple of months and was just wondering what the results for the shearing on the BRP oil at 9,200 miles. I will be changing my oil and filter in the next couple of days. I have about 9,100 miles on the filter and about 4,500 miles on this oil. (I did a drain and fill 1/2 way through the period) I will be sending a sample off for analysis. Going by the last time, it will take 4 weeks for the results to come back .
Lots of grumbling about it so your results will be interesting. So far I have not seen oils holding true beyond 4,000 give or take. RT 1330 with lower rpm's six speed with hydraulic clutch may be different...:dontknow:
Just did my interim oil change also at about 4500. Looking forward to seeing your results.
CJ JAX
Did you use the blended oil or 100% synthetic oil?
I used the blended. Was told the synthetic was too slick for the wet clutch. Maybe that has changed?
If the dealer told you this, they have told you an old husband's tale. As long as you are using a motorcycle oil, fully synthetic will have no effect on the wet clutch but it will provide superior lubrication compared to a blended oil or a dino oil. If you were to use a synthetic car oil, it will probably contain friction modifiers and be unsuitable for a wet clutch.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Humphreys
Sent my oil off for analysis yesterday. Sent it to a different lab. We'll see how quick the results come back this time. The oil in question is Summer Blend BRP Semi-synthetic. I believe it's 5x40.
I have been using Amsoil 10-W-40 motorcycle specific synthetic which is formulated for use in bikes with wet clutches. This is for my 2012 Victory Cross Country which has a unit construction (engine, transmission & primary which share the same oil) and a wet clutch. This would be similar construction to what the 1330 ACE is.
This has never been true for any Spyder, any year, any model.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Humphreys
The meter is in the red zone with this one.
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/wp-...5/bs-meter.jpg
[QUOTE=BajaRon;921611]This has never been true for any Spyder, any year, any model.
The meter is in the red zone with this one.
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/wp-...5/bs-meter.jpg[/QUOTE
Nice to know what I was told was horse pucky! Thanks, Ron!
Have you had the oil tested?Quote:
Originally Posted by den1953
Why would I trust the advice of an oil test company, which has a huge motivation to find something wrong, instead of the company that manufactured the vehicle in the first place and has a strong motivation to advise people on how to make their vehicle last? The issue isn't whether there is combustion products or other contamination or chemical breakdown or fuel dilution in the oil. The only issue that matters is whether the oil is preserving the life of the engine. Oil test companies don't determine that. Vehicle manufacturers do.
:hun:......To the best of my knowledge the independent companies that do these tests DON'T SELL ANYTHING ........So what would be their motivation to lie ........This is one of the reasons Consumer Reports doesn't accept advertising They don't even want to give the APPEARANCE of favoritism .............JMHO.......Mike :thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Mann
Actually, your engine determines what it needs so I respectfully disagree on this one. I suggest you trust the oil testing facility because they are providing a valuable service at a very reasonable price.Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Mann
Oil testing companies are independently certified to be accurate. If they loose this rating or don't have it to start with they are pretty much out of business. Their livelihood is built upon trust and accuracy. That is their pony in this race. They test specifically to find things wrong in the oil before you find things wrong on the side of the road or when the bad news hits you at the repair shop.
Trucking companies, heavy equipment companies, racing teams and many others use these services regularly as they can't afford the pain of preventable problems.
There is more to the equation than dilution. Oil breakdown and metal contaminants in the oil will alert you to a poor quality lubricant or other issues with your engine before permanent damage is done. Manufacturers typically recommend lubricants that they feel SHOULD take care of the engine under most conditions. But if you think BRP, or any manufacturer, is primarily interested in vehicle longevity then you are mistaken. And if you think the manufacturer's engineers are always right then you haven't been reading some of the problem posts here or on any other product forum.
I'm not ranting on anyone here. Just attempting to be realistic.
Everything is a compromise between quality and price. Some think the manufacturer is always right in where they come down on the Quality/Price continuum. And that's fine, it's their ride.
For those who want to check up on the manufacturer's recommendations through an oil testing facility I say 'More Power To You!'. If the engineers are right then you validate their findings at very little cost to you. However, if the engineers aren't correct in your case, then you'll know it while there is still time to switch to a better lubricant.
I, for one, am very interested in this independent testing.
I've used this oil in both my Triumph Rocket III and my current Victory Cross Country without any kind of problems. If anything the Amsoil makes the unit transmissions seem to shift smoother and also quiets down valve train noise. I never had it tested but I routinely go 6000 miles on Amsoil with a filter-only change midway at 3000 miles. Never had a clutch slip or act up once. I also use a WIX filter with the oil changes.
Doc, I haven't seen or read about any oil tests done with that many miles. Would surely love to see someone do it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Humphreys
Meanwhile, I'm not about to run mine past 4000 miles unless someone can show proof that X brand will hold its viscosity beyond that. :)
I'll post the results as soon as i get them, Uniflyer. I agree with BajaRon. Most manufacturers will plan failure into their models. That is consumerism. If they made a perfect product that lasted forever, they would soon run out of consumers to buy their stuff. My main concern is the new 1330 and how well it is holding up. I have seen too many first year "test projects" get sold in the 4 wheeler world. This makes the consumer a vehicle test pilot. I have seen so many recalls on vehicles in my years as a mechanic it is pitiful. Now with all that being said, BRP does a much better job than most. They have a few issues, but not many. If I had not done my research I would not have laid out the 32K for my RT, especially with a first year power plant. However, that does not mean I won't check to make sure everything is holding together well.
If the truth about engines and oil changes were known, few people would give these companies any money and most would go out of business. There is a place for this kind of analysis but I don't think it tells the average driver/rider anything useful.Quote:
Originally Posted by BLUEKNIGHT911
First of all, I am not trying to say that these companies put out erroneous test results. My experience has been that their results are accurate and repeatable. What i am saying is that for most people, they are irrelevant. Trucking and heavy equipment companies use oil tests to determine how far past the recommended change interval they can go. When you replace that much oil, it is worth it. I will take your word for it that they also use tests to detect engine problems. I'm sure racing teams also use oil testing to find out if their engines are developing problems but most riders never operate their engines anywhere close to the survival limit for any length of time.Quote:
Originally Posted by BajaRon
I am not sure how BRP derives their oil recommendations but I can guarantee you it isn't a result of how someone "feels". In the automotive industry, millions and millions of dollars worth of vehicles and engines on test stands are destroyed each year to determine maintenance schedules. They use oil oil tests and tear downs to determine maintenance schedules. I know because i have been a part of such a study. I would be shocked if BRP didn't destroy at least a few engines and whole machines to determine the same thing. To do otherwise is just negligence. If I thought they set their maintenance schedules based on how someone feels rather than experiment, I would never buy one.
Here is my experience. I was a long distance Goldwing rider for a long time and used to know quite a few riders with near or over 6 figures on their odometer. Some of them changed their oil with synthetics at 2000 or 3000 mile intervals based on amateur advice or the results they got from an oil test. Others just used petroleum based oil at the recommended interval. I knew just as many high mileage riders riders in the second category as the first. Were these guys just lucky?
I just think good enough is good enough. If you look for problems with the expectation of finding them, you almost certainly will.
I plan to use this oil in my 2014 RT its full synthetic 5w40 MOTORCYCLE OIL. WHICH has a LS JSMO rating... available on Amazon for $52.26 delivered
I admit that a Victory 106 air/oil cooled v-twin isn't exactly the same motor as the ACE 1330 but it's still a four stroke motorcycle application with a wet clutch. I might be on the conservative side by completely changing it at 6000 mile intervals with a filter-only change midway at 3000, but I'd rather error on the safe side. I'm thinking ahead to when I'd have my first Spyder (either an RT or F3) and feel that I'd error on the safe side and do the same thing at 6000 mile intervals. Better safe than sorry.
Doc,Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Humphreys
I am interested to see how your oil with 4,500 miles compairs to my results with the same oil at 6,000 miles. Which lab did you use?
I've never used their full synthetic, but the Castrol Blend, also MA2, surely didn't hold up in my '11 RT. I'd suggestQuote:
Originally Posted by Orange Spyder Man
sending off a lab test at 3000miles at least. Heres where I got my oil from:
http://www.powersportsuperstore.com
I understand what you are saying. People can generally use the OEM oil at recommended oil changes and go a long way with no noticeable problems. Reduced wear and longer oil change intervals that a better lubricant can provide does not interest everyone. I understand that for many, good enough IS good enough. And there is nothing wrong with that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Mann
Others, however, are very interested in making improvements to suspension, intake, exhaust, tires, seating, and a host of other things. That's because 'Good Enough' has a different meaning for them.
Certainly, BRP does testing for lubricants. Just like they do testing for tires, suspension components, seating position, etc. But the fact is, there are products available which will enhance every one of these areas. I don't see that it hurts to inform people that there are better lubricants available that will give better service, improve protection, reduce wear and allow for longer service intervals. No one is saying anyone HAS to use a better lubricant any more than saying you have to upgrade your tires. It's just accurate, usable information.
The bottom line is, for some, Good Enough is Good Enough. For others, Good Enough.... Isn't! :ohyea:
My dealer will not install full synthetic into my Spyder 1330. He claims BRP recommends using the Semi-synthetic only. Before anyone says to get rid of the dealer, that isn't going to happen. He is Platinum Certified, and the tech is highly trained, and certified. As far as 9200 mile oil changes? I don't doubt the Spyder will do just fine, and the oil will be fine also. The Honda Gold Wing calls for 8,000 mile changes on dino oil! I won't have to worry about it. I will not put that much mileage on the Spyder between oil changes. Once a year oil changes will do for me. BRP oil and filters changed by a BRP Tech.. :popcorn: Tom :thumbup: