F3 idler pulley on an RT

[Devious56]

Well, I don't really know how to do this, because to do it right will take a while but, here goes. I just got back from the first ride on my 2015 RT Limited with the BRP belt idler kit and Doc Humphreys adapter kit. I was a little concerned about the installation as I had to remove my Smooth Spyder belt tensioner, and will admit that doing that was harder than installing the new set up. I think the hardest part of the whole installation was pushing down on the new tensioner to get it flat and the bolt holes lined up so the bolts would go into the holes. When everything was lined up, it was pretty easy. Doc even provides the recommended thread locker in his kit. I was also worried that I would have to adjust my belt but that too was wrong, I didn't touch it. I did check the tension and it was 180 # with the tire off the ground, and 240 # with the tire on the ground. I was using a Krikit !!, and wish I knew how to convert the Krikit reading into foot pounds or Neutons. That's it for the installation. My wife just informed me that lunch was ready, so there will be a slight break before I get to my ride, hang onto your hat.......David VonStein
Now that my tummy's full, let's see how the ride went: I live out in the country, and while putting on my helmet and gloves, I let my Spyder warm up and wondered exactly what I was going to experience. I had the Smooth Spyder belt tensioner installed shortly after I got my Spyder, and was very happy with the smoothness of the ride it gave me. I had very little belt slap since having it installed, but, there was times when it did show up, and most recently when the tack came down thru 4,500 rpm decelerating it would really shake things. I rode a couple of miles, headed for the closest highway, and run it up to the speed limit, 65 mph. Pleasantly surprised, my ride was never this smooth. Keep in mind that this is a motorcycle, a mechanical device, but now it is smooth as silk. I still had it in my head, that I was going to have to adjust the belt, from what little I know, the 240# Krikit reading was on the high side. Wrong again. Now I must ask you not to be too hard on me, but I wanted answers. I went thru the gears, up to 7,500 rpm, no vibration, NO belt slap. I'd roll off the throttle, no belt slap.I was in awe! I went up to 100 mph in 5th gear, smooth as silk, 105 in 6th gear, I was in heaven. Accelerating, and decelerating, absolutely no belt slap. I did get a little vibration, from time to time, but it was more like a buzzing than an actual vibration. Like I said, I think my belt is a bit tight, but, it is tracking perfectly, 1.5 mm off the pulley flange, I am not going to mess with it! I hope I have covered everything, and if not, I'll be glad to answer any questions you might have.. As one of the testers we were asked to write our opinions of Doc's installation kit, and this is mine, as honestly as I could write it, I hope I've up held my end of the barging. I know that Kenny Butler is one hell of a mechanic and an all around nice guy, and I am waiting to see what he has to say. Everyone have a Happy Thanksgiving, and I honestly hope that your experience is as good as mine. I am impressed, it was easy to install, and performs as advertised. I think instead of calling it a belt tensioner, I would call it a harmonic dampener. .....//David VonSteinI have to add, that my testing was done solo, as my wife was getting stuff done for Thanksgiving. But, most of my riding is done double, so I am anxious to see how things go with my wife on the back. I don't expect things to be much different, but I will post again after the next ride.

David

[SAMBILLIE]

I was just about to go to work installing the smoothspyder on my 15 rtl thats been sitting around since summer. Should i wait? What made you want to switch to the new brp ?

[Bob Denman]

Thanks for the review! :clap:
Question: What does BRP's belt tensioner cost, and do you have the part number for it?

(Okay: TWO questions! :D)

[Devious56]

Thanks for the review! :clap:
Question: What does BRP's belt tensioner cost, and do you have the part number for it?

(Okay: TWO questions! :D)

219800412 Idler Belt kit

#34.99 and cost me $15.00 shipping from Pit Bull Power Sports in Springfield, Mo.

I think Lamont has one very similar.

[Deer Slayer]

Ok gang, next question? Can we fit it to a 14 RS-S? ??:hun:

[Devious56]

I would have to say, contact Doc Humphreys. 1-812-372-4500

David

[SpyderCruiser]

David,
Why did you take the smoothspyder off? I intend On installing Doc's kit but plan on keeping the smoothspyder on as well. Is the smoothspyder in the way?

My theory is that the smoothspyder will keep tension when letting off the throttle, and the BRP tensioner will reduce vibes while accelerating/cruising.

Take Care,
Louie

[Cruzr Joe]

David,
Why did you take the smoothspyder off? I intend On installing Doc's kit but plan on keeping the smoothspyder on as well. Is the smoothspyder in the way?

My theory is that the smoothspyder will keep tension when letting off the throttle, and the BRP tensioner will reduce vibes while accelerating/cruising.

Take Care,
Louie


The BRP one is all that is needed. It works absolutely great on my F3 Ltd.

Cruzr Joe

[Devious56]

The BRP one is all that is needed. It works absolutely great on my F3 Ltd.

Cruzr Joe

I have to go with Joe, A belt tensioner isn't the answer, the idler pulley dampens the harmonics . I did everthing I could on my ride today, to induce belt slap and vibration. I honestly feel, it is the fact that the pulley is on the top run of the belt that is the answer. My Smooth Spyder tensioner was set at 12 pounds and put a lot more tension on the belt than the idler pulley does, and yet it didn't do the job that BRP's did. It is your trike, and it isn't that much of a job to remove your Smooth Spyder, why not try the BRP one by it's self and see what happens? All you have to loose is a little bit of time. Who knows, you may find you don't need the heavier tensioner. If you do need it, you can still put it on.

Good luck in what ever you choose, I hope you wind up as happy with your trike as I am with mine. I will say this, what led me to trying the current set up is that I had a significant bit of belt slap, at 4500 rpm, when I let off the throttle, that was with the Smooth Spyder one, this morning I had none, from idle to 7,000 rpm.

David

[Ron2andia]

Had mine put in and it is amazing.. loving the ride..

[Bob Denman]

219800412 Idler Belt kit

#34.99 and cost me $15.00 shipping from Pit Bull Power Sports in Springfield, Mo.

I think Lamont has one very similar.


:clap: Thanks! :thumbup:

Before I order anything; I'm going to wait, and see what Lamont's looks like!

[Devious56]

:clap: Thanks! :thumbup:

Before I order anything; I'm going to wait, and see what Lamont's looks like!

Bob I think he did a video about it on his site and should have it ready soon. Ask him about it.

Here is a link to his video for the idler pulley, but I don't think he is doing the TR adapter (yet).


http://www.lamonstergarage.com/news/f3-idler-kit-install/

David

Happy Thanksgiving.

[Bob Denman]

:clap: Thanks for the link; I've been waiting to see his! :2thumbs:

[Devious56]

Doc Humphreys is having a 25% off sale now, but I don't know how long it will last.

David

[RTL1330]

Well I got it installed and now wait till snow is gone so I can test ride it. Install was smooth after watching Doc's video. Thanks Doc.

[timeless]

Well, I don't really know how to do this, because to do it right will take a while but, here goes. I just got back from the first ride on my 2015 RT Limited with the BRP belt idler kit and Doc Humphreys adapter kit. I was a little concerned about the installation as I had to remove my Smooth Spyder belt tensioner, and will admit that doing that was harder than installing the new set up. I think the hardest part of the whole installation was pushing down on the new tensioner to get it flat and the bolt holes lined up so the bolts would go into the holes. When everything was lined up, it was pretty easy. Doc even provides the recommended thread locker in his kit. I was also worried that I would have to adjust my belt but that too was wrong, I didn't touch it. I did check the tension and it was 180 # with the tire off the ground, and 240 # with the tire on the ground. I was using a Krikit !!, and wish I knew how to convert the Krikit reading into foot pounds or Neutons. That's it for the installation. My wife just informed me that lunch was ready, so there will be a slight break before I get to my ride, hang onto your hat.......David VonStein
Now that my tummy's full, let's see how the ride went: I live out in the country, and while putting on my helmet and gloves, I let my Spyder warm up and wondered exactly what I was going to experience. I had the Smooth Spyder belt tensioner installed shortly after I got my Spyder, and was very happy with the smoothness of the ride it gave me. I had very little belt slap since having it installed, but, there was times when it did show up, and most recently when the tack came down thru 4,500 rpm decelerating it would really shake things. I rode a couple of miles, headed for the closest highway, and run it up to the speed limit, 65 mph. Pleasantly surprised, my ride was never this smooth. Keep in mind that this is a motorcycle, a mechanical device, but now it is smooth as silk. I still had it in my head, that I was going to have to adjust the belt, from what little I know, the 240# Krikit reading was on the high side. Wrong again. Now I must ask you not to be too hard on me, but I wanted answers. I went thru the gears, up to 7,500 rpm, no vibration, NO belt slap. I'd roll off the throttle, no belt slap.I was in awe! I went up to 100 mph in 5th gear, smooth as silk, 105 in 6th gear, I was in heaven. Accelerating, and decelerating, absolutely no belt slap. I did get a little vibration, from time to time, but it was more like a buzzing than an actual vibration. Like I said, I think my belt is a bit tight, but, it is tracking perfectly, 1.5 mm off the pulley flange, I am not going to mess with it! I hope I have covered everything, and if not, I'll be glad to answer any questions you might have.. As one of the testers we were asked to write our opinions of Doc's installation kit, and this is mine, as honestly as I could write it, I hope I've up held my end of the barging. I know that Kenny Butler is one hell of a mechanic and an all around nice guy, and I am waiting to see what he has to say. Everyone have a Happy Thanksgiving, and I honestly hope that your experience is as good as mine. I am impressed, it was easy to install, and performs as advertised. I think instead of calling it a belt tensioner, I would call it a harmonic dampener. .....//David VonSteinI have to add, that my testing was done solo, as my wife was getting stuff done for Thanksgiving. But, most of my riding is done double, so I am anxious to see how things go with my wife on the back. I don't expect things to be much different, but I will post again after the next ride.

David



Well I put one on my 2010 RTSE5 today and will most likely remove it tomorrow!!!!!!!

The thing screams like I have a turbo, so loud I can hear it with my hearing aids turned OFF!!!!!!!!!!!!


:banghead:

[Roadster Renovations]

Well I put one on my 2010 RTSE5 today and will most likely remove it tomorrow!!!!!!!

The thing screams like I have a turbo, so loud I can hear it with my hearing aids turned OFF!!!!!!!!!!!!


:banghead:



That is strange. I did one with a ribbed belt 3 days ago and you could hardly hear it. I am assuming you have checked the alignment?

[Roadster Renovations]

Spoke to Kathy and if you want to take it off and send it back, we will refund the part even though we state there is some noise due to the ribbed belt.

[timeless]

That is strange. I did one with a ribbed belt 3 days ago and you could hardly hear it. I am assuming you have checked the alignment?

Yea, the alignment is perfect, I used the BRP unit and as you know it is not the best designed or built available.
When I can afford it I will probably purchase one of your units.

[Roadster Renovations]

OK, Timeless, couple of things you can do:

Send us an email to: http://dochumphreys.wixsite.com/roadster/contact
.
1. Give us the email address that you used when ordering the kit so that we can reference your order. This will also establish that you are having problems and the date.
2. Make sure you were moving forward when you stopped where you are. The alignment of the belt will not be accurate if you have backed up. To get a correct track of where the belt rydes when you are ryding, you have to do this. Double check that the bracket alignment is aligned with the belt. It is possible to center the pulley on the belt and have it slightly tweaked so the front of the bracket and the back of the bracket are not even with the belt. This will cause the pulley to slightly skip since it is angled on the belt. A small block of wood against the belt should allow you to measure from the wood to the front and back of the brackets to make sure it is straight.
3. After verifying the correct alignment, make sure you test it with the tupperwear back on. The sound deadening panels substantially reduces the buzzing noise.
4. Run it for a couple of weeks. Since you have sent us the email (above), we have it on file that you are having problems and we will honor your return regardless. It may seat in and the noise may reduce. Or it may not.
If none of this helps, then you will have 2 choices; you can return our damper and live with the vibration or if your belt (2008) is fairly old, check on replacing it with a newer style belt that is smooth on the outside.

We want to make you happy.

[timeless]

Spoke to Kathy and if you want to take it off and send it back, we will refund the part even though we state there is some noise due to the ribbed belt.

Thanks Doc, but this is NOT one of your units, it is a BRP chepo and I am paying the price for going that route!!!!!!


:banghead:

[Roadster Renovations]

Thanks Doc, but this is NOT one of your units, it is a BRP chepo and I am paying the price for going that route!!!!!!


:banghead:



Ahh, now I understand more. So you just have our adaptor then! Well, i hate to say this, but our unit may not work any better.
However, with that being said, their pulley had .008 side to side play and ours had .001. It may be vibrating on the belt because of that play. This may be causing the excessive noise you are hearing. Since you already have the BRP one, you can order a kit #1 for the RT and use the existing parts and use our arm and pulley.
If you do that we will be willing to give you a refund if it is not better with our setup. I will tell you this; when we did that 2010 RT the other day you could hardly hear it. In fact, the customer said that the only time he heard it was slightly on deceleration.
If you want to return the bracket adapter instead, send us the email and we'll take it back. Either way you want to go.

[timeless]

Ahh, now I understand more. So you just have our adaptor then! Well, i hate to say this, but our unit may not work any better.
However, with that being said, their pulley had .008 side to side play and ours had .001. It may be vibrating on the belt because of that play. This may be causing the excessive noise you are hearing. Since you already have the BRP one, you can order a kit #1 for the RT and use the existing parts and use our arm and pulley.
If you do that we will be willing to give you a refund if it is not better with our setup. I will tell you this; when we did that 2010 RT the other day you could hardly hear it. In fact, the customer said that the only time he heard it was slightly on deceleration.
If you want to return the bracket adapter instead, send us the email and we'll take it back. Either way you want to go.

Thanks again Doc,

I removed the pulley and popped the bearing out, I found it to be rough and I believe that is the cause of the noise. I have removed the grease seals and cleaned the bearing. I got some junk out of the race & balls, this must have been from the manufacturing process or just collected some dirt while laying around prior to assembly.
The bearing rotates MUCH smoother and will probably be considerably quieter now.

I am thinking about drilling the bolt/axle shaft & adding a grease zerk, just not sure i feel like going to all that trouble.

I will let the forem know if my repair is successful.

Thanks again Dock for your kind offer to help out!!!!!!!!!!!

[Roadster Renovations]

From what you are telling us I'll bet they are not even ABEC-rated. Too bad out bearings won't fit, too big.

[Roadster Renovations]

NOTE:
For those installing our adapter kits on the RT, the angle bracket goes under the flat bar and the slots on the flat bar go to the front of the bike. Note the video at 11:27


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkCEelsoNEY&t=32s

[zbunker]

David,
Why did you take the smoothspyder off? I intend On installing Doc's kit but plan on keeping the smoothspyder on as well. Is the smoothspyder in the way?

My theory is that the smoothspyder will keep tension when letting off the throttle, and the BRP tensioner will reduce vibes while accelerating/cruising.

Take Care,
Louie

Hi, I have the aftermarket tenisoner and it works okay. This is the first time I have heard of the BRP model. But as reducing the vibration on deceleration, it is the top of the belt that tends to vibrate because the wheel works against the engine. I guess the REAL ANSWER would be to install an idler wheel somewhere between the front and rear sprocket. This way the vibration on both acceleration and deceleration could be addressed. Ron

[Roadster Renovations]

Hi, I have the aftermarket tenisoner and it works okay. This is the first time I have heard of the BRP model. But as reducing the vibration on deceleration, it is the top of the belt that tends to vibrate because the wheel works against the engine. I guess the REAL ANSWER would be to install an idler wheel somewhere between the front and rear sprocket. This way the vibration on both acceleration and deceleration could be addressed. Ron
.
Actually, the location for the BRP unit (with our adapter) and the one we sell are in the exact position they need to be. I don't jnow why the vibration is centered there, but it is. In fact, owning both an RT and F3, and having the damper on both I can tell you it works good at all speeds, accelerating or decelerating, and is even more effective on the RT. In our initial design we were going to move it closer to the center of the belt, but after testing, it was not necessary.