Group Riding Etiquette Do's & Don'ts

[Synthetic]

Let me say up front....I did not search this before posting....I didn't know how to title the search.....

We'll be going on our first group ride with several Spyders this weekend.....Can you share with me some do's and don'ts and group riding etiquette?

Thanks

[sandeejs]

Heres a link to look at to get started:
http://www.msf-usa.org/downloads/group_ride.pdf
(http://www.msf-usa.org/downloads/group_ride.pdf)
Have fun!
~Sandee~


Let me say up front....I did not search this before posting....I didn't know how to title the search.....
We'll be going on our first group ride with several Spyders this weekend.....Can you share with me some do's and don'ts and group riding etiquette?
Thanks

[sandeejs]

Here's another, more detailed, site:

http://www.southerncruisers.net/ridingrules.htm (http://www.southerncruisers.net/ridingrules.htm)

~Sandee~

[hecoon]

ride in a stagger position. keep back at least 3 seconds and stay alert.
have fun.....leave the drama at home
I have been leading rides on thurs and sat for almost 3 years(in oct) weather permtting.

[hecoon]

Here's another, more detailed, site:

http://www.southerncruisers.net/ridingrules.htm (http://www.southerncruisers.net/ridingrules.htm)

~Sandee~


the only thing I dislike about the southern c's is that they say its unsafe for3 wheelers to ride anywhere but in the rear of the group.

on the police rides here in Jacksonville fl trikes ride anywhere in the formation. if it wasn't safe the sheriff's office wouldn't allow it

no accidents on any of their runs

a former dissatified member of the sc's

just my 2 cents worth

later
hecoon

[jaherbst]

Group Riding Hmmmm, best advice I can give is don't get to close to anybody not only for their sake but for yours. Ride sweep (last) if you can. Safest place for a newbie. Ride your own ride. ( an old Harley saying) If you can figure that out it could save your life. i.e. Don't do anything that you feel uncomfortable with, or that makes your pillion rider uneasy.

My personal recipe for a safe group ride.

Jack

[blacklightning]

the only thing I dislike about the southern c's is that they say its unsafe for3 wheelers to ride anywhere but in the rear of the group.

on the police rides here in Jacksonville fl trikes ride anywhere in the formation. if it wasn't safe the sheriff's office wouldn't allow it

no accidents on any of their runs

a former dissatified member of the sc's

just my 2 cents worth

later
hecoon
I don't know about any set rules, but I will say, that it is hard seeing around a trike and getting a visual to see if everyone is still there. Unfortunately I seem to end up being the leader since it seems like I know all the interesting places. I usually ask if the guys with 3 wheels would either ride in the rear, or be responsible for the bikes behind them.

[Chupaca]

Gather up and go over the route and signals. If possible have ryder in the middle with directions and last ryder (sweep) will help ryders with problems and will stay with them till solved makes the ryder in front of him the new sweep.
Ryde in a staggard formation when possible if not single file...arm up one finger pointing up.
Ryde with a three second spacing
If your seperated by a light find a safe curb to pull over to and allow the rest of the group to catch up.
If spacing is large and turning stay close to the corner so the following ryders can see you. Then move up and the one behind you stays.
Make sure all signaling is well in advance
When pulling into a parking area make sure you all go in to the rear allowing for all your ryder to get in. Don't pick the closest parking spot backing in and leaving the rest out in the street.
Remind everyone it is not a race..unless it is and then ya'll are justs nuts...:roflblack::roflblack:

Probably more but this will get you a good ryde....:thumbup:

[Bfromla]

Here's another, more detailed, site:

http://www.southerncruisers.net/ridingrules.htm (http://www.southerncruisers.net/ridingrules.htm)

~Sandee~
:agree: & LEAVE DRAMA BEHIND:thumbup: make a Ride captain (gps guy) make sure everyone knows signals for debris & pit stops, if whole group is dpyders or trikes, singile file with good spacing (not much room to stagger)first group ride together, try short leg routes everyone knows, has ridden solo before, then venture off to more detailed routes. Communicate before ride, how they like to ride, what they don't (been around few would NOT pass a simi trailer:banghead:)
& you said several spyders:thumbup::firstplace: We want pics please.
Have a good & safe ryde:clap:

[ARtraveler]

The above posters have you covered.

Ride safe, expect the unexpected. Stay in your comfort zone. The group is as strong as its weakest rider.

[PatriotRider]

As a leader in the Patriot Guard Riders, between missions was an individual's choice escort of the hearse with state police doing traffic control. What that means is the official mission involved members seeing the hearse off from the airport, and receiving it at the funeral home in another city. The procession left at 7pm, westward into the sun, with darkness before arrival. My Navy Pilot instincts prevented me from sanctioning riders joining the escort. Five riders decided to go, regardless.

So with extenuating circumstances, halfway while on the interstate, there was a terrible accident involving a Harley Trike in the left half of the left lane, and a Spyder riding staggered behind in the right side of the same lane.

Louis Sevin died at the scene and Rick Kline sustained life threatening injuries which he is recovering from. Both are/were my dear friends serving in the PGR.

State Police press release: "Louis Sevin Jr. of Slidell (http://topics.nola.com/tag/slidell/index.html) was traveling west along I-10 on his Can Am motorcycle when Richard Kline's Harley Davidson drifted to the right and hit the Can Am's front left tire, police said. The contact caused the Harley to veer to the left side of the road, and the Can Am to veer to the right. The crash occurred just before 7:30 p.m"

Upon review, it was unfortunate that they were in the formation like that. The two Harley trike rear wheels plus the two Spyder front wheels added together where quite a bit wider than a lane.

So, for future missions that involve me, I will put the 3 wheel bikes of any make in the same line, probably the far right, behind each other leaving the other line for 2 wheel bikes. If there is a problem and a bike ending up too fast or too slow, and is next to a 3 wheeler, it will not take up more than a lane's width.

[vided]

Group Riding Hmmmm, best advice I can give is don't get to close to anybody not only for their sake but for yours. Ride sweep (last) if you can. Safest place for a newbie. Ride your own ride. ( an old Harley saying) If you can figure that out it could save your life. i.e. Don't do anything that you feel uncomfortable with, or that makes your pillion rider uneasy.

My personal recipe for a safe group ride.

Jack

:agree::agree::agree: this is the best advice :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:
http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=117966&stc=1

[hecoon]

I don't know about any set rules, but I will say, that it is hard seeing around a trike and getting a visual to see if everyone is still there. Unfortunately I seem to end up being the leader since it seems like I know all the interesting places. I usually ask if the guys with 3 wheels would either ride in the rear, or be responsible for the bikes behind them.


if the entire group is made up of spyders. where does the front start everyone cant be in the REAR. I haven't heard of any wrecks caused by a group of 3wheelers. many spyder clubs and riders very few wrecks

[Bob Denman]

Group Riding Hmmmm, best advice I can give is don't get to close to anybody not only for their sake but for yours. Don't do anything that you feel uncomfortable with, or that makes your pillion rider uneasy.

My personal recipe for a safe group ride.

Jack

:agree:
Jack's got you covered... :thumbup:

[Devious56]

I'm probably going to be out of line, but, most, if not all of these answers deal with motorcycle group riding, which is something I didn't like doing when I was a motorcycle rider. And if you don't mind, I do have a couple of questions : If a trike is supposed to ride by it's self in a lane, how can a group ride staggered? And, why in the world would you ride close enough to someone that would allow them to drift into you. The crash incident that was talked about was terrible, but easily avoided. I guess my age has something to do with my outlook, I turned 76 this past July, and I've been riding since 1962. When toy rides here in Jacksonville became popular, a large group was 50 attendees, and there were very few incidents. Today, they have to limit the rides to groups of 700, and there are always problems; cars breaking into the formation because they got tires of waiting, people running back and forth in the group so they can ride with their buddies, all kinds of stupid stuff. Even the big events, bike weeks are out of hand with folks dying every year. The last bike week I attended pretty much ended my enjoyment as it seemed that most riders had no idea about motorcycle safety and just wanted to show off.

Common sense plays a big part in being successful, and consideration of the folks around you has something to do with it also. Down here in Florida, it's Biketoberfest time, so ride safe. If you are uncomfortable riding in a group, the go to the back and give yourself a little distance to avoid disaster. So down, it's not a race, enjoy the ride. I hope to see some of you at the get together at Spyder Comfort on Saturday, there's a free cook out that starts at 11:00am, and vendors are going to be available to spend your money, not to mention laser alignment being available by Mike Loescher, the guy who developed the system.

Catch you all later,
David

[FieldTester]

Ride safe, expect the unexpected. Stay in your comfort zone. The group is as strong as its weakest rider.[/QUOTE]

Could not agree more. My wife Val and I (she being a very new rider) had our first group ride last Sunday. I, having owned a Harley for many years, have a tendency to ride hard and found it difficult to keep at a safe pace for her. Understandably being in a large group requires much more consideration of others abilities for which we need to keep in mind.

My two cents.

[blacklightning]

if the entire group is made up of spyders. where does the front start everyone cant be in the REAR. I haven't heard of any wrecks caused by a group of 3wheelers. many spyder clubs and riders very few wrecks
I agree, that it is safer if the entire group is made up of 3 wheelers. But if there are 2 wheelers in the group, they will ride is staggered pattern. If that is the case, it is much harder to see everyone that is behind you if you have a spyder blocking the view. I like riding up front because it allows me to use my cruise control whenever possible. But I also cannot enjoy the scenery as much when trying to glance in the mirrors and keep track of everyone.

[Pirate looks at --]

Gather up and go over the route and signals. If possible have ryder in the middle with directions and last ryder (sweep) will help ryders with problems and will stay with them till solved makes the ryder in front of him the new sweep.
Ryde in a staggard formation when possible if not single file...arm up one finger pointing up.
Ryde with a three second spacing
If your seperated by a light find a safe curb to pull over to and allow the rest of the group to catch up.
If spacing is large and turning stay close to the corner so the following ryders can see you. Then move up and the one behind you stays.
Make sure all signaling is well in advance
When pulling into a parking area make sure you all go in to the rear allowing for all your ryder to get in. Don't pick the closest parking spot backing in and leaving the rest out in the street.
Remind everyone it is not a race..unless it is and then ya'll are justs nuts...:roflblack::roflblack:

Probably more but this will get you a good ryde....:thumbup:

Gene did a great job on this. We practice something called "bread crumbs". What this means is if the group is making a turn, and you can't see the bike behind you, you will make that turn but stay visible along the side of the road so when the trailing Ryders catch up they will know to make that turn as well. The group will never make a turn with out leaving somebody behind to help any stragglers find their way. If you are one of those stragglers you know if you don't see another Ryder, you know that the group has not turned.

Signals are very important. We practice hand signals as well as using the turn indicators. Go over all of the signals that you use before your Ryde in a group meeting. We always have a trained Road Captain lead our rydes, with another trained Road Captain as the sweep. If you group is large, I would suggest that you consider having two road captains and two sweeps. Have the groups leave 10 minutes apart and it makes it much easier to manage. This is especially true if you have a lot of lights to go through it will be much easier to keep the group together and safe.

We have a little experience with with this as we have 50 or so Club sponsored group rydes a year.

[SpyderAnn01]

For the person that did not understand how to stagger on a Spyder. The lead Spyder takes the left side of the lane, left front tire near the center line, the Spyder behind - 3 seconds behind- lines up his left front tire with the rear tire of the Spyder in front which puts him on the right side of the lane. This formation allows you to see several Spyders in front and gives you a cushion in front and alongside in the event of a sudden move.

At no time ever should two Spyders/trikes ride side by side in a single lane as was apparently the case in the PGR accident. No two wheeled motorcycles should ride side by side either, instead there should be a one second interval to the side and 3 to the front of each two wheeler.

And I also have to disagree with Jack Herbst, the safest place for a newbie in a group is at the front, directly behind the leader. They will not be subject to the whiplash effect of the group. When one rider rolls off the throttle this is amplified to the riders at the back and they will constantly be adjusting speed and in big groups this usually means going very fast to catch up.

I rode for 3 straight days with 450 motorcycles on the American Legion Legacy ride and this is how they did it and we made it with no accidents.

[Pirate looks at --]

We usually have beginning Ryders up front close to the leader. This is always a trained Road Captain who knows what they are doing and can keep an eye on the newbie. One other good point to mention so that at Stop signs and especially red lights the group should bunch up a in as tight formation as possible. This will shorten the time it takes to get through the intersection and minimize breaks in the group.

[SPECTACUALR SPIDERMAN]

Heres a link to look at to get started:
http://www.msf-usa.org/downloads/group_ride.pdf
(http://www.msf-usa.org/downloads/group_ride.pdf)
Have fun!
~Sandee~

i like the hand signal stuff on that link, i will have my wife practice them

[kbwitt]

I don't know about any set rules, but I will say, that it is hard seeing around a trike and getting a visual to see if everyone is still there. Unfortunately I seem to end up being the leader since it seems like I know all the interesting places. I usually ask if the guys with 3 wheels would either ride in the rear, or be responsible for the bikes behind them.

Spyder trikes are easier to see around than rear wheel trikes. Are front wheels are low and that is were our widest spot is. II have even seen some 2 wheel bikes with bigbags wider than our bag or front cowling width. Any one who says it is dangerous to have trikes any were but the back I think might be a danger rider and not know what he is talking about.
Kenn

[Pirate looks at --]

As a leader in the Patriot Guard Riders, between missions was an individual's choice escort of the hearse with state police doing traffic control. What that means is the official mission involved members seeing the hearse off from the airport, and receiving it at the funeral home in another city. The procession left at 7pm, westward into the sun, with darkness before arrival. My Navy Pilot instincts prevented me from sanctioning riders joining the escort. Five riders decided to go, regardless.

So with extenuating circumstances, halfway while on the interstate, there was a terrible accident involving a Harley Trike in the left half of the left lane, and a Spyder riding staggered behind in the right side of the same lane.

Louis Sevin died at the scene and Rick Kline sustained life threatening injuries which he is recovering from. Both are/were my dear friends serving in the PGR.

State Police press release: "Louis Sevin Jr. of Slidell (http://topics.nola.com/tag/slidell/index.html) was traveling west along I-10 on his Can Am motorcycle when Richard Kline's Harley Davidson drifted to the right and hit the Can Am's front left tire, police said. The contact caused the Harley to veer to the left side of the road, and the Can Am to veer to the right. The crash occurred just before 7:30 p.m"

Upon review, it was unfortunate that they were in the formation like that. The two Harley trike rear wheels plus the two Spyder front wheels added together where quite a bit wider than a lane.

So, for future missions that involve me, I will put the 3 wheel bikes of any make in the same line, probably the far right, behind each other leaving the other line for 2 wheel bikes. If there is a problem and a bike ending up too fast or too slow, and is next to a 3 wheeler, it will not take up more than a lane's width.

Two trikes should never be that close for that to happen. One or both of these riders made a very costly error. As was mentioned by Anne. Not only should they be staggered but three seconds behind the trike in front. I am very sorry for your loss, and I pray for the speedy recover of your surviving friend!

[Trbayth]

What we did at Spyderquest:

1. Road captain in the front, Tailgunner at the rear.
2. At a turn, the Road Captain signals to the person immediately behind him to pull over to the side and direct the rest of the group as to the proper turn.
3. When the Tailgunner catches up, the person that pulled over pulls out directly in front of the Tailgunner.
4. Lather, rinse, repeat

And according to my MSF course, trikes are never staggered although I do tend to stagger with the person in front of me when stopping at a light or a stop sign.

[WEB-WVR]

Group Riding Hmmmm, best advice I can give is don't get to close to anybody not only for their sake but for yours. Ride sweep (last) if you can. Safest place for a newbie. Ride your own ride. ( an old Harley saying) If you can figure that out it could save your life. i.e. Don't do anything that you feel uncomfortable with, or that makes your pillion rider uneasy.

My personal recipe for a safe group ride.

Jack

I agree with Jack.
I would say #1; RIDE YOUR OWN RIDE ! Dont ride or go faster beyond your skill level....yes I would take a rear position.
Staggered position for sure.
Know the route in case you get left behind.

Some Clubs have extensive rules, you as a group should set some ground rules.

Personally......I dont like it !!! I dont mind riding with a bud that you know and your riding style is similar. But these larger group rides, I think some are just asking for trouble.

Stay safe !

[PatriotRider]

as far as hand signals go, I strongly discourage it when I'm ride leader. I want everyone's hand on both bars at all times. I encourage everyone to pay close attention to brake lights and turn signals. and I teach throttle control. a perfect PGR escort rider never touches his brakes but learns "formation" flying with very gradual throttle inputs. we only ride staggered and have to stay closer than a recreational ride to stay up with police and to discourage vehicles pushing into the formation breaking it up into pieces.

the referenced accident's first link in the chain of events was the formation coming from 60mph to 25mph because of an errant car driver who ran up an onramp toward the procession. the Harley trike was staggered on the left side of the left lane and the spyder was staggered behind and off the corner of the trike at the right side of the same left lane. a two wheeler would be able to pass the staggered 3 wheel bike in front of them space wise if necessary. the spyder had no room in the lane to come up to the side of the trike which lowered it's escape space by 75%.
PGR processions, by the nature of the beast, are a potentially dangerous type of riding. On the other hand, I've participated or led over 300 PGR missions with never a problem that required a hospital stay. and this was the first fatality and serious injury requiring a helicopter

[blacklightning]

I have even seen some 2 wheel bikes with bigbags wider than our bag or front cowling width.

I have been around a lot of different bikes with big bags, and they all seem to be easier to see around then a spyder. The only bike close to the spyder width that I have been around is my cousins decked out goldwing 1500, which is huge.
Anyway, I am not here to argue, bust anyones bubble, or change anyones opinion. I am just stating what works for me. After talking to 3 of my close friends that have joined the spyder band wagon, we all seem to prefer that the wider bikes, and 3 wheeled bikes (spyders included) stay in the rear in order to help with visibility of the entire group.
PS, normally we keep our groups in a 10 or less number. The only exceptions are when we do group charity rides. On those, I rarely lead, and therefore, I only have 2 to keep up with the one in front of me, and the one behind me.

[PatriotRider]

PS, normally we keep our groups in a 10 or less number. The only exceptions are when we do group charity rides.

strongly agree to keep the groups small...I stick to eight when leading recreational rides...me plus 7 others...that way, I can glance in my mirrors and see the last bike...I also run a CB and try to put a CB equipped (experienced rider) last and maybe one in the middle of the pack.

[hecoon]

Spyder trikes are easier to see around than rear wheel trikes. Are front wheels are low and that is were our widest spot is. II have even seen some 2 wheel bikes with bigbags wider than our bag or front cowling width. Any one who says it is dangerous to have trikes any were but the back I think might be a danger rider and not know what he is talking about.
Kenn

amen

[hecoon]

as far as hand signals go, I strongly discourage it when I'm ride leader. I want everyone's hand on both bars at all times. I encourage everyone to pay close attention to brake lights and turn signals. and I teach throttle control. a perfect PGR escort rider never touches his brakes but learns "formation" flying with very gradual throttle inputs. we only ride staggered and have to stay closer than a recreational ride to stay up with police and to discourage vehicles pushing into the formation breaking it up into pieces.

the referenced accident's first link in the chain of events was the formation coming from 60mph to 25mph because of an errant car driver who ran up an onramp toward the procession. the Harley trike was staggered on the left side of the left lane and the spyder was staggered behind and off the corner of the trike at the right side of the same left lane. a two wheeler would be able to pass the staggered 3 wheel bike in front of them space wise if necessary. the spyder had no room in the lane to come up to the side of the trike which lowered it's escape space by 75%.
PGR processions, by the nature of the beast, are a potentially dangerous type of riding. On the other hand, I've participated or led over 300 PGR missions with never a problem that required a hospital stay. and this was the first fatality and serious injury requiring a helicopter


many of the sheriff's motormen are hurt during funeral processions..requires fast movements on the bikes between intersections

[PaladinLV]

Trikes tend to overlap tracks, especially Spyders.

From what you stated, they were not following the minimum 1 second rule for staggered positions (minimum 2 seconds in single or the bike in front of you).
Shame and sorry for your lose.

AJ


As a leader in the Patriot Guard Riders, between missions was an individual's choice escort of the hearse with state police doing traffic control. What that means is the official mission involved members seeing the hearse off from the airport, and receiving it at the funeral home in another city. The procession left at 7pm, westward into the sun, with darkness before arrival. My Navy Pilot instincts prevented me from sanctioning riders joining the escort. Five riders decided to go, regardless.

So with extenuating circumstances, halfway while on the interstate, there was a terrible accident involving a Harley Trike in the left half of the left lane, and a Spyder riding staggered behind in the right side of the same lane.

Louis Sevin died at the scene and Rick Kline sustained life threatening injuries which he is recovering from. Both are/were my dear friends serving in the PGR.

State Police press release: "Louis Sevin Jr. of Slidell (http://topics.nola.com/tag/slidell/index.html) was traveling west along I-10 on his Can Am motorcycle when Richard Kline's Harley Davidson drifted to the right and hit the Can Am's front left tire, police said. The contact caused the Harley to veer to the left side of the road, and the Can Am to veer to the right. The crash occurred just before 7:30 p.m"

Upon review, it was unfortunate that they were in the formation like that. The two Harley trike rear wheels plus the two Spyder front wheels added together where quite a bit wider than a lane.

So, for future missions that involve me, I will put the 3 wheel bikes of any make in the same line, probably the far right, behind each other leaving the other line for 2 wheel bikes. If there is a problem and a bike ending up too fast or too slow, and is next to a 3 wheeler, it will not take up more than a lane's width.

[skak72]

I love group riding! We have ridden in trike and mixed trike/bike formations, and I don't see a difference. Just keep up with the group, be aware of the rider in front of you in case they have to stop, and also be aware of the person behind you..to be sure they are still there..and have fun!

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