Every bike should have a laser alignment

[Roadster Renovations]

I was getting some feathering on my front tires and bike was slightly pulling to the right. With no one in the area to do mine, I decided to do it the unprofessional method that showed how far it was off. It was 5/8" towed out on the left and about 1/4" towed out on the right. It took maybe 1 1/2 turns on the left and 3/4 on the right. I could immediately feel the difference. The steering was almost effortless and the curves were much smoother. Before I go any farther, let me say that I plan on having it done whenever someone is available, perhaps, "Spyder in the Smokies?"
Anyway, I have got the bars slightly off, and I will eventually get them back straight. Less than 1/8" off which is not bad for no BUDS to calibrate with.
If anyone is interested on how I did it, I will post it. Otherwise, I would suggest any bike, new or new to you be checked. My tires were actually skipping they were towed out so far. And my bike had 0 miles on it when I got it. It has pulled since day one, so it was NOT set up right when sold. I'm betting every one of them are sold that way. And like Lamont says, most people doing this won't charge you if it's not off.

[hognut]

I was getting some feathering on my front tires and bike was slightly pulling to the right. With no one in the area to do mine, I decided to do it the unprofessional method that showed how far it was off. It was 5/8" towed out on the left and about 1/4" towed out on the right. It took maybe 1 1/2 turns on the left and 3/4 on the right. I could immediately feel the difference. The steering was almost effortless and the curves were much smoother. Before I go any farther, let me say that I plan on having it done whenever someone is available, perhaps, "Spyder in the Smokies?"
Anyway, I have got the bars slightly off, and I will eventually get them back straight. Less than 1/8" off which is not bad for no BUDS to calibrate with.
If anyone is interested on how I did it, I will post it. Otherwise, I would suggest any bike, new or new to you be checked. My tires were actually skipping they were towed out so far. And my bike had 0 miles on it when I got it. It has pulled since day one, so it was NOT set up right when sold. I'm betting every one of them are sold that way. And like Lamont says, most people doing this won't charge you if it's not off.

I would be very interested. Also can you tell me what BUDS are. Perhaps buddies over watching and drinking beer? :) Thanks.

[SpyderAnn01]

I would be very interested. Also can you tell me what BUDS are. Perhaps buddies over watching and drinking beer? :) Thanks.

BUDS is BRP Utility and Diagnostics Software and in the case of alignments it is used to reset the steering angle sensor and torque offset.

[Roadster Renovations]

Bombadier Updates and Diagnostic System (BUDS)
I am sure Lamont can explain better what BUDS is, short answer is that it is the BRP diagnostic software.
OK, here is how I did my alignment. I lifted my bike up on my lift adaptors. I then checked the toe in the front and the back of the front tires after I made sure I had centered the handlebars. (which were slightly off). Verified that it was for sure toed out. I then checked the rear belt alignment to make sure it was 1-2 mm off of the inside sprocket. Once I had verified that I used my homeowner drywall level and shot a vertical line from the center of the frunk to the exact center of the rear tire. I verified this by making sure that the bottom center beam was centered all the way down to the center of the rear tire. This may not have been perfect, but it had to be pretty close based upon the rear tire.
I then took a machined straight edge and gently clamped it front and back to the new bump/skid. Centering the straight edge with the beam, this gave me a fixed location front and back of the tire to measure to. I then took four measurements from the same groove on each tire front and back. As I said the left was toed out almost 3/4" and the right toed out almost 1/4". I then broke the inside lock nuts on each tie rod, then broke the outer ones loose. Starting with the left, and then the right, I adjusted in 1/2 turns until I got close on the measurements. I ended up putting about 1/16" toe-in on each side. Locked all 4 nuts down, verified that I was still good with my measurements and went on a test drive. As soon as I pulled away from the shop I noticed that the power steering was about 30-40% better than it had ever been. I went around the block and took some corners, checked to see if I was tracking straight. It was pulling just slightly right. No where near as bad as before and I am thinking it is a bad tire. (At my 3,000 mile service they noted that they were unable to completely balance the right tire as it was slightly out-of-round) This was before I knew about the tire recall. So I will probably have to have them address that or just buy two new car tires and be done with it.
Anyway, pulled back into the parking lot and called the wife. My wife has her beginners' and does not ride much. I ask her to come down and take the bike for a spin without telling her what my thoughts were. She came back and said, "It seemed to steer easier and rode straighter." Her comments pretty much mirrored mine, so it was not wishful thinking on my part.
My plan on how to straighten the handlebars (that are so slight she didn't even notice) is to turn both tie rod 1/4 of a turn equally, one in and one out. This will straighten the bars. May have to do it several times since I don't have the BUDS to help me, but it should work.
Couple of things I didn't mention or need mentioned again:
1. My lift works by lifting the wheels so the suspension is fully loaded (minus the rider, of course)
2. I will have a proper laser alignment done in the near future (if nothing else to see how close I got)
3. I am an ASE certified Master Tech in automotive and do alignments on vehicles, so this was not that hard to figure out.
4. I would caution anyone not mechanically inclined to attempt this. If you somehow screw it up the bike will go into limp-in mode until a BUDS scan and alignment can straighten it out.
5. I have looked into purchasing the laser alignment system to start doing Spyder alignments and have checked on the purchase and licensing for the BUDS system and everyone that does them pay dearly for the set-up fees, the continued yearly licensing fees, and for them to only charge what they do, they give us each a big break and probably barely make enough to make it affordable. I'm betting they are doing it more to see the Spyders reach their full potential than any profit motive.
This shadetree method of aligning my bike, as pitiful as it was, showed me that everyone should have their bike checked. If I had known what I know now before my New England trip, I would have had the alignment done before we left and saved a bunch of premature wear on my tires........

[ThreeWheels]

You're preaching to the choir here. After the several alignment issues I had on my 2010 within the first year, two sets of front tires etc, I chose to get a laser alignment immediately after I took ownership of my 2014.
I had mine done by rnet (Ron Netzley) when I owned the bike for the first 6 days and 140 miles, most of those miles were over to his shop.
It's cheap enough insurance for the tire reliability, handling improvement and an interesting day with good people. Even more important, the Spyder is happy because it gets to go to a luxurious day spa.

[Chupaca]

Squared away did mine and they do it right. If they don't align the back wheel it will not work well. They also hooked up to buds and reset things as well as a brief history on how I am ryding....it will be standard some day till then keep an eye on those fine folks at squared away they may be in your town soon....:2thumbs:

[Roadster Renovations]

Finally got back into mine and adjusted the bars straight. I just turned both tie rods the same amount in the same direction 1/4 turn, locked them in, and test rode it. Took a couple of times, but the handlebars are as straight as when I bought it! Looking forward to a laser alignment to get it finetuned in, but for now it is a darn sight better by far than it was.

[PMK]

Doc, You may have gotten a good setting with the 1/16", however from what I have been told and read, the Spyder unladdden is setup toe out slightly and will bump steer towards toe in when loaded.

It is very difficult to compare the alignment values of the laser style equipment to settings taken near the tire. The lasers are using distance ahead of the machine to set the alignment boards, allowing very fine degrees of precision.

I, like you have not done the laser alignment yet, but will at some point. I set ours by feel through corners, then did some quick checks with my simple front end alignment tools I use for other vehicles. Not near as accurate as the laser setup, but certainly provided a better machine, safer ride and peace of mind.

http://www.quicktrickalignment.com/home/qt-products/

When I was content with the results after riding and adjusting. I used the tools, and asked a friend that is heavier than I, but less than the wife and I to sit on the Spyder while I verified the toe. With him onboard, the machine went from toe out with no load to slight toe in with him aboard.

Just information and you are obviously able to make the settings you prefer.

PK

[DrewNJ]

...

[oldguyinTX]

You're preaching to the choir here. After the several alignment issues I had on my 2010 within the first year, two sets of front tires etc, I chose to get a laser alignment immediately after I took ownership of my 2014.
I had mine done by rnet (Ron Netzley) when I owned the bike for the first 6 days and 140 miles, most of those miles were over to his shop.
It's cheap enough insurance for the tire reliability, handling improvement and an interesting day with good people. Even more important, the Spyder is happy because it gets to go to a luxurious day spa.

I must have missed the hot tub at Ron's.:roflblack::roflblack:

[PMK]

What I noticed is that these machines really respond well to toe. They tighten up and feel more stable on the straights with some toe in.

Agree.

With ours, it was toe out with riders onboard when delivered. This was obvious in how it handled. After my shade tree adjustments, possibly I need more toe in, but by feel of the machine it is very close for our weight and how we ride.

As you mentioned, stability on straights is where you can set cruise and go hands free for a long way without correction. Super stable in a line, and smooth transitions in corners.

PK

[Bob Denman]

I must have missed the hot tub at Ron's.:roflblack::roflblack:

He didn't have it running for you?? :dontknow:

He did the alignment on mine; I'm as happy in a clam in wet sand, with the handling of the bike! :thumbup:

[Roadster Renovations]

We just got back from a 200 mile ride with a bunch of twisties (some real good ones, see map)
97135
This portion had the best and it had about 150 curves in 15 miles. Speed limit on the whole stretch is 45 to give you an idea. I figure good practice for the dragon next weekend.
Anyway, I was really pleased with the way the bike handled. I have fabricated something for the front springs that seems to be working very, very well. I will test it for 1,000 miles (at least) before I make them available. So far they have exceeded my expectations. Unloaded, it lifted the front of the bike less than an inch, increasing the pre-load, and stiffened each spring about 15-20%. It still takes bumps in the road pretty softly and in the twisties it really show the improvement. As far as the alignment goes, the tires are now wearing correctly and that inner feathering is going away, so it has to be pretty close. The wife remarked that the bike seemed more solid in the curves and even though I was taking them hard enough the nanny kicked in a couple of times, she had no worries. In fact, she was likening it to a roller coaster ride with the elevation changes and curves at the bottom. I will eventually get a helm cam and post this road. it's that good!

[Bob Denman]

:clap: :2thumbs: