Low Speed Wreck, Lots of Damage

[DanLong]

First- no injuries....

This weekend we were about 200 miles away on a multi day ride. Lots of technical roads in the mountains. My wife was on her RTS with a passenger on the back, I was following on my Concours. We were making a left turn onto a highway on ramp, and her left front wheel lifted up. She corrected, but by then they hit gravel on the side of the road and slid into the guardrail at around 15mph. There is a LOT of damage. The right front wheel is a full 8" behind the left wheel when you look at them. The handlebars are at almost a full left lock with the wheels straight. The seat/rear of the bike is twisted to the right. Cosmetically, the headlight is smashed, the right fender is damaged and there are scrapes on the frunk lid.

After all the technical roads we had ridden it was bizzare that this happened. The only thing we can see is that the ramp was tilted from left to right- the left side of the road was higher than the right, and that, combined with the left turn, is what caused the wheel to lift.

We had to drive back out there yesterday with a trailer and bring it home. I'm hoping it's repairable- if it's just steering components and no frame damage.

Anyone had a similar mishap, and what was the outcome?

[Bob Denman]

:shocked: Is everybody okay??
Without seeing pictures; you probably do have frame damage.
Mine was pushed back about that far also... 95717

[NoLmtz]

I hope everyone is okay and safe! I'm sorry that you had this happened and I hope I don't ever have to come back and share a similar experience.

Can't help you with the specifics of your wreck, but it sounds like a weight distribution and speed issue. If the wheel lifts up the computer should have down-throttled.

Again, sorry this happened and hope everyone is okay... that's whats important!

[PrairieSpyder]

I'm thankful there were no injuries. I hope the damage isn't too severe and she'll be back on the road again soon. :thumbup:

[DanLong]

no serious injuries... a couple bruises.

did they total yours? I'm really hoping ours is not, we got a great deal on it and wouldn't be able to replace it for the price we paid.

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj60/dan88z/Mobile%20Uploads/20140923_093834_zpssirxd0xk.jpg
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj60/dan88z/Mobile%20Uploads/20140923_093819_zpsgewzjwrz.jpg

[Bob Denman]

Mine was repaired; to the tune of $12,900...
95718

[DanLong]

Mine was repaired; to the tune of $12,900...
95718

That'd be fine with me...

[jcthorne]

Its likely total loss, or should be. The frame where those suspension arms mount is likely badly damaged. I would not want a bike that had sustained significant frame damage and been repaired. Anything CAN be repaired but should you?

Insurance does not pay what you paid for the bike, they pay what the bike is worth today to replace with like kind and quality. If the value went up in your case (not likely) they pay more than you did. ACV normally works in the insurance company favor, but not always. Been there and done that on a high dollar car wreck.

[bruiser]

Glad no one was seriously injured. Can't tell by the pictures if there is frame damage. Going to take a very knowledgeable tech to do a thorough inspection.

[DanLong]

Its likely total loss, or should be. The frame where those suspension arms mount is likely badly damaged. I would not want a bike that had sustained significant frame damage and been repaired. Anything CAN be repaired but should you?

Insurance does not pay what you paid for the bike, they pay what the bike is worth today to replace with like kind and quality. If the value went up in your case (not likely) they pay more than you did. ACV normally works in the insurance company favor, but not always. Been there and done that on a high dollar car wreck.

We paid 16k for it earlier this year. KBB was over 17k yesterday. So we'd be covered, but replacing it would not be practical, because of the cost of a new one, or even finding a deal like this on a 2012.

It just stinks that such a low speed impact causes this much damage.

[Dan McNally]

Glad there were no serious injuries . . . that is the most important outcome, here.

[Bob Denman]

This is why I'm a bit concerned about the SST framework; they just don't take impacts all that well. They twist! :yikes:
I have to go get a couple of pictures of the frame that came out from under mine... It shows how unsuported and weak these actually are.

[BajaRon]

I am very glad no one was hurt.

A wheel lift can be unnerving, but it is rarely reason to make much more than a minor correction. In almost every case, the wheel will come down with no harm, no foul. The perception of a wheel lift is much worse than the reality.

It may well be that the passenger was surprised by the off camber, felt like they were losing balance, grabbed a hand rail and hoisted themselves against the lean. The farther back and the higher the weight, the more affect it has on how much the Spyder leans.

Again, glad everyone is ok. But it doesn't hurt to mentally prepare for as many 'Surprises' as you can. Like, what will I do if an animal runs out in front of me. If you're mentally prepared it can greatly improve the outcome if it ever does happen.

[Jim&Teresa]

Sorry to hear about this accident! I am glad you are all OK...that's the main thing - it could have been much worse! Good luck with the repair! :thumbup:

[ChasCS]

Always asking for pics...
These threads are my very least favorite to read, but we must. The lessons taught in these accident reports are what may keep some of us alive.

Yes, it's disturbing that these kind of things ever even happen, to good folks.

Let's hope you can get it fixed or replaced and have you back on the road very soon.

Wishing you only good luck, with much happier times ahead...

Chas

[WA5VHU]

Glad the ryder and passenger are OK!

Between the DW and I plus some stuff in the bags we are nearing the published weight load limit for our 2011 RT. When we were out the other day with a group of Spyders we occasionally lifted a wheel on the corners when keeping up with the other ryders, many of which were single ryders so they were much lighter than us and quicker around the corners. In addition, I like to goose it around the corners so that doesn't help! I just ignore it and let the nanny do it's thing if it wants to. We have not been anywhere near turning over, just feel the load come off the tire and possibly some traction loss but that traction loss could be imagined. When it happens I have to remind myself to just continue to hold or turn the handlebars in the direction I was going and just drive the Spyder! Reacting or over-reacting could be a really bad thing. The very last time it happened I caught myself (for a very brief moment) trying to correct by turning into oncoming traffic!!!

It is hard for me to get a tire off the ground with only me on it - I've tried - and I'm the heavier one of us. I need to remember when both of us are on we are top heavy and I should either take the corners a bit slower or just keep on - she says as long as we don't roll over it's all fun!

:clap:

[jcthorne]

We paid 16k for it earlier this year. KBB was over 17k yesterday. So we'd be covered, but replacing it would not be practical, because of the cost of a new one, or even finding a deal like this on a 2012.

It just stinks that such a low speed impact causes this much damage.


I dont think finding another used 2012 would be all that difficult. These spyders are not all that rare.

[DanLong]

I dont think finding another used 2012 would be all that difficult. These spyders are not all that rare.

True- I have been searching cycletrader and they are out there, just have to travel to get them.

Gotta wait and see what the ins co says... might be a week til they have someone come out. :(

[waffle.snot]

After having our own accident just two weeks ago (Fall down Go boom boom thread) I can sympathize with you totally. It is a shock to have tipping issues with a trike that isn't supposed to. Our 2012 RT will be in the shop for quite a while getting a lot of new tupperware and we are missing her greatly.

Most importantly, all humans involved are OK! everything else is a learning experience, for you and all the rest of us who read and discuss your mishap.

[CentralCoastCA]

Glad that everyone is okay and hoping you can be up running soon on a Spyder

[jcthorne]

True- I have been searching cycletrader and they are out there, just have to travel to get them.

Gotta wait and see what the ins co says... might be a week til they have someone come out. :(

Dont forget that if there is not a comparable unit locally, the cost of transport to get the unit to you is part of the claim when figuring price for settlement. Not just KBB.

[daveinva]

I can attest to off-camber roads being a real :cus: on the Spyder. Many a mountain curve has surprised me with a "weeeeee!!!" moment as a result.

That said, my observations:

1. It's not really necessary to do it while riding casually, but when riding technically, I *always* shift my weight to the inside. Even a single butt-cheek's worth of slip on the seat is almost always more than enough to keep the wheel planted.

2. The Spyder does have a *little* slip before the traction control kicks in. It won't kick the tail out as far as an actual drift, but there's enough there to help you around corners-- it just takes practice to figure out where the "sweet spot" of braking, cornering, and acceleration is.

3. An aftermarket anti-sway bar and upgraded shocks is always an improvement. The only downside to them, I feel, is that while it increases your performance margin, it simultaneously reduces your safety margin. Meaning, with a stock Spyder, the Nanny will kick in long before you hit the edge of the envelope. With a better bar and shocks, you'll be able to take corners at greater speeds before the Nanny kicks in-- which means that, when the Nanny finally *does* kick in, it's trying to save you in a more challenging situation with a lot less margin of error. Thus, when riding, YOU are even more responsible for your safety margin. Caveat emptor.

Anyway, my biggest piece of advice while riding is to always expect the unexpected (which, I guess, makes it all expected, no? ;)). Every blind corner will be off-camber, covered in gravel, infested with deer, and half-blocked by a logging truck driven by a dozing 95-year-old wondering why he can't get his Jitterbug to text. Do that, and you'll be safe! :doorag:

[Kratos]

Yeah, that's a total loss. You'll be in another spyder no problem. And like you've already found, the deals are definitely out there.

[ChasCS]

My insurance company, offers a depreciation waver for $50.00 a year.

Well worth it, if ever needed...

Chas

[rgk]

My insurance company, offers a depreciation waver for $50.00 a year.

Well worth it, if ever needed...

Chas

That sounds like a good deal.

[ARtraveler]

First of all, glad to hear that there were no physical injuries.

The crush factor in accidents these days absorbs impact and in a lot of cases helps save more severe passenger injuries.

Due to the high cost of repairs, a good argument to keep full coverage on the :spyder2: even after they are paid for.

Please keep us posted on how the claims process goes.

[Flanker]

I am very glad no one was hurt.

A wheel lift can be unnerving, but it is rarely reason to make much more than a minor correction. In almost every case, the wheel will come down with no harm, no foul. The perception of a wheel lift is much worse than the reality.

It may well be that the passenger was surprised by the off camber, felt like they were losing balance, grabbed a hand rail and hoisted themselves against the lean. The farther back and the higher the weight, the more affect it has on how much the Spyder leans.

Again, glad everyone is ok. But it doesn't hurt to mentally prepare for as many 'Surprises' as you can. Like, what will I do if an animal runs out in front of me. If you're mentally prepared it can greatly improve the outcome if it ever does happen.

Ditto!

[DanLong]

small update, insurance guy was here today. Never saw a Spyder before so it's being towed up to the dealer tomorrow to have them give an itemized list of what it needs.

[ChasCS]

Hope upon hope it's not a write off...

Chas

[DanLong]

got it towed up to the dealer yesterday. They haven't torn into it yet (there are 2 other wrecks ahead of ours!) but the tech called me and said it looks like the frame is bent along with the front end stuff that we had figured on. He said it'll most likely be repaired, not totaled. That would include replacing the frame, not fixing it. It'll probably be a week before we get any idea of the estimate. He said that the insurance company will consider it a total loss if the estimate gets to around 80% of the value. Fingers crossed!

My wife is doing better. She's got a nice bruise on her calf where the passenger kicked her, a sore knee, and her hand is sore.

[Bob Denman]

The frames cost about $1400... :shocked:
And he's correct; once the repair bill reaches 80% of the machine's ACV, the Companies usually total them...
Good Luck!

[ChasCS]

I hope she feels better soon too, mentally as well as the minor hurts. You both must be so let down right about now, at this time.
But hey, look forward a few weeks or so, and you will have this, as only a near past memory.

When you get the new bike, please throw away those nasty pics of the awful accident...

Wishing only awesome good luck with what ever transpires next, & rooting for you of only the very best outcome. I'm sure we all are...
Fingers crossed.

Chas

[Dgjason]

My wife is doing better. She's got a nice bruise on her calf where the passenger kicked her, a sore knee, and her hand is sore.[/QUOTE]

Good luck with everything Dan. If you are like me I would rather be injured than my wife.

This post reminds me of the "I have been noticing" post. Great info, commentary and caring.
Doesn't get any better than that...:clap:

[jcthorne]

The frames cost about $1400... :shocked:
And he's correct; once the repair bill reaches 80% of the machine's ACV, the Companies usually total them...
Good Luck!


I know for a fact that the rule for State Farm is 75% of the difference between ACV and Salvage. For most vehicles its a small difference between the two as salvage value is usually around 5 to 10% of ACV but...for some vehicles with very high salvage values, the damage can be rather small and cause a vehicle to be totaled.

If they replace the frame, be sure they include the cost of a BRP provided replacement VIN tag or you will have lots of difficulty later. Good shops know this but it is easily overlooked and you don't get them overnight due to the red tape and paperwork involved. Do not accept the repairs if you cannot identify the VIN ON THE FRAME as yours and matches the title.

As this is an 'at fault' repair being paid by YOUR insurance, there is no recovery of diminished value in most states, but the bike once repaired with a new frame is lower, much lower in value than an undamaged one. It will be reflected against the VIN on the tracking services and insurance data bases.

I do wish you all the luck in getting the repairs done correctly and quickly and your riding again soon.

[Tango]

Glad everyone is ok. IMHO Pray for it to be totaled. :pray: Better off on a new one. nojoke Tom :trike:

[flaggerphil]

Could the passenger have been leaning the wrong way?

[Roadster Renovations]

First of all, glad no one was hurt, Thank God!

I am by no means an expert on the bike, but I have had mine lifted with an unobstructed view and there is not a lot of frame support. A lot of tubular and square stock thin wall steel, which is great for it's flexibility, but is not strong and once it has been bent almost impossible to straighten and it will always be weak in that area possibly effecting tire alignment and handling. So even if they fix it, you may have problems in the future because of it.

I know this is after the fact, and I am not sure if anyone else but me did this, but when I first started riding my Roadster, I went over into a large open parking lot and purposely caused the front tires to raise by accelerating and sharply turning. This gave me an idea of how well the nanny worked, what was required by me to correct it, and what I could get away with. Once I was comfortable with one up, I added my wife so that we could see exactly what the bike did in certain situations. This has been invaluable several times, the latest was a near miss pulling out onto a two lane road with blind corners. If the guy had been running the speed limit (who does nowadays) we would have had plenty of time. As it was, towing a fully loaded trailer, I had to stand on the throttle to get out of the way and quickly make a 90 degree turn to not run off the road. I waited until the last moment to turn knowing that as soon as the left wheel left the pavement, the nanny would slow the bike down. If that had not been done right, either the bike or the trailer would have been broadsided. As it was, it was close. The left wheel raised at least 12-15". Training the wife to lean with me also greatly helped keep us from flipping.
I know you probably had already done those things and I said all that more for the new riders to maybe save them grief.
Again I am so glad you guys are alright. And I hope they can fix the bike. Just accept nothing but a complete return to original condition.

[DanLong]

Update- the estimate is in, $7900.

Our dealer says BRP makes them buy x amount of parts each year, so they asked if we'd be willing to let them order our parts as part of that order. The only issue is they don't do that order for a couple more weeks. We figured that we'd let them do it considering my wife isn't a cold weather rider and if we get it back in Nov or January, won't make a difference because she won't be using it anyway. The dealer is going to take care of us with some other things in return. Some mutual back scratching to benefit all.

[Bob Denman]

Glad to hear that you've got a workable plan... working! :thumbup:

[SpyderAnn01]

My insurance company, offers a depreciation waver for $50.00 a year.

Well worth it, if ever needed...

Chas

Is yours limited by the age of the Spyder? I have it but it is only good for the current model year and one year older. So the 2012 would not be covered under my coverage.

[Roadster Renovations]

Glad it can be fixed!

[Bob Denman]

Some Companies are starting to offer this incentive. ;)
The problem is... you DO end up paying fo rit... :shocked:

NOTHING is free, when you deal with insurance. :banghead: