klunky shifting PLEASE HELP!

[blackcrowe]

I've been driving an 2014 ST Limited for about a month now and I cannot figure this out on getting smooth shifting. Its always inconsistent. I don't know if it's normal or the bike or just me but in any case it just doesn't seam to be good for the bike but I could be wrong. I'm new to motorcycle riding but I've been driving a car with manual shift for about 25 years so know the concept. I've been told by Can Am that the shifting varies around 4-5k but also depends on the load so it's just me on the bike and no other load, and to go to the dealer. I don't want to go to the dealer yet if it's normal or just me. I tried varying the RPMs when shifting and cannot get a smooth transition except for maybe 3rd to 4th which is around 3800 RPMs and 4th to 5th which is around 3800-4200 RPMS. But again it's inconsistent even in those gears and even they klunk sometimes. Shifting in reverse there always a klunk, Shifting from 1st into 2nd is the worst and just about every time there's a klunk. And from 2nd to 3rd but not as bad as 1st to 2nd.

Could someone please help me out here if experiencing or experienced this issue?

[JKMSPYDER]

The problem may be that you are shifting at too low of RPM's. You will get a klunking sound when shifting from neutral to first or neutral to reverse. But once in first get your RPM's up to 5200 to 5700 before upshifting and don't roll back on the throttle when you do. The Spyder should shift smoothly. The 998 v-twin likes high RPM's.

[ARtraveler]

I've been driving an 2014 ST Limited for about a month now and I cannot figure this out on getting smooth shifting. Its always inconsistent. I don't know if it's normal or the bike or just me but in any case it just doesn't seam to be good for the bike but I could be wrong. I'm new to motorcycle riding but I've been driving a car with manual shift for about 25 years so know the concept. I've been told by Can Am that the shifting varies around 4-5k but also depends on the load so it's just me on the bike and no other load, and to go to the dealer. I don't want to go to the dealer yet if it's normal or just me. I tried varying the RPMs when shifting and cannot get a smooth transition except for maybe 3rd to 4th which is around 3800 RPMs and 4th to 5th which is around 3800-4200 RPMS. But again it's inconsistent even in those gears and even they klunk sometimes. Shifting in reverse there always a klunk, Shifting from 1st into 2nd is the worst and just about every time there's a klunk. And from 2nd to 3rd but not as bad as 1st to 2nd.

Could someone please help me out here if experiencing or experienced this issue?

Optimum shift point on the 998 Rotax seems to be in the 4500 - 5500 rpm range. I usually find that gives seamless shifts. There is always a klunk from neutral to first. It seems to become quieter after the :spyder2: has warmed up a bit. I usually manually downshift at between 4500 and 5000--once again resulting in seamless shifts. Second to 1st at 2500 or so.

If you are experiencing erratic klunks and noise between gears you might give the oil level a check. Low oil can have an adverse reaction on the tranny.

Beyond the above, it may be necessary to take the vehicle into the dealer for a look see.

[blackcrowe]

Appreciate the replies.

I check the oil quite often, It looks to be slightly above half way. That's another story. I really can't stand the way to check the oil with these. It's really not as clearly defined like it is when checking the oil cold.

Really about 5K? I've never taken it above that but I'll try that next time. And that's for all the gears? I wasn't sure with revving it that high, didn't seem right to me. Especially in stop and go traffic which I do have to contend with on part of my commute. I'd be revving it in first. I asked this question when I first got the bike and I got varying answers from 3800 to 4200 and from Can Am 4-5k. Nothing seems to work but I'll try your recommendations and see or next stop is back to the dealer.

[Highwayman2013]

He has an ST.

[wyliec]

He has an ST.

Is there a difference in shifting an RT and an ST?

[cohoff]

When I had my 2012 RT I never shifted before at least 5200-5500 rpms. the 998 rotax needs the higher rpms for better performance. The only time i was in 5th gear was when I was going at least 65 mph. You are doing your machine an injustice if you don't start shifting at higher rpms. downshift when you are at 4000 rpms.

[Chupaca]

you are talking about an semi automatic transmission. 1st and reverse will klunk because you are engaging an idle transmission to a running engine. Once in gear both will be running making the shifts smoother. Your clutch is not fully engaged till over 3,500 rpm's making shifts around there klunk so the higher the smoother. These are high rpm engines and though mine is manual I run upwards 6,000 and shifts are smooth even without using the clutch. It is a bit hard to get used to but once you find the spot it will become second nature....:thumbup:

[wis2013rtltd]

Are you?

[missouriboy]

...Your clutch is not fully engaged till over 3,500 rpm...Are you sure about that? I've been relying on what I read previously on here, that SE5 clutch lockup is at 3,200 rpm +/- 200 rpm. For a maximum of 3,400 rpm with any slippage happening. Wasn't it Scotty who wrote that?

[CanAmKidd]

I shift my RSS at a wide range of RPMs with out clunking. It just takes practice. Learning to shift without using the clutch helps. With practice you can shift it smooth as an automatic.

[DrewNJ]

You can't compare motorcycle shifting to car shifting. They are world's apart.
First, your shifting at way to low of rpm's. Again, it's not a car and your going to run much higher rpm's. A good rule of thumb is to double your car rpm's and that's about what you'll see on th bike.
Second, the transmission gears are straight cut gears. This makes it super easy to shift with no clutch/synchronization but the shifts can feel clunky at times.
Third, it's a wet clutch. Shift feel can change quite a bit depending on oil level as well as oil temp.

Basically, everything your experiencing is normal, especially when your shifting way to early. Double your revs and you'll be fine.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

[OJ UK]

From the wording of your post I'm assuming that you have a manual transmission. (SM5)

(Wrong again!!)
As the guys above has said, you need to apply more revs but the main obstacle to smooth shifting
through the box on a bike is familiarity and practice. You will soon become accustomed to the
amount of movement you have to apply to the clutch lever and synchronising that with foot shifting.

All of the bikes I've owned 'klunk' when engaging first gear from neutral and the Spyder will do this
shifting into reverse also.

[blackcrowe]

Thanks for all the replies.

I have the SE5. Not letting up on the throttle when shifting. The consensus seems to be over 5K RPMs. I'll try that when riding today.

[IGETAROUND]

I've been driving an 2014 ST Limited for about a month now and I cannot figure this out on getting smooth shifting. Its always inconsistent. I don't know if it's normal or the bike or just me but in any case it just doesn't seam to be good for the bike but I could be wrong. I'm new to motorcycle riding but I've been driving a car with manual shift for about 25 years so know the concept. I've been told by Can Am that the shifting varies around 4-5k but also depends on the load so it's just me on the bike and no other load, and to go to the dealer. I don't want to go to the dealer yet if it's normal or just me. I tried varying the RPMs when shifting and cannot get a smooth transition except for maybe 3rd to 4th which is around 3800 RPMs and 4th to 5th which is around 3800-4200 RPMS. But again it's inconsistent even in those gears and even they klunk sometimes. Shifting in reverse there always a klunk, Shifting from 1st into 2nd is the worst and just about every time there's a klunk. And from 2nd to 3rd but not as bad as 1st to 2nd.

Could someone please help me out here if experiencing or experienced this issue?
Black Crowe; please note that all of the information you have been given is for the 998 Rotax, not the triple your riding. Might be helpful to identify whether you have a manual shift or the SE transmission. I'm sure others will chime in with more accurate information once this is clarified for them. :popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:

[wyliec]

Black Crowe; please note that all of the information you have been given is for the 998 Rotax, not the triple your riding. Might be helpful to identify whether you have a manual shift or the SE transmission. I'm sure others will chime in with more accurate information once this is clarified for them. :popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:

I thought the 2014 RT was the only triple. The ST is 998cc; isn't it?

[EnjoyingTheRyde]

I thought the 2014 RT was the only triple. The ST is 998cc; isn't it?

You are correct, the triple is in the RT only and blackcrowe is riding a 2014 ST Limited with the SE5.

[Magdave]

Thanks for all the replies.

I have the SE5. Not letting up on the throttle when shifting. The consensus seems to be over 5K RPMs. I'll try that when riding today.
If you have the throttle twisted too much it will not be a super smooth shift. If you are accelerating lightly it will be.I shift between 5&6k usually sometimes up to 8k when winding it out. That said I still blip it on the shift( when running hard) and you cannot tell I shifted other than an RPM change. I have been working on trying to see how smooth I can shift at various acceleration point and it works for me it feels like a CVT with just a slight blip. I know you do not have to but with my wife on the back I try to make the ride as smooth as possible.:thumbup:

[ARtraveler]

Is there a difference in shifting an RT and an ST?

On the 2014's yes. 998 vs. 1330 ACE engine on the RT.

[mob133]

another thing is don't run the rpms up then settle before you shift if your running at say 53oo rpm and 28 mph then traffic opens allowing you to increase speed be sure your in the throttle before shifting if not it will klunk
Thanks for all the replies.

I have the SE5. Not letting up on the throttle when shifting. The consensus seems to be over 5K RPMs. I'll try that when riding today.

[blackcrowe]

Thanks again, I appreciate all your replies...

I should have made it clear earlier that I have the SE5, Rotax 998cc. Maybe you guys replying that shift into the 5500 to 6k RPMs have the manual shift and it might be different I don't know. But I took it out today and 1st to 2nd klunks no matter F'n RPM I'm at (sorry but I'm PO'd right now). I tried shifting over 5k - 5500 range and at that RPM the bike is screaming in 1st. That 5k-5500 RPM range is equivalent to about 35 MPH which is what I have to get to in order to shift to 2nd? so driving through areas where the speed limit is 25 MPH means I'm 10 miles over the speed limit before I'm going into 2nd. Maybe you guys who are shifting at that 5-6k RPM do have the SM5 or maybe the RT or RS are different.

After much playing around today this is what works for me and can get a smooth gear shift in the later gears, so essentially Can Am was correct in stating between 4 - 5k. Getting into the 5-6k range I'm practically gunning the bike every time to shift gears.

1st - 2nd = WTF?

2nd - 3rd = 4200 RPMs
3rd - 4th = 4200-4800 RPMs
4th - 5th = 4800 RPMs

So I guess I need to contact the dealer. OK so there is a klunk from neutral to 1st or to reverse but the 1st to 2nd is troublesome to me.

[blackcrowe]

Black Crowe; please note that all of the information you have been given is for the 998 Rotax, not the triple your riding. Might be helpful to identify whether you have a manual shift or the SE transmission. I'm sure others will chime in with more accurate information once this is clarified for them. :popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:

Thanks. I'm not sure what you mean by triple your ride? Haven't heard that before.

[Jester]

Thanks. I'm not sure what you mean by triple your ride? Haven't heard that before.
Some of us mistakenly think you are riding the new '14 RT which has the three (triple) cylinder Rotax but you have the original V Twin that easily revs to 9,ooo RPMs

i do have the new block and it clunks a lot!

[AlEverett]

Black Crowe-- When I got my 2013 with the same set up as you it really bothered me to hear the engine at 5000 RPM is first gear. You get used to it. My bike won't even shift in 2nd until about 27-28 mph. I ride around a lot in first gear. In 2nd gear I ride all day in 35mph speed zones. It doesn't hurt the bike at all to be at those rpms. It just takes getting used to the sound. I bought another Spyder, a 2014 RTs, and now I am getting used to lower rpms and shifting sooner and more often. Ride that 998 Rotax at 4500 to 6000 rpm all day. It will like it and be very responsive. You won't hurt anything. The clunking from 1st to 2nd only happens to me if my rpms are low or if I let up on the throttle. Stay on the throttle nice and steady and you'll do fine.

[DrewNJ]

The gear ratios on the se and sm are the same. You don't need to scream it down the road in first. 5k rpms is not screaming either...Shift to second whenever you want to cruise out of the neighborhood.
You need to forget what you think you know about what proper shifting is on the bike. It is NOTHING like a car. They are totally different.

Sent from my Venue 8 3830 using Tapatalk

[900Dave]

That is when I normally shift up on my 13 ST and that is when I am just out for a casual ride. when I ride alone and get a little agressive in the corners I will take it up to 7000 to 8000 rpms or even a little higher.

When you shift at 6000 that keeps the rpms above 4500 in the next gear. If you are riding below 4000 rpms you are "lugging" the 998! Dont do that!

[otter28169]

I try to always keep my RPMs over 4000, Any lower and it sounds like it is lugging, and the acceleration is sluggish. I have also found that I seem to get better mileage when I "play" than when I am "just cruisin".

Just sayin'...........

[ARtraveler]

Thanks again, I appreciate all your replies...

I should have made it clear earlier that I have the SE5, Rotax 998cc. Maybe you guys replying that shift into the 5500 to 6k RPMs have the manual shift and it might be different I don't know. But I took it out today and 1st to 2nd klunks no matter F'n RPM I'm at (sorry but I'm PO'd right now). I tried shifting over 5k - 5500 range and at that RPM the bike is screaming in 1st. That 5k-5500 RPM range is equivalent to about 35 MPH which is what I have to get to in order to shift to 2nd? so driving through areas where the speed limit is 25 MPH means I'm 10 miles over the speed limit before I'm going into 2nd. Maybe you guys who are shifting at that 5-6k RPM do have the SM5 or maybe the RT or RS are different.

After much playing around today this is what works for me and can get a smooth gear shift in the later gears, so essentially Can Am was correct in stating between 4 - 5k. Getting into the 5-6k range I'm practically gunning the bike every time to shift gears.

1st - 2nd = WTF?

2nd - 3rd = 4200 RPMs
3rd - 4th = 4200-4800 RPMs
4th - 5th = 4800 RPMs

So I guess I need to contact the dealer. OK so there is a klunk from neutral to 1st or to reverse but the 1st to 2nd is troublesome to me.

Sorry to hear the suggestions seem to be not working out for you. The shift rpm's are indeed ballpark 5000 (4500-5500). I am actually a bit conservative on that. Others have said to wind it out into the mid 7's. I have had both versions of transmissions (SM5 and SE5) on the 998 Rotax.

The engine is loud and seems to be screaming when you get to 5000 rpms. This is where the power band begins.

Driving through town (35 speed limit) I find I am usually in first to second gear. (45 speed limit) in third gear. (55 speed limit) fourth gear. 65 + then I use fifth gear.

Regardless of speed, I always try to keep the Spyder in the 5000 rpm range.

If you are coming off of a two wheeler, these rpm's and gears for riding seem weird and a bit strung out. They do work, they are recommended, and your :spyder2: will shift smooth and happy. If you are experiencing klunky shifts and following the above, you may have a mechanical issue with your tranny.

The new ACE 1330 is a whole new animal and likes to be shifted at 2500-2750--but that is a whole different story.