BRP issues Campaign to address heat issue for 2013 models!!!

[Spyder Tony]

I just got back from the dealership and they have informed me that BRP Campaign#'s 2013-0015 and 2013-0016 are in. It is a 3-part campaign:

A) Seal the front fuse boxes

B) Update ECM Software

C) Replace upper belt guard retaining screws

It is "B" which addresses the problem termed as "Heat Soak" by BRP. It is a B.U.D.S. update. Attached is my copy of the campaign notice which includes more specific details. I cannot attest to how effective this fix is, as I have not had it done on the '13 ST-L yet (as I was at the shop about my '08 GS)...but I did set a date to have it done. I will provide an update once the work has been completed. In the meantime, if you own a 2013 model year Spyder...call your dealer to schedule your appointment, as i'm sure there will be quite a few bikes wanting to get this done all at once...similar to the heat shield campaign from last year.

[jaherbst]

I just got back from the dealership and they have informed me that BRP Campaign#'s 2013-0015 and 2013-0016 are in. It is a 3-part campaign:A) Seal the front fuse boxesB) Update ECM SoftwareC) Replace upper belt guard retaining screwsIt is "B" which addresses the problem termed as "Heat Soak" by BRP. It is a B.U.D.S. update. Attached is my copy of the campaign notice which includes more specific details. I cannot attest to how effective this fix is, as I have not had it done on the '13 ST-L yet (as I was at the shop about my '08 GS)...but I did set a date to have it done. I will provide an update once the work has been completed. In the meantime, if you own a 2013 model year Spyder...call your dealer to schedule your appointment, as i'm sure there will be quite a few bikes wanting to get this done all at once...similar to the heat shield campaign from last year.Don't see that the three items address the actual heat. Will only keep the overheat warning from coming on and sets a higher perameter for that to happen???????

[Spyder Tony]

Don't see that the three items address the actual heat. Will only keep the overheat warning from coming on and sets a higher perameter for that to happen???????

I don't want to reinvent the wheel, so check out this thread to see those who have done the campaign and their claims of a cooler running Spyder. CARB states are a factor though:

http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?62393-Bulletin-2013-9

[GeoffCee]

Don't see that the three items address the actual heat. Will only keep the overheat warning from coming on and sets a higher perameter for that to happen???????

The last sentence in item 2 talks about the rider feeling excessive heat. That is the problem with some 2013 models? It sounds like an attempt to fix that as well as correcting an erroneous hot code when the engine is cold. Sounds like progress to me. :)

[SNOOPY]

I don't like the part about sealing the fuse boxes, this looks like the frunk needs to come off to do this and this interferes w how I have some things wired and will probably have to go behind dealer to recheck my wiring when they finish. Pain in the butt. :(

[3 Wheel Addict]

If this a CARB issue then it has something to do with the tuning and mixture of the engine, maybe they found out that the 13,s are running too lean. Clearly something changed from 12 to 13? I think they are coating the connections on the back of the fuse boxes because they have had some water issues as well.

[Jackspyder]

If this a CARB issue then it has something to do with the tuning and mixture of the engine, maybe they found out that the 13,s are running too lean. Clearly something changed from 12 to 13? I think they are coating the connections on the back of the fuse boxes because they have had some water issues as well.

Is the layout/ location of the motor, gas tank, pipes, and other internal components different in a 2013 than 2012? If they are different, it could play a partial role in some of the issues.

[Bob Denman]

The new frame DID end up moving some components around... :shocked:

[taxmyzer]

I hate when dealer blames owner first. This bulletin proves there was a problem with seals on fuse boxes and I was not to blame when washing the bike. I hope this truly solves the problem. :clap::clap::clap:

[Bob Denman]

Unfortunately; they've got to look at all of the possibilities when confronted with something that is still unclear... :shocked:
But; you certainly WERE vindicated!!!! :2thumbs::ohyea::yes::ohyea:

[Sarge707]

I see the key words as "May Slightly?" :dontknow:

[3 Wheel Addict]

I hate when dealer blames owner first. This bulletin proves there was a problem with seals on fuse boxes and I was not to blame when washing the bike. I hope this truly solves the problem. :clap::clap::clap:

That's right you had issues with water shorting something out and the dealer said it was because you washed the bike. I thought I remembered there was somebody with an issue about water in a connector or something.

[ARtraveler]

Will be waiting and watching to see if the heat issue fix (the ECM fix) helps in the problems that some are having. :popcorn::popcorn:

[jaherbst]

I see the key words as "May Slightly?" :dontknow:Exactly what does that mean?????? Does not sound promising at all. There go my hopes. Why don't they put a city/traffic switch on the damn fan so we can run it when not on the highway? Or how about setting the parameters lower on the ECM so the fan comes on at a lower setting. It may also be a temperature control switch. Change it! This I know would help!Install a second fan (smaller) to keep airflow moving front to back under the tupper ware and around the tank. Constant or controlled by ECM to come on at lower speeds and when stopped with the engine running. Too much heat in one area is simply a matter of airflow. Come on BRP this cannot be all that difficult to solve.

[NetJunkie]

Exactly what does that mean?????? Does not sound promising at all. There go my hopes. Why don't they put a city/traffic switch on the damn fan so we can run it when not on the highway? Or how about setting the parameters lower on the ECM so the fan comes on at a lower setting. It may also be a temperature control switch. Change it! This I know would help!Install a second fan (smaller) to keep airflow moving front to back under the tupper ware and around the tank. Constant or controlled by ECM to come on at lower speeds and when stopped with the engine running. Too much heat in one area is simply a matter of airflow. Come on BRP this cannot be all that difficult to solve.

But the fan really isn't the problem. That's a nuisance. The problem is gas boiling in tanks for some people and the seat so hot you can't sit on it. THAT is what BRP should fix.

[3 Wheel Addict]

But the fan really isn't the problem. That's a nuisance. The problem is gas boiling in tanks for some people and the seat so hot you can't sit on it. THAT is what BRP should fix.

Maybe this "tune" that they are going to install does indeed reduce some extra exhaust temps. The engine temp is controlled by a thermostat so that temp is what it is, but since most of that heat is displaced by the radiator then the only source left of our "extra" heat is the radiating heat from the exhaust/engine if they can reduce that by even 10 or 20 degrees it would make a noticeable difference, that alone with everybody "additional fixes" (wrapping pipes, extra insulation, extra vents) could prove to be the cure or at least some relief??

[Bob Denman]

Face it folks... :shocked:
This is probably going to be a long and arduous journey...
It will take more than one approach; to more than one system...
But BRP will figure it out! :thumbup:

[jcthorne]

Picked up Louise new RT-S on Sat. She got a chance to put a few miles on it yesterday. It has the new ECM mapping released Friday. Upon parking in our garage last night and closing the doors.....about 10 minutes later went back out to the garage and was overwhelmed with gas fumes. Had to open garage doors and air out for an hour or so.

In the two weeks since I fixed mine, had gotten into the habit of not leaving the garage open any more. Was no longer any need. So much for that. Until she gets past 600 miles and the first checkup, I will not do any mods other than CanAm accessories she ordered.

But its obvious that while the new mapping may help, IT DOES NOT CURE THE FUEL BOILING and FUME ISSUE.

I still plan on getting the update on mine as soon as the fuse box parts are available and they can do the whole bulletin at once.

Keep working on it BRP. you are not there yet.

[jaherbst]

Picked up Louise new RT-S on Sat. She got a chance to put a few miles on it yesterday. It has the new ECM mapping released Friday. Upon parking in our garage last night and closing the doors.....about 10 minutes later went back out to the garage and was overwhelmed with gas fumes. Had to open garage doors and air out for an hour or so.In the two weeks since I fixed mine, had gotten into the habit of not leaving the garage open any more. Was no longer any need. So much for that. Until she gets past 600 miles and the first checkup, I will not do any mods other than CanAm accessories she ordered.But its obvious that while the new mapping may help, IT DOES NOT CURE THE FUEL BOILING and FUME ISSUE.I still plan on getting the update on mine as soon as the fuse box parts are available and they can do the whole bulletin at once.Keep working on it BRP. you are not there yet.Just as I previously stated. We need more airflow under the tupperware flowing front to back. How about a fan Brp.

[jaherbst]

But the fan really isn't the problem. That's a nuisance. The problem is gas boiling in tanks for some people and the seat so hot you can't sit on it. THAT is what BRP should fix.The extra fan (small) would go under the tupperware to move air front to back when stopped or slowed in city traffic. Thus replacing heated air with ambient air under the tupperware. (under the plastic, around the engine and tank)

[3 Wheel Addict]

Picked up Louise new RT-S on Sat. She got a chance to put a few miles on it yesterday. It has the new ECM mapping released Friday. Upon parking in our garage last night and closing the doors.....about 10 minutes later went back out to the garage and was overwhelmed with gas fumes. Had to open garage doors and air out for an hour or so.

In the two weeks since I fixed mine, had gotten into the habit of not leaving the garage open any more. Was no longer any need. So much for that. Until she gets past 600 miles and the first checkup, I will not do any mods other than CanAm accessories she ordered.

But its obvious that while the new mapping may help, IT DOES NOT CURE THE FUEL BOILING and FUME ISSUE.

I still plan on getting the update on mine as soon as the fuse box parts are available and they can do the whole bulletin at once.

Keep working on it BRP. you are not there yet.

Afraid of that, small fix for part of it but clearly not a cure. I keep telling myself... baby steps but we will get there! Mine has had issues with the hot temp stumbling on acceleration so if it cures that i'll be happy for that one!!

[Ramjet]

Face it folks... :shocked:
This is probably going to be a long and arduous journey...
It will take more than one approach; to more than one system...
But BRP will figure it out! :thumbup:


Just cannot figure out if you just an optimist or a tried and true BRP Cheerleader Bob? :yes:

[frenchek]

I have developed a theory that lean mixture is about 80 percent of the problem. Which means that a ECU flash could go a long way to correct that.

I am basing this on my own 13 RT Limited which does not have heat problems even in 105 degree weather while in traffic. No gas boiling, no melting of the brake manifold, no excesive heat through the seat. The tupperware, gas filler, and seat get WARM to the touch but not pink-burn hot. If I dont wear boots my right foot gets uncomfortably hot, but thats the same on other bikes and i wear boots always. (There is a 15 inch wheel rolling right in front of my foot)

When I say 'not excessive heat' I mean, no worse than any other big twin in hot weather. My 2012 Harley Ultra will fry your leg pink if you ride in shorts, and the heat rolls up from under the gas tank VISIBLY its brutal. 105 ambient + 100 thermal = rolling pink thunder thighs.

The reaosn I think my mixture is richer than normal (therefore the engine is cooler) is that my gas mileage sucks, there is a fair amount of black soot on the exhaust openings, and it 'behaves' like a rich engine - just based on my experience. Example, in cold weather, it starts right up and runs like warm, whereas lean-burners tend to pop and stumble in cold weather. Also the pipes have no bluing or discoloration. The oil has a LOT of carbon in it. Also no popping on deceleration = rich mixture.

My 2 cents

Also, its white. White ones run cooler.

what is your mpg--I agree with your thoughts-my 2013rt has the same mo--blue ones run COOL to :yes:

[flamingobabe]

I will agree 100%...but mine has been running lean...white chalky plugs....mpg...I'll get 19 to 36...just depending....can't trust it....looking forward to the ECM flash...2013-9...but BRP has to follow government regulations....so we will see


I have developed a theory that lean mixture is about 80 percent of the problem. Which means that a ECU flash could go a long way to correct that.

I am basing this on my own 13 RT Limited which does not have heat problems even in 105 degree weather while in traffic. No gas boiling, no melting of the brake manifold, no excesive heat through the seat. The tupperware, gas filler, and seat get WARM to the touch but not pink-burn hot. If I dont wear boots my right foot gets uncomfortably hot, but thats the same on other bikes and i wear boots always. (There is a 15 inch wheel rolling right in front of my foot)

When I say 'not excessive heat' I mean, no worse than any other big twin in hot weather. My 2012 Harley Ultra will fry your leg pink if you ride in shorts, and the heat rolls up from under the gas tank VISIBLY its brutal. 105 ambient + 100 thermal = rolling pink thunder thighs.

The reaosn I think my mixture is richer than normal (therefore the engine is cooler) is that my gas mileage sucks, there is a fair amount of black soot on the exhaust openings, and it 'behaves' like a rich engine - just based on my experience. Example, in cold weather, it starts right up and runs like warm, whereas lean-burners tend to pop and stumble in cold weather. Also the pipes have no bluing or discoloration. The oil has a LOT of carbon in it. Also no popping on deceleration = rich mixture.

My 2 cents

Also, its white. White ones run cooler.

[flamingobabe]

we'll see what happens with the new flash...but if y'all got and still problems...keep me in touch...congrats to Louise....hope to ride with y'all when they finish my bike....will go to shop after BRP calls me back...hopefully today


.
Picked up Louise new RT-S on Sat. She got a chance to put a few miles on it yesterday. It has the new ECM mapping released Friday. Upon parking in our garage last night and closing the doors.....about 10 minutes later went back out to the garage and was overwhelmed with gas fumes. Had to open garage doors and air out for an hour or so.

In the two weeks since I fixed mine, had gotten into the habit of not leaving the garage open any more. Was no longer any need. So much for that. Until she gets past 600 miles and the first checkup, I will not do any mods other than CanAm accessories she ordered.

But its obvious that while the new mapping may help, IT DOES NOT CURE THE FUEL BOILING and FUME ISSUE.

I still plan on getting the update on mine as soon as the fuse box parts are available and they can do the whole bulletin at once.

Keep working on it BRP. you are not there yet.

[DrewNJ]

Your dead on Unclejay!
Any of you that think its only trapped heat and that airflow mods, fans,etc under the plastic are the solution really need to pull all that plastic off and go for a ride. You will experience the same, if not worse as having the plastic in place.
Proper tuning on a water cooled motor is a big part of cooling.

Sent from my Venue 8 3830 using Tapatalk

[Bob Denman]

Just cannot figure out if you just an optimist or a tried and true BRP Cheerleader Bob? :yes:
Optimist; pure and VERY simple! :D
But it's pretty reasonable to expect that BRP will want to grow it's market share with the Spyders... c:thumbup:
They know that's not going to happen if they've got "Grumblings" that are ongoing... :shocked:
The full weight of their engineering strength will be brought down on this; and they'll have an answer for the 2013 owners...
The $64,000 Question: is When? :dontknow:

[Ramjet]

I can answer that Bob....................... not soon enough.

[flamingobabe]

I'm beyond frustration with mine 2013 ST...BRP's Trailer Queen needs fixed or replaced....no one from BRP will call me back since 9am cst...I've called 3 times to Carlo and once to service....too early to start drinking

[Dat Guy]

So... how would someone living in Claifornia get this much needed update? CARB states be damned, I'm sick of roasting on my Spyder. :banghead:

[Jeriatric]

i'm beyond frustration with mine 2013 ST...BRP's Trailer Queen needs fixed or replaced....no one from BRP will call me back since 9am cst...I've called 3 times to Carlo and once to service....too early to start drinking

It's five o'clock somewhere.......


So... how would someone living in Claifornia get this much needed update? CARB states be damned, I'm sick of roasting on my Spyder. :banghead:

You're going to get a headache doing that.

The sufferers of heat line is replete with cooked riders. Welcome to the roast!

[flamingobabe]

I have spoken with a BRP rep and things will begin to happen...I'm feeling better.....really nice rep...seems to understand mechanics some....more discussion tomorrow....I'm feeling better




I'm beyond frustration with mine 2013 ST...BRP's Trailer Queen needs fixed or replaced....no one from BRP will call me back since 9am cst...I've called 3 times to Carlo and once to service....too early to start drinking

[MouthPiece]

:popcorn::popcorn::popcorn:

[JacqueTanis]

I have spoken with a BRP rep and things will begin to happen...I'm feeling better.....really nice rep...seems to understand mechanics some....more discussion tomorrow....I'm feeling better

LOL, tell him to call me when he's done with you - we need to talk before the heat starts effecting my ST-L like it has yours. Would be nice if they get it fixed BEFORE the damage sets in ...:(

[Bob Denman]

I have spoken with a BRP rep and things will begin to happen...I'm feeling better.....really nice rep...seems to understand mechanics some....more discussion tomorrow....I'm feeling better
:clap: :2thumbs: Please let us know what they're able to do for you! :yes::ohyea::yes:

Who was it???

[hotglue]

It is always something...hoping a fix is in the works, but fear the heat has already taken it's toll.

[stewartj239]

I have developed a theory that lean mixture is about 80 percent of the problem. Which means that a ECU flash could go a long way to correct that.

Agreed. That is my theory as well. After 4500 miles, I have had none of the issues that others have reported and it was proven when I pulled my plugs a couple of weeks ago to check them out. One plug looks perfect and the other is a little rich. I am thinking about skipping the ECM update because I'm not sure I need it, or I already have it. I bet that not all Spyders have the same map as tweaks are often made during a production run.

[NancysToy]

Agreed. That is my theory as well. After 4500 miles, I have had none of the issues that others have reported and it was proven when I pulled my plugs a couple of weeks ago to check them out. One plug looks perfect and the other is a little rich. I am thinking about skipping the ECM update because I'm not sure I need it, or I already have it. I bet that not all Spyders have the same map as tweaks are often made during a production run.
Less likely that they have different maps than that sensor variations would cause most variation. Differences in O2 sensors, temperature sensors, and MAP sensors would all affect the mixture. It has also been seen that the sensor wiring can affect the mixture in some Spyders...particularly extension harnesses.

[Bob Denman]

Scotty,
Are you saying, that this could all be the result of some sensors being flaky??? :shocked: :gaah:

[NancysToy]

Scotty,
Are you saying, that this could all be the result of some sensors being flaky??? :shocked: :gaah:
No, but there is always some variation in sensor output that could affect the mixture from machine to machine. Normally it isn't noticeable, but when the mapping is very close to the point of super-lean (or rich) and/or when multiple sensors all vary in the same direction, it could happen. The programming is a constant, the inputs are all that are likely to change or vary.

[Bob Denman]

Death :shocked:; from a thousand papercuts then? :gaah:

[3 Wheel Addict]

Agreed. That is my theory as well. After 4500 miles, I have had none of the issues that others have reported and it was proven when I pulled my plugs a couple of weeks ago to check them out. One plug looks perfect and the other is a little rich. I am thinking about skipping the ECM update because I'm not sure I need it, or I already have it. I bet that not all Spyders have the same map as tweaks are often made during a production run.

Be careful on that, if your bike goes in for any kind of service you may get that update anyway. Your dealer may do it without asking since it's an "across the board" campaign. I don't think they would do part of it (fuse boxes) and not do the update because there is money involved for them.

[stewartj239]

Less likely that they have different maps than that sensor variations would cause most variation.

That is possible, but the amount of variation we're talking here is huge. Some bikes are running snow white plugs, boiling gas and melting parts while others like mine are running normal with plugs that look spot on.

[stewartj239]

Be careful on that, if your bike goes in for any kind of service you may get that update anyway. Your dealer may do it without asking since it's an "across the board" campaign. I don't think they would do part of it (fuse boxes) and not do the update because there is money involved for them.

I am planning to go in today to ask them about that. I am not opposed to getting it if I don't have a choice, but I would like to have the option. I'll let you know what they say.

[OJ UK]

Firstly I'm not being contentious on purpose, it's just that different folk are experiencing differing
problems with the engines on 2013 RTs (STs ?) Some get bad problems while others don't.
This has nothing to do with riding style or, within reason, ambient temperatures.

I can't help but think that the whole unfortunate episode is extremely similar to the steering
alignment problems, where one Spyder would leave the factory with totally different alignment parameters
than the next. We know that to be true.

An engine that has an electronic management system, and these days that's most of them, has inherent
problems if the ancilliary components (sensors, throttle bodies etc.) don't have accurate tolerances. This can and will
give rise to potentially wide ranging problems. The electronics are constantly monitoring and adjusting
the running parameters of the engine. That's fuel mixture, ignition timing etc. which if wrong can be
responsible for a whole gamut of entirely different but ultimately related problems.
A sensor, as has been pointed out above can be fine, but if there's a poor connection between that and the
ECU then things start to go rapidly pear-shaped. The ECU samples the reading and makes adjustments to the rest of
the system, incorrectly. An increasing number of sensors present multiplies the likelihood of errors occuring.
These errors however will not give rise to an 'Error code' being generated because the the ECU 'thinks'
that everything is peachy!

Thus the quality of the sensors and other componentry connected to the ECU has to be beyond reproach
to ensure that the engine runs well consistently. On top of all that the wiring and connectors need to be rugged enough
to handle the environment in the engine compartment. Ideally the canbus wiring should IMHO be
PTFE sleeved and terminated with high integrity connectors.
Component tolerances, manufacturing tolerances and testing procedures need to be looked at.


These are just my observations and my opinion.....they are not carved in stone and may possibly be misguided!

[Bob Denman]

These are just my observations and my opinion.....they are not carved in stone and may possibly be misguided!
But they were wonderfully presented... :clap: nojoke

I wonder if the sensors were also supplied by a low bidder? :shocked:

[OJ UK]

But they were wonderfully presented... :clap: nojoke

I wonder if the sensors were also supplied by a low bidder? :shocked:

Hold your horses there young Bob...I haven't finished editing it yet!!!:coffee:

[MouthPiece]

Hold your horses there young Bob...I haven't finished editing it yet!!!:coffee:

Thanks for putting a smile on my face. Roger and you ought to hook up.

​Chris

[cuznjohn]

i need a dictionary to read oj uk posts

[Bob Denman]

That's what happens when you get a quality education... :thumbup:

[donec]

OJ UK kind of brought up a point I wonder about. The problems are well documented on 2013 RTs and some what STs but I've seen no mention about the RS. Either there are almost no RSs out there or (it seems to me) there the problems are more related to the style of the spyder and differences in them.

I am a little concerned that making changes in the ECM Software on the spyders that don't have problems may cause problems. So once the change is made, does anyone know if it can be reversed?

[Mets79ST2013]

Being there done that, I will take by bike to the dealer so they can get this done, if that doesn't fix the heat, then I can call BRP again, but I will give them the benefit of getting this done first....and I hope it works because my ST-S runs very hot..

[DrewNJ]

OJ UK kind of brought up a point I wonder about. The problems are well documented on 2013 RTs and some what STs but I've seen no mention about the RS. Either there are almost no RSs out there or (it seems to me) there the problems are more related to the style of the spyder and differences in them.

I am a little concerned that making changes in the ECM Software on the spyders that don't have problems may cause problems. So once the change is made, does anyone know if it can be reversed?

Remember though that the RS and ST are the same machine with the same plastics below the headlights....

Sent from my Venue 8 3830 using Tapatalk

[flamingobabe]

the ST has a different frame than the RS....things were moved around on the ST but not the RS

[DrewNJ]

the ST has a different frame than the RS....things were moved around on the ST but not the RS

Incorrect. The frame (as well as most of the other parts)is the same on the 2013 RS and 2013 ST. 705203234


Sent from my Venue 8 3830 using Tapatalk

[DrewNJ]

Actually, the frame is the same across all 3 models for 2013

Sent from my Venue 8 3830 using Tapatalk

[DrewNJ]

As for going back to a previous software version, I don't think that's possible.

Sent from my Venue 8 3830 using Tapatalk

[cuznjohn]

i took a car ride to my dealer b4 and i brought the printed campaign papers from BRP. as of today he had no clue about it. so i asked him to order what he needed ( covers ) for the fuse blocks and as soon as i can get the bike there when the parts come in he will do the job complete and not just the software update.

[SNOOPY]

i need a dictionary to read oj uk posts


Here you go... http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/peachy


roflmao


.

[OJ UK]

That's what happens when you get a quality education... :thumbup:

I think it was George Bernard Shaw who said "England and America are two countries separated by a common language."

That being the case I have to think carefully about the words that I use when posting here.

I'm not too sure that I had a good education but I like to think that it was adequate!:thumbup:

[SNOOPY]

I didn't see anything unusual about it? :dontknow:

[stewartj239]

These are just my observations and my opinion.....they are not carved in stone and may possibly be misguided!

We are all just putting our thoughts and ideas out there. Your guess is as good as anyone else's unless BRP decides to set us all straight :)

[cuznjohn]

I think it was George Bernard Shaw who said "England and America are two countries separated by a common language."

That being the case I have to think carefully about the words that I use when posting here.

I'm not too sure that I had a good education but I like to think that it was adequate!:thumbup:

i feel like your a very educated man, and being a man with just a high school education and growing up on the streets of NY i would be the last person to talk about someone else with the way they speak. it was just a joke

[OJ UK]

Hey John I wasn't taking a swipe at you! Not one bit of it!
I have been fortunate enough to enjoy vacations in the 'States many times.
Once I was accused of being an Australian!! I have a London accent. No, not Cockney...that really doesn't exist anymore,
but the way I speak is regarded by many to be as common as $#!+. That's their problem! But sometimes over on
your side of the duck pond people didn't always understand what I was saying....and vice versa, so over the years I seem
to have learned to copy speech patterns and the last time I did Daytona Bike Week, a guy in a bar who I was
playing pool with for a couple of hours thought I was a local!! I was quite flattered!
Next day, the girl behind the bar shouted to me "Hey Geoff, when y'all movin' down here now you're one of us an' all?!" :roflblack:

I don't think that the answer I gave her is suitable for this forum.....I am after all a biker!! I believe the second word was "OFF!!":shocked:

Here on the forum, though, it's quite different and more difficult for me, because I'm thinking in British English and having
to make sure that when I write something it will be OK in American!. I'm sure that the Spanish speakers among you know
what I mean, when they speak Spanish they think in Spanish and when they speak English they think in English.

All of you guys on this forum are cool and some of you are having some real bad luck with your Rydes just now
I feel more than a little sympathy for you.

[MouthPiece]

Hey John I wasn't taking a swipe at you! Not one bit of it!
I have been fortunate enough to enjoy vacations in the 'States many times.
Once I was accused of being an Australian!! I have a London accent. No, not Cockney...that really doesn't exist anymore,
but the way I speak is regarded by many to be as common as $#!+. That's their problem! But sometimes over on
your side of the duck pond people didn't always understand what I was saying....and vice versa, so over the years I seem
to have learned to copy speech patterns and the last time I did Daytona Bike Week, a guy in a bar who I was
playing pool with for a couple of hours thought I was a local!! I was quite flattered!
Next day, the girl behind the bar shouted to me "Hey Geoff, when y'all movin' down here now you're one of us an' all?!" :roflblack:

I don't think that the answer I gave her is suitable for this forum.....I am after all a biker!! I believe the second word was "OFF!!":shocked:

Here on the forum, though, it's quite different and more difficult for me, because I'm thinking in British English and having
to make sure that when I write something it will be OK in American!. I'm sure that the Spanish speakers among you know
what I mean, when they speak Spanish they think in Spanish and when they speak English they think in English.

All of you guys on this forum are cool and some of you are having some real bad luck with your Rydes just now
I feel more than a little sympathy for you.

If only more of us on this side of the pond spoke and wrote with as much clarity as you.

​Chris

[SNOOPY]

I only bark.

People don't understand what I say, but I get treats.

[jlt31971]

I have a 2013 ST-S I have over 8000 miles on it, have rode it to Florida, circled Lake Erie into Canada back thru New York I get great gas mileage ( around 28 to 32) and have never once had a heat problem even in 95 degree days when in traffic 4 bars. So I am thinking it is best to just ride and enjoy, but I do hope it helps the ones that do have the issues.