Elkas and 2013 rts. With the new frame were there be a need to change my settings?

[kbfk]

Ok here's the question. I have a 2011 RT with Elka shots currently and have a new 2013 rts coming next week. I'm moving a lot of my addons to my new bike including my elkas. The question is does anyone know if my current settings need to be adjust due to the changes in the 2013 frame and shock stance? Thanks for you help.

[MarkLawson]

I would recommend more thought on that plan. Lamont reported that the 2013 standard BRP suspension is superior to the Elkas Stage-5's he's currently using. The Stage-5's are the top of the line Elkas for the RT.

You may want to leave them alone...

[kbfk]

I saw that post by Lamont. In it he seemed to be comparing a 2010 with stage 5 vs a new 2013 with updated shocks and frame. From what I read, I'm not certain that he meant to imply that the shocks themselves were superior to elkas. So I thought I would ask a clarifying question. I already own the elkas so swapping is easy and free.

[MouthPiece]

I saw that post by Lamont. In it he seemed to be comparing a 2010 with stage 5 vs a new 2013 with updated shocks and frame. From what I read, I'm not certain that he meant to imply that the shocks themselves were superior to elkas. So I thought I would ask a clarifying question. I already own the elkas so swapping is easy and free.

<Watch this start an uproar> I have a 2013 RT-S and if it can be done, I would go ahead and transfer your Elka's over to your soon to be 2013. I say this first, because I like to have options. The shocks on the 2013 do not provide for any adjustment. Secondly, I have found that if I drive aggressively, my nanny has a tendency (I'm not saying all the time or most of the time, but some of the time) to kick in. Perhaps it's trying to tell me something.

The shocks and suspension system on the 2013 is by far better than the Elkas I had on my 2010 RT-S. It's also a much smoother ride. Again, though I'm a believer in having options or choices meaning that I like to be able to adjust.

Hope this helps.

Chris

[NancysToy]

Be careful! The spring rate and shock length on the 2013s is unknown at this point, and the 2013 shocks may require somewhat different damping characteristics...although the Elkas would probably cover the range. If you have existing Elkas you can experiment, but otherwise I'd contact Trooper or Len and see what they have to say.

[Bob Denman]

:agree: There simply isn't enough factual information available out there yet on the 2013 setup.
Now if somebody could measure up their OEM shocks; that's a start! :thumbup:

Other important "numbers":
Shock travel
Spring rate
Damping rate(s)

Just because they might fit, soesn't mean that they belong there...

[Trooper]

Ouch...

I think what Lamont meant ( correct me if I am wrong Lamont), is that Can Am did some engineering homework and made some changes to the suspension pick up points for the shocks mounts to help eliminate some of the suspension weaknesses that are ever so present on the previous models. The changes make the VEHICLE handle better, and is not because the actual SHOCKS are better. The shocks are the same as they always were.....terrible. What changed is the geometry.

Now, you will get the same result taking off the stock shocks on a 2013 Spyder and putting Elka's....a massive increase in performance.

I wish there was a better way to explain this without making it sound like some sort of biased sales pitch....but there is no other way. What I can say is that I have always been more than honest when dealing with my customers, and would not jeopardise that in any way to sell a set of shocks.

Oh, and your existing Elka shocks WILL fit on the 2013 models.

To help prove my point, I will be offering the same deal at Spyderfest this year as I did last year. Try the Elka's on your Spyder. If you are not satisfied, I will take them off and refund you 100%. There is absolutely nothing to lose.

[Lamonster]

Ouch...

I think what Lamont meant ( correct me if I am wrong Lamont), is that Can Am did some engineering homework and made some changes to the suspension pick up points for the shocks mounts to help eliminate some of the suspension weaknesses that are ever so present on the previous models. The changes make the VEHICLE handle better, and is not because the actual SHOCKS are better. The shocks are the same as they always were.....terrible. What changed is the geometry.

Now, you will get the same result taking off the stock shocks on a 2013 Spyder and putting Elka's....a massive increase in performance.

I wish there was a better way to explain this without making it sound like some sort of biased sales pitch....but there is no other way. What I can say is that I have always been more than honest when dealing with my customers, and would not jeopardise that in any way to sell a set of shocks.

Oh, and your existing Elka shocks WILL fit on the 2013 models.

I just saw this post and you explained it well. The 2013 is much more than a shock change or sway bar change. There is a new frame that is much stiffer and the a-arm are now shorter reducing flex. On all but the 2013 RSS the shocks are not adjustable. I'm still not clear why they went this route but it seems to be working well.

I would also think that adding Elka's can't hurt and should help but unless there are some real world testing nobody knows for sure. The right way to do it would be to put the stock 2013 shock on a shock dyno and see what the current spring and dampening rates are and then match up a Elka shock to that.

http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=54847&d=1349380357

http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=54846&d=1349380356

Shock Dyno
http://www.traxxion.com/images/ShockDynoTesting04.jpg

[Trooper]

I would also think that adding Elka's can't hurt and should help but unless there are some real world testing nobody knows for sure.



No better time than Spyderfest, right Lamont? ;)

[Bob Denman]

:shocked: How would I hide THAT charge on the credit card??? http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/4/4_12_12.gif

[Trooper]

:shocked: How would I hide THAT charge on the credit card??? http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/4/4_12_12.gif

I'm sure with a bit of creativity, it can be done. :D

[kinggeek]

:shocked: How would I hide THAT charge on the credit card??? http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/4/4_12_12.gif

Just pay cash like I did!

[kbfk]

Thanks for the input. Looks like I will move the Elka Shocks to my new bike. Naturally, the fun question will be finding the best method to correctly adjust them to fit the new frame setup beyond the dyno. I may be in for some trial and error. Unless maybe we can find out from BRP if they changed shocks themselves at all and if so what are the new ratios for the stock shocks.

[Trooper]

Thanks for the input. Looks like I will move the Elka Shocks to my new bike. Naturally, the fun question will be finding the best method to correctly adjust them to fit the new frame setup beyond the dyno. I may be in for some trial and error. Unless maybe we can find out from BRP if they changed shocks themselves at all and if so what are the new ratios for the stock shocks.

If anything, you would want to first reduce some of the preload since the leverage ratio has changed. If you can wait until Spyderfest, I will be there to take care of all of that for you if you'd like.

[kbfk]

I will be at Spyderfest but I have a short window to next week to switch bikes and move upgrades from one bike to the other. I'm not the mechanical type but I think adjusting the Elkas falls into my limited capabilities. Is it clockwise or counter clock wise turns to reduce the loading? And if you were to hazard a guess how many revolutions should I reduce it by to start? It is currently set to the standard layout you had at spyderfest last year.

[Sarge707]

I will be at Spyderfest but I have a short window to next week to switch bikes and move upgrades from one bike to the other. I'm not the mechanical type but I think adjusting the Elkas falls into my limited capabilities. Is it clockwise or counter clock wise turns to reduce the loading? And if you were to hazard a guess how many revolutions should I reduce it by to start? It is currently set to the standard layout you had at spyderfest last year.

I can tell you this- My Elka Plus 1s came with the preload at 8 1/2 inches. So the Spring was 8 1/2 inches long .
I Adjusted the preload exactly 4 Complete turns Counterclockwise- Which lengthened the Spring to 8 3/4 inches and softened up the preload . This Length is Great on my 2012 RT- But was to stiff on the lighter RS?

Measure your Spring length First and then Approximately every 4 complete turns counterclockwise will lengthen the Spring (Softer) 1/4 inch. I imagine tightening (Clockwise ) 4 turns would shorten the Spring 1/4 inch (Stiffer). Thats All I know?nojoke

[Bob Denman]

Trooper,
My death might as well be at your hands... :shocked: :2thumbs:

[Trooper]

Trooper,
May death might as well be at your hands... :shocked: :2thumbs:

That's.....um ....great? :dontknow: :D

[Bob Denman]

Oops... :shocked: :opps:

Edited it so that it might make a little more sense... ;)