Carlo said in regards to the drive belt..

[wyliec]

tension questions I asked-

I asked two questions:

What is the service bulletin number? And, the answer is- 2010-6.

The 2nd question was, is it covered under warranty or is it part of the maintenance schedule? For those that have had it done with no charge, good on you. But, Carlo said it is not covered under warranty. He said it is part of the scheduled maintenance. The first time is at the 600 mile check up and every 6,000 miles after that (or yearly). And, there is a charge and each dealer's charge is different.

[xpeschon]

Great work, Thank you so much wyliec. Now I can inform the dealer of the bulletin number cause they didn't know anything about it..

Joe
(X)

[M2Wild]

tension questions I asked-

I asked two questions:

What is the service bulletin number? And, the answer is- 2010-6.

The 2nd question was, is it covered under warranty or is it part of the maintenance schedule? For those that have had it done with no charge, good on you. But, Carlo said it is not covered under warranty. He said it is part of the scheduled maintenance. The first time is at the 600 mile check up and every 6,000 miles after that (or yearly). And, there is a charge and each dealer's charge is different.
So they wanna charge you for the adjustment but fix your broken bearing under warrenty .... nice move BRP.

[groundeffect]

tension questions I asked-

I asked two questions:

What is the service bulletin number? And, the answer is- 2010-6.

The 2nd question was, is it covered under warranty or is it part of the maintenance schedule? For those that have had it done with no charge, good on you. But, Carlo said it is not covered under warranty. He said it is part of the scheduled maintenance. The first time is at the 600 mile check up and every 6,000 miles after that (or yearly). And, there is a charge and each dealer's charge is different.


Thanks for posting this information, great to have for us all. Thanks to Carlos for sharing, also.

Are you able to post the actual service bulletin here in this thread, for those who will find this thread in the future (and now) will have the information in one place.
Thanks

[Magic Man]

So they wanna charge you for the adjustment but fix your broken bearing under warrenty .... nice move BRP.

But only if your bearing goes out in the first two years.

They're playing the odds here.

Sometimes at BRP the word "Service" is really just an acronym.

S crew
E verybody
R egardless,
V iolating
I ndividual
C ustomers
E verywhere

:D

MM

[M2Wild]

But only if your bearing goes out in the first two years.

They're playing the odds here.


If you have BEST, will the bearing covered under that?

[Magic Man]

If you have BEST, will the bearing covered under that?

You should be covered under BEST


MM

[Sarge707]

But only if your bearing goes out in the first two years.

They're playing the odds here.

Sometimes at BRP the word "Service" is really just an acronym.

S crew
E verybody
R egardless,
V iolating
I ndividual
C ustomers
E verywhere

:D

MM
I was told its FREE so I called again and NOW am waiting a call back from Carlos??? I,m not Happy.nojoke

[wyliec]

I was told its FREE so I called again and NOW am waiting a call back from Carlos??? I,m not Happy.nojoke

Who told you the adjustment was free?

Please let us know what Carlo tells you.

Thanks

[aka1004]

i guess belt adjustment is part of 6k or 12k check but not free.
if you were to get it done seperately, i guess cost will depend on what kinda mood the service writer/mechanic is on that day.
i've gotten same minor adjustments done before sometimes paying but other times didn't.:dontknow:
for example, i have paid as much as 28.50 for parking brake adjustment but got it done without paying also.

[groundeffect]

i guess belt adjustment is part of 6k or 12k check but not free.
if you were to get it done seperately, i guess cost will depend on what kinda mood the service writer/mechanic is on that day.
i've gotten same minor adjustments done before sometimes paying but other times didn't.:dontknow:
for example, i have paid as much as 28.50 for parking brake adjustment but got it done without paying also.
:agree:

[Magic Man]

But only if your bearing goes out in the first two years.

They're playing the odds here.

Sometimes at BRP the word "Service" is really just an acronym.

S crew
E verybody
R egardless,
V iolating
I ndividual
C ustomers
E verywhere




:D

MM


Remember even at $10 a unit in warranty time to adjust 15,000 belts is still $150,000.00.

My bet is they are thinking most everybody will be out of the warranty before they spend $150,000.00 on bearing replacements.

One is a "sure loss to the bottom line" the other is a maybe.

Again these numbers are only at $10 to do it and don't include anything for the other paperwork and BRP staff to process the warranty claims ether.

You can see how something seemingly small like this can turn into some real money on BRP's end and why they are not always quick to "step up" and do what seems like the right thing.

[Sarge707]

Who told you the adjustment was free?

Please let us know what Carlo tells you.

Thanks
2 Days ago the Rep said it was covered. In the meantime Carlo wrote a different opinion posted here. So I called today TWICE and FOUGHT the battle for it to be free because I do my own Maintenance and have done so for 20 years on 13 Sea Doo,s . The first time I called today someone was going to get back to me with an answer SOO after 2 hours I called again (I,m Retired:roflblack:) and they noted it again and will get back to me someday???

Because BRP set the belt pressure 75-200+ Pounds Over what they NOW recommend is not my problem and SHOULD be covered NO CHARGE!!nojoke

[aka1004]

the dealer plays such a big roll.
there are ryders who have paid for repairs that most ryders got it done for free. there are also ryders who have not paid for repairs that easily should have been paid by the ryders. until carlo came into picture, brp did not even wanted to talk to or discuss repair with customers but they will take dealer's word for what was and was not a warranty repair. i think every dealer has different position on this. some will go out of their way to make it a warranty repair but some won't. dealers i had dealt with in los angeles area all did go out of their way to make things happen. when i had that pulley problem on my way back home to vegas and had to tow the spyder to dealer here to vegas, i did not have a long conversation with the service writer when i dropped it off, assuming it was gonna be covered by warranty but he thought i was paying for it. i had to leave my cc info to pick it up because he did not get an ok from brp. don't get me wrong, i think the mechanic knows what he is doing. he knows far more than some of spyder mechanics i talked to before.

in short, get your spyder to right dealer:thumbup:

[boborgera]

Dealer, Dealer, Dealer, A dealer who treats his customers right will survive the slow times. I've been dealing with my guy since 1988. I was at his show room last SAT. Just kicking tires, the service guy asked me if i had my Spyder with me i said yes , then he said give me the key we'll bring it in and adjust the belt. Did it in a few minutes NO charge. That's why he was able to open a new 120 thousand sq. foot show room in these slow times.
All good businessmen will cast a little bread upon the waters.
Thats the way i ran my busines.

[Roaddog2]

:agree:
There's a lot of things that BRP SHOULD do, but they never do.........:agree::agree:

[krb1945]

with the service writeup:2thumbs: explanation. I've put that one in my quotes file. /Ken krb1945-OEM

[YPILOT]

I had my belt replaced at 19,000 and it still looked good, the bearings however were toast and had to be replaced as well. The :spyder:was still under warranty but when my dealer asked BRP to warranty the bearings they said NO ,wear item not covered. I don't know what the belt tension was at that time. Oh well, water under the bridge now. More $, More $, More $.

[Magic Man]

I had my belt replaced at 19,000 and it still looked good, the bearings however were toast and had to be replaced as well. The :spyder:was still under warranty but when my dealer asked BRP to warranty the bearings they said NO ,wear item not covered. I don't know what the belt tension was at that time. Oh well, water under the bridge now. More $, More $, More $.

No way really?

Wow bearings should have been covered? Although they do need some service from time to time (new grease) I did not see that have a replacement mileage listed.

Even if they have a replacement mileage, and you have not neglected to do the service when they say it needs to be done and the bearing fail before BRP says they are to be replaced, than they have failed early and should still be under warranty.

...and if they are not to be replaced at regular interval than how do they become a wear item.

That's like saying because you change the oil in a motor that luibes your main bearings at 3000 miles, that the bearings inside the motor are a wear item too?

MM

Sorry they did this to you, but like I said a few posts ago.

BRP's idea of S E R V I C E sometimes is not what it should be.

MM

[bone crusher]

Ya know what,

Have Carlo step in and do something for you. We've all been waiting long enough for DPS issues information, and Carlo has tried to help, but his bosses are still keeping everyone in the dark and this is getting to be ridiculous.

Carlo should be more than willing to call the dealership on your behalf and have them right you...and send the bill to BRP...it's enough of these warranty issues that BRP/dealers skip out of...enough is enough. I'm tired of reading about all of us who have issues and then nobody is wiling to help. If they want people to spread a good word about their product and company, they need to go the extra mile to help...forget going the extra mile, they just need to do the right thing!

I always remember this thought...

If you go to a restaurant and have a horrible experience, you will tell everyone about it and really try to hurt the place as you are very unhappy.

If you go to a restaurant and have an average experience, no harm done...you don't go out of your way to tell anyone and you would likely forget that place in the future.

If you go to a restaurant and it exceeds expectations, you will tell everyone you know about how happy you are and hope they can have a great experience such as yours.

Now, at this time, BRP is the first example and this is entirely unacceptable. I'm not one for the conspiracies, but Carlo and BRP need to do more to help people, period.

[spyryder]

The manual states in the maintenance schedule, that rear wheel bearings are to be 'inspected' every 12,000 miles or 2 years. Sounds like a maintenance item to me.:dontknow:

[Firefly]

Remember even at $10 a unit in warranty time to adjust 15,000 belts is still $150,000.00.

My bet is they are thinking most everybody will be out of the warranty before they spend $150,000.00 on bearing replacements.

One is a "sure loss to the bottom line" the other is a maybe.

Again these numbers are only at $10 to do it and don't include anything for the other paperwork and BRP staff to process the warranty claims ether.

You can see how something seemingly small like this can turn into some real money on BRP's end and why they are not always quick to "step up" and do what seems like the right thing.


Do you really think that $10 or $20 is going all the way back to BRP?

I doubt it.

That's the dealers $$$. What does it take to adjust a belt? 1/2 hour?

The dealer has expenses to pay... like the wages of the tech doing the adjustment, the cost of the tools to do it and general overhead.

Independent dealers folks... which means they can charge or not charge for such things.

I plan on having my rear bearings changed every other rear tire-- so around every 20,000 miles. Cheap price for peace of mind.:thumbup:

[Tom in NM]

Sometimes at BRP the word "Service" is really just an acronym.

S crew
E verybody
R egardless,
V iolating
I ndividual
C ustomers
E verywhere

:D

MM

An interesting comment from one vendor to another.

Tom

[Sarge707]

Dealer, Dealer, Dealer, A dealer who treats his customers right will survive the slow times. I've been dealing with my guy since 1988. I was at his show room last SAT. Just kicking tires, the service guy asked me if i had my Spyder with me i said yes , then he said give me the key we'll bring it in and adjust the belt. Did it in a few minutes NO charge. That's why he was able to open a new 120 thousand sq. foot show room in these slow times.
All good businessmen will cast a little bread upon the waters.
Thats the way i ran my busines.
:agree: Whats it really cost a dealer-
1- They pay utilities anyway.
2- Techs are paid anyway.

It Cost them a New Cotter Pin :yikes:(Hopefully they use a new one?) and a few spare minutes when available~!
It Gets Them- Happy Returning Customers!!!:yes:

[Magic Man]

An interesting comment from one vendor to another.

Tom

What could you be talking about!

We give real customer service everyday to every one of ESI's customers and anybody here who has bought from us can tell you that first hand.

So, I know doing the right thing by your customers can be done if the person in charge really cares to do so.

I have bought BRP products since 1989. If it were not for my local dealer being such good folks doing all they can on their end, I most likely would not still be using BRP products today. However, the SERVICE I have gotten from BRP directly leaves much to be desired. FACT!

I will not play the "Good Ol Boys" role here, and because I too am in the cycle industry turn a blind eye to when I, or other people I know are treated unfairly by another vendor. I will speak my mind and tell it like it is.

Sending out bikes with this crazy too tight a belt spec was a mistake on BRP's end. I have had HDs for years which are all belt drive, and never was there ever a need for a belt to be this tight. I always thought this was crazy tight even from day one when there was all the "belt talk" on here 2 years ago.

Now BRP is seeing bearing failures because of this spec. and that there really was no reason to have it this crazy tight. Now BRP trys to BS us customers that if you are stilling running their old spec it's OK, but the new spec is 3 time less? How can anything have that big a swing in tolerances, 1400 to now 450.

That if you want to get it set to the new spec so your bearings are not stressed to the max it's on your dime. Also, if your bike is near or over 2 years old that bearing replacement because of this crazy too tight a spec for the last two years is going to be on your dime.

Hearing that dealers are even charging for failed bearings less than 2 years old, saying BRP says they are a wear item, all this is nuts.

I am as much a customer of BRP as anyone here, and have most likely been one longer and spent more money with them than most. However at 50 years old and involved in powersports since I was 11, I know what is right and what is not. This just is not good customer service.

MM

[fastfraser]

:2thumbs: Thanks Magicman, well said.

[spyryder]

I haven't noticed a lot of bearing failures.:dontknow: Lamont did have one spin in the hub though at 36,000.
http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=130561&postcount=27

[spyryder]

If you were to combine the bearing failures that you haven't noticed, with the drive pulley, output shaft, and retaining bolt failures that I've noticed, the real results of the original banjo string belt tension spec from the manufacturer become much more evident......
Oh sorry, I thought today's flavor was wheel bearings. :bowdown:

[wyliec]

Okay back on topic of being charged for belt adjustment.

Drove round trip 150 miles, 44 F with rain and had belt adjuisted n/c. The General Mgr. gave the service dept. the go ahead and not charge me. The G.M. is going to take it up with BRP. I just said it was BRP's mistake from the beginning with the wrong spec. for tension and they should pay.

[Sarge707]

Okay back on topic of being charged for belt adjustment.

Drove round trip 150 miles, 44 F with rain and had belt adjuisted n/c. The General Mgr. gave the service dept. the go ahead and not charge me. The G.M. is going to take it up with BRP. I just said it was BRP's mistake from the beginning with the wrong spec. for tension and they should pay.

Good for you!!:2thumbs: My Audition is Tuesday! :yikes::roflblack:

[bone crusher]

Okay back on topic of being charged for belt adjustment.

Drove round trip 150 miles, 44 F with rain and had belt adjuisted n/c. The General Mgr. gave the service dept. the go ahead and not charge me. The G.M. is going to take it up with BRP. I just said it was BRP's mistake from the beginning with the wrong spec. for tension and they should pay.


Can we get Carlo on this to tell his bosses to do us right and fix this for everyone...no fee? From what I'm reading here, this can be a major issue that can be corrected by BRP or a dealer for virtually no time/expense...

[GA-SPYDER]

i guess belt adjustment is part of 6k or 12k check but not free.
if you were to get it done seperately, i guess cost will depend on what kinda mood the service writer/mechanic is on that day.
i've gotten same minor adjustments done before sometimes paying but other times didn't.:dontknow:
for example, i have paid as much as 28.50 for parking brake adjustment but got it done without paying also.
Bring it by my house. I'll do the brake adjustment for a ham sandwich.:joke:
Times are tuff.

[YPILOT]

My :spyder: has been to the dealer every 3000 miles to get scheduled maintenance done. We ride every chance we get so I want it to be in top shape for performance and safety. Now with this belt tension issue and related bearing and front pulley bolt failures. I have a question regarding belt tension relating to belt performance.
If the belt tension has been set to the high end of the scale and then later adjusted to a lower setting, has the belt been stretched by the higher tension rendering it weaker or less effective performance wise?
Will this cause vibration problems with the belt?

[wyliec]

Can we get Carlo on this to tell his bosses to do us right and fix this for everyone...no fee? From what I'm reading here, this can be a major issue that can be corrected by BRP or a dealer for virtually no time/expense...

I actually sent Carlo another e-mail on Saturday before I left for the belt tension adjustment. I expressed my feelings for having to pay when BRP made the original mistake by setting the spec. to high. My only suggestion is that others e-mail Carlo. Maybe, if Carlo hears from enough owners, BRP will step up and actually cover it under warranty.

[bone crusher]

I actually sent Carlo another e-mail on Saturday before I left for the belt tension adjustment. I expressed my feelings for having to pay when BRP made the original mistake by setting the spec. to high. My only suggestion is that others e-mail Carlo. Maybe, if Carlo hears from enough owners, BRP will step up and actually cover it under warranty.


I emailed him last week...never heard back...this is a very reasonable issue that BRP should be willing to resolve...not a big expense and not a lot of time...and a lot of happy customers for helping out...

[Firefly]

:agree: Whats it really cost a dealer-
1- They pay utilities anyway.
2- Techs are paid anyway.

It Cost them a New Cotter Pin :yikes:(Hopefully they use a new one?) and a few spare minutes when available~!
It Gets Them- Happy Returning Customers!!!:yes:

Have you ever run a business or had employees?

While I'm not defending BRP or the dealers for charging for this (I wouldn't charge my customers for it)-- my point is dealers have the end choice to bill or not-- and they do have REAL expenses involved in doing ANY work.

The 1/2 hour the tech spends adjusting your belt with the $700 device isn't 'free' time. He could have been doing other billable work during that time, or maybe went/sent home early.

Here's a good analogy for you.... go to your local airport and find a plane that isn't full.... then ask them if you can just ride for free in one of the empty seats--- since they're flying anyway. Doesn't cost them any more to have you sit there.....

Ain't gonna fly--- literally....;)

[Firefly]

Okay-- so now back onto belt tension..... I addressed this issue while at Cowtown this weekend.

They did a great job fixing my drain plug and a fast oil change. Didn't charge me extra for drilling and tapping the broken plug out... went the extra mile.

They also checked my belt tension... which read 1200. They felt it was perfectly in spec so no adjustment. When I told them many where having theirs adjusted down to 450 the techs thought I was joking or crazy (usually I'm BOTH). They were not aware of an official statement from BRP telling them to lower the tension.

Spoke to Doc this weekend.... he has had 4 sets of rear bearings and 3 front pulleys thus far in 80,000 miles on his Spyder. He said he has run his belt tension around 800-900 from early on and these parts still failed.

So would they fail at the same rate with the tension down at 450? I would certainly think the lower tension would help... but there might be other problems--- like maybe the parts are cheap to begin with?

I meant to check Brian and Debs tensions with my tester and see what it read... as they both are running down at 450 and say they really like the feel of it... less vibration .

I'm lowering mine.. and have bearings ready and waiting..... more concerned about the front pulley than the bearings.

[RoadHammer]

you think we feel like paying for there mistake?

use your brains fly... it's like buying a car with three wheels on it and you have to shell out extra for the 4th cause they forgot to put it on..


Have you ever run a business or had employees?

While I'm not defending BRP or the dealers for charging for this (I wouldn't charge my customers for it)-- my point is dealers have the end choice to bill or not-- and they do have REAL expenses involved in doing ANY work.

The 1/2 hour the tech spends adjusting your belt with the $700 device isn't 'free' time. He could have been doing other billable work during that time, or maybe went/sent home early.

Here's a good analogy for you.... go to your local airport and find a plane that isn't full.... then ask them if you can just ride for free in one of the empty seats--- since they're flying anyway. Doesn't cost them any more to have you sit there.....

Ain't gonna fly--- literally....;)

[Firefly]

you think we feel like paying for there mistake?

use your brains fly... it's like buying a car with three wheels on it and you have to shell out extra for the 4th cause they forgot to put it on..

Not what I said at all. Have someone read it to you again....;)

I said I do not think we should pay for THEIR mistake... the difficulty is the wrong 'THEIR' seems to be getting blamed. This is a dealer choice at this point. If you're getting charged for it-- the money isn't going to BRP-- it's going to the DEALER.

[bone crusher]

Not what I said at all. Have someone read it to you again....;)

I said I do not think we should pay for THEIR mistake... the difficulty is the wrong 'THEIR' seems to be getting blamed. This is a dealer choice at this point. If you're getting charged for it-- the money isn't going to BRP-- it's going to the DEALER.


Fly,

I was hoping Carlo could get BRP do the right thing and adjust this down for us to likely prevent problems 'down the road.' I'm going in for service in a few weeks and am giving my dealership money for hard bags, their installation, 2nd update (don't really pay for this one...), maintenance, and whatever else comes up...I'll be giving them a nice chunk of money...you'd think they could perhaps check the tension for me and adjust it accordingly? I guess I'll give them a call and ask if they can...what's that bulletin number that Scotty said?? Bossweb 6-2010?

I think they should do the work at their cost when you have your standard maintenance done (so at least you're there giving them money for something)...send the bill to BRP as it appears to be an issue from their side...doesn't this sound reasonable?

[RoadHammer]

Not what I said at all. Have someone read it to you again....;)

I said I do not think we should pay for THEIR mistake... the difficulty is the wrong 'THEIR' seems to be getting blamed. This is a dealer choice at this point. If you're getting charged for it-- the money isn't going to BRP-- it's going to the DEALER.

they made the mistake they should pay. why should i pay the dealer, brp should pay the dealer to cover it for us.

[Firefly]

Fly,

I was hoping Carlo could get BRP do the right thing and adjust this down for us to likely prevent problems 'down the road.' I'm going in for service in a few weeks and am giving my dealership money for hard bags, their installation, 2nd update (don't really pay for this one...), maintenance, and whatever else comes up...I'll be giving them a nice chunk of money...you'd think they could perhaps check the tension for me and adjust it accordingly? I guess I'll give them a call and ask if they can...what's that bulletin number that Scotty said?? Bossweb 6-2010?

I think they should do the work at their cost when you have your standard maintenance done (so at least you're there giving them money for something)...send the bill to BRP as it appears to be an issue from their side...doesn't this sound reasonable?


A good dealer will take care of you on it... especially when you're having other things done at the same time.

If a person walks in and that is the ONLY thing they want done.... I wouldn't be shocked that the dealer has a minimal fee.

Cowtown felt mine was in spec at 1200... so no adjustment. I'm going to adjust it myself down to around 500-600 and call it good.

[Firefly]

they made the mistake they should pay. why should i pay the dealer, brp should pay the dealer to cover it for us.

How about talking to your dealer instead of just blasting BRP for it?

You're ASSuming your dealer will charge you.

A good dealer would cover it, especially when you're getting other things done. Most would just have it done with their next service, or if you're that concerned--- do it yourself.

There are plenty of higher mileage ryders that have not had any problems when running in the old spec. Get it lowered to the new spec at your own discretion.

This is hardly a 'sky is falling' situation. nojoke

[boborgera]

How about talking to your dealer instead of just blasting BRP for it?

You're ASSuming your dealer will charge you.

A good dealer would cover it,.


This is hardly a 'sky is falling' situation. nojoke
:agree::agree:That's how to tell you have a dealer you'll feel comfortable to deal with again.

[RoadHammer]

How about talking to your dealer instead of just blasting BRP for it?

You're ASSuming your dealer will charge you.

A good dealer would cover it, especially when you're getting other things done. Most would just have it done with their next service, or if you're that concerned--- do it yourself.

There are plenty of higher mileage ryders that have not had any problems when running in the old spec. Get it lowered to the new spec at your own discretion.

This is hardly a 'sky is falling' situation. nojoke
I'll ASSume what I wish at my discretion. Just talked with dealer, never heard of the issue.... :roflblack::roflblack:

[Sarge707]

How about talking to your dealer instead of just blasting BRP for it?

You're ASSuming your dealer will charge you.

A good dealer would cover it, especially when you're getting other things done. Most would just have it done with their next service, or if you're that concerned--- do it yourself.

There are plenty of higher mileage ryders that have not had any problems when running in the old spec. Get it lowered to the new spec at your own discretion.

This is hardly a 'sky is falling' situation. nojoke
The Problem is A " Lot of Techs" including the one that adjusted yours at Cowtown did not check Boss Web to know of any change??:dontknow:
They are supposed to perform the Bulletin when you bring it in for scheduled maintenance BUT seeing many do not even check for Bulletins how can you be sure their even going to do it :dontknow:at the Scheduled Maintenance UNLESS you specifically make them aware of it.?
Running DOUBLE tension on a drive belt is not in the best interests of My investment :yikes:and since they set it twice as high and I do my own maintenance THEY should change it for Free!!:D
Thank the Lord for this Forum that we many times know whats going on with our machines BEFORE the Techs even Bother to become aware of it!!nojoke

[M2Wild]

The Problem is A " Lot of Techs" including the one that adjusted yours at Cowtown did not check Boss Web to know of any change??:dontknow:
They are supposed to perform the Bulletin when you bring it in for scheduled maintenance BUT seeing many do not even check for Bulletins how can you be sure their even going to do it :dontknow:at the Scheduled Maintenance UNLESS you specifically make them aware of it.?
Running DOUBLE tension on a drive belt is not in the best interests of My investment :yikes:and since they set it twice as high and I do my own maintenance THEY should change it for Free!!:D
Thank the Lord for this Forum that we many times know whats going on with our machines BEFORE the Techs even Bother to become aware of it!!nojoke
It makes me laugh every time I hear techs say "don't believe what you read on these internet forums". Maybe SpyderLovers should become required reading for these Spyder techs.

[RoadHammer]

The Problem is A " Lot of Techs" including the one that adjusted yours at Cowtown did not check Boss Web to know of any change??:dontknow:
They are supposed to perform the Bulletin when you bring it in for scheduled maintenance BUT seeing many do not even check for Bulletins how can you be sure their even going to do it :dontknow:at the Scheduled Maintenance UNLESS you specifically make them aware of it.?
Running DOUBLE tension on a drive belt is not in the best interests of My investment :yikes:and since they set it twice as high and I do my own maintenance THEY should change it for Free!!:D
Thank the Lord for this Forum that we many times know whats going on with our machines BEFORE the Techs even Bother to become aware of it!!nojoke

Agreed... they caused the problem they pay:2thumbs::2thumbs:

[Firefly]

The Problem is A " Lot of Techs" including the one that adjusted yours at Cowtown did not check Boss Web to know of any change??:dontknow:
They are supposed to perform the Bulletin when you bring it in for scheduled maintenance BUT seeing many do not even check for Bulletins how can you be sure their even going to do it :dontknow:at the Scheduled Maintenance UNLESS you specifically make them aware of it.?
Running DOUBLE tension on a drive belt is not in the best interests of My investment :yikes:and since they set it twice as high and I do my own maintenance THEY should change it for Free!!:D
Thank the Lord for this Forum that we many times know whats going on with our machines BEFORE the Techs even Bother to become aware of it!!nojoke

Yup... they were unaware of the new specs, so no adjustment was done. No charge for reading it with the meter. I mentioned the bulletin(but not by number)-- didn't want to push the issue because they were swamped and already doing me some favors...:thumbup:

I'll be doing mine myself as I do most the stuff myself anyway. I'm still skeptical about going down to 450 from 1200... so I'm thinking in the 500-700 range will work fine.

Interesting that many are upset about the original belt tension being so high per BRP's recommendation, yet are willing to take BRP's new advice on the really low tension recommendation.:dontknow:

We sure do get the real info here much quicker than most dealers do---- which is GREAT for us end users.

[widowmaker2011]

tension questions I asked-

I asked two questions:

What is the service bulletin number? And, the answer is- 2010-6.

The 2nd question was, is it covered under warranty or is it part of the maintenance schedule? For those that have had it done with no charge, good on you. But, Carlo said it is not covered under warranty. He said it is part of the scheduled maintenance. The first time is at the 600 mile check up and every 6,000 miles after that (or yearly). And, there is a charge and each dealer's charge is different.


Wiping out bearings- because the initial setting was too tight. So lets make it a service bulletin and make it NOT warranty. Just wrong. This doesn't need to be a recall but it should be a special service campaign , BRP should send letters to owners advising to take to dealer for a complimentary belt tension check. Pay the dealer 3 tenths of an hour to check and adjust it , save alot of aggravation for owners in the future and warranty costs to BRP for bad countershaft bearings. But in the way BRP is doing it you will only get your tension set correctly "if" you know about the service bulletin. Good God BRP there are only a few thousand out there , bring em in and get em fixed, your initial tension settings were wrong.. Ridiculous Customer service. :yikes:

[widowmaker2011]

How about talking to your dealer instead of just blasting BRP for it?

You're ASSuming your dealer will charge you.

A good dealer would cover it, especially when you're getting other things done. Most would just have it done with their next service, or if you're that concerned--- do it yourself.

There are plenty of higher mileage ryders that have not had any problems when running in the old spec. Get it lowered to the new spec at your own discretion.

This is hardly a 'sky is falling' situation. nojoke

Firefly , it is a sky is falling situation to a rider who doesn't read these forums and ends up wiping out the countershaft bearings because BRP couldn't be bothered to do a quick service campaign to notify only a few thousand owners to get their belt tension set. If you wiped out your countershaft bearings and had to spend a thousand or so bucks or were stranded for a month or so without your spyder (aka Brian) it would bother you too. Even if they don't want to pay for it (wrong in my opinion) they could mail a few thousand first class mailers notifying ryders to get their belt tension checked (oh by the way because the initial BRP settings were WRONG from the factory) for not much money.

[Smylinacha]

You're ASSuming your dealer will charge you.
nojoke

"RUDENESS is the weak man's imitation of strength".....
Eric Hoffer

Nice job fly man, there you go again sneaking in the nasties

[mxz600]

Cowtown felt mine was in spec at 1200... so no adjustment. I'm going to adjust it myself down to around 500-600 and call it good.
At 1200 it's not in spec anymore. The new spec is 450N + or - 100N. These dealers need to get their :cus: together.

[NancysToy]

At 1200 it's not in spec anymore. The new spec is 450N + or - 100N. These dealers need to get their :cus: together.
I thought 450N + or - 150N was the correct spec on the actual Service Bulletin?

[Firefly]

Firefly , it is a sky is falling situation to a rider who doesn't read these forums and ends up wiping out the countershaft bearings because BRP couldn't be bothered to do a quick service campaign to notify only a few thousand owners to get their belt tension set. If you wiped out your countershaft bearings and had to spend a thousand or so bucks or were stranded for a month or so without your spyder (aka Brian) it would bother you too. Even if they don't want to pay for it (wrong in my opinion) they could mail a few thousand first class mailers notifying ryders to get their belt tension checked (oh by the way because the initial BRP settings were WRONG from the factory) for not much money.


I get ya.. and pretty much agree-- but it is what it is-- and as I've said there are many high mileage Spyders out there without any problems running the higher tensions.

Doubtful it would be a problem for me as I have the BEST warranty--- so I have 3 years left where such issues are covered-- and if possible I will renew that policy as long as they will allow it. I was told the BEST can be continued beyond the 5 year time.

[Firefly]

"RUDENESS is the weak man's imitation of strength".....
Eric Hoffer

Nice job fly man, there you go again sneaking in the nasties

Considering the level of filthy, nasty PM's I've received from your pal and the various things he threatened me with - what I said isn't rude, actually pretty darn nice all things considered.;)

"You are Judged by the Company You Keep"
Author unknown

[wyliec]

I thought 450N + or - 150N was the correct spec on the actual Service Bulletin?

It is.

[widowmaker2011]

I get ya.. and pretty much agree-- but it is what it is-- and as I've said there are many high mileage Spyders out there without any problems running the higher tensions.

Doubtful it would be a problem for me as I have the BEST warranty--- so I have 3 years left where such issues are covered-- and if possible I will renew that policy as long as they will allow it. I was told the BEST can be continued beyond the 5 year time.

I concur you are probably safe , however , its still better to have the correct tension , so damage is not being done to your machine and more importantly while "you" may be safe, the general population of owners is not...... with a BEST sales penetration in the 20% range , that means 80% of the Spyder owners won't be covered by something BRP realizes is an issue that can cause damage to the spyder. If this were a fuel gauge that intermittently read too high on some spyders I would agree do not send out a notice. This issue is way different though. Not flamin , just sharing a different perspective and my thoughts that good business practices would automatically dictate a quick, inexpensive letter to owners.

[dltang]

I concur you are probably safe , however , its still better to have the correct tension , so damage is not being done to your machine and more importantly while "you" may be safe, the general population of owners is not...... with a BEST sales penetration in the 20% range , that means 80% of the Spyder owners won't be covered by something BRP realizes is an issue that can cause damage to the spyder. If this were a fuel gauge that intermittently read too high on some spyders I would agree do not send out a notice. This issue is way different though. Not flamin , just sharing a different perspective and my thoughts that good business practices would automatically dictate a quick, inexpensive letter to owners.

Brad, that is a horrible avatar...Sorry for the thread hijack.

[Firefly]

Brad, that is a horrible avatar...Sorry for the thread hijack.

:agree:

Freaks me out!

[scudrunner]

I'm taking my RT-S in for it's 600 mile check this week. I have a list of items for them to check including the drive belt bulletin. I am taking it upon myself to be knowledgeable about my equipment and not relying on someone else. I've had to do this from the first day I picked up my Spyder. There is no one who has my best interest at heart than me.

[Firefly]

I'm taking my RT-S in for it's 600 mile check this week. I have a list of items for them to check including the drive belt bulletin. I am taking it upon myself to be knowledgeable about my equipment and not relying on someone else. I've had to do this from the first day I picked up my Spyder. There is no one who has my best interest at heart than me.

:agree::thumbup:

[mxz600]

At 1200 it's not in spec anymore. The new spec is 450N + or - 100N. These dealers need to get their :cus: together.


I thought 450N + or - 150N was the correct spec on the actual Service Bulletin?

That could be Scotty. I'm just going by the email I had. Either way, 100 or 150 + or -, I don't believe 1200 would still be within spec.

[Smylinacha]

"You are Judged by the Company You Keep[/I]"
Author unknown

"Live in such a way that you would not be ashamed to sell your parrot to the town gossip. " ~Will Rogers

[RoadHammer]

"You are Judged by the Company You Keep[/I]"
Author unknown

"Live in such a way that you would not be ashamed to sell your parrot to the town gossip. " ~Will Rogers

:2thumbs:

[Sarge707]

Went for my belt tension adjustment. Got there 3/4 hour early to let the hub cool. Took me right on time.
I asked them to tell me orginal and try to take it down to the upper level of the New ##.
He came out 25 minutes latter and said they had it at 1050 or about 245Lbs. He lowered it to 600 or about 145 Lbs.
Thats a Large difference and everyone should have it done ? IMHO

I asked if it was covered and he said "No Problem!" So I put on my helmet and drove off,

THE BRP VERDICT--:roflblack:
When I got home my answering machine was taking a message?:yikes:

I opened the door and played it Back---:dontknow:

" Mr. Sarge regarding your request about the belt tension Warranty check--:pray: BRP DOES NOT and WILL NOT Warranty any adjustment of this sort!@!" "Talk to your dealer about any future concerns in this area?"
Her name was KIM@!!!!!:lecturef_smilie:

[Firefly]

Went for my belt tension adjustment. Got there 3/4 hour early to let the hub cool. Took me right on time.
I asked them to tell me orginal and try to take it down to the upper level of the New ##.
He came out 25 minutes latter and said they had it at 1050 or about 245Lbs. He lowered it to 600 or about 145 Lbs.
Thats a Large difference and everyone should have it done ? IMHO

I asked if it was covered and he said "No Problem!" So I put on my helmet and drove off,

THE BRP VERDICT--:roflblack:
When I got home my answering machine was taking a message?:yikes:

I opened the door and played it Back---:dontknow:

" Mr. Sarge regarding your request about the belt tension Warranty check--:pray: BRP DOES NOT and WILL NOT Warranty any adjustment of this sort!@!" "Talk to your dealer about any future concerns in this area?"
Her name was KIM@!!!!!:lecturef_smilie:


So 600 would equate to around 145 lbs using something like the kricket. :thumbup:

How's the ride seem? I know Brian and Deb seemed to like theirs.

[bone crusher]

So 600 would equate to around 145 lbs using something like the kricket. :thumbup:

How's the ride seem? I know Brian and Deb seemed to like theirs.

1 Newton = .224 pounds...at least this is what we use to compare when we deal with studies that discuss pressures on the body....should be the same...

[wyliec]

So 600 would equate to around 145 lbs using something like the kricket. :thumbup:

How's the ride seem? I know Brian and Deb seemed to like theirs.

I had mine readjusted Saturday and I didn't notice any smoother ride. The CHAD's movement is as much as it has ever been.

[NancysToy]

So 600 would equate to around 145 lbs using something like the kricket. :thumbup:

How's the ride seem? I know Brian and Deb seemed to like theirs.


1 Newton = .224 pounds...at least this is what we use to compare when we deal with studies that discuss pressures on the body....should be the same...
Don't be certain...until you can get a comparision between the sonic and the krickit. While the above conversion is true (actually 1 Newton = 0.2248089 pounds force), the kricket may read something different altogether, due to the vast difference in measuring methods. You do not want to accidentally set your belt tension way too low, just because you assumed it was a direct conversion.

[Firefly]

Don't be certain...until you can get a comparision between the sonic and the krickit. While the above conversion is true (actually 1 Newton = 0.2248089 pounds force), the kricket may read something different altogether, due to the vast difference in measuring methods. You do not want to accidentally set your belt tension way too low, just because you assumed it was a direct conversion.

I really wanted to check Brian's or Deb's with my krickit--- but I forgot.

I guess some have been able to do sonic readings using computer software also--- but can't find much info on it.

Someone at Cuba (I think it was Wheeler) said that in Daytona his was checked and it only read 1 Newton--- it was that loose. :yikes:

[kytten]

I took my Spyder in on Friday last week and the way they explained it to me was that they would do the belt check during normal maintenance for no charge and if I wanted it done outside normal maintenance that they would charge me for it.

I checked the mileage and was right around the mileage needed for the first maintenance check so they did mine for no additional charge. When I got my bill I checked it carefully and I was charged for the oil change and labor -- and several warranty and maintenance items were listed at $0.

I also did feel more comfortable driving it after the change, it was a smoother ride to me (less vibration) and also it seemed that the downshifting was less jarring.

As for what BRP should do -- I see a lot of valid points here, but whether this large corporation is going to listen to a few users is another thing entirely. So far as I've seen in the past 6 months they don't seem to be willing to do much of that.

I agree with those that say it's really up to the dealer to have your back. But at the same time, the dealer is in it for money too. it's kind of a delicate balance between making the money and keeping the customer happy.

I didn't and don't like my dealer's response about what they'd make me pay for and what they wouldn't. What if I wasn't due for another service for a couple thousand miles? Does that mean I should drive on outdated spec and possibly damage a vehicle that I paid a lot of money for? As it is, it appears I was out of spec on several warranty related updates despite the fact that my dealer uncrated and built my bike new last fall. Apparently no updates were done at that point before letting me take it home. These things annoy me and make me want to look for another dealership. When I told my service department my feelings on the subject I was told that their way of doing things was 'standard' and the same for all companies, not just BRP.

All this run around is putting my boyfriend (who has been considering buying a Spyder since I bought mine) in a mood to look at OTHER vendors and other dealers when he goes to buy his motorcycle later this year.

[Sarge707]

So 600 would equate to around 145 lbs using something like the kricket. :thumbup:

How's the ride seem? I know Brian and Deb seemed to like theirs.

Actually I,m wrong . Scottys right 1050= 235 600=134 My base # was off!

I noticed LESS vibration as I blew by a Semi at 95 on the way home!:roflblack:
Seemed to be a looser song to it?
I,m going to buy a Kriket, Torque wrench and 36mm socket soon and will test it in the next several days (Jacking under frame-Not swing arm!)
Hopefully I can do the test by the book and give you a comparison.:pray:

[Questions]

I just called my dealer in AUS asked him about the belt tension and they told me that it only applies only to the RT.This doesnt sound right.Could someone confirm this.I tried to access the bossweb page with no luck.
Thankyou in advance.
Eric

[Vordak]

Belt adjustements have never been covered by any automotive manufacturer.

GM/FORD/DODGE/TOYOTA/HONDA and all the others, they don't cover it.

Neither does Harley Davidson.

Belts are like brakes, wear item.

V.

[Trickie Dick]

I just called my dealer in AUS asked him about the belt tension and they told me that it only applies only to the RT.This doesnt sound right.Could someone confirm this.I tried to access the bossweb page with no luck.
Thankyou in advance.
Eric
I doubt very seriously you will be able to access bossweb unless you are a dealer with software and password.
Anyway look at post 30 here for a copy of the Service Bulletin. http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18551
You will see it affects the GS & RS as well.
Dick

[scudrunner]

Well, I'm confused. Bought my RT-S March 1st, it had been in the crate in the back for a while.... It's in the shop for the 600 mi check and the service guy told me there are no outstanding bulletins for my Spyder. I told him I was concerned about the belt tension, but he said "There are no bulletins listed for your Spyder." I guess that means he isn't going to check it since it wasn't listed. Trust is a big part of a service department. So far, they don't have that from me.

[Prense01]

Mine was done by the dealer when I picked up the bike new. I told them about it and they pulled up the information on this site. No questions asked and no charge...

Chris :spyder:

[Sarge707]

Well, I'm confused. Bought my RT-S March 1st, it had been in the crate in the back for a while.... It's in the shop for the 600 mi check and the service guy told me there are no outstanding bulletins for my Spyder. I told him I was concerned about the belt tension, but he said "There are no bulletins listed for your Spyder." I guess that means he isn't going to check it since it wasn't listed. Trust is a big part of a service department. So far, they don't have that from me.

"For your own piece of mind ?" Call 866-767-0707 BRP Tech Line Toll Free :Dand give your VIN # and ask them for any Outstanding services due and ask about the belt tension!! If your paying for a 600 mile service the bulletin should be free while they do the service! I,d have BRP CALL your dealer. Let your dealer know WHO the customer is!!!

[scudrunner]

Well, I'm on the phone with them now, lots of confusion. Since this isn't a "campaign", the "service bulletin" wouldn't show up when the dealer pulled the VIN# for upgrades. :hun::hun: So they wouldn't know to do it. But the bulletin says for machines that come in for service, it needs to be done. So after verifying everything, the VERY nice lady at BRP is going to call my dealer and tell them what they need to do.
And this is yet another reason why I am skeptical about the ability and quality of this dealer. I've had to TELL them how to do their job since the second day I've owned this Spyder. I even told him that I was concerned about the belt tension and gave him the bulletin number.
I'm just about to run out of honey with these guys.....
Update: Picked up the Spyder and talked to the service guy. He gave the bulletin to the tech. According to my highly sensitive and calibrated finger, the belt is now looser than it was before.

[SpyderWolf]

I took my Spyder in on Friday last week and the way they explained it to me was that they would do the belt check during normal maintenance for no charge and if I wanted it done outside normal maintenance that they would charge me for it.

I checked the mileage and was right around the mileage needed for the first maintenance check so they did mine for no additional charge. When I got my bill I checked it carefully and I was charged for the oil change and labor -- and several warranty and maintenance items were listed at $0.

I also did feel more comfortable driving it after the change, it was a smoother ride to me (less vibration) and also it seemed that the downshifting was less jarring.

As for what BRP should do -- I see a lot of valid points here, but whether this large corporation is going to listen to a few users is another thing entirely. So far as I've seen in the past 6 months they don't seem to be willing to do much of that.

I agree with those that say it's really up to the dealer to have your back. But at the same time, the dealer is in it for money too. it's kind of a delicate balance between making the money and keeping the customer happy.

I didn't and don't like my dealer's response about what they'd make me pay for and what they wouldn't. What if I wasn't due for another service for a couple thousand miles? Does that mean I should drive on outdated spec and possibly damage a vehicle that I paid a lot of money for? As it is, it appears I was out of spec on several warranty related updates despite the fact that my dealer uncrated and built my bike new last fall. Apparently no updates were done at that point before letting me take it home. These things annoy me and make me want to look for another dealership. When I told my service department my feelings on the subject I was told that their way of doing things was 'standard' and the same for all companies, not just BRP.

All this run around is putting my boyfriend (who has been considering buying a Spyder since I bought mine) in a mood to look at OTHER vendors and other dealers when he goes to buy his motorcycle later this year.


Well, I'm on the phone with them now, lots of confusion. Since this isn't a "campaign", the "service bulletin" wouldn't show up when the dealer pulled the VIN# for upgrades. :hun::hun: So they wouldn't know to do it. But the bulletin says for machines that come in for service, it needs to be done. So after verifying everything, the VERY nice lady at BRP is going to call my dealer and tell them what they need to do.
And this is yet another reason why I am skeptical about the ability and quality of this dealer. I've had to TELL them how to do their job since the second day I've owned this Spyder. I even told him that I was concerned about the belt tension and gave him the bulletin number.
I'm just about to run out of honey with these guys.....
Update: Picked up the Spyder and talked to the service guy. He gave the bulletin to the tech. According to my highly sensitive and calibrated finger, the belt is now looser than it was before.

The two of you are basically in the same position I am right now. I made calls to 3 different dealers trying to find one that knew about the bulletins and would perform the work on our Spyders. The closest 1 is an hour and a half away. A couple of them were adamant that they do not perform service bulletin work until you bring the Spyder in for service. One of them changed his tune rather quickly when I told him the issue was causing the sprockets to fail. He asked me to provide our VINs and he would look into it further. Fortunately, the closest dealer called me back and set up an appointment to take care of it tomorrow. I fully expect to be charged for their time, but will be most pleased if they do it for free.

An ounce of prevention may definitely be worth a pound of cure in this situation. :thumbup:

Hopefully this dealer will do me well, and you will be able to find good ones to deal with also. Best of luck.

[Firefly]

The tech guys in Cuba thought I was nuts for saying the belt tension should be down in the 450 range..... just seems most techs are not up to date as quickly as we are on what is going on......

Gotta keep ontop of them... or do it yourself.

Going to order new front sprocket bolt and replace it just to be on the safe side.