Dealer says Rain triggered Limp Mode & VSS Fault? Is this true?

[Two2Three]

So today I was on the interstate, in the rain for about 100 miles on I-35. Temp was about 70 degrees, light but steady rain shower. I did have the heated grips on low because I only had mesh gloves and they were soaked and a little cool. Otherwise, I was cruising along just fine, enjoying the vivid wet leaves on the trees.

About 90 miles in, the cruise control suddenly shut off, and wouldn't re-engage.

Then suddenly (first time for me) the "Limp Home Mode" light came on, along with an idiot light that I couldn't quite make out in the rain. Maybe wheels with a little lightning bolt? I'd recogize it if I saw it again.

I was still doing 70, and was passing a big tractor-trailer when it went into Limp mode (yay) but was able to slow down, move behind him and off the road. Shut it down, waited a minute, and started it up again, and it got me the rest of the way home. The cruise control still wouldn't work though, but it did work again much later after I'd stopped for gas for several minutes.

After I got home I called the dealer, who basically said "if it's working now, there's nothing we can do". And also essentially told me riding in the rain is the issue. That it messes up the electrical "stuff".

WHAT? I'm about to head off alone for South Dakota, and you tell me riding in the rain is a problem? Seriously? :shocked: I'm thinking of cancelling my trip and I'll only take long trips with at least one other rider if a light rain can shut down the bike. :sour:

Is this true? Don't ride a spyder in the rain?

[fatboy]

water in brake switch

[Snowbelt Spyder]

Of course you can ride a Spyder in the rain. This is a classic example of what happens if your brake light switch is activated without actually using the brakes. So, you were wet and cold. Could you have been accidentally contacting and slightly depressing the brake pedal without realizing it? Plus, you have a 2022 RT. Have you checked it for the recall on the switch?

[Two2Three]

I did get the brake light switch recall done.
I don't think I was touching the brake pedal, because I've been warned about that from people who had it happen.

I was amazed when the service tech implied that riding in the rain caused the problems. Hence my question and concern. :)

[Two2Three]

water in brake switch

Is that something I can check or prevent? I'm halfway mechanically inclined, but all I've had to do is an oil change and hook up a GPS so far. I don't know all the ins and outs. :)

[CloverHillCrawler]

I rode my F3 through the afternoon downpours for 4 days straight while I did my tour of the cherohala, dragon, moonshiners, and brp back home.

Had to bail out of the BRP after going through heavy thunderstorms on mount pisgah when rocks and rain started coming in the roadway.

even had a f350 coming the opposite way who was so kind enough to go right for a large piece of flooded out road so he could drench me.

But luckily the only issue with water was my show chrome turn signal on the right side lost one led prematurely in cold weather , and I think I can also attribute some moisture causing a premature failure from that trip of my signature light when I took it out in 14 degree weather and it failed on one side..

[BajaRon]

Rain, even heavy rain, should not be a problem. The brake light switch would be my first answer as it has been with others. That could also explain the link to the cruise control. Did they pull codes to see what the computer said?

[Two2Three]

Rain, even heavy rain, should not be a problem. The brake light switch would be my first answer as it has been with others. That could also explain the link to the cruise control. Did they pull codes to see what the computer said?

No, they weren't interested in me even bringing it in. Just said if it's running fine now, there's nothing to look at.

I need a new dealer.

[billz]

I rode from Washington D.C. to Calif. first part of June on I-80. I had rain, hail, or both for part of every day with no problems. On the trip to D.C. the guy behind me noted that my brake light was on for a while. I figured out that I had my foot resting against the brake pedal shaft. After that, I made sure my foot was not in contact with it and no more issues.

[Snowbelt Spyder]

No, they weren't interested in me even bringing it in. Just said if it's running fine now, there's nothing to look at.

I need a new dealer.

Yes you do. And now the entire world knows that your service tech is full of crap.

First - props to you for getting the recall done.

Second - here's a link to the actual recall bulletin. The 2022 gets the new, curly-q helper spring. If able, you could crawl under there, to check their workmanship, and make sure that it has been installed correctly, especially where it hooks to the main spring. Refer to the RT picture on page 5.

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/rcl/2023/RCSB-23V175-2373.pdf

Something as simple as a new pair of riding boots can cause a rider to inadvertently contact the brake pedal enough to trigger the VSS fault. When you're cold, wet, and miserable, no telling what can happen.

Go on your trip. Worry less. Be safe out there.

[BajaRon]

No, they weren't interested in me even bringing it in. Just said if it's running fine now, there's nothing to look at.

I need a new dealer.

Here is what they were not interested in.

Decent Customer Service
Doing the right thing
Your safety
Your satisfaction
Your loyalty

I could add a few more lines. But I'd say you get the picture.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

OK my take on this after reading all the other answers ..... my first reaction was :gaah: the dealer ..... That icon you saw was the VSS warning that the Spyder had Exceeded the parameters of the computer ( and YES it was logged in and Yes it could be retrieved ) .... could the Brake switch be part of the problem Yes again ..... But I am surprised you could drive at 70 mph on a wet surface .....here's the thing about WET surfaces .... THEY ARN'T ALL THE SAME AMOUNT OF " SLIPPERINESS ".... From what I learned from my " accident investigator courses " during wet weather different types of rad surfaces will react differently to water .... and there will be spots that are a lot more slippery than others because of various types of contamination ie. oil, diesel fuel, gas, antifreeze etc. .... Real life example - me driving in a downpour & have to stop at a toll booth, after paying I applied throttle & just spun the rear tire, I let off the gas gained a bit of traction and just barely applied throttle ( while the A-hole behind me was blasting thier horn :yikes: ) .... finally got going and slowly drove into traffic. Is this what happened to you ???? .... can't say for sure but it could have .... Mike :thumbup:

[BajaRon]

OK my take on this after reading all the other answers ..... my first reaction was :gaah: the dealer ..... That icon you saw was the VSS warning that the Spyder had Exceeded the parameters of the computer ( and YES it was logged in and Yes it could be retrieved ) .... could the Brake switch be part of the problem Yes again ..... But I am surprised you could drive at 70 mph on a wet surface .....here's the thing about WET surfaces .... THEY ARN'T ALL THE SAME AMOUNT OF " SLIPPERINESS ".... From what I learned from my " accident investigator courses " during wet weather different types of rad surfaces will react differently to water .... and there will be spots that are a lot more slippery than others because of various types of contamination ie. oil, diesel fuel, gas, antifreeze etc. .... Real life example - me driving in a downpour & have to stop at a toll booth, after paying I applied throttle & just spun the rear tire, I let off the gas gained a bit of traction and just barely applied throttle ( while the A-hole behind me was blasting thier horn :yikes: ) .... finally got going and slowly drove into traffic. Is this what happened to you ???? .... can't say for sure but it could have .... Mike :thumbup:

Good catch. At 70 mph the OP may have had some rear wheel spin. Though I would think he might have noticed his RPM increasing with no matching increase in speed. That could very well have set the VSS off and disengaged the cruise control. Though it would not explain why the cruise control refused to re-set until much later.

[Bfromla]

Would be telling dealer interested in knowing what was recorded (Buds)just to confirm what the issue actually was & if is resolved, not just inactive.

[Two2Three]

I honestly didn’t notice any lack of traction or slip while riding. But I can see how maybe the computer noticed something I did not. I also don’t think I was against the brake. My hands were chilly but the rest of me was perfectly comfortable. I was relaxed and warm in my riding gear and rain suit. But it sounds like that brake pedal must be crazy sensitive. Seems like a big design flaw if hitting the side can cause that much chaos.

I’ll have a look at that bulletin. I can run it up on my Big Blue and get under there easily enough.

I do appreciate everyone’s replies. The weather forecast for Deadwood for the 3W rally week looks like rain every single day, so it may not even be worth going. But that’s why the dealers comment about rainy weather sort of freaked me out!

[CloverHillCrawler]

I have had my 2wd silverado spin the back wheels while doing 75 with the cruise control on going uphill on a wet road.

I don't use cruise control anymore in the rain after experiencing that.

I don't know about more modern cars but I thought there was a warning or bulletin out about using cruise control on wet surfaces at one time an all vehicles.

[Mikey]

Well, they tell you in the book not to use your cruise in slippery conditions anyway!!:lecturef_smilie:

[Snowbelt Spyder]

OK my take on this after reading all the other answers ..... my first reaction was :gaah: the dealer ..... That icon you saw was the VSS warning that the Spyder had Exceeded the parameters of the computer ( and YES it was logged in and Yes it could be retrieved ) .... could the Brake switch be part of the problem Yes again ..... But I am surprised you could drive at 70 mph on a wet surface .....here's the thing about WET surfaces .... THEY ARN'T ALL THE SAME AMOUNT OF " SLIPPERINESS ".... From what I learned from my " accident investigator courses " during wet weather different types of rad surfaces will react differently to water .... and there will be spots that are a lot more slippery than others because of various types of contamination ie. oil, diesel fuel, gas, antifreeze etc. .... Real life example - me driving in a downpour & have to stop at a toll booth, after paying I applied throttle & just spun the rear tire, I let off the gas gained a bit of traction and just barely applied throttle ( while the A-hole behind me was blasting thier horn :yikes: ) .... finally got going and slowly drove into traffic. Is this what happened to you ???? .... can't say for sure but it could have .... Mike :thumbup:

You're right, a VSS activation in those conditions would be normal and expected. But, that will activate, correct the situation, and then clear. A Limp Home Mode is not part of a normal VSS activation. And as Ron pointed out, nor would being locked out of cruise control until later, either. But the nugget here, of course, is to refrain from using cruise control in the rain.

[Tango]

Yes you need a new dealer. He didn't even offer to check it out for you! :lecturef_smilie: Did you buy it there? AND, we need to know who this dealer is! nojoke Tom :spyder:

[Two2Three]

Well, they tell you in the book not to use your cruise in slippery conditions anyway!!:lecturef_smilie:

I know I know. And I did actually think about that when the rain started. I kept it off for a long time. I didn’t start using it until the rain was really nearly done. I made sure I wasn’t seeing any standing water or anything anywhere. But if that was the problem I certainly won’t use it unless the road is bone dry in the future.

Yes this was the dealer where I bought it.

[Raven]

I am no expert, but here is my take on it.
When your traction control comes on, it applies the brake to the wheel slipping.
With the cruise on and the TC kicking in might have triggered the fault.
Just a guess.

[Raven]

Also your dealer is a idiot along with the tech.
They should checked for safety reasons alone.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

Well, they tell you in the book not to use your cruise in slippery conditions anyway!!:lecturef_smilie:

On the other hand if the rear wheel slips on a wet road the CC is shut off instantly. The time or two it happened to me the RT immediately straightened up and I was in full control.

[BajaRon]

I need to take back my previous statement. Rain CAN trigger limp mode...

203599

[ARtraveler]

Years ago, I had similar experience when riding in the rain. My problem was a bad spark plug wire. It was shorting out when I ran through puddles. :bowdown: This was on my 08 GS.

[Peter Aawen]

On the other hand if the rear wheel slips on a wet road the CC is shut off instantly. The time or two it happened to me the RT immediately straightened up and I was in full control.

:agree: Altho it doesn't hafta be just the rear wheel - a front wheel speed difference like that, maybe induced by something like you getting one front wheel hydroplaning in a deeper than expected puddle, will do exactly the same thing as well as applying and balancing any necessary braking of the other wheels (cos TC rarely applies the brake on a slipping wheel, it usually releases it if there's any braking being applied to that wheel! ;) ) to keep it all tidy and then returning full control to you far quicker than you could otherwise even realise what was going on, let alone regain control & react in the first instance! :shocked: Most of the time the shock to you as a rider is that it's all over quicker than you can even realise what's going on, and I believe it's often THAT which needlessly scares many! So the Nanny looked after you & maybe saved your butt, that's what she's DESIGNED to do! :lecturef_smilie:

Back in the days of the older vacuum type or throttle lock cruise control systems, not using CC in the rain was only sensible because of the inherent delays in shutting it down & taking back full control if things went wrong; but these days, with fly-by-wire throttles and the whole suite of computer controlled traction & stability aids that respond in milli-seconds to variations in wheel speed changes et al that we so affectionately call the Nanny, if you are judicious & reasonable with your initial speed settings and then vary that setting appropriately as/when conditions change, using CC and letting the Nanny do her thing by responding FAAARR QUICKER than you ever could to all those changes, many of which YOU, the operator, CAN'T EVEN DETECT (as evidenced by the original post in this thread) then IMHO, using CC judiciously in the wet can be can be a pretty handy SAFETY AID! :lecturef_smilie:

As for the Limp Home Mode, I suspect that something else triggered that, possibly even something that the 'CC shut off' was in response to. :rolleyes: But whatever it was, since it was persistent enough to stop CC being reset for some time, I doubt very much that it was simply 'wet road wheel spin' related, cos whenever my CC has disengaged in the wet due to wheel spin or a slip (often that I barely even noticed!) I've been instantly able to re-assess my speed setting and pretty much immediately reset CC & proceed, safe in the knowledge that the Nanny can and will react far quicker to that sorta wheel spin &/or sliding stuff than I could even think of winding back my throttle setting, let alone actually DOING ANYTHING ABOUT IT! :ohyea:

[Flamewinger]

Rule of thumb with anything you drive or ride is “You don’t use cruise control when it’s raining!”

https://www.aaa.com/autorepair/articles/avoid-cruise-control-on-slippery-roads

[Peteoz]

Couldn’t agree more, Peter. The old adage of “don’t use cruise control in the rain” was made redundant once “Nannies” became commonplace in todays vehicles. The nanny has taken over before your brain has even registered an issue, has shut down cruise and applied corrective action to wherever needs it. I remember doing an advanced driving course about 6 years ago when the driving instructor told us exactly that. He said the “no cruise in wet” claim was similar to those who claimed they could brake better than ABS when it arrived on the scene……..except they couldn’t, when put to a live test.

Pete

[CloverHillCrawler]

I need to take back my previous statement. Rain CAN trigger limp mode...

203599

I felt like that going through Blue Ridge City Tenn. on my way to Tellico Plains. Had a couple of places that I thought would swamp my Spyder.

Luckily when I stopped under a overhang there for an Insurance agency 2 nice ladies came out and offered to let me in to dry off.

But the rain let up as they were talking with me and I was able to move on.

[Mikey]

:popcorn: This ones going into the weeds!!! Pretty soon we will be going to autonomies bikes, and you will be able to sit and shave your face while the bike takes you to where you have punched in to the gps!:roflblack:

[Little Blue]

Rain Spyder

:coffee:...Well you just have to talk about all the different possibilities. I mean what else can you do. ....:banghead:

Stay Safe and stay Healthy. ....:thumbup:

[JesseT]

I would go back to the dealer and ask to speak to the owner. Or at least to the highest man in charge in the office. the service mgr and the tech need a good talkin to. otherwise go talk to some other dealers and choose the one you like. I do know if I were the owner a couple of heads would be rolling. It only take a couple of minutes to read the code history and then you would know.