One for Mr Aawen on tyres in Aus

[glennm]

Peter I noticed a couple of times you mentioning that you were testing a variety of tyres on the Spyder.

Is there a timeframe where we can expect your considered and valued opinion on what tyres are available in Aus for our Spyders?

While I do not need tyres at the moment I would very much like to have recommended/preferred options when the time comes. Given I am using Spydey as an almost daily rider I expect I will need them sooner rather than later.

It would appear there are very few options in Aus for us and unfortunately the preferred options of our US friends don't translate to availability here.

Others please feel free to chime in with your Aus tyre experiences/recommendations. If they are not the standard size then the tyre you went for would also be great as I expect I will need to pop the wheels off and take them in to the tyre place for fitting.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Peter I noticed a couple of times you mentioning that you were testing a variety of tyres on the Spyder.

Is there a timeframe where we can expect your considered and valued opinion on what tyres are available in Aus for our Spyders?

While I do not need tyres at the moment I would very much like to have recommended/preferred options when the time comes. Given I am using Spydey as an almost daily rider I expect I will need them sooner rather than later.

It would appear there are very few options in Aus for us and unfortunately the preferred options of our US friends don't translate to availability here.

Others please feel free to chime in with your Aus tyre experiences/recommendations. If they are not the standard size then the tyre you went for would also be great as I expect I will need to pop the wheels off and take them in to the tyre place for fitting.

:agree: .. If anyone will give the best advice it would be Peter ( for Australian tires ) … I'm fairly positive He is going to recommend Auto tires as re-placements …. If you could post what Auto tires are available in Australia it will save a bunch of time … I can research a good choice if I knew what you can get. …. Help us help you ….. Mike :ohyea:

[Peter Aawen]

It's not strictly 'tire testing on Spyders' so much Glen, it's more along the lines of 'tire testing, which in some instances, depending on appropriate sizes & tire availability, might include some time spent fitted to a Spyder while said testing is being conducted'.... Make sense?!? :lecturef_smilie:

However, I'll freely share my opinions & general advice on tires pretty much anytime (on an 'all care no responsibility you get what you paid for money back guarantee' basis, of course! ;) ) but the sad news about the tire testing I'm doing atm is that someone else is paying for it & because of that, they 'own' the rights to those results & how/when said results might see the light of day, if at all!! :shocked:

But for what it's worth, to date I haven't yet come across any 'readily available & reasonably recognisable name brand auto tires' here in Aust that haven't behaved very well on our Spyders, even when the sizes available have meant changing up or down a width &/or a profile size or two. The Spyder's VSS will readily handle the 'legally allowable' changes in size/width/profile here in Aust just so long as you stay fairly close to matching any changes made up front with similar changes on the rear and vice versa; and of course, any tire you fit MUST suit a 'J' profile rim and match or exceed the load & speed ratings on your tire placard. :rolleyes: At least for me & my tire needs/uses, so far every tire fitting the criteria above that I've tried has worked & performed better than the OE Spec Kendas & provided better & more predictable handling, traction, braking, and response in all tested ryding conditions, just so long as the tire pressures have been adjusted to suit the lesser loads a Spyder places upon them!! :thumbup:

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

It's not strictly 'tire testing on Spyders' so much Glen, it's more along the lines of 'tire testing, which in some instances, depending on appropriate sizes & tire availability, might include some time spent fitted to a Spyder while said testing is being conducted'.... Make sense?!? :lecturef_smilie:

However, I'll freely share my opinions & general advice on tires pretty much anytime (on an 'all care no responsibility you get what you paid for money back guarantee' basis, of course! ;) ) but the sad news about the tire testing I'm doing atm is that someone else is paying for it & because of that, they 'own' the rights to those results & how/when said results might see the light of day, if at all!! :shocked:

But for what it's worth, to date I haven't yet come across any 'readily available & reasonably recognisable name brand auto tires' here in Aust that haven't behaved very well on our Spyders, even when the sizes available have meant changing up or down a width &/or a profile size or two. The Spyder's VSS will readily handle the 'legally allowable' changes in size/width/profile here in Aust just so long as you stay fairly close to matching any changes made up front with similar changes on the rear and vice versa; and of course, any tire you fit MUST suit a 'J' profile rim and match or exceed the load & speed ratings on your tire placard. :rolleyes: At least for me & my tire needs/uses, so far every tire fitting the criteria above that I've tried has worked & performed better than the OE Spec Kendas & provided better & more predictable handling, traction, braking, and response in all tested ryding conditions, just so long as the tire pressures have been adjusted to suit the lesser loads a Spyder places upon them!! :thumbup:

:agree: .. and let me add that I have seen ( on this forum ) every possible combination of front to rear tire sizes used ( auto tires ) and none of them have tripped up the Nanny. The settings Bosche used in their computer parameters are wide enough to allow for any tires that will fit the OEM wheels and frame / fender clearances. ….. Mike

[glennm]

Thanks Peter & Mike.

Will do some research today on possibilities but to date haven't found anything in 165 55 15 for the fronts.

I am assuming I should also look for 155 60 15 and 175 50 15????

There doesn't seem to be much guard clearance.

For the back 225 50 15, 215 60 15 or 235 45 15?

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Thanks Peter & Mike.

Will do some research today on possibilities but to date haven't found anything in 165 55 15 for the fronts.

I am assuming I should also look for 155 60 15 and 175 50 15????

There doesn't seem to be much guard clearance.

For the back 225 50 15, 215 60 15 or 235 45 15?

" 235 " …. that size would make me nervous ….. we need to know what tires are available to you ….. Mike :ohyea:

[Peter Aawen]

The basic guidelines are "if you go up a width, go down a profile, and vice versa", altho we know from experience that up front, most of our Spyders actually benefit from going up in either width OR profile WITHOUT the corresponding drop in the other aspect. There are quite a few people running 165/60's up front, some running even wider tires.... (I know of one running 185/45's, altho personally, I'm not too keen on going that much wider &/or lower than 165 without making appropriate suspension &/or steering changes, buuut.... :dontknow: ). Same on the rear, there are Spyders out there running 225/60 rear tires quite successfully, even (or possibly especially...) in the wet! For example, I'm currently running 165/60R15's up front and have a 225/60R15 on the rear giving me ride & handling that is a measurable improvement over 'stock' and has returned more than double the tire longevity, plus the speedo is almost exactly spot on! :ohyea:

That said, as Mike suggests, 235 might be just a little wide for the rear, especially given the swing arm & belt proximity constraints, but as we've both said a number of times, you really need to look at the ACTUAL physical dimensions of any/each tire you are considering - the nominal size taken off the sidewall is just that, a NOMINAL size, and as such it can be INCHES (or somewhat more than 25mm!) different from the actual physical size that you might expect!!! Similarly, the 'size comparison' charts & tables that abound on the internet are just GUIDES, they don't necessarily reflect the ACTUAL physical dimensions of the tires you are considering, so while they are handy for rough comparisons, you really need to look at the published specs & dimensions on whichever tires you may see as contenders...... and then compare those dimensions to the ACTUAL dimensions of a tire that you KNOW fits already!! :thumbup:

Without delving into their current listings, IIRC Bridgestone, Goodyear, Hankook, Toyo, Michelin, Yokohama, Kumho, BFGoodrich, Federal, Nankang, and a bunch more reputable tire brands all sell tires in Australia in actual sizes that fit our Spyders.... (sorry if I've missed anyone's 'favourite brand', that list wasn't intended to be exhaustive or necessarily complete... it was an 'off the top of my head' indicative listing. ;) )

[JackSA]

Thanks Peter & Mike.

Will do some research today on possibilities but to date haven't found anything in 165 55 15 for the fronts.

I am assuming I should also look for 155 60 15 and 175 50 15????

There doesn't seem to be much guard clearance.

For the back 225 50 15, 215 60 15 or 235 45 15?

I put Nankeng Eco 2 165 x 60 x15 on my F3L front. Very good in handling and well balanced. The vibration is no longer felt.
For the rear I put a Falken ZE 912; 225 x50 x15


I am very happy with the tyres I now have.

[Airborne]

I Have ordered but not yet received a Nankeng in std size for my rear after reading some good reviews, however i was informed by the dealer that they are struggling to get them anymore, at least in std size. Strangely, after telling the dealer 'no thanks' to kenda's it was the only other tire he would fit to a spyder even though it is a 'car tire' he said it was the only other tire suitable for a spyder. Go figure. Good luck and let us know what you end up with.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

I Have ordered but not yet received a Nankeng in std size for my rear after reading some good reviews, however i was informed by the dealer that they are struggling to get them anymore, at least in std size. Strangely, after telling the dealer 'no thanks' to kenda's it was the only other tire he would fit to a spyder even though it is a 'car tire' he said it was the only other tire suitable for a spyder. Go figure. Good luck and let us know what you end up with.

IMHO, that dealer doesn't know their A from their E :roflblack::roflblack::roflblack: ….. Peter knows better …. Mike :ohyea:

[glennm]

Thanks everyone. The search so far has revealed the below available is Aus.
165 55 15
Achilles ATR-K Economist
Nankang AS-1 Asymmetric

175 50 15
Hankook Kinergy eco K425
Goodyear Eagle NCT5
Kumho Ecowing ES01 KH27

155 60 15
Achilles ATR-K Economist
Kumho Ecsta KH11

225 50 15
Pirelli P Zero but at $600 a tyre no thanks
Bridgestone Potenza Motorsport RE11S TL - a racing tyre?
Falken ZE912 - Falken Aus don't list it however a general search returns a tyre mob that supposedly has them so may be an option.

215 60 15
Hankook Optimo H426
Dunlop SP Sport LM704
Kumho Ecowing ES01 KH27
Maxxis MAP1
BF Goodrich Radial T/A
Goodyear Eagle Efficientgrip
Falken ZE912
Bridgestone Supercat TL

[glennm]

The basic guidelines are "if you go up a width, go down a profile, and vice versa", altho we know from experience that up front, most of our Spyders actually benefit from going up in either width OR profile WITHOUT the corresponding drop in the other aspect. There are quite a few people running 165/60's up front, some running even wider tires.... (I know of one running 185/45's, altho personally, I'm not too keen on going that much wider &/or lower than 165 without making appropriate suspension &/or steering changes, buuut.... :dontknow: ). Same on the rear, there are Spyders out there running 225/60 rear tires quite successfully, even (or possibly especially...) in the wet! For example, I'm currently running 165/60R15's up front and have a 225/60R15 on the rear giving me ride & handling that is a measurable improvement over 'stock' and has returned more than double the tire longevity, plus the speedo is almost exactly spot on! :ohyea:

That said, as Mike suggests, 235 might be just a little wide for the rear, especially given the swing arm & belt proximity constraints, but as we've both said a number of times, you really need to look at the ACTUAL physical dimensions of any/each tire you are considering - the nominal size taken off the sidewall is just that, a NOMINAL size, and as such it can be INCHES (or somewhat more than 25mm!) different from the actual physical size that you might expect!!! Similarly, the 'size comparison' charts & tables that abound on the internet are just GUIDES, they don't necessarily reflect the ACTUAL physical dimensions of the tires you are considering, so while they are handy for rough comparisons, you really need to look at the published specs & dimensions on whichever tires you may see as contenders...... and then compare those dimensions to the ACTUAL dimensions of a tire that you KNOW fits already!! :thumbup:

Without delving into their current listings, IIRC Bridgestone, Goodyear, Hankook, Toyo, Michelin, Yokohama, Kumho, BFGoodrich, Federal, Nankang, and a bunch more reputable tire brands all sell tires in Australia in actual sizes that fit our Spyders.... (sorry if I've missed anyone's 'favourite brand', that list wasn't intended to be exhaustive or necessarily complete... it was an 'off the top of my head' indicative listing. ;) )

Thanks Peter trouble is a number of those well know brands indicate on their web sites they don't have our oem sizes or have matching front or rear.
I would like to stick to standard if possible as you are pretty much assured they will fit.

[glennm]

I put Nankeng Eco 2 165 x 60 x15 on my F3L front. Very good in handling and well balanced. The vibration is no longer felt.
For the rear I put a Falken ZE 912; 225 x50 x15


I am very happy with the tyres I now have.

Thanks Jack neither Nankang nor Falken Aus indicate they have those sizes. Might be lucky enough to find someone who imports direct though.
Nankang do have an AS-1 Asymmetric though in standard size apparently.

[glennm]

I Have ordered but not yet received a Nankeng in std size for my rear after reading some good reviews, however i was informed by the dealer that they are struggling to get them anymore, at least in std size. Strangely, after telling the dealer 'no thanks' to kenda's it was the only other tire he would fit to a spyder even though it is a 'car tire' he said it was the only other tire suitable for a spyder. Go figure. Good luck and let us know what you end up with.

Thanks Airborne Nankang Aus only list the AS-1 Asymmetric as an option.

[Airborne]

Thanks Glenm, the one i have on order is a xr-611 in 225/50/r15, but i'm told no longer available in Oz, i got the last one..

Yes Mike i know but at least hes happy to supply and fit for me'

[stu]

i have a customer with nankang as-1 fitted on front,165/55/15 no problemns there.in aus

[Peter Aawen]

Thanks Peter trouble is a number of those well know brands indicate on their web sites they don't have our oem sizes or have matching front or rear.
I would like to stick to standard if possible as you are pretty much assured they will fit.


I wouldn't just rely on the websites - they don't always tell the whole story! If you can, find out who your State's 'Prime Dealer' for a given tire brand is, and give them a call, or at least ask your local tire bloke to give them a call! ;) Most brands have many tire sizes made & probably even imported that are not listed as available in Aust on their websites, you just hafta ask the question! :lecturef_smilie:

And once again, don't be too fixated on the 'standard sizes' - very few tires are ACTUALLY the specific size they have printed on their sidewalls, so you can often find tires with a different nominal size printed on their sidewall that are actually very close in their physical dimensions to the OE Spec Kendas..... or maybe something that's a little bit taller so that your speedo is closer to correct! Checking & comparing the published 'revs per km' is often a good start to doing that comparison, bearing in mind that the OE Spec tires can give you a speedo reading that can as much as 10% higher than your true speed. :thumbup:

[askitee]

I had two Nankang AS-1's (same size as the OEM Kenda's ) fitted to the front of my 17 RTL yesterday, as close a match to the Nankang XR611 (same size as the OEM Kenda) rear as I could get. I've put about 130kms on them and agree with Peter, anything appears to improve on the OEMs.

You've possibly already read my write up on the XR611 https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?124948-Nankang-XR611-Rear-225-50R15-fitted-to-RTL&highlight=nankang

[glennm]

I had two Nankang AS-1's (same size as the OEM Kenda's ) fitted to the front of my 17 RTL yesterday, as close a match to the Nankang XR611 (same size as the OEM Kenda) rear as I could get. I've put about 130kms on them and agree with Peter, anything appears to improve on the OEMs.

You've possibly already read my write up on the XR611 https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?124948-Nankang-XR611-Rear-225-50R15-fitted-to-RTL&highlight=nankang

Thanks askitee glad you chimed in as I thought you had mentioned your tyre selection in another thread.

Not expecting people to pour over the list I have put up mainly want to know which brands/sizes to steer clear of. Would like to have much better than oem if possible.

Look forward to your updates once you put them through the wringer, rain, twisties etc.

[Peteoz]

Thanks askitee glad you chimed in as I thought you had mentioned your tyre selection in another thread.
Not expecting people to pour over the list I have put up mainly want to know which brands/sizes to steer clear of. Would like to have much better than oem if possible.
Look forward to your updates once you put them through the wringer, rain, twisties etc.

Hi Glennm,

Were you going to mount the tyres yourself, or get a tyre shop to do it? I only ask as I got very excited about the number of tyre options, went to my tyre guy, only to find that many of them were no longer available. (He was quite happy to get any brand I wanted).

The best solution for me was to get him to order the best all round tyre he knew of in the specific sizes, as ANY aftermarket is better than the Kenda/Arachnid for me. That also gave him a bit of profit on the tyre purchase, which I thought was fair. He got a bit of a shock when he saw the “special motorcycle” stamp on the Kendas, but was fine with it when he saw the J type car rim underneath. There are SOME tyre places though that will refuse to mount an aftermarket car tyre on a Spyder.....worried about the “special motorcycle” stamp, I’d imagine. The easiest tyre to get was the Kuhmo Ecsta.... very happy with them.

Pete

[merlot]

"I would like to stick to standard if possible as you are pretty much assured they will fit"
not a good surmise


tyres can have the same numbers but have diff OD's

are we talking 14's or 15's

gets expensive if you get it wrong:banghead:

russ

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

I would like to stick to standard if possible as you are pretty much assured they will fit.
Don't know what the situation is over there in Oz but here in the US there are VERY FEW car tires available in the OEM size. That's why you see so much discussion about what tires fit best. Generally speaking, a 215/60/R15 is a very good size choice for the rear.

[glennm]

Hi Glennm,

Were you going to mount the tyres yourself, or get a tyre shop to do it? I only ask as I got very excited about the number of tyre options, went to my tyre guy, only to find that many of them were no longer available. (He was quite happy to get any brand I wanted).

The best solution for me was to get him to order the best all round tyre he knew of in the specific sizes, as ANY aftermarket is better than the Kenda/Arachnid for me. That also gave him a bit of profit on the tyre purchase, which I thought was fair. He got a bit of a shock when he saw the “special motorcycle” stamp on the Kendas, but was fine with it when he saw the J type car rim underneath. There are SOME tyre places though that will refuse to mount an aftermarket car tyre on a Spyder.....worried about the “special motorcycle” stamp, I’d imagine. The easiest tyre to get was the Kuhmo Ecsta.... very happy with them.

Pete

Pete thanks for the info.
Won't be fitting myself. I asked the local Jax if they could handle the small centre hole on the fronts and they seemed to think it would be fine so here's hoping they will be happy to do the fitting when the time comes.
Looking like the Ecsta or similarly readily available tyre then. Always better to have something that can be readily replaced in case you are out in the boonies and badly damage a tyre e.g. my wife hit a dead echidna, so many punctures in 2 tyres they both had to be scrapped.
It looks like it will be a ring around when the time comes.

[glennm]

"I would like to stick to standard if possible as you are pretty much assured they will fit"
not a good surmise


tyres can have the same numbers but have diff OD's

are we talking 14's or 15's

gets expensive if you get it wrong:banghead:

russ

Thanks merlot yes my thinking too.
15" front and rear.

[glennm]

Don't know what the situation is over there in Oz but here in the US there are VERY FEW car tires available in the OEM size. That's why you see so much discussion about what tires fit best. Generally speaking, a 215/60/R15 is a very good size choice for the rear.

Thanks same situation here Idaho. Will scrutinise the sizes more closely when the times comes although I must admit with all the negative comments about the kendas I am keen to replace sooner rather than later.

[Peteoz]

Glennm,

You mention Kuhmo.......just another heads up. You will see some negative comments about the Kuhmo performance in the wet from some American riders. That does not appear to be the case out here. I have had zero issues in the wet, and Zoom Zoom Aawens, who rides much harder than me, has also reported zero issues. Perhaps we use a different road mix to the US?

Pete

[Airborne]

I had two Nankang AS-1's (same size as the OEM Kenda's ) fitted to the front of my 17 RTL yesterday, as close a match to the Nankang XR611 (same size as the OEM Kenda) rear as I could get. I've put about 130kms on them and agree with Peter, anything appears to improve on the OEMs.

You've possibly already read my write up on the XR611 https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?124948-Nankang-XR611-Rear-225-50R15-fitted-to-RTL&highlight=nankang

Hi Askitee, Looking forward to getting my rear Nankang and hope you still having a good runh with yours.

The new Nangkangs on your front, can you keep us updated on their progress. I think someone said they were ASymmetrical
. What does that mean [i know dumb, but getting better]

[glennm]

Glennm,

You mention Kuhmo.......just another heads up. You will see some negative comments about the Kuhmo performance in the wet from some American riders. That does not appear to be the case out here. I have had zero issues in the wet, and Zoom Zoom Aawens, who rides much harder than me, has also reported zero issues. Perhaps we use a different road mix to the US?

Pete

Thanks Pete will keep that in mind.

Would like to get something decent rather than follow crap with potential crap.

[Peter Aawen]

...... I think someone said they were ASymmetrical
. What does that mean.....

Yep, as you probably guessed already, 'Asymetrical' means the tread pattern isn't mirrored down the centre-line/across the tread face, usually so that the tread pattern has a section/one side or half that is best suited to saaay, wet road handling; while another section/the other half of the tread is better suited to dry road handling. Best of both Worlds! :ohyea:

It can also (but not necessarily) mean that the tire tread only works properly when the tire is spinning in one direction, altho those tires are usually labelled 'Directional' &/or have an arrow or a label saying 'inside' or 'outside' on their sidewall. However, you can get Directional tires that aren't Asymetric, just like you can have Asymetric tires that aren't Directional! Make sense? :dontknow:

Oh, btw, Asymetric &/or Directional tires aren't usually an issue up the front (running the correct way of course, &/or at least knowingly running the 'wrong' way for a suitable reason! ;) ) of your Spyder, and they aren't necessarily too much of an issue on the rear either, altho you do want to make sure that an asymetric &/or directional tire run on the rear of your Spyder is suitable for use as a drive tire and that it's also running in the correct direction! There's not really gonna be any 'suitable reason' for running a directional drive tire the wrong way :lecturef_smilie:

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

Oh, btw, Asymetric &/or Directional tires aren't usually an issue up the front (running the correct way of course, &/or at least knowingly running the 'wrong' way for a suitable reason! ;) ) of your Spyder, and they aren't necessarily too much of an issue on the rear either, altho you do want to make sure that an asymetric &/or directional tire run on the rear of your Spyder is suitable for use as a drive tire and that it's also running in the correct direction! There's not really gonna be any 'suitable reason' for running a directional drive tire the wrong way :lecturef_smilie:
As you know many riders of conventional trikes mount the front tire in reverse of normal. This is because the front tire is pushed instead of doing the pushing. This supposedly maximizes the traction aspect of the tire for turning, etc. I wonder if there would be any similar benefit to mounting Spyder front tires to run reverse of their specified direction of rotation. Or is the pushing traction already factored into the OEM Kenda fronts?

[seaweed]

IdahoMtnSpyder, that is a very good question. Perhaps Peter Aawen and/or Blueknight911 can answer that for us.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

IdahoMtnSpyder, that is a very good question. Perhaps Peter Aawen and/or Blueknight911 can answer that for us.

I dis-agree with using the tread …. in REVERSE … of what the directional arrows are on the tire ….. the directional arrows are there because of how the manufacturer designed the tire ……. ask Peter ……. Mike :ohyea:

[Peter Aawen]

As you know many riders of conventional trikes mount the front tire in reverse of normal. This is because the front tire is pushed instead of doing the pushing. This supposedly maximizes the traction aspect of the tire for turning, etc. I wonder if there would be any similar benefit to mounting Spyder front tires to run reverse of their specified direction of rotation. Or is the pushing traction already factored into the OEM Kenda fronts?

Like Mike says....

Yeah.... NO! There is NO benefit! :shocked: At least, not for traction purposes! And that applies especially if you're talking about the OE spec Kendas! :p

For any other tires, at its most simple, with Non-directional tires, it doesn't matter which way you run them (even if they happen to be asymetrical) they've been designed to work rolling either way! And when it comes to directional tires that aren't specifically marked as 'Drive' or 'Steer' tires or marked with different 'Drive' or 'Steer' rotation directions (either/all of which can be either symetrical or asymetrical) then regardless of where you put them on your vehicle (inc on trikes &/or reverse trikes) then their TRACTION et al has been maximised by design for running in the appropriate indicated direction of rotation.... :rolleyes:

But there are other factors that can be involved for a whole raft of reasons, and it isn't necessarily quite so simple &/or cut & dried in some (albeit fairly limited) circumstances..... but few recreational or commuter type drivers/riders are likely to encounter any of those circumstances all that often, and even if they do, how many are likely to know when to swap their tires around, let alone bother doing that? :dontknow: Heck, many can't even be bothered checking their tire pressures regularly or knowing even roughly how much load they're putting on their tires?! :gaah:

[Airborne]

Thank You all.

[glennm]

:agree: thank you all. I know tyres get done to death however there always seems to be a new question, observation, fact that arises and I appreciate the effort forum members put in.

Makes it much easier for novices to make informed decisions and avoid mistakes.