June 6th, 1944

[Bob Denman]

74 years ago today...


162094

[Arion]

Lest we forget.

[ofdave]

very little mention of it in the media. Our local paper had nothing.
Damn shame, what was gone through then should be remembered and learned from.

[Bob Denman]

I haven't seen any coverage of it either... :banghead:

[canamjhb]

Sadly most, if not all, those in the photo are not with us today. They truly were "The Greatest Generation". I did hear a short mention of todays importance on the morning news (FOX of course). Thanks for the post..... Semper Fi

[RinconRyder]

How would you separate the right "D-Day" to commemorate out of the several dozen that took place during a long ago war?

How did the soldiers, sailors and airmen differ from the landings at Normandy from those who were sacrificed at Tarawa, or Dieppe?

We just celebrated Memorial Day a few days ago. That date is to honor all those who died in the effort to remain free. Why do you feel we need to celebrate every significant event and fail to celebrate others?

[Bob Denman]

That's an easy one to answer: Because it was by far the largest, and it completely changed the course of the War in Europe... :thumbup:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normandy_landings

As fierce and bloody as the Island hopping was in the Pacific Theatre: The outcome was pretty much inevitable.

But of course: nobody Is preventing you from bringing up all of the other significant Battles...

[Chupaca]

That was a monumental endevor that saved the world from a dismal future and it should never be forgotten...Unfortunately we are now in the entitled generation who don't care how they got to the idea they are owed everything in life...so they don't care. Guess the media goes along with them...:mad:

[canamjhb]

Looking at the map that shows Axis and occupied countries demonstrates just how huge and important this undertaking was. Thanks for the link Bob. Very informative

[pegasus1300]

Thank You Bob. If anybody else wants commemorate any other important event feel free to do so.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

That was a monumental endevor that saved the world from a dismal future and it should never be forgotten...Unfortunately we are now in the entitled generation who don't care how they got to the idea they are owed everything in life...so they don't care. Guess the media goes along with them...:mad:
Be careful about passing judgment upon any generation. How many of us here knows the date the Revolutionary War was won? How about the last battle of the Civil War, or the date of Lincoln's address at Gettysburg? Are they any less important to our nation's existence today than the events of WWII? The reality is, whether we like it or not, time causes historical events to become dim in our collective memories.

[oldguyinTX]

My daughter called me today to tell me that she was thinking of her grandfather on this memorable day. He wasn't there, he was a B-17 Ball Turret Gunner in'42 &'43, a really nasty job, but still, it made my heart swell with pride that she remembers the things that I taught her when she was young, and that she would take the time to call me. I thank God the she understands that she lives in the land of the free, because of the brave. Thanks for the reminder Bob.

[ARtraveler]

Better to remember than to let it go forgotten. Will be interesting to see how much mention of D-Day about 10 years from now.

RE: Memorial Day--we need to remember that also. Most of the soldiers from WW2 have now passed away.

EVERY soldier--regardless of which war or job in service to their Country--has done their part to help maintain the freedom which we so cherish.

THANK YOU TO ALL WHO ARE SERVING AND TO ALL WHO HAVE SERVED. :bowdown::bowdown::bowdown::bowdown::bowdown: :firstplace::firstplace::firstplace::firstplace::f irstplace:

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

This year is the 100th anniversary of the end of WWI. We need to really remember Armistice Day this coming Veterans Day in November. The real date is the 11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month.

[ofdave]

How would you separate the right "D-Day" to commemorate out of the several dozen that took place during a long ago war?

How did the soldiers, sailors and airmen differ from the landings at Normandy from those who were sacrificed at Tarawa, or Dieppe?

We just celebrated Memorial Day a few days ago. That date is to honor all those who died in the effort to remain free. Why do you feel we need to celebrate every significant event and fail to celebrate others?


I guessing you skipped history class and had no relatives who lived through the war.
Or you are kidding-and it is far from funny.

[RinconRyder]

That's an easy one to answer: Because it was by far the largest, and it completely changed the course of the War in Europe...

Normandy was not the largest amphibious landing of the war. That would be the Battle of Leyte Gulf (and possibly the largest of all time) but the Russian tank battle at Kursk was the largest tank battle and the Russian land invasion from the East was, by far, the largest of its kind. It took all three to defeat the Germans but only one consisted of a Western force so naturally that is the one we celebrate. You also need to remember there were several significant battles after Normandy that could have easily gone the wrong way; Market Garden (major defeat) and The Bulge (almost a defeat) were but two of these.

While the Western armies consider their part of the European War to be the significant part it was the Russians who would have beat down the Nazi armies eventually with or without our participation. The Germans simply did not have enough manpower in arms nor manufacturing capacity to overcome the Russians. Once the Germans were stopped at Moscow (and several other sites) the writing was on the wall.


As fierce and bloody as the Island hopping was in the Pacific Theatre: The outcome was pretty much inevitable.

I do not think a single senior military commander would have shared that opinion with you from Pearl Harbor through the defense of Guadalcanal - especially Dugout Doug MacArthur.

The Japanese military government was convinced that the significant destruction of our capital ships at Pearl Harbor would leave us with no possibility except to sue for peace. They failed to follow up virtually every major victorious battle with a knock-out blow.

Initially, the only thing that stopped the Japanese navy from an invasion of Hawaii and/or the West Coast were three carriers (one of which still had yard workers repairing it when it entered the Battle of Midway), a tiny fleet of submarines (which the Japanese continued to ignore from Pearl Harbor to the end of the war) and a handful of almost obsolete and/or damaged capital ships and destroyers.

It wasn't the island hopping that determined the outcome of the Pacific War but rather the manufacturing capacity of the USA. For the first two years of that conflict a handful of Aussie Coastwatchers and some old Asiatic Squadron ships, and subs, held the line until the American shipyards could build state of the art capital ships and the crews to man them. Japan could not to replace their losses and failed to appreciate the intelligence forces that allowed the ambush at Midway to turn the tide of the Pacific War. Japan also failed to recognize the American submarine threat that eventually prevented movement of war materiel from the conquered territories back to the home country. As a result, Japan literally ran out of gas.

Had the Japanese followed up Pearl Harbor with an invasion of Hawaii they would have had complete control of the Pacific theater and it would have been years before the USA, if ever, could have retaken that territory. Had they then proceeded to wipe out the shipyards and oil production on the West Coast the Pacific War might have ended almost immediately. Their shortsightedness gave the USA the time to rearm and respond and knowing that Yamamoto had worked and lived in the USA and knew firsthand of its manufacturing capacities it is most improbable he stopped at Hawaii.

[Holly]

Sadly most, if not all, those in the photo are not with us today. They truly were "The Greatest Generation". I did hear a short mention of todays importance on the morning news (FOX of course). Thanks for the post..... Semper Fi



Unfortunately a lot of people are watching main stream media and are clueless on real news issues. Thank God for FOX..……… I try to help them see the light, but they are really brainwashed and usually beyond help...….... Nothing we can do. They are like a rabbit dog. No hope for them. It's sad...…… :(

[UtahPete]

Unfortunately a lot of people are watching main stream media and are clueless on real news issues. Thank God for FOX..……… I try to help them see the light, but they are really brainwashed and usually beyond help...….... Nothing we can do. They are like a rabbit dog. No hope for them. It's sad...…… :(
WTF is a 'rabbit dog'? Never heard of that breed.

Anyway, here's a link to some interesting photographs that have been doctored to show places on D-day vs. how they are today. Enjoy.

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/d-day-pictures-then-and-now_uk_5b17bdede4b0599bc6dec8d6?f6d&utm_hp_ref=uk-homepage

[UtahPete]

Better to remember than to let it go forgotten. Will be interesting to see how much mention of D-Day about 10 years from now.

RE: Memorial Day--we need to remember that also. Most of the soldiers from WW2 have now passed away.

EVERY soldier--regardless of which war or job in service to their Country--has done their part to help maintain the freedom which we so cherish.

THANK YOU TO ALL WHO ARE SERVING AND TO ALL WHO HAVE SERVED. :bowdown::bowdown::bowdown::bowdown::bowdown: :firstplace::firstplace::firstplace::firstplace::f irstplace:
Don't forget the airmen, Marines and Navy sailors...

[Holly]

]WTF is a 'rabbit dog'? Never heard of that breed.[/B]

Anyway, here's a link to some interesting photographs that have been doctored to show places on D-day vs. how they are today. Enjoy.

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/d-day-pictures-then-and-now_uk_5b17bdede4b0599bc6dec8d6?f6d&utm_hp_ref=uk-homepage



I'm surprised...……………. They are very popular with your group. :D


162109


Sorry , On principle Huffington Post is a major Fake News Paper

[UtahPete]

That was a monumental endevor that saved the world from a dismal future and it should never be forgotten...Unfortunately we are now in the entitled generation who don't care how they got to the idea they are owed everything in life...so they don't care. Guess the media goes along with them...:mad:
I think every generation has its misfits and its solid citizens. I don't buy into the idea that the generations that come after our own are any less serious about their rights and obligations as citizens and members of the human race.

[Trickie Dick]

Unfortunately a lot of people are watching main stream media and are clueless on real news issues. Thank God for FOX..……… I try to help them see the light, but they are really brainwashed and usually beyond help...….... Nothing we can do. They are like a rabbit dog. No hope for them. It's sad...…… :(
something you understand..:roflblack::roflblack::roflblack::rofl black::roflblack::roflblack::roflblack::roflblack: :roflblack::roflblack::roflblack::roflblack::roflb lack::roflblack::roflblack::roflblack::roflblack:: roflblack::roflblack:

[ThreeWheels]

WTF is a 'rabbit dog'? Never heard of that breed.

Anyway, here's a link to some interesting photographs that have been doctored to show places on D-day vs. how they are today. Enjoy.

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/d-day-pictures-then-and-now_uk_5b17bdede4b0599bc6dec8d6?f6d&utm_hp_ref=uk-homepage

WTF ??
Huffington Post is sold to another owner.
I can't access the site unless I submit to their demands and I agree to let them place cookies in my browser.
OK. I guess I'm not going to access the site.

On another note, I'm surprised TCM hasn't run a series of movies about D Day.

[RinconRyder]

I guessing you skipped history class and had no relatives who lived through the war.
Or you are kidding-and it is far from funny.

In the future it would behoove you to refrain from speaking out your ass. Since you don't know me I will fill you in - then go ahead with your inaccurate and inflammatory statements.

I was born in late 1944 - just a week or so after my father was very seriously wounded in the Battle of Leyte Gulf. He was an amphibious tank commander during the invasion and lived the remainder of his life with those severe injuries and the pain that goes with them. He had a pit in his upper arm the size of a softball that a Japanese mortar fragment had taken out. The corpsmen had sewn back together as much of his arm as could be found but for the rest of his life this man, who was an accomplished horseman (he originally joined the US Army in 1940 as a member of the 7th Cavalry then was switched to armor later in the war), guitar player, writer, leather and wood worker had to learn to use his one remaining functioning hand. He spent several years at Letterman Hospital in San Francisco relearning to use both arms but particularly his battered right arm.

The single time I ever heard him complain was one night when he dropped his Thermos trying to open our front door. He received a military disability for the rest of his life as a result of that injury. But he was one of the lucky ones he used to say. At least he came home and lived a pretty normal life.

When I was a pre-teen he would invite other vets to our house for dinner or just to play cards. Most seemed pretty normal on the surface but it was easy to tell that some were deeply troubled by what they had gone through. My dad used the term "shell shock" to describe some of them and I never remember them talking about the war except to describe their respective units.

He did share some of his experiences with me, his only son at that time, and unintentionally convinced me I didn't want to be a soldier when the time came. My time came in 1962 just five days after high school graduation when I joined the US Navy and was sent to Viet Nam one year later. We didn't know about Viet Nam then. When I was in high school it was called Indo China. I didn't learn was a quagmire it was until we landed just two weeks before the infamous Gulf of Tonkin attack. I was "lucky" though and left two years later with just a little blue mark in my left shoulder from a mortar round. Had I not been carrying a field radio on my back I likely would have joined my dad in severe injury or worse. I lost one cousin over there, a helo pilot and have had several other close childhood friends die young of injuries during that conflict. My cousin had been in-country only a few weeks. He wasn't lucky. When I got home my country was kind enough to require me to join the active reserve and threaten me with mandatory reactivation. I won't spell out what my answer was as I am sure you can guess.

Suffice to say you do not know what you are talking about and I am absolutely positive you would not have said what you did to my face. I do not want your thanks for serving as it was not my choice. I also don't want any pity for many thousands have suffered much more than I. I would just request you to shut your pie hole about things of which you have no personal knowledge. Your comment was disgraceful.

[RinconRyder]

WTF is a 'rabbit dog'? Never heard of that breed.


I think that idiot poster meant "rabid dog".

A brain is a terrible thing to waste.

[UtahPete]

In the future it would behoove you to refrain from speaking out your ass. Since you don't know me I will fill you in - then go ahead with your inaccurate and inflammatory statements.

Suffice to say you do not know what you are talking about and I am absolutely positive you would not have said what you did to my face. I would just request you to shut your pie hole about things of which you have no personal knowledge. Your comment was disgraceful.

:agree: You were a lot more diplomatic than I would have been ...nojoke

[Holly]

I think that idiot poster meant "rabid dog".

A brain is a terrible thing to waste.



Idiot poster ????????? That's all you got ????? Don't take it out on me because your wife smacks you around, most likely you deserve it...…….. :D

[vided]

It's sad that the 2 same little boys must turn this thread into an argument.:banghead::banghead:


Bob, thanks for this thread. :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

WTF ??
Huffington Post is sold to another owner.
I can't access the site unless I submit to their demands and I agree to let them place cookies in my browser.
OK. I guess I'm not going to access the site.
At least now because of GDPR in the EU they are asking you. A couple of months ago the cookies would have been placed in your browser without asking and you would not have even known it.

[ARtraveler]

Thank you Bob for introducing the thread about a very important subject.

I too, am saddened that this has taken the turn it has. :lecturef_smilie::lecturef_smilie:

[RinconRyder]

I haven't seen any coverage of it either... :banghead:

It was covered, briefly, on NBC Nightly News as I am sure elsewhere.

No mention here of RFK's assassination though. Double standard much?

[loisk]

D-day
Hugely symbolic for all the Allies who fought

Until then, after Dunkirk, England had been in dread of Nazi armies crossing the English Channel and invading England ... add in the Blitz and constant bombings, and a huge cheer went up from those living in the uk and all who were fighting the nazi menace - the tide turned, the fight-back on the continent began - and England avoided invasion.

[ThreeWheels]

Again, I'm having trouble following the arguments because the participants are on my ignore list.
But if we're starting a flame war over this subject, then it may be time to just walk away from the keyboard.
So many other people have left.
There has to be something wrong with people who start an argument in cyberspace as though it were real space.
Let me repeat. There is something SERIOUSLY disturbed with people who argue in cyberspace.

[Bob Denman]

It's sad that the 2 same little boys must turn this thread into an argument.:banghead::banghead:
:agree: :banghead:
I try to post something to commemorate an important date in the History of the United States Military; and a couple of you guys just have to find ways to muck it up...

Rincon... I get that your Dad was wounded at Leyte Gulf: that certainly adds to the significance of the battle for you and your family.
But that sure doesn't mean that Normandy was any less important to the path to victory... nojoke

[mxz600]

:agree: also. :thumbup:



https://www.history.com/topics/world-war-ii/d-day

[kep-up]

:agree: :banghead:
I try to post something to commemorate an important date in the History of the United States Military; and a couple of you guys just have to find ways to muck it up...

Rincon... I get that your Dad was wounded at Leyte Gulf: that certainly adds to the significance of the battle for you and your family.
But that sure doesn't mean that Normandy was any less important to the path to victory... nojoke

I'm with you, Mr. Denman.:bowdown:

[RinconRyder]

D-day
Hugely symbolic for all the Allies who fought

Until then, after Dunkirk, England had been in dread of Nazi armies crossing the English Channel and invading England ... add in the Blitz and constant bombings, and a huge cheer went up from those living in the uk and all who were fighting the nazi menace - the tide turned, the fight-back on the continent began - and England avoided invasion.

The threat of invasion ended with Germany's failure to win the Battle of Britain when they could not establish air superiority over the UK. That was approximately two years prior to the invasion at Normandy.

[RinconRyder]

:agree: :banghead:
I try to post something to commemorate an important date in the History of the United States Military; and a couple of you guys just have to find ways to muck it up...

Rincon... I get that your Dad was wounded at Leyte Gulf: that certainly adds to the significance of the battle for you and your family.
But that sure doesn't mean that Normandy was any less important to the path to victory... nojoke

I never said the Normandy Invasion was not an important event. No, what matters is that you and a lot of your peers have little or no in depth knowledge of WWII. I did nothing more than correct many of your misconceptions.

Grab the collection of WWII by (RADM) Samuel Eliot Morrison. Virtually all my "facts" are taken from his work.

You're welcome!

[Bob Denman]

You're trying to look through a keyhole, and describe the entire elephant that's standing right against the door! nojoke
The War didn't end because Germany lost the Battle of Britain...
They were constantly developing new weapons, and strengthening their grasp on Europe.
It took the concerted efforts of the allies, to stretch their manufacturing capacities to the breaking point.
To a very large part: that started with the D-Day invasion.

[kep-up]

C'mon now. Donchakno that everything the USA has ever done within the last 300, even before it was a country, years has been wrong for humankind and detrimental to the entire world. :banghead:

NE OBLIVISCARIS

[UtahPete]

C'mon now. Donchakno that everything the USA has ever done within the last 300, even before it was a country, years has been wrong for humankind and detrimental to the entire world. :banghead: NE OBLIVISCARIS
Where did that come from? :hun:

[LeftCoast]

Seems to me this thread has lived a useful life and should now be put to rest.

[Joe T.]

Y'all may find this bit of history interesting. I am a WWII 'buff' and read all I can find. A quick Google found this.

Note the part I have highlighted near the end of the response. THAT is the REAL REASON Germany lost the 'Battle of Britain.'




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Ross Sharp (https://www.quora.com/profile/Ross-Sharp-5), Director, Engineering & Airframe Compliance at The People's Mosquito Ltd (2012-present)
Answered May 7 2017 (https://www.quora.com/Why-did-the-Luftwaffe-lose-the-air-battle-over-Britain/answer/Ross-Sharp-5) · Author has 75 answers and 69.5k answer views









There are many reasons why the Luftwaffe lost the Battle of Britain, some of them more powerful than others. Below, please find a few of them.


The Luftwaffe’s principal fighter at the time, the Bf 109E, could only spend around 10 minutes over London before having to return to base due to fuel state
Their other fighter, the Bf 110, had a wider radius of action and heavy armament, and could cover large parts of the Midlands (and Luftflotte V’s Bf 110 aircraft, based in Denmark, could reach the North of England if they used an underfuselage overload fuel tank, although this made them very vulnerable), however, the Bf 110 proved to be less maneuverable than the RAF’s fighters, and suffered accordingly.
Careful organisation of Fighter Command into regional Groups - with No 11 Group, covering London and the Southeast - meant that the Royal Air Force could rotate hard-pressed Squadrons away from the main area of the battle, to rest and re-equip (usually these units were sent to either the North of England or Scotland). These Squadrons could even, if necessary, be down-graded to Category ‘C’ units, which meant that they no longer were ‘fit’ to be thrust into the heavy action down South, and acted as training units for those based there.
The Auxiliary Air Force (post-war to become the Royal Auxiliary Air Force, or RAuxAF) was a Territorial-type organisation, which was based on large cities or counties, around the British Isles. Although some of these units were equipped with bombers, e.g. No 612 (County of Aberdeen) Sqn, the majority of the 20 Squadrons were equipped with Hurricanes or Spitfires. The AAF was quickly mobilised at the start of hostilities, and gave a strong boost, in terms of both quantity and quality to the RAF.
Radar, or to give it the then current British term, RDF (Radio Direction Finding) had grown out of a British research experiment to find if it was possible to develop a so-called ‘death ray’ against aircraft (the answer is no, not at that time, as chemical lasers were unknown). However Sir Robert Watson-Watt and others found that it was possible to detect an aircraft that flew through a radio beam. The Chain Home system of towers -later supplemented by the Chain Home Low stations - slowly extended along the British coastline, initially concentrated on the southern and eastern coasts.
The Control Room system. Although the Germans also had radar, it was not fully integrated in a system of defence, as the British had done. Reports from Chain Home Stations, from the Observer Corps, and from other sources were all melded together in Sector Control Rooms, enabling raids to be spotted as they formed up over their bases across the Channel and moved to attack. Markers with a raid number were moved across a very large gridded map by WAAF plotters, as were markers showing RAF fighter units. This allowed the Control to counter raids, scramble more fighters, and attempt to outguess the enemy. It is difficult to over-estimate the importance of these Control Rooms. Without them the RAF would have had to fly standing patrols - massively wasteful in fuel and aircraft hours, and tiring as well for aircrew.
The change in tactics, ordered by Hitler, in going to bomb London (rather than continuing to wear-down the RAF by attacking the fighter bases in No 11 Group and elsewhere) meant that Fighter Command did not have to withdraw to bases to the north and west of the capital (which was being contemplated in some circles). As it was, RAF Manston was so badly hit that it became - for a time - uninhabitable by RAF aircraft.
The Bf 110 was found to be, despite its intended use as a long-range escort fighter, so vulnerable to attack by Spitfires and Hurricanes, that it had to be escorted by Bf 109s towards the end of the Battle!
The Luftwaffe did not persist in attacks on Chain Home stations. Despite damage to several, because mobile units were rushed in to fill their place, there appeared to be no ‘gaps’ in the line. It was fortunate that these attacks stopped, as the quality of reporting of raids would have dropped, markedly.
As well as foreign pilots, from countries such as Poland, Czechoslovakia and the USA, it must be remembered that No 1 Squadron, Royal Canadian Air Force also fought in the Battle, equipped with Hurricanes (just not the Canadian-built examples that they had brought with them!)
The Fleet Air Arm, Army Co-operation Squadrons and light bomber Squadrons. When pilot casualties became a major problem for the Royal Air Force, it was able to call for volunteers from the Royal Navy’s Fleet Air Arm, and its own Army Co-operation Squadrons (many equipped with the Westland Lysander) and light bomber Squadrons of Bomber Command (many using the Fairey Battle). With a quick conversion course, these were thrust in the Battle.
The Air Transport Auxiliary was a collection of female and male pilots who could not be used on active service. The ATA swiftly moved new and repaired fighters from dispersal points and aircraft factories to the airfields where frontline Squadrons were waiting for them. A vital role.
The German Junkers Ju88 was a very fine and versatile aircraft, and one which would see service until 1945. However, the Junkers Ju87, the famous ‘Stuka’, (although that was a generic term), was the opposite, and despite its efforts over Poland and France, was utterly destroyed whenever it met first-class fighter opposition.
Unless killed or incapacitated, the RAF pilots of aircraft which were shot down, often were able to return to the Battle after making a forced landing or bailing out. German aircrew - in the same situation - were permanently ‘lost’ as PoW (with ONE exception). Attempts to rescue aircrew shot down over the Channel and the North Sea were rather more hit and miss. The British did not have as an efficient system as the Germans, initially, who had dedicated rescue floatplanes (the He59, for example), fluorescein dye to mark the position of aircrew in the sea and other advantages.
The Observer Corps (post-April 1941, the Royal Observer Corps) was a organisation comprised, in the main, of civilain volunteers. These were trained, to a very high standard, in aircraft recognition and reporting, and were deployed in teams of two, from the coast, inland. They report high, speed and direction of any enemy aircraft, to the local Control Room, and their reports were invaluable in building up a picture of what an enemy raid was doing.

16. The night battle which followed the Battle of Britain, the ‘Blitz’, would expose new weaknesses in Britain’s defences. However, improvisation, and a dogged sense of defiance, would see both the RAF and the country survive even that savage attack.
17. The Luftwaffe was left fighting what became a strategic bombing offensive, with what were, in effect, aircraft which were more suited to tactical bombing missions. Their heavy bomber programmes had been cancelled, as Hitler had gambled on a short war.

There we are - just a few aspects of why the Luftwaffe lost the Battle of Britain
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Joe T.

[RinconRyder]

The War didn't end because Germany lost the Battle of Britain...


Your words. Not mine.

[RinconRyder]

Y'all may find this bit of history interesting.

What you have written is true.....except it wasn't the subject. The statement in question was that with the Normandy Invasion the threat of a German invasion of the British Isles ended and the answer was no, the invasion threat ended with the Battle of Britain (air war over the UK 10 July 1940 through 31 October 1940). Normandy was the Allied invasion of Continental Europe and the prelude to the end of the war. The Russians were already making progress from the East and begging Churchill to begin a battle from the West to aid their effort.

Goering had promised Hitler he could defeat the British with a bombing campaign and that almost came to pass as he was on the edge of taking out virtually all the RAF airfields, manufacturing plants and airmen. For some inexplicable reason Goering switched his targets from military to civilian (London and other cities) which gave the RAF time to rebuild, regroup and decimate the German aircraft. When the air battle ended Hitler did not have control of the skies over the UK nor did he have an invasion fleet. He then went defensive building the Atlantic Wall anticipating an eventual Allied invasion.

The Allies tricked the Germans into believing the invasion would come at the Pas de Calais - the narrowest point of the English Channel so that is where his largest panzer groups were placed. Normandy was a huge surprise and when it took place those panzer groups could not move fast enough from the Pas de Calais to Normandy to properly defend it. This trickery gave the Allies a toe hold in France and the rest is history.

There were two unplanned events that aided the invasion as well: (1) Rommel, who was in charge of the Atlantic Wall, had gone home to Germany for his wife's birthday believing that the weather was too poor for an invasion and (2) Hitler was a night owl who frequently went to bed early in the morning and slept late. When the Allies attacked he was asleep and had left orders not to be disturbed which prevented the movement of the Pas de Calais panzer group to Normandy to oppose the landings.

[kngfsh27]

74 years ago today...


162094
I enlisted in the Army June 6, 1972. My father-in-law was at Normandy. His wife's first husband was there as a member of the 82nd Airborne. Every June 6th is a very special day to me.

[ofdave]

In the future it would behoove you to refrain from speaking out your ass. Since you don't know me I will fill you in - then go ahead with your inaccurate and inflammatory statements.

I was born in late 1944 - just a week or so after my father was very seriously wounded in the Battle of Leyte Gulf. He was an amphibious tank commander during the invasion and lived the remainder of his life with those severe injuries and the pain that goes with them. He had a pit in his upper arm the size of a softball that a Japanese mortar fragment had taken out. The corpsmen had sewn back together as much of his arm as could be found but for the rest of his life this man, who was an accomplished horseman (he originally joined the US Army in 1940 as a member of the 7th Cavalry then was switched to armor later in the war), guitar player, writer, leather and wood worker had to learn to use his one remaining functioning hand. He spent several years at Letterman Hospital in San Francisco relearning to use both arms but particularly his battered right arm.

The single time I ever heard him complain was one night when he dropped his Thermos trying to open our front door. He received a military disability for the rest of his life as a result of that injury. But he was one of the lucky ones he used to say. At least he came home and lived a pretty normal life.

When I was a pre-teen he would invite other vets to our house for dinner or just to play cards. Most seemed pretty normal on the surface but it was easy to tell that some were deeply troubled by what they had gone through. My dad used the term "shell shock" to describe some of them and I never remember them talking about the war except to describe their respective units.

He did share some of his experiences with me, his only son at that time, and unintentionally convinced me I didn't want to be a soldier when the time came. My time came in 1962 just five days after high school graduation when I joined the US Navy and was sent to Viet Nam one year later. We didn't know about Viet Nam then. When I was in high school it was called Indo China. I didn't learn was a quagmire it was until we landed just two weeks before the infamous Gulf of Tonkin attack. I was "lucky" though and left two years later with just a little blue mark in my left shoulder from a mortar round. Had I not been carrying a field radio on my back I likely would have joined my dad in severe injury or worse. I lost one cousin over there, a helo pilot and have had several other close childhood friends die young of injuries during that conflict. My cousin had been in-country only a few weeks. He wasn't lucky. When I got home my country was kind enough to require me to join the active reserve and threaten me with mandatory reactivation. I won't spell out what my answer was as I am sure you can guess.

Suffice to say you do not know what you are talking about and I am absolutely positive you would not have said what you did to my face. I do not want your thanks for serving as it was not my choice. I also don't want any pity for many thousands have suffered much more than I. I would just request you to shut your pie hole about things of which you have no personal knowledge. Your comment was disgraceful.

After reading your bio, and seeing you have some knowledge of WWII, your initial comment shows it was made in a contrary and argumentative way rather than based on ignorance of the date.
I do not understand the reason for your initial comment except as to provoke an argument.There are more than a few here who seem to post for that reason only.
I think many of us here have family that was impacted greatly by the war. And more than a few who were impacted by the activity in southeast Asia. Most of us do not need to post our military experiences to get pats on the back. And posting the loss of parents and other family in WWII to get attention is not needed.
My comment was not disgraceful in that it questioned your knowledge based on what you said.
I will not thank you nor do I have the pity for you that you seek. Those of us who served do not look for that, nor do we need it.
As for me not saying something to your face-that is the classic line of the internet chicken.
Oh, and by the way, I would.
To you and the other sour negative posters, I offer the suggestion of switching to decaf and adopting taking Metamucil as a daily event.
Why all the arguing and negativity?
My God, you woke up on the right side of the sod. Be thankful and be happy. Enjoy the day.
Many of us do not have that many years left, why spend them being pains in the butt to those around us?

[RinconRyder]

After reading your bio, and seeing you have some knowledge of WWII, your initial comment shows it was made in a contrary and argumentative way rather than based on ignorance of the date.
I do not understand the reason for your initial comment except as to provoke an argument.There are more than a few here who seem to post for that reason only.
...

Here is my initial post on the subject: "How would you separate the right "D-Day" to commemorate out of the several dozen that took place during a long ago war?

How did the soldiers, sailors and airmen differ from the landings at Normandy from those who were sacrificed at Tarawa, or Dieppe?

We just celebrated Memorial Day a few days ago. That date is to honor all those who died in the effort to remain free. Why do you feel we need to celebrate every significant event and fail to celebrate others?"

The original post by Denman suggested that it was some sort of oversight or tragedy that a significant observance of the Normandy Invasion didn't happen in his neighborhood (although it did in others). My post, which was not addressed to anyone in particular, was to illustrate that Normandy, while the "popular" invasion of WWII was not nearly the only one and not nearly the most tragic in terms of those killed or wounded in action. I also attempted to clear up the misinformation about the Blitz (which ended in October 1940 and ended any possibility of a German invasion) and another poster's opinion that the Normandy Invasion (June 1944) was responsible. These are facts, not opinions, and there is a gigantic number of written works that cover this period of time. I have read most of them and it is obvious not everyone else has so I was just trying to correct a wrong impression.

70-odd years after the fact it is not appropriate to single out one military operation, however large and successful, from all the other dozens which took place from 1939-1945. We have Memorial Day to recognize those sacrifices and if the media choose to use that day to publish their observances then that is the proper method and should not deserve any criticism. After all, if you want to honor the men and women of that day, or in any battle, there is no limit on how you can do so.

[vided]

162285

:roflblack::roflblack::roflblack::roflblack::roflb lack:

[Bob Denman]

...The original post by Denman suggested that it was some sort of oversight or tragedy that a significant observance of the Normandy Invasion didn't happen in his neighborhood (although it did in others).

Now, it's your words: certainly not mine... nojoke

[UtahPete]

Here is my initial post on the subject: "How would you separate the right "D-Day" to commemorate out of the several dozen that took place during a long ago war? How did the soldiers, sailors and airmen differ from the landings at Normandy from those who were sacrificed at Tarawa, or Dieppe? We just celebrated Memorial Day a few days ago. That date is to honor all those who died in the effort to remain free. Why do you feel we need to celebrate every significant event and fail to celebrate others?"

The original post by Denman suggested that it was some sort of oversight or tragedy that a significant observance of the Normandy Invasion didn't happen in his neighborhood (although it did in others). My post, which was not addressed to anyone in particular, was to illustrate that Normandy, while the "popular" invasion of WWII was not nearly the only one and not nearly the most tragic in terms of those killed or wounded in action. I also attempted to clear up the misinformation about the Blitz (which ended in October 1940 and ended any possibility of a German invasion) and another poster's opinion that the Normandy Invasion (June 1944) was responsible. These are facts, not opinions, and there is a gigantic number of written works that cover this period of time. I have read most of them and it is obvious not everyone else has so I was just trying to correct a wrong impression.

70-odd years after the fact it is not appropriate to single out one military operation, however large and successful, from all the other dozens which took place from 1939-1945. We have Memorial Day to recognize those sacrifices and if the media choose to use that day to publish their observances then that is the proper method and should not deserve any criticism. After all, if you want to honor the men and women of that day, or in any battle, there is no limit on how you can do so.
John, why does it matter? Seriously.

[RinconRyder]

Now, it's your words: certainly not mine... nojoke

My error. Should have said 'ofdave' not 'Denman'. Apologies.

[RinconRyder]

John, why does it matter? Seriously.

All I ask was a question. I never got any answers as to why a poster considers the Normandy Invasion THE single event that turned the tide of WWII in the European theater but I did get a bunch of hate mail and incorrect opinions. I figured the subject was important enough to clear the air and so I responded to the errors. Seems to me if someone is serious enough about their history they could at least do some research before responding with the big guns. I offered my facts and the reasons behind them but instead of a serious rebuttal I got a personal attack. What I presented are not my personal opinions but rather the efforts of hundreds of professional historians over the past seven decades.

[Bob Denman]

All I ask was a question. I never got any answers as to why a poster considers the Normandy Invasion THE single event that turned the tide of WWII in the European theater but I did get a bunch of hate mail and incorrect opinions. I figured the subject was important enough to clear the air and so I responded to the errors. .



Now, it's your words: certainly not mine... nojoke

One more time... :banghead:

[UtahPete]

All I ask was a question. I never got any answers as to why a poster considers the Normandy Invasion THE single event that turned the tide of WWII in the European theater but I did get a bunch of hate mail and incorrect opinions. I figured the subject was important enough to clear the air and so I responded to the errors. Seems to me if someone is serious enough about their history they could at least do some research before responding with the big guns. I offered my facts and the reasons behind them but instead of a serious rebuttal I got a personal attack. What I presented are not my personal opinions but rather the efforts of hundreds of professional historians over the past seven decades.
Yeah, but in the end, what does it matter if you're right or they are right. The purpose of the thread was to recognize June 6 as D-Day.

[Bob Denman]

Thank you... :thumbup:

Should we set aside three days in October for Leyte?

[UtahPete]

Thank you... :thumbup:

Should we set aside three days in October for Leyte?
Sounds good. We'll leave you in charge of that. You did such a great job with D-Day memorial.nojoke

[RinconRyder]

Yeah, but in the end, what does it matter if you're right or they are right. The purpose of the thread was to recognize June 6 as D-Day.

I took the OP to be complaining that "D-day" was not being recognized by our media. My answer was that there were many (several dozen) "D-day's" throughout the war as it was the common military designation for "go" day. June 6, 1944 was only one of them.

[Bob Denman]

74 years ago today...


162094

That's odd: I don't see a complain in here about lack of coverage...

Or were those YOUR words again; and not mine? :D

I did mention not seeing much coverage about it: it was in response to another person mentioning this fact...