Anyone ever used aviation fuel in their Spyder?

[krafael5]

Hi y'all. My question for today is: has anyone ever used aviation fuel on their Spyder? I have a '14 Rts. Let me know. Thanks

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Hi y'all. My question for today is: has anyone ever used aviation fuel on their Spyder? I have a '14 Rts. Let me know. Thanks It doesn't really matter - WHY you would want to do this. But I'm 99.99% certain that AV gas is a much higher Octane level.....In fact it's a lot higher than the Spyder is designed to be able to use....... So if it's NO benefit to use it in the Spyder because the Spyder is designed for 93 octane ( in current models ) why would a person want to double or triple the cost of the gas. The Spyder will burn it but so will a campfire and have about the same effect .................... just sayin ...... Mike :thumbup:

[Bfromla]

Bit too pricy :lecturef_smilie: have read about high octane racing fuels, & was only as a test maybe 1 tank, can't say seen AV b4:dontknow:

[Little Blue]

I DO NOT know if it will harm or help your Spyder engine.:coffee: What are you thinking? AV 100LL? JET Fuel may not be a good thing to do. I would Just Stay with a good Grade of Automotive Premium FUEL (91+ or Better).:thumbup: PS: If your thinking of building a RACE unit then maybe, a Racing Fuel. :ohyea:

[Bob Denman]

You'd be spending an awful lot of money for absolutely no benefit... :opps:
The bikes are built to run on 91... that's it!


It's just like Viagra: taking two of them won't put you in any better "condition" for the party... it just makes that Party twice as expensive!

[ofdave]

I don't see any benefit.
There is risk due to the lead content.
I would not use it in any modern non-aircraft engine.


100LL – This grade of aviation fuel has a lower lead percentage than 100/130. Almost all piston aviation engines use 100LL, but it will soon be phased out because of high levels of toxic lead.
82UL – Similar to automobile gas, this aviation gasoline is used in aircraft that have an octane rating of 82 or less or an anti-knock index of 87 or less.
Avgas 80/87 – Because of its low octane rating, it can only be used in low compression ratio engines. It contains the least amount of lead of any aviation fuel.
Avgas 100/130 – This higher octane grade aviation gas contains a high percentage of lead, which is why 100LL was designed as a replacement.

(from the EnviroSafe site)

[pegasus1300]

If you decide to do this on a regular basis please be aware that the lead content of the AVgas will plug up your catalytic converter (if you still have it connected) and cause early spark plug wear/replacement. I don't think you will get any improvement and a substantial increase in price.

[SPYD3R]

i built Jet Engines, aka: gas turbines, for over 40 yrs... these BAD-BOYS run on KEROSENE... JP4, JP5, etc... i would advise to not try any of these...
however, piston engine aircraft fuel is GASOLINE, and will burn OK, but if you go too high in octane, your valves may not like it... we bought av-gas at the local Coast Guard station in Salem, MA back in the mid 60' and went drag racing at New England Dragway in Epping, NH.... worked great back then.... my knowledge of av-fuel is now 40+ yrs old, so don't go by me, just check it out at the various oil company websites....
Dan P
SPYD3R

[krafael5]

Thanks for all the input. Had breakfast with a friend who was a air mechanic. I will stay away from this fuel. Again, thank you.

[jerpinoy]

Thanks for the people who gave the good facts and opinion. Good learning to all our rider who don't better. I was a aircraft mechanic for 21 years.

[PMK]

Rafael, I know we can buy AVGAS at close to the same price as high test pump gas. I know since I use it in my trials bikes and KTM, plus lawn equipment.

Since the Spyder has no true catalyst in the calytic converter, and you still run yours, that is not an issue. What will suffer is the oxygen sensor, oxygen sensors prefer to be run in a no lead environment. AVGAS uses Tetra Ethyl Lead to boost octane, lead is in the fuel.

As for octane and power, the higher octane is not as extreme as it seems. How will the engine enjoy burning AVGAS, the engine will like it and will produce more power, plus given enough time to reset itself with the engine management system, may even increase mpg. The downside is the Oxygen sensors and how long they will last.

Yes the plugs will tend to lead foul over time, but normally that takes a while in a well running engine.

There is easier and less harmful ways to make witches brew gasoline, but why. Our Spyders are pretty low performance as delivered making 115 horsepower from 1330cc. Similar to wanting to make a Toyota Corolla with a stock engine go fast by swapping fuel. Buy good pump gas and ride the wheels off it on your commute.

[ARtraveler]

I see the question has been answered. :yes::yes:

I was going to say probably no benefit and 91 is recommended for Spyders. Others that use 87 or in between, seem to be okay also.

[Mad Mac]

Rafael, I know we can buy AVGAS at close to the same price as high test pump gas. I know since I use it in my trials bikes and KTM, plus lawn equipment.

Since the Spyder has no true catalyst in the calytic converter, and you still run yours, that is not an issue. What will suffer is the oxygen sensor, oxygen sensors prefer to be run in a no lead environment. AVGAS uses Tetra Ethyl Lead to boost octane, lead is in the fuel.

As for octane and power, the higher octane is not as extreme as it seems. How will the engine enjoy burning AVGAS, the engine will like it and will produce more power, plus given enough time to reset itself with the engine management system, may even increase mpg. The downside is the Oxygen sensors and how long they will last.

Yes the plugs will tend to lead foul over time, but normally that takes a while in a well running engine.

There is easier and less harmful ways to make witches brew gasoline, but why. Our Spyders are pretty low performance as delivered making 115 horsepower from 1330cc. Similar to wanting to make a Toyota Corolla with a stock engine go fast by swapping fuel. Buy good pump gas and ride the wheels off it on your commute.
:agree: with above statement. I used AV fuel ( 105 octane) in my desert race bikes ( two and four stroke Honda's & ATK's) and used it in my air cooled VW sand rails. Kept pre-ignition "pinging" to a minimum and when I pulled the heads for a rebuild, valves and seats looked clean, also combustion chambers and spark wash were good ( with proper jetting). I don't know how "computer" controlled vehicles would run. I guess if the files had wide enough parameters designed into it, it would work. I think our machines run just fine on pump gas and for the extra cost, it's not worth the minor performance gains on our low H.P. & RPM bikes. Mac:doorag:

[r1100rider]

Hi y'all. My question for today is: has anyone ever used aviation fuel on their Spyder? I have a '14 Rts. Let me know. Thanksmaybe not much benefit in a spyder but I highly recommend it for your weed eater ,chain saw and such it will sit for years and everything will start first pull great way to avoid the corn gas blues in small engines, the extra buck a gallon is money saved in small stuff that only burns a quart or two a year

[Ryan12]

I took this pic at a local JUMPSTART station in KS. If you can zoom in it is all Ethanol from 10% up to 81% and look at the note for FLEX FUEL ONLY.
So what Ethanol content can a 998 engine withstand? If I see this should I find another station? The Orange note states it may harm other engines.

158893 158894

[Bob Denman]

10% is about all that these engines can stand. nojoke

[Easy Rider]

Thanks for all the input. Had breakfast with a friend who was a air mechanic. I will stay away from this fuel. Again, thank you.

Why would you consider that in the first place ?
It appears that several of us would like to know.

Higher octane does NOT equal better fuel.
'

[Bob Denman]

"Computer systems can make our engines capable of running on just about anything that it can set fire to... ...But they'll run best on 91. nojoke"

That's funny: I don't see anything in there about it... :D

[Easy Rider]

10% is about all that these engines can stand. nojoke

Exactly how do you know that ??

I would hope that the recent 1330's are made to tolerate E15 since it appears that is coming soon.

I think you are right though that E10 is the highest currently "approved" for use.

[Bob Denman]

Exactly how do you know that ??

Because I learned how to read at an early age... nojoke
Because I rode two-stroke snowmobiles for over 40 years...
Because talk of E15 has been around for about a decade now...

[R FUN]

Av gas is great for when you put Spyder or any other engine is storage. Wont go bad like auto pump gas. Can not see any advantage using it all the time, could do more harm than good and very expensive here.

Roger

[ARtraveler]

Please turn to page 241 in your Hymnals.....The Fight Is On...The trumpet sound is ringing out.... :joke:



Aside: Back in the 60's, a wise acre church pianist used the song as the wedding march during a wedding. The congregation caught on and it left everyone in stiches. So much for decorum at a church wedding. Back to the original program>

[Mad Mac]

Our engines are designed to run on 10% ethanol, any more and hoses, gaskets, sensors, start to fail, period. The snowmobile/motorcycle/recreational vehicle industry, has always been against the ethanol thing due to the fact ethanol attracts moisture over time. Corn farmers love ethanol because the gov. subsidizes them and they make serious money from the deal. When was the last time you seen a tractor that was over 3yrs. old in a field? Biiiig money folks. Yeh, it saves our petroleum reserves and keeps the gov. from soaking us with $5.00 per gallon gas or possibly more, for that matter. But ethanol gas is CRAP! from a performance point of view. You might pay less per gallon for E85 fuel, but you get half the MPG out of it also. So where is the benefit?? OH JMHO. Mac:banghead:

[Bob Denman]

FOR THE RECORD:
My Silverado took about a twenty percent drop in fuel economy; while running on E-85.

Nowhere near a fifty percent drop...

[Lew L]

My ignore list just grew again.

[Easy Rider]

Our engines are designed to run on 10% ethanol, any more and hoses, gaskets, sensors, start to fail, period.

And the sky is falling too. :yikes:

I just read through my manual; '17 RT, and it does NOT say that E15 will be bad for your engine. It says to not use it because it is not Government approved....yet.

It does say to not use E85 and to NOT experiment with other concentrations.

So it appears to me that the newer models at least ARE designed to be used safely with E15.......if and when it becomes legally available.

My Toyota says E15 is fine, right on the gas cap.

[RudyB]

It doesn't really matter - WHY you would want to do this. But I'm 99.99% certain that AV gas is a much higher Octane level.....In fact it's a lot higher than the Spyder is designed to be able to use....... So if it's NO benefit to use it in the Spyder because the Spyder is designed for 93 octane ( in current models ) why would a person want to double or triple the cost of the gas. The Spyder will burn it but so will a campfire and have about the same effect .................... just sayin ...... Mike :thumbup:
According to Manual 87 minimum for 1330��