LIMP MODE = Near Death Experience...

[Firefly]

So just W.T.H. was BRP thinking with Limp Mode??? How is this a 'safety feature' ?

Riding home from Valcourt I had it go into limp mode on I-90 in Cleveland... in 6 lanes of traffic.. all going 70.... during rush hour. To suddenly lose power and not be able to maneuver, change lanes, etc. was VERY dangerous to say the least.

I was finally able to get into a lane and without a car directly behind me do a 'triple on-off with the key' while rolling. Then it came back to life with full power.

Checked the codes and it was P-1120... TPS issue. Will get it to dealer for a checkup soon.

I seriously question the decision of BRP to have these go into 'Limp Mode' and limit you to 40 MPH.
How about a 1-2 minute warning first so you can get out of traffic and pull over? They could program this.
Which is more important to save? The engine or the rider?
Spyder ran fine for the final 350 miles home.

[youngers]

although I haven`t had the limp , I could imagine the panic that can come from it ! I think you have something with the advanced warning { like the horn blows 6 times in a row , 3 second beeps , not 6 - 30 minute blast , }

[ARtraveler]

Firefly: You are not the first to experience the WTH while going down a highway at speed. It can truly be a safety issue. I had it happen to me also, here on the Glenn. It kicked in without warning.

Lucky for me, not bumper to bumper rush hour traffic. I was actually heading for an off ramp at the time.

Turns out, I was the culprit--this time. New boots, and I was riding the brake pedal unknown to me at the time. :thumbup:

[Tazzel]

So just W.T.H. was BRP thinking with Limp Mode??? How is this a 'safety feature' ?

Riding home from Valcourt I had it go into limp mode on I-90 in Cleveland... in 6 lanes of traffic.. all going 70.... during rush hour. To suddenly lose power and not be able to maneuver, change lanes, etc. was VERY dangerous to say the least.

I was finally able to get into a lane and without a car directly behind me do a 'triple on-off with the key' while rolling. Then it came back to life with full power.

Checked the codes and it was P-1120... TPS issue. Will get it to dealer for a checkup soon.

I seriously question the decision of BRP to have these go into 'Limp Mode' and limit you to 40 MPH.
How about a 1-2 minute warning first so you can get out of traffic and pull over? They could program this.
Which is more important to save? The engine or the rider?
Spyder ran fine for the final 350 miles home.

What is the "Triple on-off the Key"

[jroberts650]

So just W.T.H. was BRP thinking with Limp Mode??? How is this a 'safety feature' ?

Riding home from Valcourt I had it go into limp mode on I-90 in Cleveland... in 6 lanes of traffic.. all going 70.... during rush hour. To suddenly lose power and not be able to maneuver, change lanes, etc. was VERY dangerous to say the least.

I was finally able to get into a lane and without a car directly behind me do a 'triple on-off with the key' while rolling. Then it came back to life with full power.

Checked the codes and it was P-1120... TPS issue. Will get it to dealer for a checkup soon.

I seriously question the decision of BRP to have these go into 'Limp Mode' and limit you to 40 MPH.
How about a 1-2 minute warning first so you can get out of traffic and pull over? They could program this.
Which is more important to save? The engine or the rider?
Spyder ran fine for the final 350 miles home.

I had this happen 3 times in the same day trying to get back home from a trip. And Everytime we were on the highway at speed. Very scary when it happens.

[Crisis]

What is the "Triple on-off the Key"

Yes, please advise on "triple on-off" Did you turn it on and off 3 times? Did you have to let it cycle before turning it off and back on again? Very interested in this procedure.
Thanks in advance.

[cuznjohn]

i had it happen to me one time when i first got my 14 RT LIMITED. i was getting on a parkway and i think i over revved it. lucky for me i was in the right lane and no one was behind me. it reset itself and i continued and never had it happen again

[Chupaca]

There must be a better way .... but gotta say it is better than a complete shut down without a chance to even manuver out of the way. They could have the fourway kick in for a few moments and then start slowing down. Glad you managed to get to safety...:pray:

[Bob Denman]

Dan,
I'm sorry to hear that BRP treated you to a "Big eyes, and Brown shorts" moment. :shocked:

But if the throttle position sensor is getting flaky: that can sure do far worse things to you... nojoke
That sensor is reading how much you twist the "loud grip", and relays that information to the computer, and then on to the throttle bodies for execution.
If it can't accurately tell the computer what you want done: you could be in for an even worse ride! :yikes:
I had the TPS get wonky on my 2010 RT, and I got to experience a couple of crazy seconds, right before things shut down...

[CanAmChris]

What is the "Triple on-off the Key"

It clears the fault code. You turn the key on and off quickly. I remember that my RS-S was 5 times, not 3.

[Bob Denman]

He might have turned the key five times; but just lost track of the count! :yikes:

[nealperkins]

I don't know for sure, but in the event of injury or damage, I would guess an attorney might want to take a stab at a class action lawsuit for this. This 'feature' could definitely kill a person. The headline read, "Spyder OK, driver killed..." If this 'feature' was user-selectable, I'd turn it OFF!

[Jeriatric]

:popcorn:

[the2pid1]

If my Spyder breaks on the highway or other high speed road it would lose power. Other than for other issues how is limp mode worse than total loss of power mode?

[oldguyinTX]

I don't know for sure, but in the event of injury or damage, I would guess an attorney might want to take a stab at a class action lawsuit for this. This 'feature' could definitely kill a person. The headline read, "Spyder OK, driver killed..." If this 'feature' was user-selectable, I'd turn it OFF!
Don't mention the "A" word or the "L" word. It will get your post deleted.

[2dogs]

Seems as if BRP sometimes has a mind of their own, just like their limp-mode. :yikes: nojoke

[oldguyinTX]

Seems as if BRP sometimes has a mind of their own, just like their limp-mode. :yikes: nojoke

Ouch! 148922

[Firefly]

If my Spyder breaks on the highway or other high speed road it would lose power. Other than for other issues how is limp mode worse than total loss of power mode?

They engine was running just fine. I've seen this before and had it in for the same thing. When I came home from Spyderfest it was in a horrible rainstorm and it did this about 10 times. I figured it was due to trying to use it as a Sea-Doo. Dealer checked it out and 'took care of it'. Obviously not.

So I knew the engine would run fine and there was no real problem that would damage or cause a loss of power...other than their stupid limp mode 'safety' feature.

HD's will shut a cylinder down if they overheat... but that is almost always in stop and go traffic where you're barely moving.

Other klind of failures certainly can happen and could be just as bad, but those are pretty rare compared to pulling a limp mode.

[cptjam]

First, I'm glad you are ok! Don't scare me like me that!
limp mode sucks. Really? What mouth breathing moron developed that? Some snowmobile riding idiot? Hey guys, traffic will kill you! Real riders roll on highways! Design flaw! Fix it!

[r1100rider]

So just W.T.H. was BRP thinking with Limp Mode??? How is this a 'safety feature' ?

Riding home from Valcourt I had it go into limp mode on I-90 in Cleveland... in 6 lanes of traffic.. all going 70.... during rush hour. To suddenly lose power and not be able to maneuver, change lanes, etc. was VERY dangerous to say the least.

I was finally able to get into a lane and without a car directly behind me do a 'triple on-off with the key' while rolling. Then it came back to life with full power.

Checked the codes and it was P-1120... TPS issue. Will get it to dealer for a checkup soon.

I seriously question the decision of BRP to have these go into 'Limp Mode' and limit you to 40 MPH.
How about a 1-2 minute warning first so you can get out of traffic and pull over? They could program this.
Which is more important to save? The engine or the rider?
Spyder ran fine for the final 350 miles home.yes and you can only get 40 if it's flat ground add a hill and it's much less

[Robby]

Gday Firefly,

My 11RTLTD did this on a few occasions and was supposed to be fixed by replacing the TPS. This was not the fault in the end. It was actually the plug on the end of TPS that feeds the info to the ECM. Make sure your wrench inspects this plug very closely. Have them fatten the pins or replace them - they are a spare part (pins). Some how they get some build up of crap in them and this upsets the message from the butterflies to the ECM. It gives an intermittent fault and goes to check engine, straight to Limp and then complete shut down as the computer is having a meltdown over the mixed up messages. There is a service bulletin on the Boss web - make sure they check this out before stuffing you around.

Best of luck getting it sorted.

Robby :spyder:

[scooterexpress]

there was a software fix for limp mode it was redesigned in 2012 at the owners event the new software would allow you to maintain 50+ if you were going 60 or better and if you were moving at slower speed it would only allow you to go to 40. I had brp load the software fix when I was there due to a throttlebody going out on my 2011rts basically told brp I didn't trust my dealership and they checked my bike out made sure I had all avail updates and never had another problem again traded my 2011 in 2016 for a 2015rtl.

[wyliec]

First, I'm glad you are ok! Don't scare me like me that!
limp mode sucks. Really? What mouth breathing moron developed that? Some snowmobile riding idiot? Hey guys, traffic will kill you! Real riders roll on highways! Design flaw! Fix it!

It's probably the same moron that developed it for cars.

I think what is worse than limp mode is when you're going down the highway, and the bolt that holds the clutch basket to the crankshaft comes off, and you're coming up to a stoplight. That happened at around 12,000 miles on my spyder. Okay, now back to limp mode.

[Firefly]

Gday Firefly,

My 11RTLTD did this on a few occasions and was supposed to be fixed by replacing the TPS. This was not the fault in the end. It was actually the plug on the end of TPS that feeds the info to the ECM. Make sure your wrench inspects this plug very closely. Have them fatten the pins or replace them - they are a spare part (pins). Some how they get some build up of crap in them and this upsets the message from the butterflies to the ECM. It gives an intermittent fault and goes to check engine, straight to Limp and then complete shut down as the computer is having a meltdown over the mixed up messages. There is a service bulletin on the Boss web - make sure they check this out before stuffing you around.

Best of luck getting it sorted.

Robby :spyder:

Thanks for the info... I will make sure the tech checks it all out.

[Jeriatric]

Gday Firefly,

My 11RTLTD did this on a few occasions and was supposed to be fixed by replacing the TPS. This was not the fault in the end. It was actually the plug on the end of TPS that feeds the info to the ECM. Make sure your wrench inspects this plug very closely. Have them fatten the pins or replace them - they are a spare part (pins). Some how they get some build up of crap in them and this upsets the message from the butterflies to the ECM. It gives an intermittent fault and goes to check engine, straight to Limp and then complete shut down as the computer is having a meltdown over the mixed up messages. There is a service bulletin on the Boss web - make sure they check this out before stuffing you around.

Best of luck getting it sorted.

Robby :spyder:


Plugs & bad wiring seem to be a common ailement.

[Machinegunner]

I had it happen to me with my 2011 RS-S. I had just passed a semi at 75 mph on the interstate and pulled back in front of him, in traffic. As soon as I got in front the bike went to 45 mph. Where do you go and what does everyone around you do???? I think they should just have warning flash on the screen to warn the driver, not slow the bike.

[UtahPete]

So just W.T.H. was BRP thinking with Limp Mode??? How is this a 'safety feature' ?

Riding home from Valcourt I had it go into limp mode on I-90 in Cleveland... in 6 lanes of traffic.. all going 70.... during rush hour. To suddenly lose power and not be able to maneuver, change lanes, etc. was VERY dangerous to say the least.

How about a 1-2 minute warning first so you can get out of traffic and pull over? They could program this.
Which is more important to save? The engine or the rider?

Spyder ran fine for the final 350 miles home.

I didn't know about this until you mentioned it here, so thanks for that.

As expensive as vehicles and their drivetrains are these days, it's not uncommon for engineers to design a fail-safe such as the limp mode into their systems to protect against engine or transmission damage. My Xterra did this to me a few times (actually shut off throttle response altogether) until I realized that it was a transmission overheating situation that was causing it (thanks to an Xterra owners forum). I was able to identify that towing a load uphill in hot weather with not enough air flow through the cooler was the culprit; now I shift into low gear sooner and that eliminated the issue.

So, it would be good to know from Spyder owners who have experienced the limp mode just what they were doing at the time the limp mode kicked in. Is it faulty computer or something we are doing that is the culprit?

[jcthorne]

Guys, this limp mode for a TPS error is actually LESS restrictive than on most automobiles. I know for a fact that a TPS error on any of my drive by wire Fords and GMs instantly results in NO throttle action. IE return to idle. Yes, at 70mph.

This is SAE design standard. The fact that BRP went beyond this and allowed some drivability if available, is more than most others provide and a step outside of design standards.

Now, complain all you like about the TPS failing to begin with, it should not. But the limp mode on TPS failure is indeed an industry standard safety feature for ALL drive by wire engine control systems.

[UtahPete]

Guys, this limp mode for a TPS error is actually LESS restrictive than on most automobiles. I know for a fact that a TPS error on any of my drive by wire Fords and GMs instantly results in NO throttle action. IE return to idle. Yes, at 70mph.

This is SAE design standard. The fact that BRP went beyond this and allowed some drivability if available, is more than most others provide and a step outside of design standards.

Now, complain all you like about the TPS failing to begin with, it should not. But the limp mode on TPS failure is indeed an industry standard safety feature for ALL drive by wire engine control systems.

I'm not sure what TPS stands for. Seems important to know.

[Steamer]

Yes, what is TPS?

[quasi]

throttle position sensor I believe.

[UtahPete]

So, it would be good to know from Spyder owners who have experienced the limp mode just what they were doing at the time the limp mode kicked in.

Is it faulty computer or something we are doing that causes the machine to go into this safe mode?



I've been researching this on the internet and it seems that all the complaints were on 2013 and earlier models; has anyone experienced this with a 2014 and later?

[Firefly]

I've been researching this on the internet and it seems that all the complaints were on 2013 and earlier models; has anyone experienced this with a 2014 and later?

The problem child I was riding is a 2015 F3 SM6

[Bob Denman]

The problem child I was riding is a 2015 F3 SM6
Dan,
I'm pretty sure that the problem can be solved with some Gold Trim, and about 50 horsepower... :D

[jroberts650]

Guys, this limp mode for a TPS error is actually LESS restrictive than on most automobiles. I know for a fact that a TPS error on any of my drive by wire Fords and GMs instantly results in NO throttle action. IE return to idle. Yes, at 70mph.

This is SAE design standard. The fact that BRP went beyond this and allowed some drivability if available, is more than most others provide and a step outside of design standards.

Now, complain all you like about the TPS failing to begin with, it should not. But the limp mode on TPS failure is indeed an industry standard safety feature for ALL drive by wire engine control systems.

That may be true but when mine happened the Limp Mode came up and several beeps.... before I could look down at the dash the bike just shut down( there was no driveability other than steering for me).....not once but 3 different times at highway speed. Luckily i had a shoulder that I was able to just pull off on before any vehicles were barreling up on my rear. The system should have a default mode for these situations and give you at least 5 minutes of run time before it completely shuts down.

[jcthorne]

That may be true but when mine happened the Limp Mode came up and several beeps.... before I could look down at the dash the bike just shut down( there was no driveability other than steering for me).....not once but 3 different times at highway speed. Luckily i had a shoulder that I was able to just pull off on before any vehicles were barreling up on my rear. The system should have a default mode for these situations and give you at least 5 minutes of run time before it completely shuts down.


Sorry but I disagree and here is why. If there is a TPS fault, the ecu has no idea what you are asking the engine to do throttle wise. If it does not know, fall back to idle is the safest bet. Its no different than how all vehicles acted before fly by wire. When the throttle cable broke, it went to idle. There can be no 5 minute delay as there is no engine control. As I said before, this is an industry standard. I agree you would have preferred not loosing power, the fault is in the TPS, not the fail safe logic. Once the TPS has failed, there is no other safe choice.

[Bob Denman]

;) I think that I kind of said this (albeit in a far less elegant manner... :opps:) back in about Post#9.

[Firefly]

Sorry but I disagree and here is why. If there is a TPS fault, the ecu has no idea what you are asking the engine to do throttle wise. If it does not know, fall back to idle is the safest bet. Its no different than how all vehicles acted before fly by wire. When the throttle cable broke, it went to idle. There can be no 5 minute delay as there is no engine control. As I said before, this is an industry standard. I agree you would have preferred not loosing power, the fault is in the TPS, not the fail safe logic. Once the TPS has failed, there is no other safe choice.


So you're saying BRP can't program their system to work differently?
Hmmm... Someone stated they changed this in 2012 so that if you were going over 50 it would keep you running that fast.. under 50 it would limit you to 40. If true, this indicates they can change the programming.

[Bob Denman]

Dan,
If the computer can't tell the throttle bodies exactly how much throttle you want: how would you want it to react? :dontknow:
As JC said: most other vehicles would have simply returned you to idle, and left you to pray on your own... :shocked:

[jcthorne]

So you're saying BRP can't program their system to work differently?
Hmmm... Someone stated they changed this in 2012 so that if you were going over 50 it would keep you running that fast.. under 50 it would limit you to 40. If true, this indicates they can change the programming.


Ok. I will stop this conversation at this point. We are no longer communicating. Perhaps never were. Its obvious from this reply you did not understand what I wrote and a I am at a loss to explain it any further.

You do not like they way your bike acted. And it should not have done that. We get that.

[Firefly]

Ughhh.. whatever......

Most of us would prefer not to have this 'limp mode' BS occur due to the OBVIOUS safety issues. Never had this happen on my 2008 GS or 2012 RT. The RT was FBW just like the F3. I guess I don't care who came up with the idiotic system of limiting you to 40 MPH... it's dangerous. Period.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Sorry but I disagree and here is why. If there is a TPS fault, the ecu has no idea what you are asking the engine to do throttle wise. If it does not know, fall back to idle is the safest bet. Its no different than how all vehicles acted before fly by wire. When the throttle cable broke, it went to idle. There can be no 5 minute delay as there is no engine control. As I said before, this is an industry standard. I agree you would have preferred not loosing power, the fault is in the TPS, not the fail safe logic. Once the TPS has failed, there is no other safe choice.
JC, this is what may have annoyed Him the most ( and I agree ) .... the reading was " in error " , the TPS didn't fail, the computer ONLY thought there was a problem....... and as far as LIMP MODE goes, most of the time it occurs , it's IN ERROR...... imho BRP has too many over-lapping systems and the computers get confused ( this is also why the Techs have difficulty diagnosing problems - they can't always pin-point them :banghead: ) ....... Mike :thumbup:

[JAS POWER]

Dan,
I'm sorry to hear that BRP treated you to a "Big eyes, and Brown shorts" moment. :shocked:

But if the throttle position sensor is getting flaky: that can sure do far worse things to you... nojoke
That sensor is reading how much you twist the "loud grip", and relays that information to the computer, and then on to the throttle bodies for execution.
If it can't accurately tell the computer what you want done: you could be in for an even worse ride! :yikes:
I had the TPS get wonky on my 2010 RT, and I got to experience a couple of crazy seconds, right before things shut down...


Guys, this limp mode for a TPS error is actually LESS restrictive than on most automobiles. I know for a fact that a TPS error on any of my drive by wire Fords and GMs instantly results in NO throttle action. IE return to idle. Yes, at 70mph.

This is SAE design standard. The fact that BRP went beyond this and allowed some drivability if available, is more than most others provide and a step outside of design standards.

Now, complain all you like about the TPS failing to begin with, it should not. But the limp mode on TPS failure is indeed an industry standard safety feature for ALL drive by wire engine control systems.

:agree::agree::agree: TOO ALL OF THEIR POSTS :agree::agree::agree:

LISTEN TO THEM THEY ARE CORRECT :cheers:

[Bob Denman]

:shocked: 148982

:D

[Jeriatric]

Dependability issues?

Get a backup bike.

Spyder's home in the garage so we're having a trouble free trip.

Hope your dealer finds out what's wrong(in less than a month or two).

:doorag: