FAQ's about BajaRon Sway Bar Kits

[BajaRon]

As I get more questions that I think should be included here. I will post them at the bottom with an edit date.

I apologize if this appears to be a sales pitch. But every season we get a great number of phone calls and emails asking the same questions about our Sway Bar Kits. As always happens, inaccurate information can overtake good advise. Now, with the Ultra-Bar, there are even more questions.

Don't get me wrong. These are good, legitimate questions. And we are happy to explain our products and answer any question you might have. I am posting this to hopefully clarify some things and help those who have not yet asked.

Some of the more common comments we get are 'I just didn't know what I was missing!' Or, 'I thought my Spyder handled fine before I installed the sway bar kit'.

Q: What does a sway bar do. And what can I expect for my money?
A: A sway bar is nothing more than a spring attached at each end to your front suspension. It is a torsion spring which means it resists twisting instead of the more common coil spring which resists compression. In a turn, it works to transfer energy from the overly weighted (heavy), outside wheel, to the inside wheel (which is too light). So light, sometimes, that it can lift off of the ground. To a lesser degree, the sway bar also transfers some energy to the rear wheel. This energy transfer flattens out the machine in turns, increases traction at all 3 wheels, and helps to keep the front wheels aligned correctly. Making it easier to turn and much more fun on a winding road.

The sway bar does much more than what is mentioned above. It increases control and stability when riding in strong cross winds, when passing large trucks, and in any situation where side force is applied. You can always call the shop if you'd like more detail. (M-F 9-5 Eastern Time) - 423-609-7588

Q: If I get your Sway Bar. Does that mean I don't need to upgrade my shocks? (Or the reverse question) If I get better shocks, does that mean I don't need your sway bar?
A: There is a lot packed into this question, and you will get a variety of answers. But here is mine. Simply put. The Sway Bar does things that the shocks cannot do. And the shocks do things that the sway bar cannot do. Yet there are areas where the function of these 2 components overlap. If you get either component stiff enough to negate the need for improving the other, you are going to have a harsh ride. The idea is to get these 2 systems working together, each doing what they do best, so that you get great handling while retaining a very nice, smooth ride. That is our goal and the basis for our recommendations. In other words, you don't have to trade ride comfort for better handling and control.

Both the shocks and the sway bar can stand improvement on the Spyder. But this can be said of most any vehicle. High quality suspension components are expensive and manufacturer's save a lot of money using less expensive parts. Many are surprised at how much more they enjoy their Spyder/Ryker with improved suspension components. It's more fun, feels safer, improves comfort, increases control, easier to steer, and gives better stability.

Improving the shocks will make a great deal of difference on the older Spyders (2008-2013). Shocks, in those years, were variations on terrible. However, BRP started making improvements to the OEM shocks in 2014 and have been improving them, in small increments, ever since. They are still not on a level with a good aftermarket shock, but they have become respectable hydraulically. The big downside being that most are not spring Pre-Load adjustable. And the ones that are (double locking ring) are functionally useless because BRP does not provide the dual spanner wrenches needed. And they are situated to where it is difficult, if not impossible, to make adjustments without removing the shocks. Here is where I'll make a shameless plug for our BajaRon Shock Adjuster Kit. This kit turns your OEM, non-adjustable shocks (or the 2019+ adjustable shocks) into easily adjustable Pre-Load shocks. They will still not be aftermarket quality. But these shock adjusters will make a big difference for a lot less than a pair of aftermarket shocks. Especially when coupled with the BajaRon Sway Bar kit.

In my opinion, the sway bar is the weakest suspension link. That's why I designed a sway bar in the first place. It is less expensive than a shock upgrade, and will give you a great deal of improvement. Very few have opportunity to try it both ways (shocks first and then sway bar first) to make a legitimate assessment of which is best. But I can tell you that if you get shocks that are designed to compensate for a weak sway bar. You're going to get a much stiffer ride. Now, some like this. But many don't. It's just a choice that you will have to make.

Many get the sway bar and upgrade shocks later. Many never upgrade their shocks. The newer OEM shocks (2014+) are good for about 50k. The older ones can be tossed as soon as you can afford it. Again, I recommend you do not purchase shocks designed to compensate for the weak, OEM sway bar. Whether you have an upgraded sway bar or not. If you do, be prepared for a harsher ride.

Q: Do I need to get the strongest sway bar I can find?
A: No, you do not want the strongest sway bar you can find. I call this suspension component a 'Goldilocks' product. It can be too weak, and it can be too strong. Too strong is worse than too weak. What you want is 'Just Right'. But there are so many variables, this can be difficult to achieve. (See Ultra-Bar explanation below)

Q: Do I even NEED to get your upgraded BajaRon sway bar?
A: No. You already have one on you Spyder/Ryker from the factory. However, if you feel your Spyder/Ryker is trying to throw you off, or you dislike the amount of lean and dive you're getting in turns. If it feels like your Spyder or Ryker lacks stability, is being blown around in crosswinds or when passing large trucks, or if you find yourself having to make several adjustments when going through curves, then an upgrade to your sway bar system can be the best 'Bang for the Buck' available.

Q: Do you have to ride aggressively to appreciate a sway bar upgrade?
A: No. Anyone who rides a Can-Am Spyder or Ryker, regardless of riding style or vehicle loading, will get a great amount of improvement in overall stability and handling. However, the harder you ride and the heavier your loading, the more pronounced this improvement will be.

Q: What about complaints that some do not notice any difference once your BajaRon Sway Bar is installed?
A: It is rare, but yes. There have been a few customers over the years say they could not tell any difference. This has almost universally occurred when the owner has put just a few miles on their Spyder or Ryker before making the upgrade. Typically, it takes about 1,000 miles of riding over a reasonably short period of time (Not 1,000 miles in 3 years) to get accustomed to the machine. Before this, most will ride very conservatively. This combination of a short time in the saddle and very careful riding may make it difficult to realize the improvements made with a sway bar upgrade.

Q: What if I get a bar kit and I don't like it?
A: If you get a kit from us and you want to return it. You will receive a full refund. However, we do not require our vendors to adhere to this promise. Each one is free to handle return requests as they choose. But even those who have said they could not tell any difference did not want to return the bar kit. So, we really have not had to live up to this promise more than 2 or 3 times since 2010 when we started making our bar kits.

Q: Which bar kit should I get? The BajaRon Original or the Ultra-Bar?
A: Either bar kit will make a significant improvement in handling, stability and control. Generally speaking, the Original BajaRon Bar works great for the light to medium weight, single rider with a more conservative to moderate riding style. We recommend the Ultra-Bar for heavy riders (225 lbs. +), aggressive riders, 2-Up riders, and those pulling a trailer. The more weight and the more aggressive you are in riding style, the more the Ultra-Bar will benefit you over the Original Bar. It is a sliding scale. As you add more factors, the benefits of the Ultra-Bar over the Original Bar increase. Single riders under 180 lbs., no trailer and little to no storage weight will probably not notice any significant difference between these 2 bar kits.

Q: Is the Ultra-Bar safe for light riders with little or no compartment storage weight?
A: Yes. This is the reason we never made a heavier 1-Piece sway bar kit for those in the heavy/aggressive category (though we had many requests over the years). Because a too stiff sway bar can be less than ideal in low traction conditions (cold pavement, rain, etc.). This is why the Ultra-Bar is ideal for those who only occasionally ride 2-Up. It will function like the Original BajaRon bar for a light load, and give you that added stability when the load increases. Giving you a safe, controlled ride in both situations.

I am not talking about Ice, Snow, or serious off road. If you ride a Spyder or Ryker in these conditions, you can expect to have traction issues, regardless of what suspension components you might have.

Q: Do I have to purchase the BajaRon end links with your sway bar kit?
A: Yes. The factory end links are made of a composite plastic. The bearings in these end links have no race. They are pressed into the plastic. While they hold up reasonably well in stock configuration. They will not stand up under the force created by any sway bar strong enough to make a meaningful improvement in handling. You do not want to break an end link. If this happens, you instantly have no sway bar at all. All BajaRon Sway Bar Kits are sold with very strong end links. Rated for several times more load than they will ever experience. They are engineered to last the life of the motorcycle and come with a lifetime guarantee (free replacement). Though the current BajaRon end link configuration is superior to the previous iteration. There have been no failures in either product. This cannot be said of the factory end links.

This is our 5th End Link Version. I think we have finally found the perfect component for this application.

Q: Can I put an RT Take-Off bar on my RS, RSS, ST or F3? (The F3, 2013+ RS, RSS & ST all use the same factory sway bar)
A: Yes you can. The factory RT bar is stronger then the factory bar for these other Spyder versions. And it will give you some improvement. However, our 2013+ RS, RSS, ST and F3 bar is stronger than the factory RT bar. And will give you a better result than you'll get with the factory bar swap. You can improve the efficiency and effect of an OEM bar swap by installing the BajaRon End Links.

Q: Did BRP upgrade the sway bar for the 2020 and later Spyder models?
A: No, the sway bar remains the same since 2013 to the current models. We have OEM bars from every model and year. We check them against their 2013 counterparts. Contrary to persistent rumor, these bars remain unchanged.

There have been part number changes and 'Superseded' numbers. While a Part # change can indicate a design change. This is not necessarily the case. It can also mean a change in supplier with no actual change in the component itself. Same component, different supplier. BRP changes the Part # to differentiate source.

Q: Do you make an upgraded bar kit for all Spyders and Rykers?
A: Yes, we produce an upgraded sway bar kit for every Spyder and Ryker ever made.

Added 04/22/23
Q: Why don't you put multiple mounting holes in your sway bar as others do?
A: Multiple holes (some have 2, some have 3) may sound like a good idea. We considered it. But we found that very few used the weaker settings. And no one is going to climb under their Spyder to switch settings depending on that day's ride. Most install a sway bar kit and forget about it. Making it a maintenance free, One & Done modification.

If the holes are punched instead of drilled. It doesn't add all that much to the cost. Even drilled (which is the right way to do it) isn't a huge amount of expense. Still, we feel that drilling extra holes, which the vast majority are never going to use, is not cost effective. And though we do not compromise function for appearance. I think the single hole design looks cleaner. Especially if you're going to use the stronger, inside hole. Which leaves the additional holes sticking out beyond the end links.

Another reason is that for best results, the end links need to be mounted in a vertical position. Multiple holes will give you this important vertical mounting position in only 1 location on the bar. Other mounting points will skew the end links away from this ideal vertical orientation. We prefer to make our bars as effective and as efficient as possible, while looking good at the same time. A 'Universal' adjustable sway bar is not a good idea, in our opinion.

Different ideas are great. It's what makes the world go around. I do not mean to bash anyone's product. This is just our reasoning for doing a Sway Bar with a single end link mounting hole.

Q: Can you determine the strength of a sway bar by comparing diameters?
A: Yes, and NO. (Don't you just love when someone says that?) But seriously, you will have to know the metallurgy, tensile strength of the steel, and the arm mounting length dimension to make a valid strength comparison. Each of these aspects are critical to overall function and strength of the sway bar. Add to this the End Links, (are they rigid or do they flex?) and their orientation, (are the end links vertical to the bar or are the canted in any direction?) If all of these factors are equal, then yes, you will be able to accurately compare different sway bar systems.

I am told that there are 5 different tensile strength levels for off the shelf spring steel. Nearly all sway bars are made from the lowest strength. This is for several reasons. Being easier to fabricate and the least expensive of the group are primary. It is less expensive to make a thicker bar in the low strength steel than to use a higher strength in a relatively smaller diameter. There is not a lot of room in the Sway Bar Channel that the bar mounts to. We tried using the highest tensile steel to keep bar size down but were not able to fabricate it without creating stress cracks. We bumped down to the 2nd highest and found that it worked very well. It kept our bars small enough to make installation easier while providing the strength we desired.

The other advantage to using a higher tensile strength steel is that it resists fatigue better. Any spring will lose strength over time with usage. The steel we use will retain virtually all of its original strength through many more cycles than will ever happen on a Spyder.

Added 06/24/23
Q: If I already have your BajaRon Original 1-Piece Sway Bar Kit. Should I upgrade to the new, 3-Piece Ultra-Bar?
A:The answer is, 'Maybe'. It depends on a few factors. But this question is usually asked by those who would like more control than they are getting with the Original Bar. The Original Bar still offers the same great improvement in handling it always has. However, if you ride 2-Up. Are heavy and or Tall. Pull a trailer or load heavy storage. Are aggressive in the twisties or any combination of these factors. The Ultra-Bar will provide better management and handling than will the Original bar. Many in these categories have done the switch and have been very happy with the results.

For a light to medium weight, conservative single rider that doesn't load heavy baggage and does not spend much time in the twisties. The Original Bar will probably give you all that is needed.

Added 06/20/24
Q: I've heard that there isn't any difference between the BajaRon Original Bar and the Ultra-Bar other than the billet aluminum arms replacing the bent steel arms. They may look better, but if there isn't any difference, why pay more?
A: We've heard this as well. I think the confusion comes from the fact that the Ultra-Bar uses the same steel and diameter as the Original Bar. But there is a big difference in performance for riders that fit the Ultra-Bar categories. The whole idea behind the Ultra-Bar was not to increase stiffness, which for light riders would be a detriment. Instead, the Ultra-Bar was designed to handle heavy riders, 2-up riders, and those who pulled a trailer or loaded a good amount into saddle and top bags. The Ultra-Bar's greater efficiency is designed to handle these heavier loadings because the billet aluminum arms do not flex. Whereas the Original Bar spring steel arms will flex at higher loadings. The more the sway bar system is stressed, the more the Original Bar arms will flex, reducing the energy transfer that the bar is trying to achieve.

So, the answer to this question is, under the right conditions, (higher centrifugal forces created by increased weight), the Ultra-Bar's higher efficiency factor will make a difference on a sliding scale. The higher the center of gravity, the heavier the loading, and the more aggressive the ride, the more the Ultra-Bar will make a difference in handling, control, stability, and lean and dive control when compared to the BajaRon Original Bar.

For light riders, they will not see any appreciable difference between these 2 bar variations.

Added 09/04/24
Issues with the Ultra-Bar Arms.
We have had some issues with the Arms on the Ultra-Bar working themselves off the end of the bar. We have looked into this extensively and determined that this is 100% due to insufficient tightening of the Arm Pinch Bolt and not any defect or lack in the product itself. We've installed hundreds of these bars here at the shop as well as having vendors who install these on a regular basis with zero issues. It's simply a matter of doing the install according to instructions. (Edited 09/09/24 - As of today, we were contacted by a customer who just had this issue. This install was done by my shop manager (Daniel) at the SpyderPops event in Arkansas in May, 2024. We are currently looking into this and will do whatever is necessary to correct the problem.)

However, I will take some blame for this because our instructions were lacking. I am in the process of revamping that portion of the product now. I am leery of torque values on small connections so this spec. was not provided for the Arm Pinch Bolt. A torque wrench can create problems if not used correctly or out of calibration. Also, many are unaware that at the lower and upper range limits, a torque wrench can be off by as much as 20%.

The torque value for the Ultra-Bar arms is 175~185 Inch Pounds (NOT Foot Pounds, Pd. Ft.) If you do not have an Inch Pound torque wrench, don't worry, it is not required. The Arm Pinch Bolt can be done visually by tightening the Arm Pinch Bolt until the spread in the Arm slot tapers to slightly narrower at the end. I will load a picture soon. But it's easily done.

My BajaRon Sway Bar Clunks when I rock it back and forth! It worked fine for awhile, but now it makes this noise.
This is another issue created when components are not correctly tightened. This noise is coming from your Sway Bar Bushings. They can be install too loosely and will work quietly for a time. But as everything settles in, a gap is created and then they will start to clunk when side motion in introduced. You probably won't hear it until you are going slowly. This is easily and permanently fixed.

Simply tighten the bushing bolts until the gap (slit) in the bushing fully closes and a small dimple, which can be seen and felt, appears at the point where the bushing bolt travels through the bushing.

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This is, by no means, an exhaustive covering of this suspension part. I may add to this Q & A list as new information comes along. You can always call the shop for questions not covered here. Who knows? I may add yours to the list!

423-609-7588

Here is a link to our webpage. We are still loading product and not everything we carry is up yet. So, if you don't see what you want, let us know.
https://bajarons.com/

Have a Great, Happy, and Enjoyable Riding Season everyone!

Ron (bajaron)

[Pirate]

This thread needs to be a sticky in the many Facebook groups because this gets asked about once a week.

[gkamer]

This thread needs to be a sticky in the many Facebook groups because this gets asked about once a week.

I was thinking the same exact thing.

[SLICE]

No link to your store.

[BajaRon]

No link to your store.

We do have a web page (Store) now at http://bajarons.com

[FrogmanDave]

This thread needs to be a sticky in the many Facebook groups because this gets asked about once a week.

It also needs to be a sticky here on SL.

[TeeJay]

Thanks for the FAQ's Ron! I just bought a 2015 Spyder RS SM5 two weeks ago with original Kenda tires on it (8,500 miles on the odometer). My first Spyder. The tires still had tread, but handling was scary. I had a death grip the whole way home...65 miles. I had a feeling that the tires were the problem, so I immediately starting searching for tire replacement options. The internet searches kept landing me on Syderlovers forum. I have gotten some great tips and have already changed out the tires [to car tires]. Thank you Spyder Lovers! I hope to give back some of my tips, too.

After hours of searching about why the front end kept jumping around on uneven roads, I finally came onto the correct term...bump steer. After looking at videos of the science behind what causes bump steer, it was clear that due to the Spyder front suspension physical design [which Ron has addressed in previous threads], bump steer cannot be eliminated, but only minimized... by limiting wheel travel [up and down].

This is why all stock Spyders need spring compression maxed and tire pressure minimized...to reduce wheel travel. This is what Ron's Sway bar does, like he says, at your most cost-effective solution to the problem. It does not do anything for dampening the travel, only reducing travel, so if you still want to tweak your ride for even more comfort on bumpy roads, that's when Elka's, etc. come into play. So, if you've already replaced the tires, have some toe-in on the wheels, balanced the wheels, minimized the tire pressure, and maximized the spring compression, and still have wheel pull on uneven roads...then you need a sway bar to get to the next stage!

That's where I'm at as of this morning. The new tires made it absolutely rideable now, so I'll test ride full spring compression and 18 PSI in front. If I don't like, I will purchase a sway bar. If anyone has a used one, I'll definitely take it off your hands regardless. I'll be checking the "for sale" threads. I hope this helps everyone.

[BajaRon]

Thanks for the FAQ's Ron! I just bought a 2015 Spyder RS SM5 two weeks ago with original Kenda tires on it (8,500 miles on the odometer). My first Spyder. The tires still had tread, but handling was scary. I had a death grip the whole way home...65 miles. I had a feeling that the tires were the problem, so I immediately starting searching for tire replacement options. The internet searches kept landing me on Syderlovers forum. I have gotten some great tips and have already changed out the tires [to car tires]. Thank you Spyder Lovers! I hope to give back some of my tips, too.

After hours of searching about why the front end kept jumping around on uneven roads, I finally came onto the correct term...bump steer. After looking at videos of the science behind what causes bump steer, it was clear that due to the Spyder front suspension physical design [which Ron has addressed in previous threads], bump steer cannot be eliminated, but only minimized... by limiting wheel travel [up and down].

This is why all stock Spyders need spring compression maxed and tire pressure minimized...to reduce wheel travel. This is what Ron's Sway bar does, like he says, at your most cost-effective solution to the problem. It does not do anything for dampening the travel, only reducing travel, so if you still want to tweak your ride for even more comfort on bumpy roads, that's when Elka's, etc. come into play. So, if you've already replaced the tires, have some toe-in on the wheels, balanced the wheels, minimized the tire pressure, and maximized the spring compression, and still have wheel pull on uneven roads...then you need a sway bar to get to the next stage!

That's where I'm at as of this morning. The new tires made it absolutely rideable now, so I'll test ride full spring compression and 18 PSI in front. If I don't like, I will purchase a sway bar. If anyone has a used one, I'll definitely take it off your hands regardless. I'll be checking the "for sale" threads. I hope this helps everyone.

I am glad you didn't give up on the Spyder, as many have done, before giving it a fair chance. People who hang in there are almost always glad they did.

It is a strange fact that many think the upgrade bar is only for the F3 or RT. When it will do wonders for the RS, RSS and ST as well.

Have a Great Riding Season!

[emudryj]

Sorry for the newbie question but I'm a really green newbie, not only to Spyders but to motorcycles in general...

People seem to swear by these Baja Ron swaybars and I have no ******** clue what they are, what are they supposed to do, and why people like them so much...

I got myself a 2021 Spyder RTL last week, so I was wondering what was I missing...

Is anyone willing to briefly explain it to me in layman's terms...?

[PaladinLV]

Non technical answer
Will allow for easier steering (while moving)
Will keep the Spyder on track
The 1st 2 things that should be done with any new Spyder purchase is a Baja Ron with End links and a Laser alignment.
If this is a "new" Spyder it should to be done.
If preowned, ask the seller if these were already done.

I'm sure others will chime in with a more detailed rundown.
Congrats and Enjoy

AJ

[K80Shooter]

I assume that your RTL is used. Before you purchase one, make sure that it has not already been changed.

[FlyingBoat]

I bought a used 2014 RTS and am at least the 3rd owner. Seller had the Spyder for three years and only 1K miles, did nothing to it, and doesn't have previous maintenance records.

Is there a way I can tell if this Spyder might already have an upgraded sway bar?

I saw a vlogger, who in the demo showed how a 14 mm wrench fits over the OEM sway bar. I tried it on mine, and it doesn't fit over where I tried it, but maybe the vlogger was showing the sway bar for a different model?
It does look like the connectors are the original OEM plastic.

[BajaRon]

I bought a used 2014 RTS and am at least the 3rd owner. Seller had the Spyder for three years and only 1K miles, did nothing to it, and doesn't have previous maintenance records.

Is there a way I can tell if this Spyder might already have an upgraded sway bar?

I saw a vlogger, who in the demo showed how a 14 wrench fits over the OEM sway bar. I tried it on mine and it doesn't fit over where I tried it, but maybe the vlogger was showing the sway bar for a different model?
It does look like the connectors are the original OEM plastic.

For the RT, use an 5/8" open end wrench on any straight portion of the sway bar. If it fits over, then it is not a BajaRon Sway Bar.

For anything else, use a 9/16" open end wrench. If that fits over the bar, then it is not a Bajaron bar. (This does not apply to the 2008~2012 RS, RSS, GS models.

There are other ways to tell. But this is the easiest. The BajaRon Sway Bar bushings have a vertical split. The OEM bushings have a horizontal split.