steve from brp answered

[bigsmoke]

the questions about the dess issues on the bike. i answered him, and don't want anyone to miss what he said. so i figured i would let you know. now he said brp doesn't support the idea of turning the system off, i told him i would sign a paper tell them that i don't mind them turning it off. if you feel the same, got to the tread and let him know. if we get enough people to say to turn it off, they might do it

Please excuse my ignorance or lack of knowing what's going on,
but the DESS issue,
1) What is DESS
2) What is the issue at hand with DESS

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Please excuse my ignorance or lack of knowing what's going on,
but the DESS issue,
1) What is DESS
2) What is the issue at hand with DESS

I'm not being Rude here but..............over 26,000 have viewed the D.E.S.S. AGAIN - Thread with over 325 comments .....I don't think anyone is going to re-print them for you here .....just find the thread and sit back and you will discover what has been going on .......Mike

[bigsmoke]

[QUOTE=BLUEKNIGHT911;1131967]I'm not being Rude here but..............over 26,000 have viewed the D.E.S.S. AGAIN - Thread with over 325 comments .....I don't think anyone is going to re-print them for you here .....just find the thread and sit back and you will discover what has been going on .......Mike [/QUOTE
OK Blueknight, I feel the Bern here.

[Jheck]

Please excuse my ignorance or lack of knowing what's going on,
but the DESS issue,
1) What is DESS
2) What is the issue at hand with DESS

Damed. Electronic. Security. System. Sorry.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

OK, I will acknowledge that some ryders have had DESS issues that were caused by defective DESS modules. But try to understand BRP's dilemma. If 1% of all units have a DESS failure, and those failures have different underlying root causes, it can be extremely difficult to ferret out what is causing the problem. Add to that failures caused by external factors, probably all of which are different, and which are difficult, if not impossible, to reproduce how are BRP engineers going to know what to look for?

My dealer was telling me the other day of an ATV that the owner repeatedly got a check engine light. They'd bring it into the shop and there was no problem. Take it back home and the next day he'd call with another check engine error. They finally found the problem. He lived close to an electrical power substation. Electromagnetic waves from the substation were playing havoc with the electronics on his ATV. Apparently no one else anywhere had that problem. He also said they had many Triumph motorcycles that were totally dead out of the crate. They finally figured out if both keys were tied together with one in the ignition, the bike would not start. There was no error indicator whatever. They had to put the second key in the trunk to get the bike to start.

Those of you who have had the DESS module replaced with the latest version and are still experiencing errors I am convinced are living or traveling in an area with some sort of external radio interference. Unless you can somehow figure out what that interference is, BRP will simply be shooting in the dark to try to prevent the DESS from being vulnerable to it. When very few people experience an identical problem, but you do have it repeatedly, that is a very strong indicator there is something unique about your situation. The key is try to figure out what that unique condition is.

I have two garage door openers that sometimes will not respond to the built-in opener in the car or pickup. But if I punch the button for the other door, then the stubborn door, the stubborn door will respond. To get one door to open I have to open both. Go figure!

[safecracker]

Idaho, I was reading my sons Triump owners manual. That's what it said in the manual. Keep the keys separate.

[Grandpot]

Please excuse my ignorance or lack of knowing what's going on,
but the DESS issue,
1) What is DESS
2) What is the issue at hand with DESS

Here's a straight answer. DESS = Digital Electronic Security System. This system reads the chip in your key for authentication before it lets you or a thief drive off with it. This system has been failing lately on some of the newer Spyders. It usually means a tow to a dealer. There is no warning when it can happen. Very frustrating and costly to those involved.

[bigsmoke]

Damed. Electronic. Security. System. Sorry.

Thank you, never been an issue with me and my 09GS

[Deanna777]

Please excuse my ignorance or lack of knowing what's going on,
but the DESS issue,
1) What is DESS
2) What is the issue at hand with DESS

Here is the thread "D.E.S.S KEY CODE AGAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!! started by Deanna777 on 8/13/15.

Go to Deanna777 **** find latest started threads*** you will find some answers to your questions 1, and 2. I posted some helpful suggestions on what to do, and their are pictures.

Also, like mike (Blueknight911) posted this thread has been viewed by 26,0000 and it is 16 pages long so far.
Deanna

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Thank you, never been an issue with me and my 09GS

The 09 thru 13 spyders were fine .......then some genius engineer decided to fix something that wasn't BROKEN and you know what usually happens ......................Yep it sure did .......Mike

[Bob Denman]

They "upgraded" the security level of the system, and that's when the trouble started.
I wonder just how many Spyders have EVER been stolen, by using the wrong key to gain access?

[jcthorne]

They "upgraded" the security level of the system, and that's when the trouble started.
I wonder just how many Spyders have EVER been stolen, by using the wrong key to gain access?

A lot fewer than have had to be towed to the dealer for a dysfunctional DESS....

[MikeT]

The BIG question is: What security system revision will the 10th Anniversary (2017) Spyders have?????
Looks like there could be options for the Y factor riding style available in 2017, or 2018.

[GeorgiaBill]

I'm one of the 'lucky' ones with no DESS problems - yet. I still cringe every time I push the starter, have ridden 7,000 miles in 9 months and only ventured more than 200 miles from home this month. That would be 269 miles to Savannah, GA.

I read as much as possible about Spyders before "assuming the risk", and decided to stay close to home at first. Reading about those with no problems encourages me. I'm not completely paranoid, having encountered a couple of problems with bikes suddenly refusing to start.

The worst was a 2004 GL1800 that failed to start in 2008 a thousand miles from home. The Honda warranty folks in Hawthorne, CA had the dealer slowly disassemble the engine and report back in an apparent attempt to blame me for the problem. I got the bike repaired under warranty after a bus ride home, an eight week wait, and a flight to Corpus Christi. Then, also, I cringed for about 6 months every time I started the bike. Then I got over it, and maybe it's time also for the Spyder fears to abate.

My career was predominately a mainframe programmer from 1963 to 2009 except for a few years in staff and management positions. I was accustomed to folks offering suggestions that on the surface seem simple but are actually less than simple. Having said that, it appears to me that the DESS starting problems could be disabled via software pretty easily. It appears from these comments that DESS is reputed to do more than prevent unauthorized operation. Just install a software patch for those who want it such that DESS is only operational if the engine is running. Just a thought, but I would love to take my chances with thieves and not be worried about DESS malfunctions.

Who knows - maybe a Spyderfest is in my future.

-Bill

[Lew L]

Well I'm over 800 miles from home in Tuscon with son and grand chillins. I just can't be worried about the DESS problems.
BUT I SURE WOULD FEEL BETTER ABOUT CAN AM AND BRP IF THEY WOULD FIX THIS !!!!!

A DESS problem 800+ miles from hime would cause;
Kaos

[pitzerwm]

OK, I will acknowledge that some ryders have had DESS issues that were caused by defective DESS modules. But try to understand BRP's dilemma. If 1% of all units have a DESS failure, and those failures have different underlying root causes, it can be extremely difficult to ferret out what is causing the problem. Add to that failures caused by external factors, probably all of which are different, and which are difficult, if not impossible, to reproduce how are BRP engineers going to know what to look for?

I might agree if BRP's record on the 2013 heat issue, their "fix" for the windshield arm and all of the other issues that they have never addressed weren't there.

[Jheck]

this is what steve said

Hi everyone,

We've been following this thread closely and I wanted to make sure I got the right information before posting here.
Here are the facts:

• The system works as follows: When the vehicle is started, the DESS module looks for a signal from the key, relayed to it via the antenna (which is just an extension of the module itself). Then, the DESS module lets the ECM know that the proper, authenticated key is present and matches the ECM, and the vehicle can be operated.
• There are different possible causes for a DESS error, and different ways for the error to manifest itself. For the vast majority of cases we've seen, neither the ignition, antenna or ECM needed to be replaced. For folks who did experience a DESS issue, replacing the DESS module itself to the latest part number is the appropriate fix.
• If, somehow, you've had a DESS failure after having the DESS module replaced to the newest part number (that occurred more than once, was not due to interference, etc), it could point to an error in one of the other aforementioned systems. Your dealer can diagnose it for you, look up any error codes and if needed our techs will assist them.
• For obvious reasons, BRP doesn't recommend nor support disabling of the DESS system.

Steve can't answer unless the higher ups give him something to say, and I'm sure he is reading what is posted on SL's, and relaying it on.


Incorrect. If I don't respond right away, it's to make sure I have all the facts straight so that I don't provide any misinformation.

"For obvious reasons, BRP doesn't recommend nor support disabling of the DESS system." Steve I would like to ask what "for obvious reasons" means? I can't understand why BRP would be so adverse to shutting off this defective system? Is it because it would affect other systems? Both Indian and HD have a system that allows the owner to bypass it if their is a problem. I was discussing this with an Indian dealer in Niles OH. And he said " if they allowed their customers to be stranded beside the road, that it would be bad for business "
I would really like an answer to this question, so I could understand BRP's reasoning.

[Bob Denman]

Let's face it:
If you think that this...



is a serious problem...

You've obviously never had the fun of THIS!



Being stranded, can come in many different flavors, and while none of them are any fun: some of them are WAY worse than others...

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

Yep, it's like what the Rabbi asked his congregant, "Is it a problem, or is it an inconvenience?" A problem is when you have a heart attack. It's an inconvenience when you break your leg.

[2dogs]

I noticed this occurrence. When I carry my wife's keyless entry fob for her car in my pocket, I get a slightly (1/2 to 1 second) longer hesitation when starting my spyder. I have a 14 RTS SE6 and my wife's car is a new Jeep Grand Cherokee. The darn car is a spaceship compared other cars we've owned. When I'm not carrying her car's key fob I notice the spyder starts almost instantly without that one second stumble before it catches on and starts up. After reading Steve's answer to this issue I can't help but think there's a possible interference from my wife's key fob when my spyder is trying to read its own key. Has anyone else had a similar experience? By the way, I've never had the DESS show up on my spyder. I guess I'm one of the lucky ones too.

[MikeT]

You've obviously never had the fun of THIS!

Who's Inferno Spyder is this???? Anybody we know????? Were they @Spyderfest 2016??????

[JayBros]

Who knows - maybe a Spyderfest is in my future.

-Bill

Add it to your bucket list. It would be a leisurely two day ride with an overnight in Clarksville, TN.

[GeorgiaBill]

... at the next one.

It's on my bucket list.

-Bill

Add it to your bucket list. It would be a leisurely two day ride with an overnight in Clarksville, TN.

[PW2013STL]

While reading this I was thinking it happens to a few, but no one I know has had this happen to them.
Well guess what happened to me Friday while on a group ride

We had stopped at this little bar (no I do not drink adult beverages when I ride, or drive) and one of members had just got a 2015 red RT-S and was asking me if I had any issues. I told him only minor ones.
So when we all went to take off I got the DESS screen.
I waited 10 min and tried to start it, but got the same DESS. I tried 30 min latter with the same results.

Called my Dealer, but he was unable to come get me so I was going to have AAA come out to get me and bring the Spyder to them. I ordered some food and chatted with the patrons of the bar and waited for the truck. After an hour I went out to make sure the parking brake would release and no DESS screen and it started right up.

No further problems the rest of the trip, but I will ask my dealer to replace the module.

[ndspyderlover]

Here's a straight answer. DESS = Digital Electronic Security System. This system reads the chip in your key for authentication before it lets you or a thief drive off with it. This system has been failing lately on some of the newer Spyders. It usually means a tow to a dealer. There is no warning when it can happen. Very frustrating and costly to those involved.

I got the dess code yesterday again for the fifth time. This time I called roadside assistance. When they arrived it started right up. I am afraid to go anywhere and turn it off . This is very maddening. I dont know what to do anymore. This is my third spyder