Turned back

[Shifter]

Went to ride an hour south through the mountains today, got the Spyder out and set off, armed with my Newfoundland knowledge to keep the revs up over 4500 I rode out of town at 36mph (speed limit) in second gear the engine at 5000rpm, soon it was creeping over that. Eager to go, hit the 50mph section and flicked the shift into third and tried to sit on our equivalent of your 50mph
It crept up again.
Got to the first uphill section changed down to second for a tight corner but the revs still dropped to 3000!
This thing is hard work.
Ran the revs up in second to 5100 then third and up to 5000rpm but this areas notorious for kangaroos so I back off a bit the revs drop under the threshold for cooking the clutch, I downshift and turn back down the mountain, ride back to the workshop and get my old Kawasaki GPz900r out put the Spyder away and enjoy a more sane ride south.
How the hell do you people ride these things keeping them over 5000 it's just all too busy mechanically plus having to haul it through corners without dropping revs it's manic.
Do I really have to ride 5000rpm up all the time.
Reminds me of riding a 2-stroke without the smoke!

[Luvs2Ride]

I have a 2012 RTS-SE5 (only owner) and truly love it. I know you'll get a lot of truly knowledgeable answers to your question from folks on here, but here's my 2 cents worth...

I rode between 5000 and 5500 RPMs religiously (or tried to) for a long time and felt as though all I was doing was watching the RPM gauge and speedometer... rather than enjoying the ride. I finally went back to shifting like I did on 2-wheels... by engine sound. End result - I'm happier and more relaxed and Spyder doesn't seem to be suffering any ill effects.

[SteveP]

You have driven other bikes obviously so I would say you should be able to feel when the Spyder is working properly. I don't always constantly keep over 5000 rpm in all driving conditions , but when riding 2 up or while under load ( uphill) etc the engine likes to be around that . The same with driving a manual transmission truck or car with a smaller higher reving engine, it's hard on them making them "lug" . In first and second gear the ratio allows a bit lower rpm if you are not pushing it for sure and at 50 or 60 km an hour 3rd gear around 4000 feels good and sounds good to me . Some have suggested on here that you will burn out the clutch if you don't stay over 5000 rpm all the time .... Nothing in my 40 plus years driving power sports toys and bikes and sports cars etc will allow me to believe that , and having worked as an automobile repair business for 7 years and working on bikes and snowmobile,s from a young age gave me a good base knowledge I think .
I began to enjoy my Spyder much more when I stopped thinking too much and started just riding . Give it some time and enjoy

[SteveP]

I have a 2012 RTS-SE5 (only owner) and truly love it. I know you'll get a lot of truly knowledgeable answers to your question from folks on here, but here's my 2 cents worth...

I rode between 5000 and 5500 RPMs religiously (or tried to) for a long time and felt as though all I was doing was watching the RPM gauge and speedometer... rather than enjoying the ride. I finally went back to shifting like I did on 2-wheels... by engine sound. End result - I'm happier and more relaxed and Spyder doesn't seem to be suffering any ill effects.

A simpler and well put version of what I put below

[Peter Aawen]

..... How the hell do you people ride these things keeping them over 5000 it's just all too busy mechanically plus having to haul it through corners without dropping revs it's manic.
Do I really have to ride 5000rpm up all the time.
Reminds me of riding a 2-stroke without the smoke!

Where the heck did keeping them OVER 5000 rpm or come from?? And I do hope you are riding one of the 998 V-twin motored Spyders too - they like their revs, the 1330 triples don't need to rev so hard at all!

Even so, everything I've read & learnt first hand about riding the V-twins suggests keeping them above 3200 rpm or so in order to keep the revs above the centrifugal clutch 'lock-up' revs & about 4200 rpm to keep the revs up in the motors' optimum power & torque band - in my case, I ride (fairly easily & gently for the most part!) to keep the revs above about 3800 rpm & usually shift up at about 5800 rpm with the occasional squirt higher, & I generally have a great time doing so, solo or 2up!

I think you may have misread something somewhere!

[Bam Bam and Pebbles]

Assuming you have a 998 V Twin motor, just do what I did before I bought my 1330 triple. I dont know the km/h equivilents but I shifted to 2nd at 30mp/h, 3rd at 42, 4th at 52 and 5th at 63. Downshift using this in reverse. Dont worry about the rpms, just go by speed. After a little practice you will learn what the engine sounds like at the proper rpms and you can just ride by the sound.

[Shifter]

It's the info in the do's and don't sticky section at the start of the forum. Keeping it above 4500rpm. So I've marked my tach at 5000 for reference.
It sounds like it's revving it's :#+#'s off at those revs and it's twitchy to Co ordinate the revs and cornering in tight stuff. How can you guys relax and enjoy the ride when it's like a 2-stroke or a rotary the way it revs is beyond me.
And yeah it's a 990 v twin

[finless]

OK maybe your being a little too strict with this.
You want to up shift over 4500. The idea is when you go to the next gear, you are not below a minimum of 3500. This is the major key point. Don't upshift below 4000-4500 as that is when you can burn up the 998 tranny as when you get to the next gear you can be at 3500 or below and that is when the tranny slips and burns it up.
If your decelerating you can either let it down shift on it's own or do it manually. But when you start accelerating again it's best to not be below 4000.

Bob

[Chupaca]

It is one of the hard parts of getting the most out of these machines. Those of us who love high revving engines don't have a problem. You do not have to stay at 5000 rpm's but if you have a semi automatic you need to be above 3500 or so to have the clutch fully engaged. Many have gone back to their two wheelers for this reason, in part, but you do have the newer triple with the lower rpms similar to your Kawasaki. It may even be the reason brp is phasing the twin out, or so it seems, but it still is one of the best running engines I have had the pleasure of owning. But hey, if it is not your ryde you need to change and find the one you can enjoy the most. It is no fun ryding something that does not make you want to be out in the wind and having a good time....

[finless]

He has a 1330? I did not see that in his post so I assumed he had a 998 since he is talking about this?

Bob

[ingramwc]

Refer to post #7, the OP says he has a 990 V-twin...
Do you watch the tach on your Kawi? It is just a matter of getting used to the engine. I will try to run between 4500 & 5000 RPM, because I want to be at or very near the power band so that when I want to scoot I don't have to wait for the engine to get there and it is instant acceleration. But that is my preference! My Spyder-- '13 ST-S SE5.

[Bob Denman]

Just ride a gear lower than you normally would, and it'll be fine...

[Shifter]

OK maybe your being a little too strict with this.
You want to up shift over 4500. The idea is when you go to the next gear, you are not below a minimum of 3500. This is the major key point. Don't upshift below 4000-4500 as that is when you can burn up the 998 tranny as when you get to the next gear you can be at 3500 or below and that is when the tranny slips and burns it up.
If your decelerating you can either let it down shift on it's own or do it manually. But when you start accelerating again it's best to not be below 4000.

Bob

Ok so 3500 is the danger threshold.
I was mislead by the sticky.
I actually posted in the sticky but got no reaction.
Posting in here got the answers I'm needing.
I'm off into the hills again today, have a trip a bit over 100 miles to do, so I'll take the Spyder and reposition my warning tape at 3500 as the DONT LET IT GO there mark.

There's pages and pages after the sticky post that I haven't read, I did read a few pages but most seemed to be in support of its higher threshold.
I hope you are right.
It's not my Spyder but I'm trying to teach the owner how to ride the thing.
He's already run off the road on a dead straight section so I'm gonna need all the help I can get.
He is a real worry on 2 wheels and sees the Spyder as his ticket to biking freedom.
I just hope it's not his ticket to the afterlife.
Help me to help him please.
There's no body here to train Spyder riders so it's into the deep end and swim....

[BajaRon]

Ok so 3500 is the danger threshold.
I was mislead by the sticky.
I actually posted in the sticky but got no reaction.
Posting in here got the answers I'm needing.
I'm off into the hills again today, have a trip a bit over 100 miles to do, so I'll take the Spyder and reposition my warning tape at 3500 as the DONT LET IT GO there mark.

There's pages and pages after the sticky post that I haven't read, I did read a few pages but most seemed to be in support of its higher threshold.
I hope you are right.
It's not my Spyder but I'm trying to teach the owner how to ride the thing.
He's already run off the road on a dead straight section so I'm gonna need all the help I can get.
He is a real worry on 2 wheels and sees the Spyder as his ticket to biking freedom.
I just hope it's not his ticket to the afterlife.
Help me to help him please.
There's no body here to train Spyder riders so it's into the deep end and swim....

This only applies to the SE5, of course. And the 3,500 RPM lower limit still has a bit of safety margin built in as well. And this is only when accelerating or cursing. As mentioned before, if you're decelerating then it does not apply because you're not putting enough stress on the clutch plates to make a difference. Trying to keep this as a hard and fast rule is going to drive you nuts and eliminate any enjoyment you might have otherwise experienced in the ride.

You have to understand that all of these 'Do's and Don'ts were generated because people were continually running their SE5's well below these RPM's in every situation which EVENTUALLY destroyed their clutch. It's not like if you let the RPM's dip below 3,500 your clutch will immediately disintegrate before you can get back above 3,500 RPM.

Once you get the hang of it you won't even need to look at your tach. You'll just know.

Good luck and enjoy! The Spyder shines in the twisties once you get the feel for it.

[ruralgirl]

He's already run off the road on a dead straight section so I'm gonna need all the help I can get.
He is a real worry on 2 wheels and sees the Spyder as his ticket to biking freedom.
I just hope it's not his ticket to the afterlife.
Help me to help him please.
There's no body here to train Spyder riders so it's into the deep end and swim....

My two cents here is to make sure he's ryding slowly. He may feel embarrassed to ride considerably more slowly than he would on a bike, especially if he's riding with "the guys". Personally, after 45 years on bikes, I now ride my 2015 RT-S much more slowly, meaning, 40-50mph, and I never go near a freeway. I don't know what your roads are like, but if he's already kissed the ditch on a straightaway, I'm guessing he's not used to the lateral flinging of the Spyder that you don't get with a bike. My roads here in MI are incredibly bumpy and wavy, which keeps me in a near constant state of side-to-side dipping. The subtle corrections that this forces a ryder to learn to make instinctively may be one of his problems at this stage. If so, the best way to feel comfortable on challenging roads is to simply slowwww down. Choose roads with very light traffic, and when cars do come up behind you, adopt a "tough sh*t" attitude if they don't like it. They can pass your ass and leave you in peace again to ryde at your own pace.

As far as when to shift, I've got the 1330, so my numbers wouldn't jive with yours, but I just go by the sound of my engine. I can shift with absolutely zero feeling of the machine changing underneath me - the only indication of engagement is the gentle dropping of rpms. If I jackrabbit from a stop, then, yes, I can feel the clunk and lurch. But to keep it smooth as silk, I find that as soon as I hear the magic range of rpms that I know is my perfect shift speed, not shifting immediately, IOW, letting that perfect sound hold for maybe two seconds, tops, will give me a flawless shift every time.

Good luck with him! I hope he learns (and lives long enough!) to love his Spyder.

[loisk]

Yes, the roos and mobile sugar sacks are fun aren't they?

Not sure which model twin you have -
Try to keep revs at 3500 or more - it protects the clutch innards and MORE importantly the little stator won't start recharging the battery until 3500 revs.

I have a 13 ST with 'trailer mode' and if I turn it on it simply keeps the revs higher at each gear change, works out about how I ride it anyway.

Don't panic if it's below 3500 for a bit, no harm will be done.

Just relax and enjoy the ride.

[Shifter]

Thanks for the reply encouragement and caution.
Just stopped for a pie and a water at Uki pub and with my new riding parameters I'm having a ball!
You're right on all counts and now my limits have dropped I'm enjoying the ride.
Moved my taped line to 3500 and I find with my new freedom I'm actually using more of the higher rev range.
It wasn't me riding when we left the road, I bailed out as we crashed through the guideposts.
I'm more confident there's a chance Tommo will learn to enjoy his new machine.
Anyway I can hear the road calling me! :-)
Thanks again and keep the input coming.

[Bfromla]

Just ride a gear lower than you normally would, and it'll be fine...

Exact way I had to train myself I heard the term "Americanized shifting" (& made more sense to me) for our clunky heavy style big bore engines & am quite happy with muscle cars & the like its all I've ever known.

Was hard but I wanted to learn how to improve my GPM & test myself. Found keeping between 4-7k is acceptable range & not so bothersome anymore. & I leave the rest to cruse control

[Shifter]

yeah thanks just got home after a great ride!
brilliant day, in the groove!

[burg650]

I always believe, ride it like you stole it. Keep your eyes on the road not the dash, lol.

[ARtraveler]

It's all about which gear you choose to ride in. We do not use 5th gear until we are going over 60 mph (about 99 kph). That keeps the rev's right around 5500.

On most 50 - 55 sections--it's fourth gear. The rev's are above 5000 then.

Hard to get used to at first. Most bikes are at their top gear and happy when you get to 50 mph or so.

Driving by sound--is the key. You will get to know how the motor sounds at the proper rpm.

The high revs do not seem to affect mileage. We get 31 mpg mostly.

[Highwayman2013]

The 990 V twin is an old sport bike engine and likes to rev. 5000 is right in it's sweet spot. It took me a while to get used to it as well coming off a 1700 V twin.

[Shifter]

used to it now after racking up over a thousand kilometers, steadily increasing my limits and pushing them.
Had an interesting ride in the rain during the week feeling it out as to how hard I could push it, kept expecting the 'nanny' to intervene but she didn't.
even to the point of controlled drifting the rear wheel out of tight second gear bends.

[Shifter]

A bit over 5000kms in 2 months Spyder ryding!
Really got the hang of it now!

[Bob Denman]