F3 two up shock

[MMMII]

After 150 mile ride today all I can say is that the "mushiness" in my F3 is gone.

I've never bottomed out like others have stated with the stock shock but I did feel a lot of movement. Now, it's a bit deal more firm which I like so all in all I'm content.

Should it have come from the factory like this? I dunno. I have a feeling that if it did there would be a thread with people commenting that the rear is to firm. It's impossible to make everyone happy.

-Cheers

[ABQSpyder]

From my sport bike days that's a LOT of intial Sag.Anyways ,just a thought,the F3-T rear air adjustable preload shock should fit and may be an viable option to stiffen up the pre load and intial sag for better handling and maybe no bottoming out.Can Anybody with a new F3-T chime in.

The new 2016 F3's should be fine they are a RT incognito. Not the same animal.

[Sccar]

Got mine installed today and put about 15 miles on it so far. I have a couple hour ride slated for tomorrow so I'll wait till after that to give my thoughts.

HOWEVER.... I thought I would do a little pre-post install experiment. So I broke out the tape measure and with a little help from a friend....

• Original shock with 3,940 miles on it measured 32 1/2" from ground to the rear tip of the passenger grab handle.
• Original shock with with me on the passenger seat (let's just say I'm about 235ish) from ground to the same point on the grab handles measured 29 3/4".
• Two up shock with no passenger measured 32 3/8" from the same points.
• Two up shock with me on the back measured 29 7/8".

I'm a casino marketing guy and by no means a mechanic but I assume this means the benefit of this "upgrade" comes towards full compression of the spring.

Thoughts?

Not sure how this comes into play but based on these numbers it does not indicate much difference. It only compresses 1/4" less the than original shock.

[ta-kid]

The new 2016 F3's should be fine they are a RT incognito. Not the same animal.

Yes but having a shock with adjustable air preload even with a 2016 F3-S would be advantageous if the stock one fits.They only come on the T or limited F3

[spyderyderjim]

Good post to stimulate rider discussion on the board. There are a number of ways to address the weakness of the OEM design; weak springs front and rear especially when riding 2 up.

My experience has been that the damping function of the shock is good enough; its the weak springs you have to fix. So now we have an option to swap out oem shock with one with a better spring for $213.49 + tax. Or... just swap out the springs with a Eibach, Hypercoil, or custom spring. Springs are in the ~$85 each range. Depending on your total weight range for the RT bike, I think you can get by with 450 lbs/in for the front and 850 lbs/in. I used 550 lbs/in up front (a bit stiff for solo work, but not objectionable) and 800 lbs/in for the rear. With the springs I used and they were very nice with 2 up riding.

Jerry

Jerry, Thanks for posting this helpful shock/heavier spring needed info to solve F3 rear shock bottoming problem.
My 2015 F3S has an Elka rear shock with Hyperco 800# single length 8" long X 2.25 ID spring.
Larry's F3S has an Elka rear shock with a 1000# single length spring for 2 up riding with his wife.
Both have only about 1" sag when riding; raising rear end ride height up to balance front & rear of F3S Spyder.
A little firm but work excellent, for over 12,000 miles!
These spring #s were recommended by Hyperco spring computer chart, tech guy Mark.
(the new F3 BRP replacement shock with not strong enough spring is a waste of money, as rear of F3 will still bottom, even after paying over $200, (my 2 cents).
(MMMII with new BRP rear replacement shock/spring only sags 1/4" less than stock F3 spring, 2 1/2" rear spring sag ride height is way too much).

The F3 Elka shock comes with a short 2 3/4" long 800# spring, a spacer and a 5 1/4" long 800# spring; the 2 short Elka Dual springs Rate are Half the force of a Single spring; or about a 400# spring (only 50# more than the 350# stock rear F3 spring). So F3 Elka rear short springs will sag 3" with Larry & his wife on it!!!
We put the 1000# Hyperco single 8" long single spring on Larry's rear Elka shock & only sags 1", firm but does NOT bottom with 2 up riding!!
Bottom line: 2015 F3 Spyder needs a much heavier rear shock spring (single Hyperco spring 8" long 2.25 ID, 800#-1000# on a F3 Elka rear shock).
Hope this helps explain why stock F3 rear 350# shock spring ride height sags 2-3", & can bottom with a driver & passenger riding.
You can replace F3 stock rear spring with a stiffer spring like Jerry suggests; buy an Elka rear shock, or BRP upgraded F3 rear shock/spring, of course it is your choice!
Enjoy your rydes!!
Jim

[llyrad]

having looked at the stock spring vs the 200 upgraded spring, they look nothing alike. Are you sure it's the same spring?

[CharlieIndia]

Jerry, Thanks for posting this helpful shock/heavier spring needed info to solve F3 rear shock bottoming problem.
My 2015 F3S has an Elka rear shock with Hyperco 800# single length 8" long X 2.25 ID spring.
Larry's F3S has an Elka rear shock with a 1000# single length spring for 2 up riding with his wife.
Both have only about 1" sag when riding; raising rear end ride height up to balance front & rear of F3S Spyder.
A little firm but work excellent, for over 12,000 miles!
These spring #s were recommended by Hyperco spring computer chart, tech guy Mark.
(the new F3 BRP replacement shock with not strong enough spring is a waste of money, as rear of F3 will still bottom, even after paying over $200, (my 2 cents).
(MMMII with new BRP rear replacement shock/spring only sags 1/4" less than stock F3 spring, 2 1/2" rear spring sag ride height is way too much).

The F3 Elka shock comes with a short 2 3/4" long 800# spring, a spacer and a 5 1/4" long 800# spring; the 2 short springs are equal to a 400# spring (only 50# more than the 350# stock rear F3 spring). So F3 Elka rear short springs will sag 3" with Larry & his wife on it!!!
We put the 1000# Hyperco single 8" long single spring on Larry's rear Elka shock & only sags 1", firm but does NOT bottom with 2 up riding!!
Bottom line: 2015 F3 Spyder needs a much heavier rear shock spring (single Hyperco spring 8" long 2.25 ID, 800#-1000# on a F3 Elka rear shock).
Hope this helps explain why stock F3 rear 350# spring bottoms.
You can replace stock rear spring, if you like, with a stiffer spring like Jerry suggests; of course it is your choice!
Enjoy your rydes!!
Jim

Did you install the Elka shock yourself and if so how hard was it to install?

[spacetiger]

Jerry, Thanks for posting this helpful shock/heavier spring needed info to solve F3 rear shock bottoming problem.
My 2015 F3S has an Elka rear shock with Hyperco 800# single length 8" long X 2.25 ID spring.
Larry's F3S has an Elka rear shock with a 1000# single length spring for 2 up riding with his wife.
Both have only about 1" sag when riding; raising rear end ride height up to balance front & rear of F3S Spyder.
A little firm but work excellent, for over 12,000 miles!
These spring #s were recommended by Hyperco spring computer chart, tech guy Mark.
(the new F3 BRP replacement shock with not strong enough spring is a waste of money, as rear of F3 will still bottom, even after paying over $200, (my 2 cents).
(MMMII with new BRP rear replacement shock/spring only sags 1/4" less than stock F3 spring, 2 1/2" rear spring sag ride height is way too much).

The F3 Elka shock comes with a short 2 3/4" long 800# spring, a spacer and a 5 1/4" long 800# spring; the 2 short springs are equal to a 400# spring (only 50# more than the 350# stock rear F3 spring). So F3 Elka rear short springs will sag 3" with Larry & his wife on it!!!
We put the 1000# Hyperco single 8" long single spring on Larry's rear Elka shock & only sags 1", firm but does NOT bottom with 2 up riding!!
Bottom line: 2015 F3 Spyder needs a much heavier rear shock spring (single Hyperco spring 8" long 2.25 ID, 800#-1000# on a F3 Elka rear shock).
Hope this helps explain why stock F3 rear 350# spring bottoms.
You can replace stock rear spring, if you like, with a stiffer spring like Jerry suggests; of course it is your choice!
Enjoy your rydes!!
Jim

Most Excellent!

If you didn't catch it in my suspension thread(s), try adding the nylon washer or the rubber bumper (if it hugs the shock shaft firm enough to stay where it was last pushed to) to verify max suspension range used. This thread was written for the front shock but is applicable to the rear shock too: http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/s...s-lots-of-pics

Jerry

[spyderyderjim]

Did you install the Elka shock yourself and if so how hard was it to install?

Yes, you can change out F3 rear shock, not hard.
Jack up rear of F3 under rear portion of frame, with the rear tire barely touching floor.
Just take off small inspection plastic plates (#30 Torx) on underside of fender black splash guard.
With help from another guy holding 15 mm socket end wrench on top bolt nut on left side from underneath, & a 15mm socket with long extension on right side, in between & just above right side inspection hole/rear splash guard. Pull top bolt out right side. Remove bottom bolt holding rear shock so it does not fall.
Install top bolt thru upper shock mount hole thru new Elka rear shock; then put lower shock bolt in by raising or lowering F3 frame enough to slide bolt thru; I use small dab of Blue Loctite on shock bolt threads/nuts.
Not sure if John at Elka will install a Hyperco single 800# spring 8" long x 2.25 Inside Diameter on rear F3 shock he sells.
Larry & I had to buy our own rear single 800# & 1000# Hyperco springs for our rear F3 Elka shocks!!
Because John would not acknowledge both our F3S Spyders were bottoming out using Elkas two short Dual 800# springs (half the force of a single spring, or about a single 400# spring rate, only 50# more than stock F3 rear shock spring). (Makes a difference in Hyperco spring #, of your weigh & if you ride F3 double a lot).
The Dual Spring system is linear just like the single spring system is with one exception, it uses a COMBINED spring rate. If the shock were compressed one inch then BOTH of the springs would compress a little to add up to that inch. Also, since each springs rate is not added together the combined spring rate can be considerably lower than a single spring system. http://shocktherapyst.com/the-truth-about-dual-rate-springs/
PM me if you need help changing rear F3 shock.
The F3 rear Elka shock has excellent dampening & eliminates the harshness of the stock shock.
Jim

[jcthorne]

No, the unequal length pair of 800 lbs per inch springs supplied by Elka are NOT the same as a single 400# spring.

They are only 400 lbs per inch during the first approx 1.25" of travel. As the shorter spring nears full compression, the effective spring rate rises toward 800 lbs per inch. The pair of springs gives and effective progressive rate coil that is 400/800.

Thus providing control on larger jounces and better ride quality on smoother roads.

I have never had the dual coil Elka bottom out on my F3 and I am no lightweight. The factory spring/shock was horrid and bottomed out easily on slow speed rail road crossings. I have been very pleased with my set of Elkas even though they were expensive.

[KID Ryker]

http://www.powersportswarehouse.com

Thanks. Got mine orderd

[Wildrice]

Did you install the Elka shock yourself and if so how hard was it to install?

Does the spring cap stopper (2 round plates on top of orignal shocck) from the original OEM shock need to be transfered/installed to the New Elka shock in this photo??????thanks,
Darrell

[juscuz]

d a short extension on the right side

Got mine yesterday and installed it today, took about 45 minutes. If you have the right tools the only thing you need to remove is the seat. The top mount bolt can be removed using a 15MM socket on a universal joint thru the slot under the seat, a wrench for the nut thru the bottom access, was able to torque the bolts as well.
The ride is much better and smoother and handling is much better in the curves. The best $167.00 I spent so far.
Sorry I should of taken pictures of wrench placement, but I didn't think of it until I was done.

I removed the passenger seat to access the two screws holding the driver's seat on, used a 15mm offset box end wrench on the bolt side of the shock thru the oval slot (in my case, the left side) and a 15mm socket with a universal connector and short extension on the other side also thru the slot (right side). Took less than 5 min to remove the shock. Same tools used on the bottom bolt/nut assembly. No need to remove anything but the driver's seat. Your tools fit through the two oval cut outs on each side of the top shock mount which can be seen once the driver's seat is removed. I don't have saddle bags mounted so can't comment on that issue if any.

[ABQSpyder]

Does the spring cap stopper (2 round plates on top of orignal shocck) from the original OEM shock need to be transfered/installed to the New Elka shock in this photo??????thanks,
Darrell

What photo?
Take the orignal shock off bike and toss it in the garbage.
The Elka should be ready to go!! Who did you buy the Elka from??
You really should get Help from someone. Do you know how to adjust preload rebound. The adjustment screw needs to face front of Bike.

[Retired 2012]

I am having Race tech shocks built and installed, like some have said before if your over 200 lbs the stock shock bottoms out, and if you ride two up it can be worst. So the wife has ok'd the new purchase along with a new rear tire. Should ride much better, time will tell.

[SpyderRush]

??

Dealer ordered shock for me .and gave me a $100.00 gift card to help pay for it

[Saleschase]

Reading thru this forum I've had mixed feelings. After my ride yesterday, something has to be done. After bottoming out over 6 times on a road that my lowered VTX had no issues on, I have contacted the dealer about the spring. No news yet on can am helping with the purchase, was not aware of the weight limit or the fact that the 15 F3-S wasn't meant for a lot of two up riding. By no means are we even close to the weight limit but evening the interstate I have to watch how I drive to avoid tearing anything up. Is it possible to put a car shock on? Something that will get me a little more mileage out of it? I'm averaging a little over 1k a month and that has been in the winter, so it will go way up now that spring is here?

[MMMII]

Reading thru this forum I've had mixed feelings. After my ride yesterday, something has to be done. After bottoming out over 6 times on a road that my lowered VTX had no issues on, I have contacted the dealer about the spring. No news yet on can am helping with the purchase, was not aware of the weight limit or the fact that the 15 F3-S wasn't meant for a lot of two up riding. By no means are we even close to the weight limit but evening the interstate I have to watch how I drive to avoid tearing anything up. Is it possible to put a car shock on? Something that will get me a little more mileage out of it? I'm averaging a little over 1k a month and that has been in the winter, so it will go way up now that spring is here?

Just my $.02 but I think some ppl got a batch of defective shocks. I never had the bottoming out problem with the stock shock even riding 2 up (about 380lbs).

[spydaman60]

just picked my f3s up from the dealer. (new shock and warranty bulletin completed) only put a little ride on, but could feel the difference instantly with the new shock. I hope it is not a temporary fix, haven't tried the two up, (as the wife just had her knee replaced) but I am prepared to go the elka route if need be. by the way, my dealer went to bat for me, and I didn't pay for the new shock set-up, I only paid for the labor portion!! hats off to rusty palmers in honesdale, ny!!

[ca8920]

After having the new heavier BRP shock installed and having the chance to ride it around for a couple of weeks, I can't tell you how pleased I am with the upgrade. The ride it much much better. The cornering is much better and the overall feel is greatly improved..... If you have a budget and can't drop a bunch on something like an Elka, the BRP upgrade is a must.

[loisk]

Great to hear all your good reports.
Husband's F3S is still waiting for this shock - they're "on backorder" here in Australia, along with the chassis warranty repair parts. Let's hope "backorder" isn't too long ...

[fjcady]

Is this a stock part from BRP? whats the number? also where did you get it installed? looks great

Thought i would post this so more people could see..
New two up F3 shock
$213.49 plus $60 installation
see any difference..

[Colin]

Not sure how this comes into play but based on these numbers it does not indicate much difference. It only compresses 1/4" less the than original shock.

To me it's not about numbers and measurements. I replaced my shock with the 2-up Shock, and after riding
around 800kms on the weekend I was very happy with the way it performed. I am not a small person at all.
I even took my partner for a ride on the back, and to be honest we would have been challenging the weight
restriction for bike and shock, and I was very happy with the ride, so was my partner. But she still prefers
to ride her own Spyder

[Wildrice]

What photo?
Take the orignal shock off bike and toss it in the garbage.
The Elka should be ready to go!! Who did you buy the Elka from??
You really should get Help from someone. Do you know how to adjust preload rebound. The adjustment screw needs to face front of Bike.

I bought the Elka shock directly from Elka . . I've done shock adjustments on the Hayabusa---didn't seem to make a big difference to me--except for traction burnout-hop-just a minimal improvement. The set it up by Elka was based on the weight I gave them. I weigh 180# & wife is at 120# thus no parameters were anywhere near the max adjustments. I've ridden less than 100 miles since the replacement--if any problems arise I will get involved with the adjustments. So far--so good.

[SpyDerSts]

I'm hopin these pix attached to my reply here. Am I to Ass-ume that there is supposed to be 6 (six) bolts in this plate that was the "warranty repair". If you look closely you'll see that there wasn't any other bolt even put in the 1 (one) open bolt hole that is visible. We just got this F3 S Wednesday 16th. Was a rough deal going into with the dealership with multiple "mistakes and omissions" on their part, but we really wanted the bike. Now this issue on the "safety/warranty" fix???? We haven't yet confronted them with this "problem.,,,just would like some O-pinions as to where to go next: Attorney?? Monetary Gimme's? Or suck it up and deal with it as a Can Am Dealer Ineptitude