Curse you DESS

[OverHillAndDale]

I rode from Birmingham, AL to Orange Beach, AL last Sunday and had a perfect trip. I left the bike parked all week and got on it this morning for the return trip. I started early to get in as much time as possible in the cool of the morning.

I stopped for gas in Evergreen, a quaint southern town along the way. When I tried to restart it I got a DESS error. I dug and found my spare key, tried it and got the same results. Long story short, I did the magic walk MULTIPLE times, found the DESS fuse, pulled it, waiting 15 minutes and replaced it with another. I disconnected the battery terminals. I pulled out some words I rarely used and they didn't help. In the meantime, the temperature had climbed into the 90s with a billion percent humidity. By now it had been nearly 3 hours, and I had drunk gallons of water and Gatorade and sweated out even more.

I finally called my insurance company to come and tow the bike, and fortunately my son was headed home as well so I was able to hitch a ride. Up until that point it had been a perfect day, but now my Spyder has betrayed me and it will take some time before I can forgive her.

[Chupaca]

knowing there are bad ignition switches/module, keys which ever is causing this I'm surprised they don't just let those affected know...or do they not know which ones and have to wait for them to fail...glad you got a ryde and hope they swap that out quick and get you back on the road...

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

knowing there are bad ignition switches/module, keys which ever is causing this I'm surprised they don't just let those affected know...or do they not know which ones and have to wait for them to fail...glad you got a ryde and hope they swap that out quick and get you back on the road...

This is becoming an almost daily occurrence here........It's not the IGNITION switch .......it's the module, they got a whole bunch of bad ones and I don't think they can figure out exactly where they are until they fail.....They may know the number sequence however so if you have ever got the DESS PIC on your screen I think you've been warned, and it's going to get worse.......jmho......Mike

[finless]

Mike, some people will not do research and will not see the TON'S of posts about this already that get posted every week.

I even made a post about the increasing number of DESS reports with information about it.

Yet the misinformation and "recall" talk continues and all the wrong information being talked about.

DRIVES ME CRAZY!

How can someone spend $26K and not spend some time knowing what they have?????
Crazy...

Bob

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Mike, some people will not do research and will not see the TON'S of posts about this already that get posted every week.

I even made a post about the increasing number of DESS reports with information about it.

Yet the misinformation and "recall" talk continues and all the wrong information being talked about.

DRIVES ME CRAZY!

How can someone spend $26K and not spend some time knowing what they have?????
Crazy...

Bob

....I'm trying really really hard to be positive in my posts ..........Mike

[Bob Denman]

And you're doing pretty darn well!

[Deanna777]

I rode from Birmingham, AL to Orange Beach, AL last Sunday and had a perfect trip. I left the bike parked all week and got on it this morning for the return trip. I started early to get in as much time as possible in the cool of the morning.

I stopped for gas in Evergreen, a quaint southern town along the way. When I tried to restart it I got a DESS error. I dug and found my spare key, tried it and got the same results. Long story short, I did the magic walk MULTIPLE times, found the DESS fuse, pulled it, waiting 15 minutes and replaced it with another. I disconnected the battery terminals. I pulled out some words I rarely used and they didn't help. In the meantime, the temperature had climbed into the 90s with a billion percent humidity. By now it had been nearly 3 hours, and I had drunk gallons of water and Gatorade and sweated out even more.

I finally called my insurance company to come and tow the bike, and fortunately my son was headed home as well so I was able to hitch a ride. Up until that point it had been a perfect day, but now my Spyder has betrayed me and it will take some time before I can forgive her.

HI, last month I got the DESS key code on my 2014RTS-SE6, go to the thread I started that says " DESS KEY CODE PICTURES on a 2014RTS-SE6".

I had the DESS key module replaced and the dealership reprogramed both keys, and it was covered under the warranty. Be sure the dealer orders the new part #, which is listed on the above thread. Since I have had the DESS module replaced, I have not had any problems. My starts every time. Deanna

[OverHillAndDale]

I live in Birmingham, AL and when I got the DESS error my bike got towed to Mobile AL, 4 hours south (insurance would only tow to the nearest dealer). I called the dealership on Saturday and was told the bike started and ran just fine, no error. I tried to explain that I expected the ignition module to be replaced anyway, that if this is a recurring issue I would likely get stranded again, that this was a known issue and that I WOULDN'T HAVE THE BIKE TOWED AFTER BEING STRANDED FOR 3 HOURS IF THERE HADN'T BEEN A PROBLEM!! (Pardon the shouting , I'm just a bit upset!)

Don't know where this will go, but it may take some effort to get this going.

[ndspyderlover]

I live in Birmingham, AL and when I got the DESS error my bike got towed to Mobile AL, 4 hours south (insurance would only tow to the nearest dealer). I called the dealership on Saturday and was told the bike started and ran just fine, no error. I tried to explain that I expected the ignition module to be replaced anyway, that if this is a recurring issue I would likely get stranded again, that this was a known issue and that I WOULDN'T HAVE THE BIKE TOWED AFTER BEING STRANDED FOR 3 HOURS IF THERE HADN'T BEEN A PROBLEM!! (Pardon the shouting , I'm just a bit upset!)

Don't know where this will go, but it may take some effort to get this going.

My dealer told me also that there was not a problem or recall. I told them that there is a problem and I was not going to settle for that answer. I found the part number on Deanna's post and called my dealer back. They started a file with BRP and they told the dealer that the part number I gave them needed to be replaced. My dealer replaced the part and I have had no problem since. This forum is a very valluable tool if it is used.

[OverHillAndDale]

HI, last month I got the DESS key code on my 2014RTS-SE6, go to the thread I started that says " DESS KEY CODE PICTURES on a 2014RTS-SE6".

I had the DESS key module replaced and the dealership reprogramed both keys, and it was covered under the warranty. Be sure the dealer orders the new part #, which is listed on the above thread. Since I have had the DESS module replaced, I have not had any problems. My starts every time. Deanna

Deanna - thanks for the details. I will be contacting the dealer today with this information.

[JayBros]

Deanna777's pictures of the DESS Error are great information. I assume from examining the parts manual the DESS module is PN 710004190; if not, could someone who has had it replaced please PM me the correct number. No one wants to be stranded on the far side of beyond with that error message which should be in the Operator's Guide list of errors on the multifunction gauge (pg. 144-145) IMO. How bad is the problem, do we really know? We've a number of reports of it in 2014 RTs but what percentage of the total number of that model, or other '14 models for that matter, have been reported to and/or corrected by dealers? I certainly would like to know if my Spyder is a candidate for the failure. FWIW, the DESS module cannot be diagnostically tested, the only way to determine a failure is to replace it with another module and see if the problem goes away. Also, the DESS module for the 2014 Spyders is different than prior years and I am not interested in prior year models. Does BRP have enough information to connect the dots, who knows? We need some hard data. Here's a suggestion: if you have had the DESS error and have had a failed DESS module replaced, kindly PM me with "DESS Error" in the subject line, the model of '14 Spyder and the date of assembly of the roadster. The date is in the upper right corner of the VIN sticker on the swing arm. If you have 2014 Spyder owner acquaintances who are Facebook ninjas but eschew this august group ask them to click over to SL and pass me their model and assembly date. I am not interested in ANY other personal information. As you can see, such information might give me significant data to send to BRPcare and possibly receive some clarification about the severity of the problem. ​

[gypsy_100]

This is becoming an almost daily occurrence here........It's not the IGNITION switch .......it's the module, they got a whole bunch of bad ones and I don't think they can figure out exactly where they are until they fail.....They may know the number sequence however so if you have ever got the DESS PIC on your screen I think you've been warned, and it's going to get worse.......jmho......Mike

And somewhere in the many prior posts someone referred to it as an "ignition module". That would just lead to further arguments with the dealer. It is not an ignition module; it is a security-system DESS module.

Mike, some people will not do research and will not see the TON'S of posts about this already that get posted every week.

I even made a post about the increasing number of DESS reports with information about it.

Yet the misinformation and "recall" talk continues and all the wrong information being talked about.

DRIVES ME CRAZY!

How can someone spend $26K and not spend some time knowing what they have?????
Crazy...

Bob

Deanna777's pictures of the DESS Error are great information. I assume from examining the parts manual the DESS module is PN 710004190; if not, could someone who has had it replaced please PM me the correct number. No one wants to be stranded on the far side of beyond with that error message which should be in the Operator's Guide list of errors on the multifunction gauge (pg. 144-145) IMO. How bad is the problem, do we really know? We've a number of reports of it in 2014 RTs but what percentage of the total number of that model, or other '14 models for that matter, have been reported to and/or corrected by dealers? I certainly would like to know if my Spyder is a candidate for the failure. FWIW, the DESS module cannot be diagnostically tested, the only way to determine a failure is to replace it with another module and see if the problem goes away. Also, the DESS module for the 2014 Spyders is different than prior years and I am not interested in prior year models. Does BRP have enough information to connect the dots, who knows? We need some hard data. Here's a suggestion: if you have had the DESS error and have had a failed DESS module replaced, kindly PM me with "DESS Error" in the subject line, the model of '14 Spyder and the date of assembly of the roadster. The date is in the upper right corner of the VIN sticker on the swing arm. If you have 2014 Spyder owner acquaintances who are Facebook ninjas but eschew this august group ask them to click over to SL and pass me their model and assembly date. I am not interested in ANY other personal information. As you can see, such information might give me significant data to send to BRPcare and possibly receive some clarification about the severity of the problem. ​

Great undertaking. That is what is needed. The parts info that I posted in Deanna's thread states that yes, 710004190 is the new part number for 2014's. The earlier part number for 2014's was 710003595 but it has been supseded by the 4190 number. Also note that these are not the same as the DESS module for the 2015's. That is a different number.

My 2014 is an April build. It was built after the early oil leak was remedied in production and it does not have a key number on the faulty list. But which DESS module?? Who Knows?? When did BRP update the module and part number?? Who Knows?? I hope you get some responses to your request.

[OverHillAndDale]

but it will happen if things don't change.

So far
- "Heh Heh - it started just fine when we took it off the tow truck."
- "Heh Heh - don't know what to do if it doesn't happen for us!"
- "Well, heh heh, we plan on getting to it later today or maybe tomorrow."
- "Heh Heh, we've never heard of this problem."

I explained the number of posts about the DESS module, given them Deanna's part number (Thanks Deanna!), and told them I didn't want the bike back as-is because I wasn't going to get stranded again with this error. They tried to blame the IPS gadget from LaMonster, but I told them I'd been using it for months, AND my spare key which doesn't have IPS didn't work either.

I'm going to try to contact BRP today and pressing them to get results out of this dealer.

[ARtraveler]

but it will happen if things don't change.

So far
- "Heh Heh - it started just fine when we took it off the tow truck."
- "Heh Heh - don't know what to do if it doesn't happen for us!"
- "Well, heh heh, we plan on getting to it later today or maybe tomorrow."
- "Heh Heh, we've never heard of this problem."

I explained the number of posts about the DESS module, given them Deanna's part number (Thanks Deanna!), and told them I didn't want the bike back as-is because I wasn't going to get stranded again with this error. They tried to blame the IPS gadget from LaMonster, but I told them I'd been using it for months, AND my spare key which doesn't have IPS didn't work either.

I'm going to try to contact BRP today and pressing them to get results out of this dealer.

I think it is time to talk with Steve at BRP

brp.care@brp.com

[OverHillAndDale]

Steve,

I was given your name from a fellow member of SpyderLovers.com.


I have a 2014 RT Limited and on Friday, August 31st my bike stranded me 4 hours from home with a DESS error. I had stopped for gas and the bike wouldn't restart with either key. I removed the keys and waited, pulled the DESS fuse and waited 15 minutes, removed both battery terminals and waited, all no no avail. After nearly 4 hours of sweltering heat I had the bike towed to one of your dealers, Hall's Motorsports in Mobile, AL (251-509-0999) which is 4 hours from my home.


Since then I have called the dealer nearly daily, but I keep hearing that they can't reproduce the error and therefore don't know what to fix. I have reminded them (each call) that the Spyders log their error codes, to which I am informed "That's good to know". I have informed them that this seems to be a common problem for the 2014s and it is fixed by replacing part 710003595 with 710004190 and re-synching the keys, but it seems to be falling on deaf ears.


Can you/will you assist? I can't reproduce the error from 4 hours away, and I don't want the bike back as-is for fear of being stranded again. I'm VERY disappointed in the lack of response from your dealer, and frustrated that after one week they have made no progress at all. Further, they seem clueless that they owe me something more than "I don't know" for a warranted bike.


Thanks in advance for you help,


Dale Scruggs

[OverHillAndDale]

The dealer said that the DESS error didn't show up in the logs, but would open a case with BRP.

In the meantime Steve at BRP responded to my email and said they would open a case and be in touch with me next week.

[gypsy_100]

The dealer said that the DESS error didn't show up in the logs, but would open a case with BRP.

In the meantime Steve at BRP responded to my email and said they would open a case and be in touch with me next week.

Once BRP and Steve start talking with your dealer, things will happen quickly. That's been my experience in the past. Keep us informed.

[sealfloorboards]

I got my 2014 fixed yesterday at ProCaliber. It seems to be specific to the 2014 and is caused by some sort of electromagnetic issue. Shawn but a filter n the ignition (about 1 hr. job) and BRP paid for it. They are very aware of the problem but it does't affect all 2014's. Shawn put in an RO (Repair Order) and BRP sent the part. THEY CAN, AND WILL FIX IT FOR FREE! Yu could call Shawn at ProCalaber and get more specifics. Hope this helps to.....

Ride in comfort,
John
Seal Floorboards

[sickticket]

Just wondering, does this problem also show up in the 2015 models??

Thanks

[Deanna777]

Deanna - thanks for the details. I will be contacting the dealer today with this information.

You are welcome for the details......... Did you get your D.E.S.S. fixed on your spyder yet?

What were the result's ?

Deanna

[Deanna777]

And somewhere in the many prior posts someone referred to it as an "ignition module". That would just lead to further arguments with the dealer. It is not an ignition module; it is a security-system DESS module.





Great undertaking. That is what is needed. The parts info that I posted in Deanna's thread states that yes, 710004190 is the new part number for 2014's. The earlier part number for 2014's was 710003595 but it has been supseded by the 4190 number. Also note that these are not the same as the DESS module for the 2015's. That is a different number.

My 2014 is an April build. It was built after the early oil leak was remedied in production and it does not have a key number on the faulty list. But which DESS module?? Who Knows?? When did BRP update the module and part number?? Who Knows?? I hope you get some responses to your request.

The people that have 2015 spyders the new part # is 710004241,, Models : RS, ST, RT...............for the DESS MODULE.... Also, It is covered under WARRANTY.

Problem: ( this is on the repair order ) Intermittently, the ignition key may not be recognized causing the unit not to start. The D.E.S.S ERROR message well be displayed in the cluster. Solution: Replace the D.E.S.S module. Program the keys using B.U.D.S referring to the RT shop manual section Digitally Encoded Security System (D.E.S.S)

Warranty: Claim under regular Warranty.

Deanna

[Deanna777]

but it will happen if things don't change.

So far
- "Heh Heh - it started just fine when we took it off the tow truck."
- "Heh Heh - don't know what to do if it doesn't happen for us!"
- "Well, heh heh, we plan on getting to it later today or maybe tomorrow."
- "Heh Heh, we've never heard of this problem."

I explained the number of posts about the DESS module, given them Deanna's part number (Thanks Deanna!), and told them I didn't want the bike back as-is because I wasn't going to get stranded again with this error. They tried to blame the IPS gadget from LaMonster, but I told them I'd been using it for months, AND my spare key which doesn't have IPS didn't work either.

I'm going to try to contact BRP today and pressing them to get results out of this dealer.

Print my " D.E.S.S. KEY CODE PICTURES ON A 2014RTS-SE6" take to your dealership, show them. You are Welcome! Deanna

[Deanna777]

The dealer said that the DESS error didn't show up in the logs, but would open a case with BRP.

In the meantime Steve at BRP responded to my email and said they would open a case and be in touch with me next week.

Keep us posted on what happens. Deanna

[Deanna777]

I got my 2014 fixed yesterday at ProCaliber. It seems to be specific to the 2014 and is caused by some sort of electromagnetic issue. Shawn but a filter n the ignition (about 1 hr. job) and BRP paid for it. They are very aware of the problem but it does't affect all 2014's. Shawn put in an RO (Repair Order) and BRP sent the part. THEY CAN, AND WILL FIX IT FOR FREE! Yu could call Shawn at ProCalaber and get more specifics. Hope this helps to.....

Ride in comfort,
John
Seal Floorboards

John, The D.E.S.S MODULE is under WARRANTY. I had the D.E.S.S. Module replaced on July 14,2015 @ my Dealership. Deanna

[gypsy_100]

Problem: ( this is on the repair order ) Intermittently, the ignition key may not be recognized causing the unit not to start. The D.E.S.S ERROR message well be displayed in the cluster. Solution: Replace the D.E.S.S module. Program the keys using B.U.D.S referring to the RT shop manual section Digitally Encoded Security System (D.E.S.S)

Deanna

According to the 2014 Shop Manual, the DESS Module can be replaced without requiring any programming of the keys. In 2014, the DESS Module simply reads the info in the key and transmits that info to the ECU which does the authentication. Unlike previous years where the DESS Module did the authentication and would therefore require reprogramming the keys if the module were changed. Not the case in '14 and I would assume '15 unless they went back to the earlier type of system in '15. Both the ECU and DESS Module part numbers are different for '15 versus '14 so exactly what they did for '15 is an open question.

In the case of the '14's, replacement would be a 5-minute swap if it weren't for having to remove the frunk!